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Filibuster Racist

stollcpa

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When are normal democrats going to stand up to these idiots and tell them to stop with every issue being racist, homophobic and other identity politics?

 
When are normal democrats going to stand up to these idiots and tell them to stop with every issue being racist, homophobic and other identity politics?


"even a blind squirrel".

in this case she is correct.

the filibuster does have racist roots and usage.

very much so.
 
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When are normal democrats going to stand up to these idiots and tell them to stop with every issue being racist, homophobic and other identity politics?

She didn't say the filibuster was racist. She said the history of the filibuster was rooted in racism. And she was correct. Are you so angry about identity politics that you don't want people to even acknowledge truth anymore?
 
She didn't say the filibuster was racist. She said the history of the filibuster was rooted in racism. And she was correct. Are you so angry about identity politics that you don't want people to even acknowledge truth anymore?

Hell everything rooted in racism, homophobe, xenophobe and all the other phobes.
 
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She didn't say the filibuster was racist. She said the history of the filibuster was rooted in racism. And she was correct. Are you so angry about identity politics that you don't want people to even acknowledge truth anymore?

And the response to that would be, "And what the **** does that have to do with anything today or what the filibuster is today?"

The answer to my question is "nothing". It has become increasingly clear that there is a tactic used (by mostly the left) that anything that stands in their way to advance their view of the world has to be labeled as some type of -ism (usually race) or -phobia (which is usually a misnomer). This is not about racism, it is about the Democrats (who used the filibuster several times the past 4 years) looking for any reason (even the most divisive of reasons) to smash through their plans for the country.

You are parsing words anyway. "This and this is rooted in racism" is the polite way of saying it is racist and it therefore must be purged. I was born at night but not last night.
 
And the response to that would be, "And what the **** does that have to do with anything today or what the filibuster is today?"

The answer to my question is "nothing". It has become increasingly clear that there is a tactic used (by mostly the left) that anything that stands in their way to advance their view of the world has to be labeled as some type of -ism (usually race) or -phobia (which is usually a misnomer). This is not about racism, it is about the Democrats (who used the filibuster several times the past 4 years) looking for any reason (even the most divisive of reasons) to smash through their plans for the country.

You are parsing words anyway. "This and this is rooted in racism" is the polite way of saying it is racist and it therefore must be purged. I was born at night but not last night.

Absolutely

Warren (who is no stranger to using the tool) pulled the racist card in their fight to gain an open runway for the next two years. Yes, the tool has roots based in race but it is not the purpose today any more than any other tool that can be misused.

I have said for decades that this tactic hurts the good work that needs to be done to end true racism, sexism, etc.
 
I am tired. Tired of it all. Why not seriously try to get work done instead of pitting people against each other?

It worked to get Trump elected, it worked to get Biden elected and it works to get agendas through.

You go with what works.

Pulling the race/sex/gender/trans cards works for everyone except those who are actual victims of the oppression. It sets the good causes back. Warren doesn't care about vicims of racism, she cares about power. Her action here was racist as hell, but people don't see that deeply into things.
 
Okay guys. Everything is racist. Politics all day every day so push it 24/7.

BTW I am offended by your comment.
Stoll you might want to go talk to someone.
Every time you post it seems like you're one step closer to eating a revolver.
There's nothing here to get that worked up over.
And no I'm not being cute or snarky.
 
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Christ on a stick.... Are you Russian? You don't know the history of the States?


“Between 1525 and 1866, 12.5 million people were kidnapped from Africa and sent to the Americas through the transatlantic slave trade.”

i Intended to read your link but stopped with the first sentence. Any author who begins a serious discussion with an accusatory theme using passive voice in this way is not worth my time. The reason for passive voice is obvious; the concept of “systematic racism” is itself vague and weak and is employed as a dodge to avoid a discussion of real problems.
 
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I am tired. Tired of it all. Why not seriously try to get work done instead of pitting people against each other?

The Democrats embarrass themselves every day with their comments about inequality and racism. I’m no fan of the reasons offered in support of the Green New Deal, but the Democrats have now made a total joke of green energy and climate change by saying this in support of its climate agenda:

“The BUILD GREEN Infrastructure and Jobs Act will make the big federal investments necessary to transform our country’s transportation system, confront the racial and economic inequality embedded in our fossil fuel economy, and achieve the ambitious targets for 100% clean energy in America.”​
They have gotten to the point where everything is the result of inequality and racism.
 
