Petty? Pathetic? Pitiful? What say you?

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

I've learned quite a bit from this thread, but I gotta be honest, a lot of it is just common sense. I mean, I already assumed that access required both clearance and need-to-know, even for guys with emeritus status.

It’s understandable when laymen don’t fully understand that a clearance is akin to a license and not tied to a specific job wherein the cleared immediately loses it at cessation of employment.

It isn’t understandable to continue to deny basic facts after being educated by multiple people all saying the same exact thing and continue to use BS talking points and cognitive dissonance.

 

[zeke4ahs]

It shouldn't be hard for a Republican DOJ with a Republican Senate and a Republican House to look into that?

They are...much like the Mueller probe, these things take time.

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/aug/15/adam-lovinger-pentagon-analyst-lost-security-clear/

https://www.redstate.com/streiff/2018/05/18/fbi-outing-stefan-halper-informant-trump-campaign/

I think there was a concerted effort by beltway insiders to sink Trump. I am with CoH in that is what Strzok was referring to with his talks with Page. I think Trump is acting rationally against the people he picked out personally...but whatever, in the end we are all going to believe what we believe.

Yet all actual evidence points to the contrary, the reopening of the emails, the not telling us about the Russia investigation, points to just the opposite conclusion. But I guess in Trump world we all actually have to pretend the emperor has clothes.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

It’s understandable when laymen don’t fully understand that a clearance is akin to a license and not tied to a specific job wherein the cleared immediately loses it at cessation of employment.

That was one of the things I learned. I mean, that obviously would be the case for people actually working in intelligence, but without thinking about it much, I guess I had always assumed that low-level employees of contractors and such would be given a temporary clearance that would extend only the length of a specific job. Now that you guys have explained, I see how inefficient that would be, considering that many of these employees would probably need to go through such a process numerous times over the course of their careers.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Way to turn the corruption level all the way to eleven.

I wouldn't say it is his primary motivation, more a side benefit.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

That was one of the things I learned. I mean, that obviously would be the case for people actually working in intelligence, but without thinking about it much, I guess I had always assumed that low-level employees of contractors and such would be given a temporary clearance that would extend only the length of a specific job. Now that you guys have explained, I see how inefficient that would be, considering that many of these employees would probably need to go through such a process numerous times over the course of their careers.

If you go onto a federal job board site you’ll see that countless jobs require the applicant to have a clearance. This doesn’t preclude uncleared from getting the job and the company to invest in getting the uncleared a clearance but an already cleared bloke will have the upper hand.

Another way to look at what Trump did is to say that the Governor of Indiana, without damning evidence, removes a retired surgeon’s medical license (thus rendering him unable to practice medicine should he decide to re-enter the field) because he opposed the governor politically.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I doubt requesting clearances be revoked will be a thing, but this retired Admiral prefers his be revoked to stand with Brennan.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

I doubt requesting clearances be revoked will be a thing, but this retired Admiral prefers his be revoked to stand with Brennan.

Bill McRaven is perhaps the manliest man to have ever walked the Earth.

The #NewGOP should take note that this walking, talking badass from Texas of SEAL Team 6 is speaking in solidarity with Brennan (whom armchair critics here call a “clown” without being able to explain why) and speaking out against Trump’s historically dictatorial act.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Bill McRaven is perhaps the manliest man to have ever walked the Earth.

The #NewGOP should take note that this walking, talking badass from Texas of SEAL Team 6 is speaking in solidarity with Brennan (whom armchair critics here call a “clown” without being able to explain why) and speaking out against Trump’s historically dictatorial act.

Ouch. That is short and right to the point.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Jesus Christ this is not that hard to understand. He has a gig because he used to be the MFing Director of Central Intelligence. He is a credible commentator on intelligence and national security.

If he is being supplied confidential information because he is a media commentator, then the person supplying the info is in breach of US Code.

Sometimes you can admit you have no clue what you’re talking about. It’s enlightening.

You are being naive. Sure, holding the title of former CIA Director gives him gravitas in some minds, but he’s been part of government for decades and if you don’t think he doesn’t talk to his friends and associates about what he talks about on the air you aren’t thinking.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Bill McRaven is perhaps the manliest man to have ever walked the Earth.

The #NewGOP should take note that this walking, talking badass from Texas of SEAL Team 6 is speaking in solidarity with Brennan (whom armchair critics here call a “clown” without being able to explain why) and speaking out against Trump’s historically dictatorial act.

Lol. Anybody who takes seriously Trump’s joke about the missing 30k emails is every bit a clown. Intelligence is an art and it involves interpreting many things. Brennan has shown without a doubt he had no business being in the CIA building let alone CIA Director.

