Covid was let loose on the World for one reason, to get rid of Trump! If you lost someone thank Nancy Pelosi!
US Dept of Energy on COVID: Lab Leak Most Likely Cause
- Thread starter JamieDimonsBalls
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To be fair, Trump could've handled things much better than he did. He encouraged people to get vaccinated and drug companies to produce vaccines as fast as possible while also actively cultivating contempt for vaccines. His throw-ideas-against-the-wall-in-hopes-one-might-stick strategy probably did cause some people to die needlessly.
As with most things during his presidency, he couldn't get out of his own way. He had to interject himself into those press briefings even when there were days it was clear he had no idea what he was talking about.
I feel like it was an instance of we didn't know what we didn't know. There was also a groundswell of xenophobia which prominent far-right wingers didn't help/exacerbated by labeling it the 'China-virus' or 'Wuhan flu.'
I agree that there were signs that it pointed to a lab leak being a strong possibility early on, but to prematurely state that with such strong conviction without iron-clad evidence - which most certainly did happen - didn't really help matters.
To be fair, Joe Biden promised to end this virus. How is he doing?
It is always clear Joe Biden has no idea WTH he is talking about in a press conference. can you imagine that doddering old fool dealing with the start of covid? He has barely said anything about it since he has been in office.
Cray to be fair to Biden Administration, he always has Elizabeth Warren to fall back on when he needs Advice!
OK. Cool story bro.
Weird to toss out the 'Biden is senile' troupe here. At the very least, Biden would have done better getting out of his own way. I'd never claim another president could have navigated something as unprecedented as COVID flawlessly and without regret.
That said, to defend Trump's handling of it takes a truckload of selective memory loss and revisionism.
Exactly. He has nobody to blame but himself b/c his inability to win reelection was 100% his own fault.
Really? Cool story how you know what Biden would have done. Obviously from his press conference history he is often totally lost. I used word doddering , you used senile. He tried to shake hands with someone who wasn't there in one appearance. So by your reasoning you are calling me senile? You are just clueless to facts living in your liberal utopia.
Again what has Biden done to stop the virus as he claimed he was going to do in his campaign?
I will amend that to "during flu season", which is still now. The problem with COVID is it is always present, unlike the flu.
When there are airborne communicable diseases that particular groups are at higher risk, we should mask when interacting with them.
I don't know what Biden would have done in February/March 2020. I do think it's likely that he wouldn't have made the similar mistake Trump did in trying to interject himself into everything. He hasn't really done that so far.
And I'm not sure what you're getting at asking what Biden has done to stop COVID. Are there still COVID restrictions where you live?
To be fair, Biden has ramped up production of bleach and tanning beds.
That’s nothing but a Democrat Trope.
The Chinese were “disappearing” people, jailing others and destroying records which could have provided evidence. Part of the analysis is the Chinese conduct which showed knowledge of guilt. But, you know, that xenophobic thing wouldn’t allow anyone to speak of it. And Fauci’s systematic denial of gain of function research in Wuhan after Obama stopped it here? The evidence is clear and unmistakable. “Iron clad” is a meaningless standard.
Don't the Chinese routinely do all of that? Rounding up people and destroying anything that makes the government look bad seems pretty run-of-the-mill.
There are two questions, did they mistakenly release COVID? Did COVID accidentally escape a lab? Many imply the former, though their economy has been hit harder than ours (their two lowest growth rates since 1970 have been in 2020 and 2022 during a time they had major lockdowns). The accidental release isn't "proven" but is certainly plausible. I don't know how we can prove it since I suspect that would require intel we don't want to share.
Trummp made no mistakes that amounted to anything. The mistakes of extended economic shut downs, extended school closures, the failure to educate about immune health, the failure to research therapies and therapeutics , the nursing home disasters, the testing screw ups, the masks messaging screw-ups, the “Dark Winter” and other scary predictions, the shutting down of outdoor parks, etc etc. etc. we’re all important mistakes and were all the result of bad expert advice, power-hungry governors, or of Democratic campaign politics.
Trump’s mistakes were what they always are; his big mouth. That had little or nothing to do with anything in the long run.
I whole-heartedly disagree - plenty of people knee-jerked to the conclusion that the Chinese surely unleashed COVID on all of us as part of some evil, nefarious plan. Our knee-jerk in chief being one of them.
And while there are nuggets of truth in your second paragraph, it's disingenuous to suggest that we all knew that in real time.
It's akin to looking at a police line up of suspected murders and singling someone out as the killer strictly based on their race. If they later turn out to be the killer based on evidence you weren't yet privy to, it doesn't excuse the fact that your initial assumption was based in racism.
The Chinese clearly were engaged in a cover-up. You don't cover things up if there isn't a reason for such.
The only nuance that should be focused on is intent. I don't believe the Chinese intentionally released COVID. That being said, negligence and poor practices demonstrate why they can't be trusted with nuclear material, among other elements.
More importantly, their culpability isn't admonished because there was a lack of intent. Millions died. Billions of dollars were lost. The economic and mental impact was immense across the globe. The Chinese should pay, economically and politically.
I think I'm mostly with you on all counts. I don't believe the Chinese intentionally released COVID either. And knowing what we know now, there most definitely should be some level of accountability.
I don't know enforcing that level of accountability comes into play though.
I agree with that to a certain extent but you have to remember that people like Putin, XI, and others don't think of a person's life as we do. I think to them a life is no more than a mosquito on your arm to be squashed if it's in your way.
The PRC is an amazingly secretive country, almost up to North Korea levels of paranoia. It is reflexive to cover up anything that makes them look bad even if they aren't directly involved. We can't apply western standards to an organization that has no western mores.
