Petty? Pathetic? Pitiful? What say you?

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Really ranger? Tanking a clearance because of a vote? You are still being dramatic. I’ll stipulate that I don’t know as much as you about clearances. That said, the gist I’ve picked up from this thread it doesn’t matter if Brennan has one to do his media job. I think he has taken himself out of the game for future use, so who cares?

Of course I was being dramatic. I thought that was clear.

Confirm yes or no: You are ok with a national leader revoking a security clearance expressly out of political revenge when no apparent misuse of said clearance is known?

Yes or no?

 

[toastedbread]

Pulling that asset for political reasons is terrible and unforgiving.

I'm trying to understand how this is any different from the firing of Strzok? Both were done solely so for political retribution.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Of course I was being dramatic. I thought that was clear.

Confirm yes or no: You are ok with a national leader revoking a security clearance expressly out of political revenge when no apparent misuse of said clearance is known?

Yes or no?

I answered in a response to twenty.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Secret squirrel network is a good way to describe the “anonymous source,” “person with knowledge,” and “informed source” network of leaks. Comey brags about his manipulation of the media to have a special counsel appointed.

No it’s not. You’re making shit up again. There is no way of inactive clearance holders to get access to information that is classified. You are completely missing the forest for the trees.

 

[IUCrazy2]

It shouldn't be hard for a Republican DOJ with a Republican Senate and a Republican House to look into that?

They are...much like the Mueller probe, these things take time.

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/aug/15/adam-lovinger-pentagon-analyst-lost-security-clear/

https://www.redstate.com/streiff/2018/05/18/fbi-outing-stefan-halper-informant-trump-campaign/

I think there was a concerted effort by beltway insiders to sink Trump. I am with CoH in that is what Strzok was referring to with his talks with Page. I think Trump is acting rationally against the people he picked out personally...but whatever, in the end we are all going to believe what we believe.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

I answered in a response to twenty.

You didn’t. You answered in dishonest vagaries that are capable of being explained in multitudinous ways to fit whatever dishonest narrative you choose that minute.

I said good day.

 

[IUCrazy2]

No, they dont, because they can’t. There isn’t some secret squirrel network that retired guys with clearances access to get the latest and greatest cool guy news. You do not understand this topic.

All do respect Ranger, I believe that is true of rank and file people with a clearance, but if you think these guys who are making money off of being analysts are not using their prior position and the fact that they still have clearance to get info, it is you who would be off base.

I provided an instance where Brennan was serving in official capacity and someone with clearance and a prior job sunk a clandestine operation so he could continue to get paid as a talking head. That was not necessarily Brennan's fault but it provides an example of how this works. He met with his group of talking heads and said "here is basically what is going on", then those guys ran with it...in the case of Clarke, within minutes of the conclusion of the meeting. Clarke was not randomly pulled into that conversation.

You are not part of that network because in the scheme of things, you did not reach an important enough level to be considered part of that network. And there is no offense meant by that, just the truth. Guys like Brennan stay connected.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

All do respect Ranger, I believe that is true of rank and file people with a clearance, but if you think these guys who are making money off of being analysts are not using their prior position and the fact that they still have clearance to get info, it is you who would be off base.

I provided an instance where Brennan was serving in official capacity and someone with clearance and a prior job sunk a clandestine operation so he could continue to get paid as a talking head. That was not necessarily Brennan's fault but it provides an example of how this works. He met with his group of talking heads and said "here is basically what is going on", then those guys ran with it...in the case of Clarke, within minutes of the conclusion of the meeting. Clarke was not randomly pulled into that conversation.

You are not part of that network because in the scheme of things, you did not reach an important enough level to be considered part of that network. And there is no offense meant by that, just the truth. Guys like Brennan stay connected.

And no Fox News Analyst has ever reached that level?

 

[IUCrazy2]

And no Fox News Analyst has ever reached that level?

Many have. I have already stated that I am fine with yanking GOP guys who are acting in the same capacity.

