I don't really know but it has been stated that IU is a difficult place to get in as a grad transfer. If that is true, then that might be one reason that Archie didn't get/recruit some kids.
Fred to retire, Archie on the clock
- Thread starter Tegray1
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I don't really know but it has been stated that IU is a difficult place to get in as a grad transfer. If that is true, then that might be one reason that Archie didn't get/recruit some kids.
Burke isn't a grad transfer.....but ignorance never keeps you from commenting. And you have no idea why either of them went to Nebraska.
He transferred from RMU because NEB is the only P5 school they wanted him. There’s a reason why NEB lost to UC-Riverside, George Mason, Southern Utah and it’s because guys like Dachon Burke is their best player. Don’t be dumb.
Could be......we do know no effort was made......we don't know why because no one feels like it's a good policy to inform the fans about anything.
Who cares what kind of transfer he is, he’s at NEB for a reason and there’s a reason why NEB will finish below .500 and last in the conference.
Of course it's "assuming they come to IU." The point that you seem to be missing in this reply and others is that it isn't Mack (or Cheatham or Burke) OR any current IU player. There are 2 open scholarships so it would be possible to add another player or two AND have all the current players. It's not complicated math.
Cheatam and Burke and Mack aren’t/weren’t coming to IU to play behind Phinisee/Durham/Green/Smith. I know there were spots available but there’s a reason why those guys transferred from small school to Nebraska and it was because they could get immediate playing time in featured roles. They (or anyone else) weren't going to get that role at IU. There’s a reason why they are at Nebraska and a reason why Nebraska has a 19 point loss on their home floor to UC-Riverside, a loss to Southern Utah, a 21 point loss to George Mason and a reason why they’ll finish last in the B10 and with a record below .500 and it’s because those “guys” aren’t better than what we have or as good as you think they are. I understand adding two more scholarship players for the sake of using all 13 scholarships, but there isn’t a point when those guys are going to be options 8,9,10 off the bench. It takes away from the potential development of guys like Franklin and Hunter who long term are going to be exponentially better and provide more value.
I’m not missing any point, I simply fail to see your point that Archie needed to add 2 more players “just because”.
It’s amazing how disingenuous you are. Your first two sentences are pure conjecture you pulled straight out of your arse.
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And for the people who still incessantly chirp about Archie not using his scholarships; WHO out there is a better option/fit than what we have.
According to ESPN, here were the 5 best available SG’s with immediate eligibility.
1. Admon Gilder-Gonzaga. Averaging 10ppg playing 25 mpg. Started 9/12 games. Shooting 37% from the field, 36% from 3.
2. Christian Keeling-North Carolina. Avg 20mpg starting 5/10 games for a pretty mediocre UNC team. Shooting 32% from the field, 21% from 3 averaging 5ppg. Nowhere near as good as our trio of guards and maybe slightly better than Franklin. Wasn’t coming to IU to play 12 minutes a game off the bench.
3. Jahad Proctor-Purdue. Was guaranteed a starting spot with Edwards and Cline moving on. Avg 30mpg starting every contest. Scores 13 ppg on 41% shooting, 26% from 3 and is considerably less athletic and a worse defender than any of our trio of guards. Would not start at IU.
4. Cameron Justice-Western Kentucky. Avg 30mpg for a mid-major and has started every game scoring 13ppg on 41% 3point shooting. Would have been a solid off the bench guy but transferred home to start immediately.
5. Jaevin Cumberland-Cincinnati. Avg 23 mpg off the bench scoring 10 a game. Shoots 39% from the field and 37% from 3. Also transferred home to play with cousin Jarron Cumberland.
The further down the list you guy it’s guys either transferring to get major minutes at smaller schools or guys putting up numbers who don’t compare to our current rotation players. Our trio of guards are all shooting 45+% from the field and better than 40% from 3. None of the above potential transfers with the exception of maybe Gilder were ever going to start at IU and/or play significant roles.
According to ESPN, here were the 5 best available SG’s with immediate eligibility.
1. Admon Gilder-Gonzaga. Averaging 10ppg playing 25 mpg. Started 9/12 games. Shooting 37% from the field, 36% from 3.
2. Christian Keeling-North Carolina. Avg 20mpg starting 5/10 games for a pretty mediocre UNC team. Shooting 32% from the field, 21% from 3 averaging 5ppg. Nowhere near as good as our trio of guards and maybe slightly better than Franklin. Wasn’t coming to IU to play 12 minutes a game off the bench.
3. Jahad Proctor-Purdue. Was guaranteed a starting spot with Edwards and Cline moving on. Avg 30mpg starting every contest. Scores 13 ppg on 41% shooting, 26% from 3 and is considerably less athletic and a worse defender than any of our trio of guards. Would not start at IU.
4. Cameron Justice-Western Kentucky. Avg 30mpg for a mid-major and has started every game scoring 13ppg on 41% 3point shooting. Would have been a solid off the bench guy but transferred home to start immediately.
5. Jaevin Cumberland-Cincinnati. Avg 23 mpg off the bench scoring 10 a game. Shoots 39% from the field and 37% from 3. Also transferred home to play with cousin Jarron Cumberland.