I believe it is quite possible, even probable, China made a mistake. I am just suggesting even if they didn't they would immediately go into paranoid mode and cover up anything that may look bad.
I don't know who you're thinking of, but around these parts, no one was accused of being a conspiracy theorist or anything else simply for suggesting the possibility of a lab leak. It was the wild claim that China unleashed it on purpose that drew criticism, and rightfully so.
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anon_6hv78pr714xta
Guest
I think you're exaggerating Trump's statements. Here's an article from fairly early in the pandemic: April 2020. At that time, Trump offers possibilities. None equate to "knee-jerked" conclusions:
Trump speculates that China released virus in lab 'mistake'
WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump has speculated that China could have unleashed the coronavirus on the world due to some kind of horrible “mistake,” and his intelligence agencies said they are still examining a notion put forward by the president and aides that the pandemic may have...
apnews.com
“It’s a terrible thing that happened,” the president said. “Whether they made a mistake or whether it started off as a mistake and then they made another one, or did somebody do something on purpose.
The IC will continue to rigorously examine emerging information and intelligence to determine whether the outbreak began through contact with infected animals or if it was the result of an accident at a laboratory in Wuhan.”
Should he have spoken like that re "on purpose?" No, but not because it's racist (that charge doesn't even make sense in this instance, as I believe we were posting about in 2020--is there a racial or genetic component to governments' covering up embarrassing things? is that a common trope about Chinese people? ), but because it causes political problems and disincentives the Chinese to provide further information (as did the call for China to pay for COVID's release/spread).
And you freaks still listen to these clowns and call us crazy. Ok sure.
A
anon_6hv78pr714xta
Guest
I'm thinking of the scientists and people in science admin/politics who did so.
I'm not as sure as you that there weren't people on this site aping these claims. I don't feel like searching through those old posts, though.
Goat has very selective memory on this subject.
There may have been some, but I did go back and look around at least a little when this came up a few months ago. And the people complaining had not been promoting a lab leak. They had been promoting a theory of planned release. Some still are in this thread.
The planned release theory makes no sense. If I was planning a release , I’d do it in New York, London, and a few other places. I sure as hell wouldn’t release it in Wuhan. Besides, any planned release would quickly be sourced to Wuhan, anyway assuming those who would trace it are honest.
Bingo. But for those who were/are espousing it, it doesn't have to make sense. It just has to continue to fuel the sense of victimization that is so prevalent among the die-hard Trumpers (you'll note the heavy overlap between people who think the virus was released on purpose and people who angrily feel the pandemic effectively stole reelection from Trump).
Yet it got there anyway and gives them an alibi from you and many others and you aren't Chinese ( at least not part of their government anyway). Which is a crazier theory? The Chinese planning this or the huge coincidences. I don't believe in coincidence.
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A liberal crying victimization is a truly funny statement.
That is not true at all. Posters like outside shooter were very demonstrative on pushing a very set narrative.
The Chinese don't give two shits about their people.
Why wouldn't you release it in Wuhan? So if it was developed in Wuhan but then later released on the other side of the world in a major city you don't think that would make it look very obvious that it was planned? Releasing it in Wuhan gives them a much better excuse to call it an accident.
And it just so happened to come about right when we entering election season and China's most hated President of all time and biggest obstacle to their goal of world domination was up for re-election? Any other year I might give them the benefit of the doubt but that is way too convenient.
CCP government 'intentionally released' COVID-19 'all over the world,' Chinese virologist says
Dr. Li Meng Yan, a Chinese virologist who sounded the alarm about the origins of COVID-19 in early 2020, speaks out after a classified intelligence report from the Energy Department found the virus most likely came from a Chinese lab.
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Bunch of racists and xenophobes. They are against science. You know Mr Science Fauci.
WSJ News Exclusive | Lab Leak Most Likely Origin of Covid-19 Pandemic, Energy Department Now Says
The U.S. agency’s revised assessment of how the pandemic started is based on new intelligence.www.wsj.com
@outside shooter get in here and taste it
The U.S. Energy Department has concluded that the Covid pandemic most likely arose from a laboratory leak, according to a classified intelligence report recently provided to the White House and key members of Congress.
The shift by the Energy Department, which previously was undecided on how the virus emerged, is noted in an update to a 2021 document by Director of National Intelligence Avril Haines’s office.
The new report highlights how different parts of the intelligence community have arrived at disparate judgments about the pandemic’s origin. The Energy Department now joins the Federal Bureau of Investigation in saying the virus likely spread via a mishap at a Chinese laboratory. Four other agencies, along with a national intelligence panel, still judge that it was likely the result of a natural transmission, and two are undecided.
The Energy Department’s conclusion is the result of new intelligence and is significant because the agency has considerable scientific expertise and oversees a network of U.S. national laboratories, some of which conduct advanced biological research.
The Energy Department made its judgment with “low confidence,” according to people who have read the classified report.
The FBI previously came to the conclusion that the pandemic was likely the result of a lab leak in 2021 with “moderate confidence” and still holds to this view.
Because I don’t shit in my own nest.
No I don’t. Think about it. What does China have to gain by shutting down, disabling, or even killing off all its customers? The Chinese aren’t stupid. The pandemic is not in its best economic interest.
For sure, the Chinese are not to be trusted, but if you are hell bent on looking for conspiracies, take a look at green energy. A few months ago Joe committed billions of dollars to Africa to provide green energy. China supplies all the solar and other green hardware to Africa. The Chinese will Expect a return for its investment in the Biden family.
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