And again, whataboutism Marvin. I do not necessarily feel it is fair to claim that whenever the other side has done something but quite a few mostly left leaning posters have been leveling that lately. Is it ok for guys like Brennan to get access based on that clearance and then turn around and act as leakers? That is the accusation against Brennan and the people on the list. They take classified info passed to them by people still actively in government and then pass it off to the media as an anonymous source. Like the contents of the President's conversations with foreign leaders. Those were some pretty unprecedented leaks, no? I think Trump is acting fairly rationally about our intelligence agencies given some of the bull shit that has gone on before he got into office and since.

 

[zeke4ahs]

If Obama had taken this away from any Republican you know this would have been the greatest assault on liberty in this country since the attempt to restrict sweets in school cafeterias. The president clearly and without any possible doubt has an enemies list, how did that work out for the last president with one?

Whataboutism, no?

And the last President with an enemies list was the one who directly preceded the current occupant of the White House, I think he was less than good at his job but he has managed to land on his feet...

That’s because millions of people, around the world disagree with you and respect him for his intelligence and his integrity. Two words you will never see associated with 45.

 

[toastedbread]

Many have. I have already stated that I am fine with yanking GOP guys who are acting in the same capacity.

And again, whataboutism Marvin. I do not necessarily feel it is fair to claim that whenever the other side has done something but quite a few mostly left leaning posters have been leveling that lately. Is it ok for guys like Brennan to get access based on that clearance and then turn around and act as leakers? That is the accusation against Brennan and the people on the list. They take classified info passed to them by people still actively in government and then pass it off to the media as an anonymous source. Like the contents of the President's conversations with foreign leaders. Those were some pretty unprecedented leaks, no? I think Trump is acting fairly rationally about our intelligence agencies given some of the bull shit that has gone on before he got into office and since.

Yea, pull Brennan clearance, pull Comey's, pull McCabe's. But, you know what... where the hell is your outrage at the Kushner's granting of a clearance after routinely providing misleading information in his applications??? Kushner is selling America out to the Chinese, Saudis, Emirates, and Israelis. It's a HUGE scandal and outrage. Him and that scumball Ivanka are benedict arnolds of the highest order. It shows how much of a joke the clearance process is that after repeatedly leaving off the most important information he is granted a clearance. (And a bunch of other shady shit he was caught doing)

Brennan is a plankton in the shark tank in comparison.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

They are...much like the Mueller probe, these things take time.

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/aug/15/adam-lovinger-pentagon-analyst-lost-security-clear/

https://www.redstate.com/streiff/2018/05/18/fbi-outing-stefan-halper-informant-trump-campaign/

I think there was a concerted effort by beltway insiders to sink Trump. I am with CoH in that is what Strzok was referring to with his talks with Page. I think Trump is acting rationally against the people he picked out personally...but whatever, in the end we are all going to believe what we believe.

I have no problems with investigations, they can investigate the FBI to see if there was anything wrong. The John Birch Society fear of an international cabal controlling our government has become mainstream GOP. I don't get how it has become so pervasive, but it has. The firing of Strozk made sense, I made no comments there. If there is need to investigate others, go ahead. But note, there is no investigation on Brennan. As far as I can tell, Trump woke up and wanted to bury the Omarosa story and chose this. We know because his letter is dated three weeks ago.

They take classified info passed to them by people still actively in government and then pass it off to the media as an anonymous source. Like the contents of the President's conversations with foreign leaders. Those were some pretty unprecedented leaks, no? I think Trump is acting fairly rationally about our intelligence agencies given some of the bull shit that has gone on before he got into office and since.

Isn't that the fault of the people leaking them the news? TS material is strictly "Need to know" and Brennan probably has no "Need to know". Anyone leaking him stuff yesterday was already violating their security arrangements. Do you think this would stop them?

Trump admits this has to do with Russia, it isn't some grandiose effort to clean up leaking. It is revenge on Russia, that's it, plain and simple. He's the one quoted in the past as saying only guilty people refuse to testify, taking him at his own words and nothing else, he should testify and let the probe end.

 

[IUCrazy2]

That’s because millions of people, around the world disagree with you and respect him for his intelligence and his integrity. Two words you will never see associated with 45.