I am not a trauma expert, but it seems there are two main ways people deal with it. One is to repress it, never speak of it, lock it far away. The other is to discuss it, open up about it.

Slavery/racism was a traumatic event for this country. The right and left are dealing with that trauma in different ways.

Race has been a major influencer in how this country has developed. And on occasion, the right does use it. For example, here is a website devoted to the Austrian School of Economic thought pointing out that minimum wage laws were created for racism, The Racist History of Minimum Wage Laws | Mises Wire
 
I am not a trauma expert, but it seems there are two main ways people deal with it. One is to repress it, never speak of it, lock it far away. The other is to discuss it, open up about it.

Slavery/racism was a traumatic event for this country. The right and left are dealing with that trauma in different ways.

Race has been a major influencer in how this country has developed. And on occasion, the right does use it. For example, here is a website devoted to the Austrian School of Economic thought pointing out that minimum wage laws were created for racism, The Racist History of Minimum Wage Laws | Mises Wire
What’s your point Marv? And I don’t mean that in a snotty way. The trauma of slavery was visited on prior generations. The economic consequences of blacks being late to the party remain today and need to be redressed. At some point the psychological cry of slavery four hundred years ago becomes a crutch does it not? Outward racism has been redressed by countless laws to try to eliminate same. And continues to be redressed as we see in GA. what good comes from the racism rhetoric being used by Dems as it relates to the energy bill etc. To me it just seems like more examples of being opportunistic. I see little attention to crime being addressed or many of the other issues facing large cities and blacks. Just photo opps rushing to Georgia for the spa shooting. No one from the admin is reporting from Chicago re the 21 shot last week.
 
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I am not a trauma expert, but it seems there are two main ways people deal with it. One is to repress it, never speak of it, lock it far away. The other is to discuss it, open up about it.

Slavery/racism was a traumatic event for this country. The right and left are dealing with that trauma in different ways.

Race has been a major influencer in how this country has developed. And on occasion, the right does use it. For example, here is a website devoted to the Austrian School of Economic thought pointing out that minimum wage laws were created for racism, The Racist History of Minimum Wage Laws | Mises Wire

I dispise slavery and racism. That doesn’t mean I can’t be tired of the democrats using it every day for political purposes.
 
How 'bout that Joe Biden, giving you another month to catch your breath before tax filing deadline?

He didn’t. The dumbasses didn’t change first quarter estimate due date. Therefore I have to basically do a person’s return to figure out the required first quarter estimate. Dumb bastards have no clue about the real world.

They’re to damn busy with racism and phobes. Yea I am tired of the idiots.
 
What’s your point Marv? And I don’t mean that in a snotty way. The trauma of slavery was visited on prior generations. The economic consequences of blacks being late to the party remain today and need to be redressed. At some point the psychological cry of slavery four hundred years ago becomes a crutch does it not? Outward racism has been redressed by countless laws to try to eliminate same. And continues to be redressed as we see in GA. what good comes from the racism rhetoric being used by Dems as it relates to the energy bill etc. To me it just seems like more examples of being opportunistic. I see little attention to crime being addressed or many of the other issues facing large cities and blacks. Just photo opps rushing to Georgia for the spa shooting. No one from the admin is reporting from Chicago re the 21 shot last week.

Actually, you point out perfectly the systemic racism. Black on Black crime isn't a problem because White America (left and right) ignores it.

I recall visiting my brother for his retirement party about 20 years ago in Hammond IN. We were in the parking lot of his office and he pointed across the street and said, "that area there is called 'Little Waco' and has the highest crime rate in Indiana". He knew the area well, it was his job to go in there and get kids to come back to school. He saw that I was 'uncomfortable standing out in the near darkness near the highest crime area in Indiana. He said, "don't worry, the criminals know if they cross that street the police will come down on them, they stay over there".

Now maybe he was making that up. But he did run the program to get kids to come back to school and I know he made frequent trips into gang/drug areas to provide outreach for his program. So if it is true, I think he would know. So if it is true, it is part of systemic racism.

