It’s Mueller Time ....running thread

[CO. Hoosier]

The left says Russia ran highly effective social media campaigns targeting white males in specific stayes to influence their vote.

2) Voter fraud and Russian meddling are two different things. Russia didn't stuff the ballot box, they influenced voters, hacked DNC computers and generally influenced stupid/easily gullible people into believing things like Hillary Clinton running a made up pedophila ring in a made up basement of a pizza restaurant.

It’s human nature for people to blame their misfortune on others or a conspiracy against them. The Democrats and their media and celebrity sycophants can never let this Russia thing go. They were too emotionally invested in Hillary, now they are too emotionally invested in hating Trump. The truth is that Hillary lost because she is Hillary.

The Russians have been shown to be messing with our politics since the days of the civil rights movement. They do it today with the anti-fracking movement. They will do it tomorrow with something else. They see our political chaos as an advantage to them. The Democrat rank and file as well as a few members of Congress are their useful idiots.

When Russia breaks the law prosecutions should happen. Mueller and his gaggle if lawyers turned over every rock where the Russians might be hiding and no important charges resulted.

It’s over.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Exactly. This Russia thing is a huge lie. You guys think Putin is some kind of a clever bogeyman playing Trump. In truth he is playing the Democrats like a fiddle. Remember when he said he wanted Trump to win the election at that presser a year or so ago? You all bit on that and Putin still has his hook in your mouth.

So Putin is funding nationalist movements (and Trump is one) all over the the West simply to anger American liberals?

 

[Rockfish1]

So Putin is funding nationalist movements (and Trump is one) all over the the West simply to anger American liberals?

The Mueller report: Lies!

The Senate Intelligence Committee report: Lies!

 

[hoot1]

It’s human nature for people to blame their misfortune on others or a conspiracy against them. The Democrats and their media and celebrity sycophants can never let this Russia thing go. They were too emotionally invested in Hillary, now they are too emotionally invested in hating Trump. The truth is that Hillary lost because she is Hillary.

The Russians have been shown to be messing with our politics since the days of the civil rights movement. They do it today with the anti-fracking movement. They will do it tomorrow with something else. They see our political chaos as an advantage to them. The Democrat rank and file as well as a few members of Congress are their useful idiots.

When Russia breaks the law prosecutions should happen. Mueller and his gaggle if lawyers turned over every rock where the Russians might be hiding and no important charges resulted.

It’s over.

Wow, so "the Russians have been messing in our politics since the civil right's movement".

This is right out of J. Edgar Hoover's wrongheaded playbook.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

So Putin is funding nationalist movements (and Trump is one) all over the the West simply to anger American liberals?

We don’t know all the social media messages the Russians use. Probably a variety.

 

[iuwclurker]

We don’t know all the social media messages the Russians use. Probably a variety.

So pretend it isn't a problem? Stonewall legislation meant to address it? Push through legislation to support bourbon instead? Should our federal legislators work less? IS their job too taxing already?

 

[CO. Hoosier]

and this effort includes the successful penetration of our election system in all fifty states.

What are you talking about here? Voter data is open for our convenience. Vote tabulation is air-locked.

 

[iuwclurker]

This morning's foray into adversarial sniping reinforces one fact: there is only one prominent candidate who is representing the forces of unity, Joseph Robinette Biden Jr. In 2020 the citizens of the United States of America will have one basic choice to make, to survive or to succumb. Either way, like it or not, we'll all do it together.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

We don’t know all the social media messages the Russians use. Probably a variety.

I know I have brought this up often. In response to Crimea, NATO hit Russia with some very hard sanctions. Russia was surprised at that, and at the severe damage it did to Russia's economy. From that NATO link:

Recent data confirm Russia’s entry into recession, with GDP growth of -2.2% for the first quarter of 2015, as compared to the first quarter of 2014. Recent forecasts suggest a fall in real GDP in the order of 3%-3.5% for 2015, and growth of around zero for 2016.
​

If one wants to act lawless, one would want to weaken the law. Anything that weakens NATO or the UN benefits those that want to operate outside that law. Weakening NATO can be done by getting the individual nations to view themselves first and foremost with little thought for the coalition. Hence, support of nationalists. Particularly people that would break apart the EU, NATO, the UN. Or, as we used to call them here before we started calling them mainstream Republicans, John Birchers.

Now the Birchers help you win elections, so you won't dare criticize them. But I also suspect you are more an internationalist than they are, maybe I am wrong on that. I see people like Twenty and Aloha that I know are.

So yes, Putin may fund a lot of groups. But he has a specific reason for preferring one of the subgroups over the rest. Putin is a big fan of "green teeth".