 

[Sope Creek]

. . . if you don’t think he doesn’t talk to his friends and associates about what he talks about on the air you aren’t thinking.

Ennnhhhh . . . are you saying that Brennan talks with "friends and associates" with access to currently classified information - new information that Brennan didn't have access to during his time of governmental service or private experience working on classified matters - and discloses that currently classified information as part of his on-air work?

If not, what are you saying?

 

[CO. Hoosier]

This has been a strange thread. I haven't seen anyone suggest we need to impeach Trump, or stage a coup, or anything like that. Just that taking this unprecedented step out of anger over Mueller is wrong. I don't have a remedy, I don't think there is a remedy afforded to anyone. Let's see where I am off:

Brennan held a very high position in the US government, even without clearance he is in demand as an analyst because he knows the system better than 99.9% of all Americans, including all of us commenting here.

Brennan is not believed to have violated any of the rules regarding TS material he has handled. If he did it needs brought out and his clearance needed revoked.

If Brennan has gained TS material since leaving office, an investigation needs opened because it is highly probably someone gave him information he did not have a need to know.

To the best knowledge of anyone commenting, normally the director of the agency involved would revoke clearance. That did not happen here, the President did. The president taking this step unilaterally is exceedingly rare.

Am I missing anything? I don't get how any of that is controversial.

Yeah, you missed the part about all former CIA directors living in mostly quiet dignity and providing objective comments when asked. Brennan sold his professionalism to a left wing outlet and spews nothing but stupid hate, as today’s NYT oped showed.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Yeah, you missed the part about all former CIA directors living in mostly quiet dignity and providing objective comments when asked. Brennan sold his professionalism to a left wing outlet and spews nothing but stupid hate, as today’s NYT oped showed.

You need to read the admiral's statement on Brennan.

That said, Donald Trump has spewed nothing but hate for 70 years. I cannot wait to see your reaction when the Democratic president in 2021 strips his clearance.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Lol. Anybody who takes seriously Trump’s joke about the missing 30k emails is every bit a clown. Intelligence is an art and it involves interpreting many things. Brennan has shown without a doubt he had no business being in the CIA building let alone CIA Director.

The tandem biker is able to judge intelligence director’s competence from Colorado. You’re a legend.

Furthermore, you’re an even better judge of competence than is the former commander of JSOC and SEAL Team 6! You’re amazing!

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Ennnhhhh . . . are you saying that Brennan talks with "friends and associates" with access to currently classified information - new information that Brennan didn't have access to during his time of governmental service or private experience working on classified matters - and discloses that currently classified information as part of his on-air work?

If not, what are you saying?

I don’t think he disclosed secrets on air. I’m not sure how much access he has classified data. I am saying he has unprecedented access to important government players and provides background and otherwise anonymous sourced material to his colleagues. He obviously has a hard-on for Trump and he uses his government trade craft to further his political views. He has monetized his public service.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Jesus Christ.

I wonder if we should mention the way Trump profits on every trip to Mar-a-Lago for monetizing government.

 

[Sope Creek]

I don’t think he disclosed secrets on air. I’m not sure how much access he has classified data. I am saying he has unprecedented access to important government players and provides background and otherwise anonymous sourced material to his colleagues. He obviously has a hard-on for Trump and he uses his government trade craft to further his political views. He has monetized his public service.

I don't think he has a "hard on for Trump". I think he genuinely believes that Trump's presidency is a threat to the US.

As do I.

There's a difference between having a "hard on" for someone on a personal basis and being critical of someone because you think their presence in government is a bad thing. I think Brennan is more in the latter category than the former.

 

[Sope Creek]

I wonder if we should mention the way Trump profits on every trip to Mar-a-Lago for monetizing government.

Go ahead and mention it . . . just so we can watch CO's head explode!

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I don't think he has a "hard on for Trump". I think he genuinely believes that Trump's presidency is a threat to the US.

Right. The admiral said what is below, sounds dang close to me.

Your leadership, however, has shown little of these qualities. Through your actions, you have embarrassed us in the eyes of our children, humiliated us on the world stage and, worst of all, divided us as a nation.​

 

[Sope Creek]

I don’t think he disclosed secrets on air. I’m not sure how much access he has classified data. I am saying he has unprecedented access to important government players and provides background and otherwise anonymous sourced material to his colleagues. He obviously has a hard-on for Trump and he uses his government trade craft to further his political views. He has monetized his public service.

