Future Indictments

[Bowlmania]

What do you think? How many more? If the over/under was set at 2.5, I'd go with the over.

1) Fulton County GA. This one's a certainty. Trump will be charged with election interference, racketeering and probably other crimes. It looks like this indictment will be unsealed in late July or August.

2) United States District Court for the District of Columbia. The documents case isn't Jack Smith's singular focus. He is definitely working on Trump's (and others) election-related criminal conduct. Two fake electors from Nevada were spotted by NBC News earlier this week at the DC courthouse where the January 6 grand jury is meeting. Smith's going to cast a wide net with this indictment; several people could be going down.

3) United States District Court for the District of New Jersey. This one has been gaining traction the last couple of days. There's an article in The Atlantic that speaks to it. Here's the deal. Paragraphs 32 through 36 of the Southern District of Florida indictment describes Trump's unlawful dissemination of classified documents (i.e. showing national defense information to a writer, a publisher and two staffers - - none of whom had security clearances), but he wasn't charged with that in Florida. That's because those crimes occurred at his club in Bedminster NJ. I'm betting on an indictment in the Garden State.

Have I missed any?

 

[mcmurtry66]

What do you think? How many more? If the over/under was set at 2.5, I'd go with the over.

1) Fulton County GA. This one's a certainty. Trump will be charged with election interference, racketeering and probably other crimes. It looks like this indictment will be unsealed in late July or August.

2) United States District Court for the District of Columbia. The documents case isn't Jack Smith's singular focus. He is definitely working on Trump's (and others) election-related criminal conduct. Two fake electors from Nevada were spotted by NBC News earlier this week at the DC courthouse where the January 6 grand jury is meeting. Smith's going to cast a wide net with this indictment; several people could be going down.

3) United States District Court for the District of New Jersey. This one has been gaining traction the last couple of days. There's an article in The Atlantic that speaks to it. Here's the deal. Paragraphs 32 through 36 of the Southern District of Florida indictment describes Trump's unlawful dissemination of classified documents (i.e. showing national defense information to a writer, a publisher and two staffers - - none of whom had security clearances), but he wasn't charged with that in Florida. That's because those crimes occurred at his club in Bedminster NJ. I'm betting on an indictment in the Garden State.

Have I missed any?

Maybe his legacy will be the creation of the first federal criminal mdl

 

[IU_Hickory]

How many is he at now? He had 37 in this last one alone.

Will he break 100?

 

[Stuffshot]

What do you think? How many more? If the over/under was set at 2.5, I'd go with the over.

1) Fulton County GA. This one's a certainty. Trump will be charged with election interference, racketeering and probably other crimes. It looks like this indictment will be unsealed in late July or August.

2) United States District Court for the District of Columbia. The documents case isn't Jack Smith's singular focus. He is definitely working on Trump's (and others) election-related criminal conduct. Two fake electors from Nevada were spotted by NBC News earlier this week at the DC courthouse where the January 6 grand jury is meeting. Smith's going to cast a wide net with this indictment; several people could be going down.

3) United States District Court for the District of New Jersey. This one has been gaining traction the last couple of days. There's an article in The Atlantic that speaks to it. Here's the deal. Paragraphs 32 through 36 of the Southern District of Florida indictment describes Trump's unlawful dissemination of classified documents (i.e. showing national defense information to a writer, a publisher and two staffers - - none of whom had security clearances), but he wasn't charged with that in Florida. That's because those crimes occurred at his club in Bedminster NJ. I'm betting on an indictment in the Garden State.

Have I missed any?

In all these, I wonder about the element of "attempt." I don't know whether attempted (whatever) is considered a separate crime or just a sentencing enhancement of the underlying crime.

But Trump definitely attempted to do many bad things, causing effort and expense to, for example, the Georgia government. I think some of that is a crime even if he didn't succeed.

 

[outside shooter]

My granny would have said (if she were with us)

"Dang, he's got more indictments than Carter's got liver pills"

 

[Bowlmania]

It's Indictment Night in Georgia and this is probably the final jurisdiction where Trump is charged. This is a big one because in the unlikely event that Trump were to win back the White House, he wouldn't be able to pardon himself for any Georgia state convictions. I don't believe Kemp (or any other Georgia governor) could pardon him either.

 

[GiggityGoo]

It's Indictment Night in Georgia and this is probably the final jurisdiction where Trump is charged. This is a big one because in the unlikely event that Trump were to win back the White House, he wouldn't be able to pardon himself for any Georgia state convictions. I don't believe Kemp (or any other Georgia governor) could pardon him either.