The further down the list you guy it’s guys either transferring to get major minutes at smaller schools or guys putting up numbers who don’t compare to our current rotation players. Our trio of guards are all shooting 45+% from the field and better than 40% from 3. None of the above potential transfers with the exception of maybe Gilder were ever going to start at IU and/or play significant roles.
You got something better? Why are they playing at 5-6 Nebraska? Are suggestion those 3 are better than the trio of guards we currently have? Are any of them more efficient than our current guards? You think Nebraska is 5-6 starting Phinisee/Green/Durham instead of Mack/Burke/Cheatam?
All I know is they ain’t at IU and I’m not worried about it in the least.
lol People already hate the next AD and no one even has a CLUE who that might be. It doesn't matter who is chosen, there will be a select few that will check out and root against IU to prove their thoughts on the next AD, was right. I am at my wits end with some of the fans here.
Well the football team has 8 wins for the first time in forever, the soccer team is Big Ten Champions again this season, the women's basketball team has never been ranked higher and the men are currently 10-1. I think Glass is smart to choose this time to step aside while IU sports in general are really doing well. Other than keeping Tom Crean a bit too long I think Fred has done a fine job. I have a bigger concern about McRobbie choosing his replacement. McRobbie is on the way out too.
Mcrobbie on the way out is also a good thing. IU over the last decade is at or near the bottom of the big ten in academics and the two major sports. Fb benefited this year from an unusually easy schedule and basketball’s 10-1 record is predicated on a super easy schedule thus far. Far more importantly IU has dipped in every major publication ranking academically. And yes they’re BS, but they create a perception and that matters to kids and parents choosing schools.
I for one am thrilled at the prospect of new leaders at iu. We need them. Our history is way to rich and successful for the mediocrity we’ve come to live with the last 15 plus years.
you can't build a program by hiring and firing coaches every 3 years. not unless you cheat.
Archie's job security doesn't rest upon the quirks of a new athletic director or even making the tournament this year. His job security will depend entirely upon whether or not TJD returns for next season. Without an experienced big man fleet of foot next season, Archie is burnt toast and he probably already knows that, hence the look of trepidation. With TJD next season, IU will be in great shape to make some "noise" of clashing cymbals, no less.
Exactly. I don't see sustained progress at all. I see moments of great basketball followed by a game where they play down to the level of their opponent. Or worse, the team looks totally disinterested. If this isn't Archie's fault, whose fault is it?
With the current state of IU basketball affairs, the current product on the floor with recruited prospects of not much more, coupled with too many more 25 pt/15 rb displays by TJD this season, Fred may be getting out at the right time...before he no longer has that choice. When freshmen of pro basketball pedigree put up those kind of numbers, The League takes notice and their dollars do the talking.
Why does Archie's salary matter? Any coach would have started with the same mess of a roster. I often wonder if Archie would have been better off if he had started over.
You don't think we have a back up PG, but we really haven't had a starting PG most of the year and we are still 10-1. We haven't had our starting shooting guard much of the season either. Durham and Franklin deserve credit for getting us through the first 10 games.
I haven't liked Archie's substitutions in the last couple of games, but he explained it as trying to keep players fresh having played and traveled 3 games in a week. Otherwise, I like the players he is recruiting and the approach he is taking.
You can't ignore that Juwan was challenged and became a very good player under Archie. Durham has improved every year. Damezi has made more progress this year than I expected. TJD is playing at a higher level than I expected. Thompson is doing the little things and shows a toughness we often ignore. I expect Hunter to continue to improve
I like this team. I like the roster balance. I will like it even better next year. You can see an intelligent process to who we bring into the program. I trust the process and Archie is a good coach.
Well, first of all, I'd take #s 1, 4 & 5 for this IU team, no doubt. As for Proctor, he's leading Purdue in minutes played and scoring. So I'd take him as well. Also, In my post, I talked about getting a back-up pg and/or a baseline shooter. I cited the 3 pt %s of Smith, DA, Hunter & Franklin. It was obvious in the Nebraska game that we had no one who could knock down wide-open 3s on the baseline. But, if you want to broaden the range of players we could have considered......
#8 Oregon has 3 transfers, who have the #2,3, and 5 most minutes played on their team. Anthony Mathis, 6-3, plays 26M/game, avg. 11.6 ppg, is hitting .53 on 3s. Chris Duarte is 6-6, plays 27M a game, avg. 10.4 ppg & 5.5 rebs, shoots 32% on 3S. Their 3rd transfer is a 6'7" forward that's playing 27M/game.
Lamar Kimble from #3 U of L....6-0 back-up pg. Avg. 11m/game, shooting .40 on 3s, has a A/TO rate of better than 2 to 1.
The Gilder kid you cite---is 6'4", shoots 37% on 3s, and is playing 25M/game for #2 Gonzaga. They also have 6'3" Ryan Woolridge, 31M/game, 56% on 3s, 11.4 ppg
#10 Baylor has Macio Teague, 6'3"...avg. 31M/game, 34% on 3s, 5 rebs, 15 ppg
#1 Kansas...6-5 Isiah Moss...23M/game, .421 on 3s. From lowly Iowa, a 3 pt specialist.