Yeah and millions think he is an ass. Point?

 

[toastedbread]

The John Birch Society fear of an international cabal controlling our government has become mainstream GOP.

They are right Marvin, but the international cabal is this administration who is selling us off to the highest bidder. This entire admin is the swamp of swampiest swamp.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

And again, whataboutism Marvin

And it isn't whataboutism, it is showing how unparalleled this is. There is a chain of command for pulling clearance, it was not followed. The prez, on his own discretion, did this. That is completely unparalleled. No Democrat, no Republican, has done that.

Trump was right when he said he could walk out on the street and shoot someone and his supporters wouldn't care. I'm just quoting him, if you disagree, take it up with him.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

he has at least some reason to believe that some of them were in fact, out to get him

Has there ever been a time that someone has criticized Trump that he hasn't taken it as someone out to get him? It sure seems to be his DNA that all criticisms are mortal attacks.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

It is correlated....I didn't say it was the exact thing. But for those in govt related industries....that clearance is as vital to operate in any function whatsoever as a occupational license is in other industries.

Here are the adjudication guidelines.....I'm not seeing anything about airing mean personal opinions of the President on TV.....

https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2012-title32-vol1/xml/CFR-2012-title32-vol1-part147.xml

If I lost my TS clearance I’d lose my current job.

 

[Rockfish1]

Well, that says it all right there....doesn't it?

As long as Trump thinks someone's "out to get him"....then to hell with precedent and normalcy.

Sigh.

That’s the real problem here: the Trumpbots will say and even believe whatever is necessary to support the corrupt unfit imbecile they elected president. Every day they look more and more foolish, which only makes them dig in deeper.

Gotta give Trump credit for recognizing that his supporters are the sort of rubes who’d make excuses if he shot someone on the street.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

You mean like @Aloha Hoosier ?

The system works like that because it's not in the govts interest to hire a subject matter expert as a full time employee....particularly for short term engagements/projects.

I’m not a consultant.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

https://indiana.forums.rivals.com/threads/petty-pathetic-pitiful-what-say-you.170361/#post-2450399

Isn't that exactly what's bandied about in QuAnon circles? That Mueller is secretly working to fight the deep state (democrats)?

Good grief, dude. You're almost as insane as the Trumpsters.

 

[toastedbread]

The Trumpbots’ Deep State conspiracy theories are all loony, but full on QAnon status requires a belief that Trump and Mueller are together fighting a Deep State pedophilia ring. I think Joe Hoopsier is sticking with the more mainstream lunacy and has (thus far anyway) not entered the open head wound lunacy of QAnon. Distinctions can be drawn, even among lunatics.

Yea, but in what other deep state conspiracy is Mueller fighting the deep state? In every other deep state conspiracy I've read, Mueller is part of the deep state, not fighting it.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

No it’s not. You’re making shit up again. There is no way of inactive clearance holders to get access to information that is classified. You are completely missing the forest for the trees.

Really? Do you think Brennan has a media gig because he is a pretty face? He has it because of contacts and connections. How he uses his sources is protected.

 

[twenty02]

Really? Do you think Brennan has a media gig because he is a pretty face? He has it because of contacts and connections. How he uses his sources is protected.

That's a LOT different than having access to active classified material. Without a NTK....anyone passing him classified data today....would be violating their own clearance.

Again....if there was evidence this was occurring...normal protocols would be followed via an investigation. Even the bogus WH statement said nothing about him improperly accessing classified info and/or leaking it to media.

 

[twenty02]

I’m not a consultant.

You are monetizing your TS clearance and your prior defense industry experience!

 

[zeke4ahs]

You are rationalizing why it was OK for Trump to do what has never happened before. Let me ask this, you call Brennan a "media clown". I find no pictures of him in a red wig with a white painted face and red nose. So define media clown. What has Brennan done that NO conservative analyst on Fox has ever done before that is utterly beyond the pale.