True. However, this case is likely very weak.

Unless there is some new explosive evidence relying on the “find 10k votes” line is some seriously weak tea.

Doesn’t come close to meeting intent. I suppose we’ll see.

 

[Bowlmania]

True. However, this case is likely very weak.

Unless there is some new explosive evidence relying on the “find 10k votes” line is some seriously weak tea.

Doesn’t come close to meeting intent. I suppose we’ll see.

Wishful thinking, goo.

The "I just want to find 11,780 votes" t/c is just one piece of this. There was a broad conspiracy to overturn the Georgia election results and I think we'll learn tonight that Trump was at the center of it.

WIllis has been working on this for almost two and a half years. She's left no stone unturned and she's not fvcking around. This won't be a weak case.

 

[Bowlmania]

In all these, I wonder about the element of "attempt." I don't know whether attempted (whatever) is considered a separate crime or just a sentencing enhancement of the underlying crime.

But Trump definitely attempted to do many bad things, causing effort and expense to, for example, the Georgia government. I think some of that is a crime even if he didn't succeed.

Conspiracy.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

she's not fvcking around.

No she isn’t. I think the country is coming to grips with the fact that we are rushing headlong into a great constitutional crisis. Except for the documents case, the Trump indictments all stretch statutes in unprecedented ways. We aren’t talking about a conspiracy to commit shoplifting, we are litigating partisan cases touching the very essence of constitutional sustainability in venues where jury pools are 80- 95% Democrats.

 

[Bowlmania]

No she isn’t. I think the country is coming to grips with the fact that we are rushing headlong into a great constitutional crisis. Except for the documents case, the Trump indictments all stretch statutes in unprecedented ways. We aren’t talking about a conspiracy to commit shoplifting, we are litigating partisan cases touching the very essence of constitutional sustainability in venues where jury pools are 80- 95% Democrats.

Classic.

You can go back to sleep now.

P.S. If Trump doesn't like the jurisdictions, he shouldn't have broken the law in them.

 

[zeke4ahs]

No she isn’t. I think the country is coming to grips with the fact that we are rushing headlong into a great constitutional crisis. Except for the documents case, the Trump indictments all stretch statutes in unprecedented ways. We aren’t talking about a conspiracy to commit shoplifting, we are litigating partisan cases touching the very essence of constitutional sustainability in venues where jury pools are 80- 95% Democrats.

Did you get a sneak peek at this indictment?

 

[Spartans9312]

Quick points re: timing of Trump cases: ex-Georgia LG Geoff Duncan (R) is testifying before the grand jury tomorrow, so my guess of a Tuesday indictment is going to be wrong. It seems like Thursday is now the earliest that will come.

Also, it was overshadowed by all the Hunter news Friday, but Trump’s attorneys had their first appearance before Judge Chutkan in D.D.C., and Chutkan ruled in favor of Trump on the majority of his objections to the protective order. Smith said he would complete discovery by August 28, and Chutkan noted that he had asked for an early trial date. That’s all relatively minor stuff, but more importantly, Chutkan suggested that the trial date would be moved up if the parties take to the media to make inflammatory comments that risk further tainting the jury pool.

Trump responded to Chutkan’s pretty direct statement by bashing her on Truth Social as a partisan hack, so he effectively chose to do exactly what Chutkan said would be necessary to convince her to move the trial date up. My impression from the first conference is that Chutkan isn’t really inclined to treat this case any differently than the rest of her docket because of its obvious political significance, and that Smith had been unlikely to get his January 2 trial date, but Trump so immediately calling Chutkan on her bluff may force her to show she wasn’t bluffing.

 

[Bowlmania]

Quick points re: timing of Trump cases: ex-Georgia LG Geoff Duncan (R) is testifying before the grand jury tomorrow, so my guess of a Tuesday indictment is going to be wrong. It seems like Thursday is now the earliest that will come.

Turn on a news channel. The Fulton County grand jury has returned 10 indictments.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Did you get a sneak peek at this indictment?

No the DA has been leaking the content for a week or two.

 

[Rockport Zebra]

No she isn’t. I think the country is coming to grips with the fact that we are rushing headlong into a great constitutional crisis. Except for the documents case, the Trump indictments all stretch statutes in unprecedented ways. We aren’t talking about a conspiracy to commit shoplifting, we are litigating partisan cases touching the very essence of constitutional sustainability in venues where jury pools are 80- 95% Democrats.

Except for the GA Lt Governor. Ga Republicans may be very mad. Trump cost them and the country.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

You can go back to sleep now.