BTW, Newt Gingrich has monetized his time in government so much that he's become an embarrassment every time he opens his mouth, even if it's just to say pleasantries. I'm convinced he runs for president just to add "presidential candidate" to his books' jacket covers. GOP types have generally made a mansion industry* out of monetizing their government service . . . a recent example is Ollie North switching to shilling for the NRA.

*In contrast to a cottage industry, of course.

 

[Sope Creek]

Right. The admiral said what is below, sounds dang close to me.

Your leadership, however, has shown little of these qualities. Through your actions, you have embarrassed us in the eyes of our children, humiliated us on the world stage and, worst of all, divided us as a nation.​

I'd love for Trump to try to berate this admiral face to face . . . I'd bet the admiral would demonstrate extraordinary self-control, in high contrast to Trump . . . which IMHO would show Trump's true colors as a snowflake.

 

[sglowrider]

Bill McRaven is perhaps the manliest man to have ever walked the Earth.

The #NewGOP should take note that this walking, talking badass from Texas of SEAL Team 6 is speaking in solidarity with Brennan (whom armchair critics here call a “clown” without being able to explain why) and speaking out against Trump’s historically dictatorial act.

Dear Mr. President:
Former CIA director John Brennan, whose security clearance you revoked on Wednesday, is one of the finest public servants I have ever known. Few Americans have done more to protect this country than John. He is a man of unparalleled integrity, whose honesty and character have never been in question, except by those who don’t know him.

Therefore, I would consider it an honor if you would revoke my security clearance as well, so I can add my name to the list of men and women who have spoken up against your presidency.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

BTW, Newt Gingrich has monetized his time in government so much that he's become an embarrassment every time he opens his mouth, even if it's just to say pleasantries. I'm convinced he runs for president just to add "presidential candidate" to his books' jacket covers. GOP types have generally made a mansion industry* out of monetizing their government service . . . a recent example is Ollie North switching to shilling for the NRA.

*In contrast to a cottage industry, of course.

Lol. I came very close to including a comment that Brennan has become a left wing Gingrich in one of my posts in this thread.

 

[sglowrider]

 

[dahldc]

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Nuance isn't a strength of yours.

 

[zeke4ahs]

View embedded media

But we on the Cooler know so much better than these clowns.

 

[sglowrider]

Nuance isn't a strength of yours.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Speaking of clowns, Flynn stood on stage at the GOP Convention chanting "Lock her up" and no one took his clearance from him. Please try to tell me how anything Brennan did is more clown-worthy (and Flynn still technically has not had his clearance revoked, it has been suspended).

 

[sglowrider]

But we on the Cooler know so much better than these clowns.

That's because not all of us drank the Koolaid.

 

[toastedbread]

Speaking of clowns, Flynn stood on stage at the GOP Convention chanting "Lock her up" and no one took his clearance from him. Please try to tell me how anything Brennan did is more clown-worthy (and Flynn still technically has not had his clearance revoked, it has been suspended).

How did Kushner get a clearance after repeated none disclosure?

 

[Marvin the Martian]

How did Kushner get a clearance after repeated none disclosure?

That one is covered by an event called "nepotism".

 

[Sope Creek]

Lol. I came very close to including a comment that Brennan has become a left wing Gingrich in one of my posts in this thread.

Suuuure you did . . . but still . . . you didn't.

And if you can't tell the difference between Brennan's concern about the country and Gingrich's shameless profiteering, well, then that speaks volumes about your judgment.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Suuuure you did . . . but still . . . you didn't.

And if you can't tell the difference between Brennan's concern about the country and Gingrich's shameless profiteering, well, then that speaks volumes about your judgment.

Ha. So when Brennan legitimized the whacky position that Trump is guilty of treason, without citing any evidence, he was showing concern for the country? Nah. Brennan wa well paid for that and he did it for ratings.

 

[Sope Creek]

Ha. So when Brennan legitimized the whacky position that Trump is guilty of treason, without citing any evidence, he was showing concern for the country? Nah. Brennan wa well paid for that and he did it for ratings.

Is the notion that Trump has committed treason "whacky"?

Not having evidence to support a legal case for that statement is one thing, I get that . . . but "treason" has become a fairly diminished charge these days what with conservative talk shows calling everything from immigration policy they don't like to Obama's Iran deal "treasonous". In that spirit - if not the letter of the law - I could see Trump's public call on Russian to released the hacked Clinton emails to be within the range of conversational use of "treasonous".

Plus we don't really have all the facts that either Brennan - or Mueller - have access to. So isn't premature to call the notion that Trump has committed treason "whacky"?

I don't think so.

