The American Experiment

[Bowlmania]

It's been 247 years since Jefferson launched his big democratic experiment. The experiment continues, and it's being tested unlike at any other point in my lifetime. Who knows how much longer American democracy will endure.

What I do know is that, except for those Americans who have been radicalized and/or prefer strongman leadership to a representative democracy, we have much more in common with each other than differences. Most of us want the same things for ourselves and our families.

While not appearing in the Declaration of Independence, Jefferson once offered this insightful commentary: "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as they are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say that there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.”

Jefferson also once noted: "I believe that every human mind feels pleasure in doing good to another."

A healthy democracy isn't all about "me" and my rights. It benefits from tolerance, kindness and respect for others and their rights.

Happy 4th.

 

[hoot1]

It's been 247 years since Jefferson launched his big democratic experiment. The experiment continues, and it's being tested unlike at any other point in my lifetime. Who knows how much longer American democracy will endure.

What I do know is that, except for those Americans who have been radicalized and/or prefer strongman leadership to a representative democracy, we have much more in common with each other than differences. Most of us want the same things for ourselves and our families.

While not appearing in the Declaration of Independence, Jefferson once offered this insightful commentary: "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as they are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say that there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.”

Jefferson also once noted: "I believe that every human mind feels pleasure in doing good to another."

A healthy democracy isn't all about "me" and my rights. It benefits from tolerance, kindness and respect for others and their rights.

Happy 4th.

Unfortunately, too many of us see the others as being manipulated in ways which are taking the country down the wrong path.

 

[GiggityGoo]

“Strongman leadership” gets bandied around a lot these days. To me it comes down to Jefferson’s vision for how government was supposed to operate.

I think Jefferson would look at a POTUS who passes EO’s knowing full well that they’re unconstitutional as a strong man. A POTUS who delegates to one of his agencies the power to stop landlords from collecting rent.

A persistent undermining of the first branch of government to support one’s own political ends. That’s a strong man to me.

Some people don’t see it that way because of some perceived benevolence attached to eviction morotiums and student loan amnesty.

Those people don’t understand our government at all.

Happy 4th.

 

[vesuvius13]

I also read when the Constitution convention ended and we had a final form of it; Ben Franklin walked out and a woman asked what kind of government we had. "The first record of the anecdote appears in a 1787 journal kept by one of the delegates to the convention, James McHenry of Maryland. He wrote: “A lady asked Dr. Franklin Well Doctor what have we got a republic or a monarchy. A republic replied the Doctor if you can keep it.”
This is from The George Washington University files.

Our founders were concerned about the tyranny of the majority which is why they choose a republic to protect the political minority. They also put in checks and balances to control the power of any one of the three branches of the government. There are many other features to discuss it posters want to but that is the basics of what was established as our government.

 

[vesuvius13]

It's been 247 years since Jefferson launched his big democratic experiment. The experiment continues, and it's being tested unlike at any other point in my lifetime. Who knows how much longer American democracy will endure.

What I do know is that, except for those Americans who have been radicalized and/or prefer strongman leadership to a representative democracy, we have much more in common with each other than differences. Most of us want the same things for ourselves and our families.

While not appearing in the Declaration of Independence, Jefferson once offered this insightful commentary: "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as they are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say that there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.”

Jefferson also once noted: "I believe that every human mind feels pleasure in doing good to another."

A healthy democracy isn't all about "me" and my rights. It benefits from tolerance, kindness and respect for others and their rights.

Happy 4th.

Jefferson clearly didn't know the monsters that lived back then and today as every person doesn't feel good when doing good for others or even wants to do good.

 

[hoot1]

I also read when the Constitution convention ended and we had a final form of it; Ben Franklin walked out and a woman asked what kind of government we had. "The first record of the anecdote appears in a 1787 journal kept by one of the delegates to the convention, James McHenry of Maryland. He wrote: “A lady asked Dr. Franklin Well Doctor what have we got a republic or a monarchy. A republic replied the Doctor if you can keep it.”
This is from The George Washington University files.

Our founders were concerned about the tyranny of the majority which is why they choose a republic to protect the political minority. They also put in checks and balances to control the power of any one of the three branches of the government. There are many other features to discuss it posters want to but that is the basics of what was established as our government.