I post better content in my sleep than you do at your best.

 

[outside shooter]

This is another wonderful day for America and our system of justice.

When even the rich and powerful are eventually held accountable for the crimes that, if any of us normal folks committed, would have us in the slammer in a matter of months.

I feel like playing the Star Spangled Banner and saluting Old Glory.

 

[Stuffshot]

Turn on a news channel. The Fulton County grand jury has returned 10 indictments.

19 defendants (named in the following link). A 98-page indictment.

Live updates: Trump indicted in Georgia election probe by Fulton County grand jury

The latest in District Attorney Fani Willis' investigation into efforts by Donald Trump and his allies to overturn the 2020 presidential election results in the state. Follow here for the latest live news updates.

www.cnn.com

Hard to think they'll get this one to trial before the election.

 

[Stuffshot]

Except for the GA Lt Governor. Ga Republicans may be very mad. Trump cost them and the country.

And then, in that phone call, Trump accused them of allowing election fraud in Georgia and even suggested they may be criminals if they didn't accept his claim that he had won Georgia.

What a great leader of the Republican party! He's a regular Ronald Reagan!

 

[Stuffshot]

This is another wonderful day for America and our system of justice.

When even the rich and powerful are eventually held accountable for the crimes that, if any of us normal folks committed, would have us in the slammer in a matter of months.

I feel like playing the Star Spangled Banner and saluting Old Glory.

Then, here is the text of the indictment:

https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/23909553/read-trump-indictment-in-fulton-county-georgia-probe.pdf

Now you've got something to read tonight.

 

[Bowlmania]

I post better content in my sleep than you do at your best.

I guess it's fair to add "delusional" to your list of "credentials."

 

[Bowlmania]

This is another wonderful day for America and our system of justice.

When even the rich and powerful are eventually held accountable for the crimes that, if any of us normal folks committed, would have us in the slammer in a matter of months.

I feel like playing the Star Spangled Banner and saluting Old Glory.

I'm actually saddened that a US president would pull this kind of shit. Never thought I'd ever see anything like this in the United States.

But I get your point that the system still works, despite Trump's efforts to burn it all down, and I'm grateful for that.

 

[Stuffshot]

I'm actually saddened that a US president would pull this kind of shit. Never thought I'd ever see anything like this in the United States.

But I get your point that the system still works, despite Trump's efforts to burn it all down, and I'm grateful for that.

Easy to make the case that this is the result of (1) electing a spoiled little rich boy who had never had to face consequences his whole life, and/or (2) electing a "businessman" with no prior government experience at all, thus being ignorant of the purposes of government in the first place.

Carter is the only other recent president I can think of who was a businessman. Unlike Trump, Carter was a former governor before he became president.

The goals of running a government are far different from the goals of running a business (or at least should be).

 

[IUINSB]

No she isn’t. I think the country is coming to grips with the fact that we are rushing headlong into a great constitutional crisis. Except for the documents case, the Trump indictments all stretch statutes in unprecedented ways. We aren’t talking about a conspiracy to commit shoplifting, we are litigating partisan cases touching the very essence of constitutional sustainability in venues where jury pools are 80- 95% Democrats.

Very true. He tried to steal the office of president. I'd say that is more than touching the essence of the constitution.

And you have yet to condemn his efforts.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

And you have yet to condemn his efforts.

Have you been sleeping under a rock for a couple of years? I have condemned Trumps post election behavior often. But I haven’t gone all apeshit crazy thinking that he threatened democracy. In fact, I hunk Trumps BS showed how strong our democracy is.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

(2) electing a "businessman" with no prior government experience at all, thus being ignorant of the purposes of government in the first place.

That’s pretty funny. I’d suggest most of those who have only been in government their whole career don’t understand the purpose of government. Trump notwithstanding, many people who have never been part of government might understand its purpose better than those who have. And everybody has experience with government.

 

[zeke4ahs]

Have you been sleeping under a rock for a couple of years? I have condemned Trumps post election behavior often. But I haven’t gone all apeshit crazy thinking that he threatened democracy. In fact, I hunk Trumps BS showed how strong our democracy is.

You say how many people worked with him to do it though? And how Republican politicians were mostly silent about him or actively perpetuating the lie. What is someone like MTG, Jim Jordan, Matt Gaetz ( I could name a dozen more) happened to be Governor of Georgia? What do you think would have happened then?

 

[CO. Hoosier]

You say how many people worked with him to do it though? And how Republican politicians were mostly silent about him or actively perpetuating the lie. What is someone like MTG, Jim Jordan, Matt Gaetz ( I could name a dozen more) happened to be Governor of Georgia? What do you think would have happened then?