The racism discussion can touch on subjects like that. You can Google it yourself because you will not like any links I provide but look up interstate highways cities racism. Local communities decided where interstates should go and were often specifically chosen to separate Black neighborhoods from White.

Air pollution is worse in poor, minority communities than in White, affluent communities (Disparities in the Impact of Air Pollution | American Lung Association ). Are we going to suggest there is absolutely no way racism played a role in that? If we can't bring that up because it divides us, how do we solve the problem? Just ignoring the fact that Blacks get asthma far more than Whites (and thus died of COVID more often) isn't going to solve that problem.

So, might air pollution be an example of systemic racism? Do we have to ignore the idea?

And to point out the other point I made in that article, note that the Austrian School economist pointed out racism in the minimum wage. I am hoping CO, Stoll, and others point out how terrible it is that they did so.
 
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Combining this with Accuro's thread, there is a lot of debate about "race". I like this article Race Is Real, But Not in the Way Many People Think | Psychology Today

There is no inherently biological reason that most starting running backs in the NFL are black or most CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are white. Nor is there a “natural” explanation for why race relations are often difficult, but there are lots of interesting social, political, psychological, and historical ones. Go find out what they are (start by checking out the references below), and bust some myths for yourself.​
 
Actually, you point out perfectly the systemic racism. Black on Black crime isn't a problem because White America (left and right) ignores it.

I recall visiting my brother for his retirement party about 20 years ago in Hammond IN. We were in the parking lot of his office and he pointed across the street and said, "that area there is called 'Little Waco' and has the highest crime rate in Indiana". He knew the area well, it was his job to go in there and get kids to come back to school. He saw that I was 'uncomfortable standing out in the near darkness near the highest crime area in Indiana. He said, "don't worry, the criminals know if they cross that street the police will come down on them, they stay over there".

Now maybe he was making that up. But he did run the program to get kids to come back to school and I know he made frequent trips into gang/drug areas to provide outreach for his program. So if it is true, I think he would know. So if it is true, it is part of systemic racism.

The racism discussion can touch on subjects like that. You can Google it yourself because you will not like any links I provide but look up interstate highways cities racism. Local communities decided where interstates should go and were often specifically chosen to separate Black neighborhoods from White.

Air pollution is worse in poor, minority communities than in White, affluent communities (Disparities in the Impact of Air Pollution | American Lung Association ). Are we going to suggest there is absolutely no way racism played a role in that? If we can't bring that up because it divides us, how do we solve the problem? Just ignoring the fact that Blacks get asthma far more than Whites (and thus died of COVID more often) isn't going to solve that problem.

So, might air pollution be an example of systemic racism? Do we have to ignore the idea?

And to point out the other point I made in that article, note that the Austrian School economist pointed out racism in the minimum wage. I am hoping CO, Stoll, and others point out how terrible it is that they did so.
Good post marv. I don’t need links. I agree with much of this - tho economics/classism is also a factor
 
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Combining this with Accuro's thread, there is a lot of debate about "race". I like this article Race Is Real, But Not in the Way Many People Think | Psychology Today

There is no inherently biological reason that most starting running backs in the NFL are black or most CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are white. Nor is there a “natural” explanation for why race relations are often difficult, but there are lots of interesting social, political, psychological, and historical ones. Go find out what they are (start by checking out the references below), and bust some myths for yourself.​

Forget it. It’s waste of time. Let’s spend every day using systematic racism as an excuse for everything. There’s no hope.
 
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I am tired. Tired of it all. Why not seriously try to get work done instead of pitting people against each other?

You mean like the GOP strategy to say no to everything a democrat tries to pass? It's been over a decade since the GOP has cared about working across the aisle.

Your posts in this thread show you have no problem pitting yourself against other people with the bs spewed at you by rightwing media.

Not sure you should be casting stones when your party has been in "my way or the highway" mode and qanon is spewing out crap like democrat-led pedophile rings and jewish space lasers.
 
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Actually, you point out perfectly the systemic racism. Black on Black crime isn't a problem because White America (left and right) ignores it.