#24 Texas Tech...Chris Clarke...6'6"....29/M, 9 rebs/game, 25% on 3s
So....it's not just crap programs like Nebraska that are looking for transfers, is it? the guys above are from the #s 1, 2,3,8, 10 & 24 teams in the country. Did we go after any of them? Why the urgency from these programs, and not IU?
It was obvious the roster had these holes coming into the season......Fred talking about how the job was a complete rebuild, Archie talking about how we had to be a great defensive team, using the same language as before last year.....translation: not enough shooters. The only thing that made sense to me was that Hunter was showing enough to Archie that he might be a break-out guy. Now we know that wasn't the case. So....we have another year of wasting the talents of an Indiana Mr. basketball because we can't surround him with guys who can play.
I'd have taken all them too, yet with the exception of Gilder, #4 and #5 obviously weren't going to get the PT/role at IU that they currently have at theschools they are at now. Justice and Cumberland obviously wanted to transfer to schools where they could have started and had featured roles. Those roles weren't available at IU because none of them are better than Phin/Green/Durham. Same thing with Proctor. Proctor was guaranteed a starting spot at Purdue with Edwards and Cline leaving and Newman redshirting. He wasn't going to get that role at IU and Green/Durham are clearly outplaying Proctor.
Mathis is from Portland OR and a high school teammate of Oregon's PG. I'm not going to crucify Archie for not landing a kid wishing to return home for his final season.
Is not having a backup really an issue for this team right now? Didn't IU just blow out one the best defensive teams in the country without it's starting PG? Green and Durham are more than capable of picking up the slack when needed.
Phin/Green/Durham are all shooting 40+% from 3. All with the exception of 2 or 3 guys on that last are WORSE shooters than what we have now.
Who is to say Archie didn't go after any of these guys? Each team is different and has different holes to fill and roles they can/cannot offer.
How much will you like the roster balance if TJD goes pro? Prayer time for IU fans that we don't lose the only stud we have. The Carton kid from Iowa, the Garcia kid from Minnesota.....huge recruiting losses. Yes, Durham & Franklin deserve credit for doing the best they can after being in positions they shouldn't have been in in the first place. 3 years in and the old point guard has recruited 1 point guard.
The salary matters to me because I would expect a higher ROI. This isn't Dayton anymore.
I don't see the urgency and intensity from the guy......after the crap Wisconsin & Nebraska games he talks about how tired the team is....seriously, that's your talking point?
I was happy with him after the Nebraska game for a while because I thought he had benched DG for a couple of his stupid-ass plays. That he was going with a couple of guys who aren't ready, namely Damezi & Franklin, just because he liked how hard they were playing, and was setting an example. Not so much.......
Salary matters bc you expect a roi for what you pay. Pay big bucks you expect big results. I guarantee you salary matters to Miller. It should matter to us too: the folks the school keeps calling and writing asking for more and more money....
All these great players we have, and the wonderful roster balance, and we can't sniff the top 25. Meanwhile:
UL #3
OSU #5
Maryland #7
Dayton !!@$# #13
Michigan #14
MSU #15
PSU # 23
What does that have to do with transfers you jackass? Is UL #3 because they have a backup PG transfer who averages 4 points a game? What transfers does Michigan State, Maryland, Michigan have? Dayton? The team with half the players recruited by Archie? Are you just looking for something to whine about?
Well, I think more in terms of accountability and responsibility. Our chronic mediocrity may or may not be his fault. But it doesn't really matter. He's being paid to put a strong team on the court and, at some point, bring home some trophies and cut down some nets.
I wouldn't be so critical if I had the impression that we've been advancing in the right direction. But I honestly don't think anybody can make a very persuasive argument that we have. Everything's about what we should eventually see, hopefully see -- they can't talk about what we've already seen.
And -- I really hope I end up wrong about this -- I'm skeptical that one more year is going to reveal significantly better results. I guess we'll find out.
I wasn't specifically talking about transfers there, Shit-for-Brains. Try to follow the conversation. But now that you brought it up again, Baylor, Oregon & Gonzaga would not be top 10 except for their transfers. So you are wrong again.
figures you don't understand the college rankings either. lol. about 80% of that ranking is comprised of the scores/ class rankings of incoming HS students and how long it takes them to get a degree (or if they even do.) Raise your admission standards and you climb the rankings. but IU is actually trying to get Indiana HS kids into college. always has been. McRobbie has done a good job keeping that up while also hiring good faculty and upgrading facilities across the board. IU undergrad actually punches above its weight when considering the rankings and scores of its freshmen.
but go ahead and wrap academics into your dopey ball of vague and ignorant dissatisfaction. cool.
#themoreyouknow
Looks disinterested?!? I don’t see that at all. I see a team that strongly wants to win and Archie deserves some credit for that.
So, a good portion of your argument (intended to bolster IU’s academic reputation) is that admissions standards are lower, so the University is better than it seems? That’s as credible as your English proficiency.
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