 

[Marvin the Martian]

It’s always a mistake to feed lying trolls like you, but in fact our entire intelligence apparatus is telling us that Russia is engaged in an unprecedented, extensive, and ongoing campaign to subvert our elections, and this effort includes the successful penetration of our election system in all fifty states. We used to agree that this was outrageous, but now that Trump canoodles with the Rooskies, you Trumpbots think it’s perfectly fine. Yet somehow you claim to be the Real Mercans. What a crock of shit.

As far as voting goes, it is exciting the largest vendor has finally started lobbying for laws to require a voting machine produce a paper ballot or receipt. Some form of a paper trail. Who knows if our politicians will sign on, but there are ZERO good arguments for not having a paper trail. You use your credit card to buy a pack of gum, you get a receipt. You vote for the leader of the free world, nothing is done to back up the computer entry.

 

[Rockfish1]

As far as voting goes, it is exciting the largest vendor has finally started lobbying for laws to require a voting machine produce a paper ballot or receipt. Some form of a paper trail. Who knows if our politicians will sign on, but there are ZERO good arguments for not having a paper trail. You use your credit card to buy a pack of gum, you get a receipt. You vote for the leader of the free world, nothing is done to back up the computer entry.

This is the sort of thing the trolls and Trumpbots say is either a lie or a nothingburger:

The Senate Intelligence Committee concluded Thursday that election systems in all 50 states were targeted by Russia in 2016, an effort more far-reaching than previously acknowledged and one largely undetected by the states and federal officials at the time.

. . . The report — the first volume of several to be released from the committee’s investigation into Russia’s 2016 election interference — came 24 hours after the former special counsel Robert S. Mueller III warned that Russia was moving again to interfere “as we sit here.”

While details of many of the hackings directed by Russian intelligence, particularly in Illinois and Arizona, are well known, the committee described “an unprecedented level of activity against state election infrastructure” intended largely to search for vulnerabilities in the security of the election systems.

It concluded that while there was no evidence that any votes were changed in actual voting machines, “Russian cyberactors were in a position to delete or change voter data” in the Illinois voter database. The committee found no evidence that they did so.​

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Wow, so "the Russians have been messing in our politics since the civil right's movement".

This is right out of J. Edgar Hoover's wrongheaded playbook.

Many Cold War history books talk about this. Both sides weaponized internal political instability and political advocacy—and still do.

 

[Neves]

This is the sort of thing the trolls and Trumpbots say is either a lie or a nothingburger:

The Senate Intelligence Committee concluded Thursday that election systems in all 50 states were targeted by Russia in 2016, an effort more far-reaching than previously acknowledged and one largely undetected by the states and federal officials at the time.

. . . The report — the first volume of several to be released from the committee’s investigation into Russia’s 2016 election interference — came 24 hours after the former special counsel Robert S. Mueller III warned that Russia was moving again to interfere “as we sit here.”

While details of many of the hackings directed by Russian intelligence, particularly in Illinois and Arizona, are well known, the committee described “an unprecedented level of activity against state election infrastructure” intended largely to search for vulnerabilities in the security of the election systems.

It concluded that while there was no evidence that any votes were changed in actual voting machines, “Russian cyberactors were in a position to delete or change voter data” in the Illinois voter database. The committee found no evidence that they did so.​

And basically Mitch has decided to do NOTHING. What a joke.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

This is the sort of thing the trolls and Trumpbots say is either a lie or a nothingburger:

The Senate Intelligence Committee concluded Thursday that election systems in all 50 states were targeted by Russia in 2016, an effort more far-reaching than previously acknowledged and one largely undetected by the states and federal officials at the time.

. . . The report — the first volume of several to be released from the committee’s investigation into Russia’s 2016 election interference — came 24 hours after the former special counsel Robert S. Mueller III warned that Russia was moving again to interfere “as we sit here.”

While details of many of the hackings directed by Russian intelligence, particularly in Illinois and Arizona, are well known, the committee described “an unprecedented level of activity against state election infrastructure” intended largely to search for vulnerabilities in the security of the election systems.

It concluded that while there was no evidence that any votes were changed in actual voting machines, “Russian cyberactors were in a position to delete or change voter data” in the Illinois voter database. The committee found no evidence that they did so.​

I got news for you. All local government computers, including elections, are under constant and perpetual attack. That’s a fact of life these days. Some bigger systems are attacked thousands of times per week.

But you already know this, don’t you.

 

[Neves]

Many Cold War history books talk about this. Both sides weaponized internal political instability and political advocacy—and still do.

My favorite part of the Cold War history books is where the Republicans called the ongoing tension Fake News and chose to take no action.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

My favorite part of the Cold War history books is where the Republicans called the ongoing tension Fake News and chose to take no action.