V13, thought it was the branch as represented by courts which protected minority and individual rights against the tryranny of federal and state governments.

Lately citizens are seeing the courts as being too often politically aligned with the same majority which elects the state and federal governments.

On top of all this, there now exists freedom fighting groups looking for a populist to restore values being lost as the country heads in the wrong direction.

Are we in a period of transition akin to the days when our country was founded with the end result being up for grabs ?

 

[MyTeamIsOnTheFloor]

It's been 247 years since Jefferson launched his big democratic experiment. The experiment continues, and it's being tested unlike at any other point in my lifetime. Who knows how much longer American democracy will endure.

What I do know is that, except for those Americans who have been radicalized and/or prefer strongman leadership to a representative democracy, we have much more in common with each other than differences. Most of us want the same things for ourselves and our families.

While not appearing in the Declaration of Independence, Jefferson once offered this insightful commentary: "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as they are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say that there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.”

Jefferson also once noted: "I believe that every human mind feels pleasure in doing good to another."

A healthy democracy isn't all about "me" and my rights. It benefits from tolerance, kindness and respect for others and their rights.

Happy 4th.

Too many these days see their freedom as the right to demand that others agree with them or be subjected to physical and emotional violence.

I say again, “live and let live.”

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I also read when the Constitution convention ended and we had a final form of it; Ben Franklin walked out and a woman asked what kind of government we had. "The first record of the anecdote appears in a 1787 journal kept by one of the delegates to the convention, James McHenry of Maryland. He wrote: “A lady asked Dr. Franklin Well Doctor what have we got a republic or a monarchy. A republic replied the Doctor if you can keep it.”
This is from The George Washington University files.

Our founders were concerned about the tyranny of the majority which is why they choose a republic to protect the political minority. They also put in checks and balances to control the power of any one of the three branches of the government. There are many other features to discuss it posters want to but that is the basics of what was established as our government.

There are various flavors of democracy, the founders did not want direct decisions by the people like some Greek city-states had. The truth is, that was unworkable in a nation our size even then.

So we are a democratic republic. Republic in that representatives make decision. Democratic in that they are elected by the people (of the people and for the people as well).

Democracy and Republic are far from mutually exclusive. Here is a Hamilton quote, “A representative democracy, where the right of election is well secured and regulated & the exercise of the legislative, executive and judiciary authorities, is vested in select persons, chosen really and not nominally by the people, will in my opinion be most likely to be happy, regular and durable.”

 

[Mas-sa-suta]

There are various flavors of democracy, the founders did not want direct decisions by the people like some Greek city-states had. The truth is, that was unworkable in a nation our size even then.

So we are a democratic republic.

Wrong.

The USA is a Constitutional Republic.

The Constitution, enumerated through The Bill of Rights, is the guarantor of minority rights.

 

[i'vegotwinners]

“Strongman leadership” gets bandied around a lot these days. To me it comes down to Jefferson’s vision for how government was supposed to operate.

I think Jefferson would look at a POTUS who passes EO’s knowing full well that they’re unconstitutional as a strong man. A POTUS who delegates to one of his agencies the power to stop landlords from collecting rent.

A persistent undermining of the first branch of government to support one’s own political ends. That’s a strong man to me.

Some people don’t see it that way because of some perceived benevolence attached to eviction morotiums and student loan amnesty.

Those people don’t understand our government at all.

Happy 4th.

translation,

TJ was no lazy liberal looking for a handout

he paid all his own tuition and rent with the labor of his own slaves.

no handouts for him.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Wrong.

The USA is a Constitutional Republic.

The Constitution, enumerated through The Bill of Rights, is the guarantor of minority rights.

We are a constitutional representative democratic republic. Getting all pissy when someone gets the term wrong is an asshole move.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

There are various flavors of democracy, the founders did not want direct decisions by the people like some Greek city-states had. The truth is, that was unworkable in a nation our size even then.

So we are a democratic republic. Republic in that representatives make decision. Democratic in that they are elected by the people (of the people and for the people as well).

