Deplorables redux: "White Rural Rage"

[BradStevens]

This is a very good, albeit long, article. It points out some of the fallacies of the liberals in thinking about rural America and Trump supporters, along with spelling out the fallacious interpretation of data that goes on quite a bit:

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/04/05/white-rural-rage-myth-00150395

"If you’ve been watching television or tracking trending topics over the last few weeks, you’ve probably seen or read something about “white rural rage.” This is owed to the publication of a new book, White Rural Rage, by Tom Schaller and Paul Waldman, whose thesis is that white rural Americans, despite representing just 16 percent of the American electorate, are a “threat to the world’s oldest constitutional democracy.”

. . .

The problem with this “rage” thesis is much larger than the fact that my research, and that of others, is being misinterpreted and misunderstood. What the authors are getting wrong about rural America is exactly what many Democrats have been getting wrong for decades — and appear to be doing so again in this critical presidential election year."

 

[Mas-sa-suta]

This is a very good, albeit long, article. It points out some of the fallacies of the liberals in thinking about rural America and Trump supporters, along with spelling out the fallacious interpretation of data that goes on quite a bit:

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/04/05/white-rural-rage-myth-00150395

"If you’ve been watching television or tracking trending topics over the last few weeks, you’ve probably seen or read something about “white rural rage.” This is owed to the publication of a new book, White Rural Rage, by Tom Schaller and Paul Waldman, whose thesis is that white rural Americans, despite representing just 16 percent of the American electorate, are a “threat to the world’s oldest constitutional democracy.”

. . .

The problem with this “rage” thesis is much larger than the fact that my research, and that of others, is being misinterpreted and misunderstood. What the authors are getting wrong about rural America is exactly what many Democrats have been getting wrong for decades — and appear to be doing so again in this critical presidential election year."

There is a huge problem midway in this screed that made me stop reading....Paul Krugman : " Because rural America is poorer than urban America, it pays much less per person in federal taxes, so in practice, major metropolitan areas hugely subsidize the countryside."

What bullshit!

How are these funds disbursed?

Does Krugman(one of the most notable of the abject failure economists) think 'the countryside' receives equitable funding from the fed?

 

[Rockport Zebra]

They are tired of being told that they are privileged and guilty.

 

[Joe_Hoopsier]

This is a very good, albeit long, article. It points out some of the fallacies of the liberals in thinking about rural America and Trump supporters, along with spelling out the fallacious interpretation of data that goes on quite a bit:

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/04/05/white-rural-rage-myth-00150395

"If you’ve been watching television or tracking trending topics over the last few weeks, you’ve probably seen or read something about “white rural rage.” This is owed to the publication of a new book, White Rural Rage, by Tom Schaller and Paul Waldman, whose thesis is that white rural Americans, despite representing just 16 percent of the American electorate, are a “threat to the world’s oldest constitutional democracy.”

. . .

The problem with this “rage” thesis is much larger than the fact that my research, and that of others, is being misinterpreted and misunderstood. What the authors are getting wrong about rural America is exactly what many Democrats have been getting wrong for decades — and appear to be doing so again in this critical presidential election year."

I got this far... before otit was bed time...

In recent years, that rural political identity has morphed into resentment — a collective grievance against experts, bureaucrats, intellectuals and the political party that seeks to Em Overpower them, Democrates

 

[larsIU]

Loved the term "rage peddlers" for these authors. Spot on. Rage, by simple volume of words, is easier to sell than facts or any kind of deep understanding.

Imagine an article titled "Black Urban Rage"**. Why does everything have to be viewed through the lens of race? The author of the article acknowledges that in rural areas dominated by whites there is certainly racial animus. I'm sure that's probably true of any area where 90% of the people are from teh same racial "group" (I hate just typing that), including urban areas. It's not shocking to me that this would be the case.

Factory farms killed family farms - was this just the way the world works or the result of bad policy? (I honestly don't know)

Manufacturing jobs have been sent overseas and the ones that remain don't pay shit

Coal mining is dying or nearly dead already. And, any mining being done requires 10% of the people that it used to.