Brennan in today’s NYT:

The already challenging work of the American intelligence and law enforcement communities was made more difficult in late July 2016…when Mr. Trump, then a presidential candidate, publicly called upon Russia to find the missing emails of Mrs. Clinton. By issuing such a statement, Mr. Trump was not only encouraging a foreign nation to collect intelligence against a United States citizen, but also openly authorizing his followers to work with our primary global adversary against his political opponent.
​

He’s not just a clown but a dishonest dumbass. Here’s the guy who had mega-access to the worlds best intelligence and he says that a Trump joke in a public setting is his clincher? This is not only old news but discredited news. Brennan trades on his former gig as Director if the CIA like no one ever before. Shameful.

You are truly all in on Trump now, aren’t you?

 

[toastedbread]

You are monetizing your TS clearance and your prior defense industry experience!

Aloha has made posts criticizing trump on a public forum, therefore he should close his TS clearance

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

All do respect Ranger, I believe that is true of rank and file people with a clearance, but if you think these guys who are making money off of being analysts are not using their prior position and the fact that they still have clearance to get info, it is you who would be off base.

That’s breaking the law. Do you have proof?

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Really? Do you think Brennan has a media gig because he is a pretty face? He has it because of contacts and connections. How he uses his sources is protected.

Jesus Christ this is not that hard to understand. He has a gig because he used to be the MFing Director of Central Intelligence. He is a credible commentator on intelligence and national security.

If he is being supplied confidential information because he is a media commentator, then the person supplying the info is in breach of US Code.

Sometimes you can admit you have no clue what you’re talking about. It’s enlightening.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Not endless justifications for Trump. I think with respect to the people he listed, he has at least some reason to believe that some of them were in fact, out to get him. I think Brennan is one of them.

I criticize Trump when he needs criticized. You all just expect everyone to jump on every outrage train, I am just beyond giving a **** about this stuff.

While I certainly agree that there is a lot of (way too much) noise in the Trump Criticism signal, you need to do some serious facts gathering on what has happened with this clearance issue and apply some introspection in your defense of and digestion of the talking points.

What he did is NOT OK. Clearances are not to be revoked in the absence of serious misconduct involving access to classified information. There is no proof Brennan did anything other than criticize Trump. I’d ask you, as an intelligent person, to do some serious introspection on your defense (in absentia of damning facts) of this action. You’re on the wrong side of this one.

 

[twenty02]

Jesus Christ this is not that hard to understand. He has a gig because he used to be the MFing Director of Central Intelligence. He is a credible commentator on intelligence and national security.

If he is being supplied confidential information because he is a media commentator, then the person supplying the info is in breach of US Code.

Sometimes you can admit you have no clue what you’re talking about. It’s enlightening.

It's kind of pointless.....unfortunately people think having a security clearance equates to some special key that allows the holder to access a treasure trove of classified info as they wish to...when in actuality it couldn't be further from the truth.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

You are monetizing your TS clearance and your prior defense industry experience!

And not just a pretty face!

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

It's kind of pointless.....unfortunately people think having a security clearance equates to some special key that allows the holder to access a treasure trove of classified info as they wish to...when in actuality it couldn't be further from the truth.

That’s what I was alluding to in my secret squirrel network post. It doesn’t exist. If anyone is being spoon fed info without NTK, it’s the spoon feeders crime.

 

[zeke4ahs]

That’s because millions of people, around the world disagree with you and respect him for his intelligence and his integrity. Two words you will never see associated with 45.

Yeah and millions think he is an ass. Point?

Not really. Point is most people are able to distinguish between a man whose policies they disagree with and a man who is a morally despicable character.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

This has been a strange thread. I haven't seen anyone suggest we need to impeach Trump, or stage a coup, or anything like that. Just that taking this unprecedented step out of anger over Mueller is wrong. I don't have a remedy, I don't think there is a remedy afforded to anyone. Let's see where I am off:

Brennan held a very high position in the US government, even without clearance he is in demand as an analyst because he knows the system better than 99.9% of all Americans, including all of us commenting here.

Brennan is not believed to have violated any of the rules regarding TS material he has handled. If he did it needs brought out and his clearance needed revoked.

