Minutes Breakdown
- Thread starter IUNorth
- Start date
Galloway will be the first guard off the bench. He will play the point if needed or the 2. Cupps will play but not automatically when Rice is on the bench.
Carlyle started 14 PAC12 games at PG for Stanford. Not sure if Trey will be the better option next year.
Leadership, defense, play at break-neck speed, cause havoc, get into transition make a couple plays, make steal, hit an impossible spinning shot, and then sit .. that's his game,
Points produced in conference.. (Points + Assists)
Per game - Trey 12 .. Kanaan 12 Per 40 .- Kanaan 19 Trey 13
They both had high TO .. KCs were higher but he's far more of a threat. Plus the expected freshman to sophomore bump should happen... We may see KC start at 2 and then slide over when Rice goes out. Or Trey may just start .... It's nice to see so many options ..
Whatever you want to do money wise. Doesn't have to be a lot of money. and sounds good about the 3 consecutive games.
3 games is the old drug suspension, if someone takes themselves out that way it should count.
No1 is getting suspended 3 games for weed under this staff.
I still like seeing Gallo come off the bench creating havoc and turning a game on it's ear.
We are not playing 13 guys. Maybe 8 or 9 in conference. Leal, Newton, and Cupps will likely be on the bench once the conference rolls around. I have no idea how you think leal or newton will see minutes.
Newton would have to beat out like 5 guys to get minutes. Anyone who thinks he is going play much this year is delusional imo
Woodson loves himself some big, physical guards that can lockdown out on the perimeter. If he's 100% healthy he'll get run early in the year with a chance to play his way into the rotation. Might come at the expense of a few less minutes for Tucker/Galloway, but if he can defend at a high level, he will play. I'm not so sure he's going to be 100% healthy.
I like this thread. I look at it in terms of rotations more than individual minutes which is harder to pin down.
I really think that Cupps and Newton could be a heckuva starting backcourt for us in 2 years. But this year once the cupcake part of the schedule is over there will be 8 players getting 20+ minutes. They aren't in that number.
There's the starting 5: Ballo, Reneau, Mgbako, Tucker, Rice
The line-up I think will at some point be our best line-up: Ballo, Mgbako, Tucker, Carlyle, Rice
Then the closers: Reneau, Mgbako, Goode, Galloway and Rice
There will be variations of course but anyone beyond that will fall outside the norm. To include whoever is the big we eventually add.
When deployed properly we have the best team of 8 in the country. There are a lot of cohesive fits that are modern, fast, perimeter defenders. We should be ecstatic right now.
"We need more shooters!!!!" NO we need to win the 3pt +/- defend the 3 at a high level, and improve the quality and frequency of 3pt attempts. We checked that box.
"Reneau has to start at the 4!!!" OK, but but Ill be shocked if the starting Frontline play more than 10mpg together by the start of conference play. There are numerous reasons why and very few why not and by the quality of the bigs we're linked to I think Woody gets it.
"Woody can't coach!!!!" Maybe, we'll know after this year. Baring a key prolonged series of injuries we should be a top ten team, win the Big Ten or BTT , and be an elite 8 team. We should be able to change the national narrative on our style not being a guard friendly perimeter style and be in great shape moving forward.
We still need a better tri-state recruiter than Walsh, or change our name to the Hurry' n Rosemonds.
I really think that Cupps and Newton could be a heckuva starting backcourt for us in 2 years. But this year once the cupcake part of the schedule is over there will be 8 players getting 20+ minutes. They aren't in that number.
There's the starting 5: Ballo, Reneau, Mgbako, Tucker, Rice
The line-up I think will at some point be our best line-up: Ballo, Mgbako, Tucker, Carlyle, Rice
Then the closers: Reneau, Mgbako, Goode, Galloway and Rice
There will be variations of course but anyone beyond that will fall outside the norm. To include whoever is the big we eventually add.
When deployed properly we have the best team of 8 in the country. There are a lot of cohesive fits that are modern, fast, perimeter defenders. We should be ecstatic right now.
"We need more shooters!!!!" NO we need to win the 3pt +/- defend the 3 at a high level, and improve the quality and frequency of 3pt attempts. We checked that box.
"Reneau has to start at the 4!!!" OK, but but Ill be shocked if the starting Frontline play more than 10mpg together by the start of conference play. There are numerous reasons why and very few why not and by the quality of the bigs we're linked to I think Woody gets it.
"Woody can't coach!!!!" Maybe, we'll know after this year. Baring a key prolonged series of injuries we should be a top ten team, win the Big Ten or BTT , and be an elite 8 team. We should be able to change the national narrative on our style not being a guard friendly perimeter style and be in great shape moving forward.
We still need a better tri-state recruiter than Walsh, or change our name to the Hurry' n Rosemonds.
Sometimes strength can compensate to some degree for a lack of athleticism. I expect him to score more, in more different ways, and to improve significantly as a rebounder.
Indiana is 14-6 in games that Leal has played 15 minutes or more.