Seriously? You are making a “what if “ argument here?

Trump made claims about election integrity, all his claims were tossed in the administrative or judicial process. That’s how the system works. Trump grumbled about that and many people believe his crap. So what?

 

[mcmurtry66]

Seriously? You are making a “what if “ argument here?

Trump made claims about election integrity, all his claims were tossed in the administrative or judicial process. That’s how the system works. Trump grumbled about that and many people believe his crap. So what?

No. There’s a difference between questioning results and attempting to influence/interfere with results. The former is fine the latter isn’t

 

[CO. Hoosier]

No. There’s a difference between questioning results and attempting to influence/interfere with results. The former is fine the latter isn’t

Al gore attempted to change or influence results. The system cranked along and it was over. The difference between Al Gore and Trump is that Trump is a bigger asshole and is he running.

A big part of politics these days is the stable of election attorneys on call in every jurisdiction. Their purpose is to change or influence close results. .

 

[mcmurtry66]

Al gore attempted to change or influence results. The system cranked along and it was over. The difference between Al Gore and Trump is that Trump is a bigger asshole and is he running.

A big part of politics these days is the stable of election attorneys on call in every jurisdiction. Their purpose is to change or influence close results. .

You’re lost on this one.

 

[Spartans9312]

This is another wonderful day for America and our system of justice.

When even the rich and powerful are eventually held accountable for the crimes that, if any of us normal folks committed, would have us in the slammer in a matter of months.

I feel like playing the Star Spangled Banner and saluting Old Glory.

There are plenty of outcomes where Trump is neither president nor in prison in 2025: another Republican winning, hung juries or acquittals, a victory on appeal, or perhaps even Biden commuting a sentence to home confinement. There are a narrow band of political moves he can make now that could trigger real legal (and thus by extent, political) ramifications for him. Obviously he’s not risking any of his defenses or constitutional protections by attacking the judge, but a winter trial isn’t what he wants, and a gag order would not be good for his campaign and fundraising.

 

[Indyhorn]

Did you get a sneak peek at this indictment?

Someone requested Danc read an indictment, and Danc quit the board- are you targeting the dream team? 😝

 

[Spartans9312]

Turn on a news channel. The Fulton County grand jury has returned 10 indictments.

I was wrong. Duncan and others testified yesterday

 

[Stuffshot]

Have you been sleeping under a rock for a couple of years? I have condemned Trumps post election behavior often. But I haven’t gone all apeshit crazy thinking that he threatened democracy. In fact, I hunk Trumps BS showed how strong our democracy is.

So, then, does that mean that you excuse his pre-election behavior?

Trump began his election fraud claims in August, 2020 (three months before the election) in a speech in Wisconsin on August 17, 2020, in which he said, "So we have to win the election. We can't play games. Get out and vote. Do those a beautiful absentee ballots or just make sure your vote gets counted. Make sure because the only way we're going to lose this election is if the election is rigged, remember that. It's the only way we're going to lose this election."

Transcript - Speech: Donald Trump Delivers a Campaign Speech on the Economy in Wisconsin - August 17, 2020 | Factba.se

Speech: Donald Trump Delivers a Campaign Speech on the Economy in Wisconsin - August 17, 2020

factba.se

Go to excerpt 126 in the link.

Trump's despicable strategy started long before the election. Don't excuse it.

 

[Stuffshot]

That’s pretty funny. I’d suggest most of those who have only been in government their whole career don’t understand the purpose of government. Trump notwithstanding, many people who have never been part of government might understand its purpose better than those who have. And everybody has experience with government.

The purpose of government, no matter how specifically described, is to further the public good.

Do you seriously claim Trump's purpose was to promote the public good?

 

[CO. Hoosier]

So, then, does that mean that you excuse his pre-election behavior?

Just stop. I have never excused Trump’s bad behavior. Not once. Not ever.

 

[zeke4ahs]

Seriously? You are making a “what if “ argument here?

Trump made claims about election integrity, all his claims were tossed in the administrative or judicial process. That’s how the system works. Trump grumbled about that and many people believe his crap. So what?

Of course I’m making a what if argument and you did deny to dispel it. Yes, the courts worked. However, as I said, if MTG had been Governor of Georgia, again, I’m not sure what would have happened.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Do you seriously claim Trump's purpose was to promote the public good?

Trump advanced and enacted a number of policies that I think furthered the public good and with which I wholeheartedly agree. On this metric Trump is way ahead of Bid.en, Obama, and many others.