If Brennan has gained TS material since leaving office, an investigation needs opened because it is highly probably someone gave him information he did not have a need to know.

To the best knowledge of anyone commenting, normally the director of the agency involved would revoke clearance. That did not happen here, the President did. The president taking this step unilaterally is exceedingly rare.

Am I missing anything? I don't get how any of that is controversial.

 

[zeke4ahs]

And again, whataboutism Marvin

And it isn't whataboutism, it is showing how unparalleled this is. There is a chain of command for pulling clearance, it was not followed. The prez, on his own discretion, did this. That is completely unparalleled. No Democrat, no Republican, has done that.

Trump was right when he said he could walk out on the street and shoot someone and his supporters wouldn't care. I'm just quoting him, if you disagree, take it up with him.

What I think is really telling is when all the GOP in old administrations speak out about this and all the other multiple abuses and they are just dismissed. The only people that aren’t concerned and appalled are current Republicans afraid of Trump.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

This has been a strange thread. I haven't seen anyone suggest we need to impeach Trump, or stage a coup, or anything like that. Just that taking this unprecedented step out of anger over Mueller is wrong. I don't have a remedy, I don't think there is a remedy afforded to anyone. Let's see where I am off:

Brennan held a very high position in the US government, even without clearance he is in demand as an analyst because he knows the system better than 99.9% of all Americans, including all of us commenting here.

Brennan is not believed to have violated any of the rules regarding TS material he has handled. If he did it needs brought out and his clearance needed revoked.

If Brennan has gained TS material since leaving office, an investigation needs opened because it is highly probably someone gave him information he did not have a need to know.

To the best knowledge of anyone commenting, normally the director of the agency involved would revoke clearance. That did not happen here, the President did. The president taking this step unilaterally is exceedingly rare.

Am I missing anything? I don't get how any of that is controversial.

You forgot the part of how people are such disciples of Trump that they rush to defend his unprecedented authoritarian actions with complete disregard for the above facts you’ve accurately stated.

 

[twenty02]

This has been a strange thread. I haven't seen anyone suggest we need to impeach Trump, or stage a coup, or anything like that. Just that taking this unprecedented step out of anger over Mueller is wrong. I don't have a remedy, I don't think there is a remedy afforded to anyone. Let's see where I am off:

Brennan held a very high position in the US government, even without clearance he is in demand as an analyst because he knows the system better than 99.9% of all Americans, including all of us commenting here.

Brennan is not believed to have violated any of the rules regarding TS material he has handled. If he did it needs brought out and his clearance needed revoked.

If Brennan has gained TS material since leaving office, an investigation needs opened because it is highly probably someone gave him information he did not have a need to know.

To the best knowledge of anyone commenting, normally the director of the agency involved would revoke clearance. That did not happen here, the President did. The president taking this step unilaterally is exceedingly rare.

Am I missing anything? I don't get how any of that is controversial.

Nope....you pretty much nailed it.

I'd also say that Trump's interview with the WSJ pretty much made all of the discussion moot, anyway.

He just comes out and says he did it because Brennan was part of the original Russia investigation. What's left to really debate after that?

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Nope....you pretty much nailed it.

I'd also say that Trump's interview with the WSJ pretty much made all of the discussion moot, anyway.

He just comes out and says he did it because Brennan was part of the original Russia investigation. What's left to really debate after that?

Which raises the question, is this going to happen to everyone in the intel agencies that agreed Russia tried to interfere? Which would seem likely to be the intent, to create that fear.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

That’s what I was alluding to in my secret squirrel network post. It doesn’t exist. If anyone is being spoon fed info without NTK, it’s the spoon feeders crime.

I've learned quite a bit from this thread, but I gotta be honest, a lot of it is just common sense. I mean, I already assumed that access required both clearance and need-to-know, even for guys with emeritus status.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Which raises the question, is this going to happen to everyone in the intel agencies that agreed Russia tried to interfere? Which would seem likely to be the intent, to create that fear.

Way to turn the corruption level all the way to eleven.