My favorite action was a POTUS who told Putin to “cut it out”. How did that work out?

 

[Neves]

My favorite action was a POTUS who told Putin to “cut it out”. How did that work out?

Not well, due to there being an entire political party that welcomes help from the Russians and chooses to block any legislation to punish them.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

It concluded that while there was no evidence that any votes were changed in actual voting machines, “Russian cyberactors were in a position to delete or change voter data” in the Illinois voter database. The committee found no evidence that they did so.

Changing voter data? What does that even mean? In Colorado, the online voter data is so friendly to the voter, that I can change “voter data” for anybody for whom I know their birthday. All that I can do is change party affiliation. But when it comes to voting, the security is significantly more stringent.

 

[Rockfish1]

Not well, due to there being an entire political party that welcomes help from the Russians and chooses to block any legislation to punish them.

While also blocking any and all legislation that would defend our elections from the interference our entire intelligence community warns is coming again.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Not well, due to there being an entire political party that welcomes help from the Russians and chooses to block any legislation to punish them.

What legislation do you suggest? This “voter data” concern seems to be a red herring.

 

[T.M.P.]

My favorite action was a POTUS who told Putin to “cut it out”. How did that work out?

My favorite action was a POTUS who told Putin to “find Hillary's emails”. How did that work out?

 

[iuwclurker]

My favorite action was a PUTIS who told Putin to “find Hillary's emails”. How did that work out?

fify and it worked out beyond anyone's wildest dreams.

 

[IUJIM]

My favorite action was a POTUS who told Putin to “find Hillary's emails”. How did that work out?

She acid washed them

 

[hoot1]

It’s human nature for people to blame their misfortune on others or a conspiracy against them. The Democrats and their media and celebrity sycophants can never let this Russia thing go. They were too emotionally invested in Hillary, now they are too emotionally invested in hating Trump. The truth is that Hillary lost because she is Hillary.

The Russians have been shown to be messing with our politics since the days of the civil rights movement. They do it today with the anti-fracking movement. They will do it tomorrow with something else. They see our political chaos as an advantage to them. The Democrat rank and file as well as a few members of Congress are their useful idiots.

When Russia breaks the law prosecutions should happen. Mueller and his gaggle if lawyers turned over every rock where the Russians might be hiding and no important charges resulted.

It’s over.

Last month 13 Russians and several Russian companies were accused of meddling in our elections by the Justice Department.

Putin, of course, denies that the Russian government was involved, and our president probably accepts Putin's declaration just as he has done in the past.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Last month 13 Russians and several Russian companies were accused of meddling in our elections by the Justice Department.

Putin, of course, denies that the Russian government was involved, and our president probably accepts Putin's declaration just as he has done in the past.

I don’t think we can ever stop meddling without restricting access for ourselves. But we can make ourselves more immune than we have. We create divisions and the Russians exploit those divisions. The more divisiveness we have, the better for the Russians. That’s the way medaling works. We do that too. By the way, meddling works domestically also. Liberal interest groups took down a very viable GOP Colorado’s governor candidate in the primaries. The GOP ended up with a dumbass for a candidate. Liberal interests did the same thing to in the Missouri GOP senate primary a few years ago.

 

[hoot1]

I don’t think we can ever stop meddling without restricting access for ourselves. But we can make ourselves more immune than we have. We create divisions and the Russians exploit those divisions. The more divisiveness we have, the better for the Russians. That’s the way medaling works. We do that too. By the way, meddling works domestically also. Liberal interest groups took down a very viable GOP Colorado’s governor candidate in the primaries. The GOP ended up with a dumbass for a candidate. Liberal interests did the same thing to in the Missouri GOP senate primary a few years ago.

CoH, think we can agree that our system of electing representatives is way more vulnerable to meddling than the Russian system which is pretty much devoid of free elections.

Furthermore, as you point out, just having two parties ushers in divisiveness. The Russians have only the Communist Party controlled from the top by a dictator who controls the media.

On top of having a free press, our social media allows individuals and groups to say just about anything with little or no sense of dealing with facts. Propaganda techniques such as guilt by association, gilding the lily, exageration, material taken out of context, and the list goes on prevails in our political dialogue. Propaganda in Russian is the sole domain of Putin and his lackeys.

Could go on and on, but think you get my drift.

 

[zeke4ahs]

My favorite part of the Cold War history books is where the Republicans called the ongoing tension Fake News and chose to take no action.

My favorite action was a POTUS who told Putin to “cut it out”. How did that work out?