Democracy and Republic are far from mutually exclusive. Here is a Hamilton quote, “A representative democracy, where the right of election is well secured and regulated & the exercise of the legislative, executive and judiciary authorities, is vested in select persons, chosen really and not nominally by the people, will in my opinion be most likely to be happy, regular and durable.”

Strictly speaking, the fact that we are a republic has nothing to do with representative democracy. We are a republic because we have a President instead of a King. "Republic" refers to the form of our executive government, as opposed to a "monarchy." That we are also a representative democracy has no bearing on whether or not we are a republic.

But don't tell the fake pedants that. They love to think they are making a point when they really aren't.

 

[Rockport Zebra]

Strictly speaking, the fact that we are a republic has nothing to do with representative democracy. We are a republic because we have a President instead of a King. "Republic" refers to the form of our executive government, as opposed to a "monarchy." That we are also a representative democracy has no bearing on whether or not we are a republic.

But don't tell the fake pedants that. They love to think they are making a point when they really aren't.

Ben Franklin begs to differ.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Ben Fraklin begs to differ.

No, he doesn't.

 

[Rockport Zebra]

No, he doesn't.

I guess his quote of we have a Republic if you can keep it is irrelevant.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

I guess his quote of we have a Republic if you can keep it is irrelevant.

No, it isn't irrelevant. It proves my point. Perhaps you misunderstood my point.

 

[Rockport Zebra]

No, it isn't irrelevant. It proves my point. Perhaps you misunderstood my point.

I think I understand you very well.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

I think I understand you very well.

He gave that retort in response to someone who asked if we had a republic or a monarchy. As I said, a republic is a form of government in which the head of government is a representative of the people in some form, rather than a hereditary prince, as in a monarchy. How that head is chosen, however, has a lot of options. It doesn't have to be representative democracy, or even any democracy at all. The Roman Republic wouldn't qualify as a democracy by any modern standard. Honestly, neither would Athens. Modern China is a "republic." You think that has anything to do with democracy in any form? I don't.

 

[Rockport Zebra]

He gave that retort in response to someone who asked if we had a republic or a monarchy. As I said, a republic is a form of government in which the head of government is a representative of the people in some form, rather than a hereditary prince, as in a monarchy. How that head is chosen, however, has a lot of options. It doesn't have to be representative democracy, or even any democracy at all. The Roman Republic wouldn't qualify as a democracy by any modern standard. Honestly, neither would Athens. Modern China is a "republic." You think that has anything to do with democracy in any form? I don't.

Thank you for your interpretation.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Thank you for your interpretation.

It's not an interpretation. It's just basic language. I'm a world-class pedant. Don't try to f*ck with me on this.

 

[IUCrazy2]

He gave that retort in response to someone who asked if we had a republic or a monarchy. As I said, a republic is a form of government in which the head of government is a representative of the people in some form, rather than a hereditary prince, as in a monarchy. How that head is chosen, however, has a lot of options. It doesn't have to be representative democracy, or even any democracy at all. The Roman Republic wouldn't qualify as a democracy by any modern standard. Honestly, neither would Athens. Modern China is a "republic." You think that has anything to do with democracy in any form? I don't.

I think China is more of an oligarchy than a Republic.

 

[Bowlmania]

“Strongman leadership” gets bandied around a lot these days. To me it comes down to Jefferson’s vision for how government was supposed to operate.

I think Jefferson would look at a POTUS who passes EO’s knowing full well that they’re unconstitutional as a strong man. A POTUS who delegates to one of his agencies the power to stop landlords from collecting rent.

A persistent undermining of the first branch of government to support one’s own political ends. That’s a strong man to me.

Some people don’t see it that way because of some perceived benevolence attached to eviction morotiums and student loan amnesty.

Those people don’t understand our government at all.

Happy 4th.

Strongman leadership gets "bandied around a lot these days" because there are a number of prominent strongmen around the world in leadership roles - - for example, el-Sisi (Egypt), Edrogan (Turkey), Orban (Hungary), Kim Jong Un (North Korea), Xi (China) and Putin (Russia). Trump has publicly praised all of them.

The constant of strongman leadership is obsession with power and a willingness to do anything (legal or illegal) to remain in power.

Biden's a strongman? Biden? That's a new one! Get back to me when he attempts a self-coup like his predecessor.