I think the geography argument is underplayed. As is the socio economic argument. Things like high speed internet development in rural areas don't see color. Democrats would do well to play up and focus on those things which benefit rural folks b/c they'll benefit more than just poor and middle class whites. But stop ridiculing their beliefs and way of life. Stop thinking they are uneducated b/c of these beliefs and start to understand WHY people feel the way they do. It's really not hard for me to understand that if you spend your entire formative years around a singular group (and economic class!) of people, as did your parents and their parents, that you'd have a pretty unbalanced view of other groups of people.



**I can and it would probably be a justification/rationalization argument.

 

[Joe_Hoopsier]

White rural Rage...

Anyone ever been to a wedding that had a fight break out ?
Were you involved in the fight?

The current woman that lives in my house and I had been "dating" for a couple weeks and I went to one of her nieces wedding. The Mother of the groom and the mother of the bride, went full blown cat fight, as everyone was being seated.. Of course I was hooked. I said to myself... Self, this is just the kind of EFF'd up family that should be fun, I'm in !

 

[mrhighlife]

White rural Rage...

Anyone ever been to a wedding that had a fight break out ?
Were you involved in the fight?

The current woman that lives in my house and I had been "dating" for a couple weeks and I went to one of her nieces wedding. The Mother of the groom and the mother of the bride, went full blown cat fight, as everyone was being seated.. Of course I was hooked. I said to myself... Self, this is just the kind of EFF'd up family that should be fun, I'm in !

That's a perfect time to raid the bar too. Seems like you wouldn't even get in trouble. The family would just nod in approval between fist thrown.

 

[Bill4411]

White rural Americans do not like change and Trump is perceived as restoring yesteryear.

 

[BCCHoosier]

White rural Rage...

Anyone ever been to a wedding that had a fight break out ?
Were you involved in the fight?

The current woman that lives in my house and I had been "dating" for a couple weeks and I went to one of her nieces wedding. The Mother of the groom and the mother of the bride, went full blown cat fight, as everyone was being seated.. Of course I was hooked. I said to myself... Self, this is just the kind of EFF'd up family that should be fun, I'm in !

Live in a small town and been to a wedding like that. Despise white trash. Especially the ones in my area that sit around and bitch about migrants working their ass off in jobs these lazy asses won't do. Think concrete work, landscaping, and roofing. But yet they want to play the victim card.

Many are stuck. They are unwilling or unable to complete higher education but unwilling to work difficult physical jobs. Easier to sit around and complain. See it every day.

 

[mcmurtry66]

White rural Rage...

Anyone ever been to a wedding that had a fight break out ?
Were you involved in the fight?

The current woman that lives in my house and I had been "dating" for a couple weeks and I went to one of her nieces wedding. The Mother of the groom and the mother of the bride, went full blown cat fight, as everyone was being seated.. Of course I was hooked. I said to myself... Self, this is just the kind of EFF'd up family that should be fun, I'm in !

my cousin got married here. i had a tie in my pocket and when i stood next to my mom (didn't have enough lawn chairs) i told her "told ya i didn't need a tie." not one person wore a tie. people appreciated the venue as they could smoke during the "ceremony." my cousin is a third as in xxxx the third. but there's no second. i don't know how that came about. in the grass next to the pool my uncle did doughnuts while the reception was going on and created a smoke show that overwhelmed the entire ceremony. we ate a pig that they pulled out of hte ground with beans and potato salad on quartered styrofoam plates. as a wedding present i handled his felony dwi. i got it continued for more than six years until the cop retired (and people think judge cannon is slow). then set it for trial knowing the cop wouldn't show. they dumped it. my mom cried and said the wedding was perfect. combined the wedding and reception here (just moved over to the grass) lasted about 18 hours with people coming and going

 

[snarlcakes]

@Spartans9312 your post in the other thread reminded me of this post and think it applies here. It was the first time I started thinking about the concept, but it intuitively makes sense. There has to be a trade offs for running trade deficits and major deficits overall. A lot of that burden falls on the working classes of all races.