My favorite action was when Obama went to
Moscow Mitch with the information and wanted to put out a joint bipartisan statement. Mitch said of course not and threatened President Obama if he put out one of his own. Could it be any more obvious that not just Donnie and his gang of criminals, but also Moscow Mitch encouraged this interference and continue to do so? And again the true Patriots here don’t give a single ish because they support their candidate. And why do Russians support their candidate? Because he’s a moron that is easily manipulated and they likely have blackmail material on him.

 

[UncleMark]

She acid washed them

<pedant>
No, she bleached them.
https://www.bleachbit.org/news/bleachbit-stifles-investigation-hillary-clinton
</pedant>

It's good software. I use it myself.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

This is the sort of thing the trolls and Trumpbots say is either a lie or a nothingburger:

The Senate Intelligence Committee concluded Thursday that election systems in all 50 states were targeted by Russia in 2016, an effort more far-reaching than previously acknowledged and one largely undetected by the states and federal officials at the time.

. . . The report — the first volume of several to be released from the committee’s investigation into Russia’s 2016 election interference — came 24 hours after the former special counsel Robert S. Mueller III warned that Russia was moving again to interfere “as we sit here.”

While details of many of the hackings directed by Russian intelligence, particularly in Illinois and Arizona, are well known, the committee described “an unprecedented level of activity against state election infrastructure” intended largely to search for vulnerabilities in the security of the election systems.

It concluded that while there was no evidence that any votes were changed in actual voting machines, “Russian cyberactors were in a position to delete or change voter data” in the Illinois voter database. The committee found no evidence that they did so.​

Trump and Clinton spent 81 million on Facebook ads.

Russia spent 160,000.

It was in the Mueller report.

Have you read the Mueller report?

 

[Rockfish1]

Trump and Clinton spent 81 million on Facebook ads.

Russia spent 160,000.

It was in the Mueller report.

Have you read the Mueller report?

The report I linked described hacking our election system, not Facebook ads. Can you read?

 

[iuwclurker]

I don’t think we can ever stop meddling without restricting access for ourselves. But we can make ourselves more immune than we have. We create divisions and the Russians exploit those divisions. The more divisiveness we have, the better for the Russians. That’s the way medaling works. We do that too. By the way, meddling works domestically also. Liberal interest groups took down a very viable GOP Colorado’s governor candidate in the primaries. The GOP ended up with a dumbass for a candidate. Liberal interests did the same thing to in the Missouri GOP senate primary a few years ago.

Obama is renowned for being able to present the opposing argument. Your "we" posts suffer credibility when you only cite liberal counter-examples.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

The report I linked described hacking our election system, not Facebook ads. Can you read?

Yes, the original post of yours that I quoted was deleted. I can’t imagine why.

 

[iuwclurker]

Trump and Clinton spent 81 million on Facebook ads.

Russia spent 160,000.

It was in the Mueller report.

Have you read the Mueller report?

Why would Russia waste any money on ads? Their entire internet propaganda machine is free. Do you understand how it works?

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Trump and Clinton spent 81 million on Facebook ads.

Russia spent 160,000.

It was in the Mueller report.

Have you read the Mueller report?

It wasn't just Facebook, Twitter too. One server farm made 9 million Russian tweets. Their social media campaigns have been very successful as far as generating followers and interactions.

 

[T.M.P.]

Trump and Clinton spent 81 million on Facebook ads.

Russia spent 160,000.

It was in the Mueller report.

Have you read the Mueller report?

You believe Russian FIS and GRU uses add space for active measures and hybrid war?

That's absolutely hilarious.... clueless but hilarious.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

Why would Russia waste any money on ads? Their entire internet propaganda machine is free. Do you understand how it works?

I don’t know why, but they did. It was in the Mueller report.

 

[iuwclurker]

I don’t know why, but they did. It was in the Mueller report.

So were commas, semicolons, and hyphens. And?

 

[iuwclurker]

It’s over.

It's over only for Russian Dog Republicans.

 

[iuwclurker]

Senator Ron Wyden, Democrat of Oregon, appended an impassioned dissent to the report, arguing that the committee did not go far enough. “The committee report describes a range of cybersecurity measures needed to protect voter registration databases,” he wrote, “yet there are currently no mandatory rules that require states to implement even minimum cybersecurity measures. There are not even any voluntary federal standards.”
​

Have we become an anarchy of bumbling states?

 

[Rockfish1]

It wasn't just Facebook, Twitter too. One server farm made 9 million Russian tweets. Their social media campaigns have been very successful as far as generating followers and interactions.

And of course paid ads were only a tiny part of the Russian social media campaign, as anyone who’d actually read the Mueller report would know. Those who care about what the facts are on this point should read pages 14-35 of Volume I of the Mueller report — although much of it is redacted due to “Harm to Ongoing Matter”.