 

[Joe_Hoopsier]

View embedded media

Deep state crap right here. .. "I know my little Johnny killed a bus load of nuns, but since he's a good boy it is almost highly unlikely and mostly practically unprecedented that it had ever happened before". Or something like that. Now for the Cha Cha slide... to the left, to the left to the left.

 

[Sope Creek]

Deep state crap right here. .. "I know my little Johnny killed a bus load of nuns, but since he's a good boy it is almost highly unlikely and mostly practically unprecedented that it had ever happened before". Or something like that. Now for the Cha Cha slide... to the left, to the left to the left.

My sense is that the GOP is working its damnedest to create a deep state where there is none, and one that serves the interests of the GOP's donors and officials at the expense of the American public. And Trump's their vehicle for doing so, because they've been thwarted in their prior attempts to accomplish this.

The GOP - at least as it currently is constituted - is a major threat to American democracy, and is more so with its collaboration - collusion, if you want to go there - with Russian to undermine both the democratic process and the US' domestic policy dialogue.

 

[wiede]

Deep state crap right here. .. "I know my little Johnny killed a bus load of nuns, but since he's a good boy it is almost highly unlikely and mostly practically unprecedented that it had ever happened before". Or something like that. Now for the Cha Cha slide... to the left, to the left to the left.

Those in the “deep state” have kept us safe for decades. The idea that there’s somehow some coordinated cabal of intelligence professionals/services that all work together towards a single goal of undermining Trump and his team is absolutely laughable.

These are agencies that fight among themselves. Often because they have competing interests in the same matters.

And now they can suddenly coordinate a secret conspiracy to undermine Trump???

I’ve got to hand it to Trump. He feeds some of you this stuff, and you guys absolutely eat it up.

 

[wiede]

My sense is that the GOP is working its damnedest to create a deep state where there is none, and one that serves the interests of the GOP's donors and officials at the expense of the American public. And Trump's their vehicle for doing so, because they've been thwarted in their prior attempts to accomplish this.

The GOP - at least as it currently is constituted - is a major threat to American democracy, and is more so with its collaboration - collusion, if you want to go there - with Russian to undermine both the democratic process and the US' domestic policy dialogue.

We need to pin a running comparison to events in watergate to what’s happening now. The parallels are striking- and they keep happening.

Asking a foreign government for emails from your opponent (that would be hacked/stolen) and meeting with a foreign enemy in too many instances to count (among all of team Trump, with many of those meetings hidden, or at least were attempted to be hidden) is absolutely taking us into treasonous territory.

Never mind Kushner trying to set up a secret back channel outside of our security services. Or, mixing Trump businesses with foreign governments (multiple examples of him profiting off of his official position). And I could go on. There are several more examples.

And, maybe most damning, taking the side of a ruthless dictator in a hostile foreign power when it comes to protecting our voting system is perhaps the most damning of all. That’s the very foundation of our being, and Trump not only allows it to happen- he actively looks away while it’s happening, and tries to undermine the credibility of those sounding the alarms.

I’ll hand it to Trump again- he does it all in plain view, and slowly wears out our ability to define what he’s doing as abnormal.

A typical Trump week has a year or more’s worth of “normal” political scandals- and we’ve come to accept it as normal.

Well, at least some of us have. Not all of us

 

[Joe_Hoopsier]

Those in the “deep state” have kept us safe for decades. The idea that there’s somehow some coordinated cabal of intelligence professionals/services that all work together towards a single goal of undermining Trump and his team is absolutely laughable.

These are agencies that fight among themselves. Often because they have competing interests in the same matters.

And now they can suddenly coordinate a secret conspiracy to undermine Trump???

I’ve got to hand it to Trump. He feeds some of you this stuff, and you guys absolutely eat it up.

We have no fear of a Hitler because of our 8 year max on the Pres. There's a check and balance there. But what about the tenor of the most influential person in the IC (CIA director) on the planet? Add the director of the FBi..... I am sorry and I do NOT want to believe in any of this (and not sure I do, but), but so much of the last two years has CIA (with a Clinton machine help) written all over it.
Trump is a dip shit, that I voted for and will again if things keep going as they are. But this is very much beyond him. He's just a very well driven opportunist that is totally NOT ideological, yet Pragmatic. If we truly want solvers instead of party lines, WTF is the probelm?

 

[MonroeCity]

There are two separate and distinct issues here. Brennan's clearance and his access. His access to classified programs should of ended the day he left Langley. He no longer occupies a billet requiring access nor does he have need to know. Clearances are different. Clearances are in effect for a period of years and can be extended by a refresher, so to speak, investigation. When you leave government your clearance is in effect until it lapses but a clearance without need to know is nothing. People leaving the military and government with high security clearances are in big demand with Beltway contractors.