Unfortunately, our politicians enjoy power and getting re-elected so they focus on demonizing the people who don’t vote for them. They can’t be honest and say they have been screwing them the past 40 years. It’s easier and more effective to call them deplorables, Magats, or White Christians Nationalists. I hope white rural and brown/black urban people are pissed off, they should be.





Shorter version.

 

[mcmurtry66]

@Spartans9312 your post in the other thread reminded me of this post and think it applies here. It was the first time I started thinking about the concept, but it intuitively makes sense. There has to be a trade offs for running trade deficits and major deficits overall. A lot of that burden falls on the working classes of all races.

Unfortunately, our politicians enjoy power and getting re-elected so they focus on demonizing the people who don’t vote for them. They can’t be honest and say they have been screwing them the past 40 years. It’s easier and more effective to call them deplorables, Magats, or White Christians Nationalists. I hope white rural and brown/black urban people are pissed off, they should be.

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Shorter version.

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The insane prices since Biden took over certainly impact both. Gas alone is a killer. Hard running asphalt trucks and roofing trucks and keeping prices down on bids when customers are also getting killed with prices. The last thing they want to spend money on is repairs. Dems free cheese and lockdowns have been awful for urban and rural folks. But zero chance whoever is pulling Biden’s strings understands same.

 

[snarlcakes]

The insane prices since Biden took over certainly impact both. Gas alone is a killer. Hard running asphalt trucks and roofing trucks and keeping prices down on bids when customers are also getting killed with prices. The last thing they want to spend money on is repairs. Dems free cheese and lockdowns have been awful for urban and rural folks. But zero chance whoever is pulling Biden’s strings understands same.

Oh yeah, inflation and big government is terrible for the working classes. The problem is they can’t tame inflation because the government keeps spending too much.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Oh yeah, inflation and big government is terrible for the working classes. The problem is they can’t tame inflation because the government keeps spending too much.

Of course. And we’re conditioned to pay for necessities. But Jan 6 hostages is the focus. Sad. These unserious people will bring Biden back with no regard of the impact on hundreds of millions while they were about “academic” concerns and semantics

 

[larsIU]

Let’s not be too broad with the term “big government” and its effects on the working class. Certainly things like SS, Medicaid, and Medicare (ie big government) have had life changing positive effects on the middle/working class. There is a civic structure between anarchy and communism that benefits the largest number of citizens possible.

 

[snarlcakes]

Let’s not be too broad with the term “big government” and its effects on the working class. Certainly things like SS, Medicaid, and Medicare (ie big government) have had life changing positive effects on the middle/working class. There is a civic structure between anarchy and communism that benefits the largest number of citizens possible.

There is a threshold. Pick a number. Bottom 50% most likely benefit, the top 50% most likely don’t. The elephant in the room is it’s unsustainable. The current system has been great for boomers, but at a cost of bankrupting the nation.

 

[snarlcakes]

Of course. And we’re conditioned to pay for necessities. But Jan 6 hostages is the focus. Sad. These unserious people will bring Biden back with no regard of the impact on hundreds of millions while they were about “academic” concerns and semantics

At this point, I’m not sure how much it matters. Trump would slow the decline, but I think both parties are content on running massive deficits. I do want to win in 28 so Republicans can maintain control of the Supreme Court.

 

[larsIU]

There is a threshold. Pick a number. Bottom 50% most likely benefit, the top 50% most likely don’t. The other elephant in the room is it’s unsustainable. The current system has been great for boomers, but at a cost of bankrupting the nation.

Yep. It’s a pickle. Humans have only been trying to figure out the best method of organizing ourselves for about 70,000 years.

I think several hundred years into the future there will be less of us. Not more. Either through cataclysm (climate, virus, pick your poison) or planning. The latter probably scarier.

I’ll be dead

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

At this point, I’m not sure how much it matters. Trump would slow the decline, but I think both parties are content on running massive deficits. I do want to win in 28 so Republicans can maintain control of the Supreme Court.