I don't know if he gets more minutes next year or fewer, but what I can say is that people are over estimating talent vs winning.
One thing that I think Moke Woodson recognizes is what winning basketball looks like. He will figure out which line ups give IU a better chance. My thing with Carlyle is that he just has not proven a single thing as a player. At this point there is no reason to say he is more likely to be on the floor at key times in games until we see how he plays at IU. Gallo and Leal understand what is needed, and if IU can use them to get the ball to guys who can score, then that's what will happen.
With Galloway it is a no brainer. He will play a lot and will be a huge part of whatever they accomplish next year.
But IU has been actually better with Leal in the game playing minutes, and it is because older guys generally make fewer mistakes and are stronger and can do what is expected more often.
I don't know if he gets more minutes next year or fewer, but what I can say is that people are over estimating talent vs winning.
One thing that I think Moke Woodson recognizes is what winning basketball looks like. He will figure out which line ups give IU a better chance. My thing with Carlyle is that he just has not proven a single thing as a player. At this point there is no reason to say he is more likely to be on the floor at key times in games until we see how he plays at IU. Gallo and Leal understand what is needed, and if IU can use them to get the ball to guys who can score, then that's what will happen.
With Galloway it is a no brainer. He will play a lot and will be a huge part of whatever they accomplish next year.
But IU has been actually better with Leal in the game playing minutes, and it is because older guys generally make fewer mistakes and are stronger and can do what is expected more often.
I agree that Newton has a big up-side though he hasn't seen the court yet. But Woody thinks the world of Cupps by playing so early in his career and giving his all. Woody will reward him.
Tamar Bates.
Derek Simpson.
He may come through (Carlyle) he may not. Stanford sucks. So did Missouri. So did Rutgers.
Silliest thing I've read on this website. Carlyle is a legitimate NBA prospect who had his ups and downs (on a bad team) just like every other true freshman in America. He's scored more than double Leal's career points and needed only 23 games to do so. He had scoring outputs of 31 and 28 against legitimate tournament teams last year. No clue how many minutes Carlyle plays next year, but whatever number it is, it'll be 3-4x more than whatever Leal plays. I wouldn't rule out Carlyle being the teams leading scorer next year, he's definitely the best 3 level scorer on the roster and I don't think it's particularly close.
Anyone that's questioning his potential impact is probably just a box score watcher. Everything you wrote is spot on, in my opinion.
The only pause I'd have is whether or not Woody will effectively utilize or maximize his skills and potential? I've been one of Woody's harshest critics with how he's chosen to run his offenses at IU...but even I have to admit he's been opening things up more each year he's been at IU. And this next roster is by far his most versatile, and has the most talent on the perimeter of any of his IU teams. So I'd be pretty surprised if guys like Carlyle and Rice aren't utilized pretty heavily.
He's more likely to be really good than not, in my opinion.
Not sure about these numbers, in B1G play last year TG averaged 10.3 ppg and 5.25 apg. Almost 21 points responsible for in 33.6 mins, 25 per 40
KC averaged 12.5 ppg and 2.9 apg. Basically 18.3 responsible for in 26.6 mins or 27.5 per 40
IIRC correctly he also played out of position. Though listed as a combo he's more a 2 than 1. When Bynam went down KC was put in the PG position.
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/kanaan-carlyle-1.html
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/trey-galloway-1.html
Trey in conference play. 244 PProd in 20 games 673 minutes = 14.5 per 40
Kanaan in conference play. 242 PProd in 19 games. 504 minutes. = 19.21 per 40
PProd is found in the advanced stats section at the bottom. My mistake was representing it as just points and assists ... it's more complicated than that .. . My bad.
The formula ..
Last edited:
In my post I point out that people are too focused on talent instead of winning and the first thing you do is say he is a "legitimate NBA prospect"
I'm hoping he's better than Bates and Gunn, OK? From what I've seen, he turns it over, shoots mediocre from 3, doesn't win, and doesn't defend ball screens very well, but he is a dynamic scorer and passer so he may help with what IU needs at guard offensively. Hopefully he can defend a bit by the time the season heats up.
Troy Williams had a bunch of turnovers and defensive lapses too but he was winning games so it's just tougher to tell what kind of impact Carlyle will have for IU.
But talent....I mean, UK has loads of talent every year and they just pushed out their coach. Talent is just a part of the equation.
Anthony Leal getting to play after sitting the bench for 3.5 years was a feel good subplot in a rather major disappointing season. You go 19-14 and don't make the tournament when guys like Anthony Leal are major "contributors" in your back court. That's the reality of the situation.
What you have described of Kannan Carlyle is the literally the standard ebbs and flows of a talented true freshman. Carlyle's ceiling is the Burj Khalifa compared to that of Anthony Leal and Carlyle has already produced on the court at levels Leal can only dream. Carlyle scored 28 points in his fourth ever career college basketball game in an upset win over Arizona. If we're playing Anthony Leal major minutes next year, it's because we've had a multitude of injuries again and aren't a threat to make the tournament or compete for a B10 championship.
Similar threads