Trump was just as bad as anyone wrt deficits and spending. Almost as bad as Joe. He will slow nothing.

 

[snarlcakes]

Trump was just as bad as anyone wrt deficits and spending. Almost as bad as Joe. He will slow nothing.

Sorry, he wasn’t as bad Joe. The numbers say so. Also, I think the Democrats are less likely to go along with Trump and is our best chance of cuts. The current set up has been a disaster. Republicans in the House have just rolled over and down little to nothing.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

Sorry, he wasn’t as bad Joe. The numbers say so. Also, I think the Democrats are less likely to go along with Trump and is our best chance of cuts. The current set up has been a disaster. Republicans in the House have just rolled over and down little to nothing.

I stipulated that he wasn’t as bad as Joe but that doesn’t mean who wasn’t also worse than anyone else who came before him.

 

[Mas-sa-suta]

Sorry, he wasn’t as bad Joe. The numbers say so. Also, I think the Democrats are less likely to go along with Trump and is our best chance of cuts. The current set up has been a disaster. Republicans in the House have just rolled over and down little to nothing.

The 'Republican Party' should drop the elephant and adopt a naked pants around the ankles ass as it's mascot..

 

[snarlcakes]

I stipulated that he wasn’t as bad as Joe but that doesn’t mean who wasn’t also worse than anyone else who came before him.

Gotcha. I was in a hurry and read it too quickly. I do think the best scenario for less spending would be Trump, a GOP controlled Senate and a Democrat controlled House.

 

[Mas-sa-suta]

Gotcha. I was in a hurry and read it too quickly. I do think the best scenario for less spending would be Trump, a GOP controlled Senate and a Democrat controlled House.

Oh my.....

You would hire Hakeem Jeffries?

 

[snarlcakes]

Oh my.....

You would hire Hakeem Jeffries?

Democrats hate Trump and would refuse to work him. It’s the only way the media would champion government cuts. If Republicans propose it, the media runs all the scare tactics like they did last year and the GOP puckers up and gives in.

 

[Mas-sa-suta]

Democrats hate Trump and would refuse to work him. It’s the only way the media would champion government cuts. If Republicans propose it, the media runs all the scare tactics like they did last year and the GOP puckers up and gives in.

'Democrats hate Trump,etc...'.
Yet you presuppose a Democrat house will cooperate to cut government?

 

[snarlcakes]

'Democrats hate Trump,etc...'.
Yet you presupposes a Democrat house will cooperate to cut government?

It’s a better chance than the current situation.

 

[Spartans9312]

Face Off: Christopher Rufo vs Curtis Yarvin

Curtis Yarvin & Christopher Rufo debate the American Revolution, Power, Strategy, and more

im1776.com

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

This is a very good, albeit long, article. It points out some of the fallacies of the liberals in thinking about rural America and Trump supporters, along with spelling out the fallacious interpretation of data that goes on quite a bit:

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/04/05/white-rural-rage-myth-00150395

"If you’ve been watching television or tracking trending topics over the last few weeks, you’ve probably seen or read something about “white rural rage.” This is owed to the publication of a new book, White Rural Rage, by Tom Schaller and Paul Waldman, whose thesis is that white rural Americans, despite representing just 16 percent of the American electorate, are a “threat to the world’s oldest constitutional democracy.”

. . .

The problem with this “rage” thesis is much larger than the fact that my research, and that of others, is being misinterpreted and misunderstood. What the authors are getting wrong about rural America is exactly what many Democrats have been getting wrong for decades — and appear to be doing so again in this critical presidential election year."

Is this what they are referring to?

 

[BradStevens]

Is this what they are referring to?

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In another thread, @cosmickid and @UncleMark suggested that the abortion violence in the 70s-'20's be attributed to the movement. Under that rationale, are these types of things attributed to the trans movement?

Or, do we differentiate between the mainstream parts of political movements and the fringes? The normal people and the mentally disturbed? How much is the hyperbolic rhetoric of a political movement responsible for the actions of the mentally disturbed who take up the mantle and treat that rhetoric literally?

In another comparison, how close do these things become to fundamentalist Islam, whose rhetoric leads to thousands being murdered at a time? Is religion different from secular ideology, or if your secular ideology leads to murders, deaths, and widespread violence does your ideology now resemble a religion?

I have rough answers to these questions mapped out in my head. But I wonder what the abstract rules are that people think apply--outside their partisan camps.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

In another thread, @cosmickid and @UncleMark suggested that the abortion violence in the 70s-'20's be attributed to the movement. Under that rationale, are these types of things attributed to the trans movement?

Or, do we differentiate between the mainstream parts of political movements and the fringes? The normal people and the mentally disturbed? How much is the hyperbolic rhetoric of a political movement responsible for the actions of the mentally disturbed who take up the mantle and treat that rhetoric literally?

In another comparison, how do close do these things become to fundamentalist Islam, whose rhetoric leads to thousands being murdered at a time? Is religion different from secular ideology, or if your secular ideology leads to murders, deaths, and widespread violence does your ideology now resemble a religion?

I have rough answers to these questions mapped out in my head. But I wonder what the abstract rules are that people think apply--outside their partisan camps.

It occurred to me as I read JDB’s post that if that thing had a MAGA hat on, Cosmic would have already posted a breathless 30,000 word screed on the dangers of the movement.

 

[Joe_Hoopsier]

It occurred to me as I read JDB’s post that if that thing had a MAGA hat on, Cosmic would have already posted a breathless 30,000 word screed on the dangers of the movement.

Comics other screen name is, Al go rhythm.

 

[NPT]

White rural Americans do not like change and Trump is perceived as restoring yesteryear.

Most Americans don't like change once they get things changed to the way they want them. We have too many politicians that think what is good for NY City is good for rural Kansas and those same politicians think they know what is good for them.

 

[Spartans9312]

Excellent thread here from Rubio.

Does this speak to voters like Marv and Mark?

 

[snarlcakes]

View embedded media

Excellent thread here from Rubio.

Does this speak to voters like Marv and Mark?

A lot of those issues stem from being the reserve currency and our policies the last 50 years. It’s one of the trade offs. The dollar losing reserve currency status would be great for the middle class and U.S. industries. You would see a lot of industries coming back to the U.S.

 

[BadWakeboarder]

In another thread, @cosmickid and @UncleMark suggested that the abortion violence in the 70s-'20's be attributed to the movement. Under that rationale, are these types of things attributed to the trans movement?

Or, do we differentiate between the mainstream parts of political movements and the fringes? The normal people and the mentally disturbed? How much is the hyperbolic rhetoric of a political movement responsible for the actions of the mentally disturbed who take up the mantle and treat that rhetoric literally?

In another comparison, how close do these things become to fundamentalist Islam, whose rhetoric leads to thousands being murdered at a time? Is religion different from secular ideology, or if your secular ideology leads to murders, deaths, and widespread violence does your ideology now resemble a religion?

I have rough answers to these questions mapped out in my head. But I wonder what the abstract rules are that people think apply--outside their partisan camps.

@UncleMark will be fair and agree there are loons on both sides that each serve to delegitimize the cause.

@cosmickid will admit no such thing and instead go on a diatribe about Trump that ends with him covered in seed

 

[Spartans9312]

A lot of those issues stem from being the reserve currency and our policies the last 50 years. It’s one of the trade offs. The dollar losing reserve currency status would be great for the middle class and U.S. industries. You would see a lot of industries coming back to the U.S.

I have heard that debate and think there are pros and cons…and you could be correct.

Rubio has made a good case for industrial policy multiple times now. This should speak to the “moderates” I hear so much about. Are the moderate Democrats able to support the policy if pushed by Rubio?

 

[NPT]

@cosmickid will admit no such thing and instead go on a diatribe about Trump that ends with him covered in seed

A three page one at that. 🤣