I recall visiting my brother for his retirement party about 20 years ago in Hammond IN. We were in the parking lot of his office and he pointed across the street and said, "that area there is called 'Little Waco' and has the highest crime rate in Indiana". He knew the area well, it was his job to go in there and get kids to come back to school. He saw that I was 'uncomfortable standing out in the near darkness near the highest crime area in Indiana. He said, "don't worry, the criminals know if they cross that street the police will come down on them, they stay over there".

Now maybe he was making that up. But he did run the program to get kids to come back to school and I know he made frequent trips into gang/drug areas to provide outreach for his program. So if it is true, I think he would know. So if it is true, it is part of systemic racism.

The racism discussion can touch on subjects like that. You can Google it yourself because you will not like any links I provide but look up interstate highways cities racism. Local communities decided where interstates should go and were often specifically chosen to separate Black neighborhoods from White.

Air pollution is worse in poor, minority communities than in White, affluent communities (Disparities in the Impact of Air Pollution | American Lung Association ). Are we going to suggest there is absolutely no way racism played a role in that? If we can't bring that up because it divides us, how do we solve the problem? Just ignoring the fact that Blacks get asthma far more than Whites (and thus died of COVID more often) isn't going to solve that problem.

So, might air pollution be an example of systemic racism? Do we have to ignore the idea?

And to point out the other point I made in that article, note that the Austrian School economist pointed out racism in the minimum wage. I am hoping CO, Stoll, and others point out how terrible it is that they did so.

Im not convinced all the conversation about systemic racism is anything more than a dodge. But if there is an agreement about that, I think it’s found in public education. There are reasons why Black and Brown youngsters graduate from high school without the ability to read and do math at levels of their White and Asian counterparts. Since these youngsters become adults with lower skills, and can’t qualify for many well-paying jobs, people will blame systemic racism at the adult level for the inequality. Even more disturbing and disgraceful is the notion that being accomplished in reading, language, and math is itself a racist notion. Believing this will permanently embed the bigotry of low expectations in society thus giving us a permanent and intractable inequality AKA systemic racism. We can and should do better.

I don’t buy the historic social trauma argument either. All of us can identify with mistreatment in our heritage. Mine is a lot more recent than 1620.

As far as interstate highways are concerned, I think you will find that they generally follow the path of lowest property values in both urban and rural areas. They are built near railroads, in flood-prone areas, and even like than Dan Ryan in Chicago, in blighted urban areas as part of Urban Renewal.

Your air pollution argument is nothing more than saying high density urban areas have more pollution than low density areas. No surprise there.

If the story your brother tells about crossing the street is true, I’d call that racism. Systemic has nothing to do with it. Youd have to admit that many police departments have gone further than many other institutions to correct racist practices. We aren’t perfect, and probably never will be, but you can’t deny the progress.

The now ubiquitous claims of racial inequality are essentially the classic technique of forming a conclusion (systemic racism) and than finding and discussing only evidence to support the conclusion. That is where we are today in politics and society in general.
 
I am curious how that responds to the point of the paragraph I linked?

Last summer, three US Fortune 500 companies were led by Blacks. Does that show a problem in the system somewhere or is it just noise and we should entirely ignore it? There are now only 3 Black Fortune 500 CEOS. Here they are. (businessinsider.com)

My response is forget it. I won’t post about this subject. Your cancel culture party is hell bent of making everything race and identity politics. There’s ZERO room to keep it out of all discussions.

Should Biden be cancelled for saying “if you don’t vote for me, you ain’t black?”
 
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Your air pollution argument is nothing more than saying high density urban areas have more pollution than low density areas. No surprise there.

And why is that? Blacks in densely populated urban areas own cars at a far, far lower rate than Whites in suburbia. Not many homes any longer are heated by wood or coal inside the homes. Auto/truck traffic is a primary creator. All those affluent suburban people sitting in long traffic lines on the interstate getting to their offices.

Now, this is more classism than racism. Poor Whites suffer as well. But the people who had money to take part in White Flight are more immune to the problem. Does anyone want to doubt that if air pollution was extreme in Carmel that it wouldn't be dealt with? Poorer people tend to have to cope, wealthier people can fight city hall. It just happens there is a disparity as to which race has a higher percentage of its people in the poor category. But my guess is you do not find America any more classist than racist.

Im not convinced all the conversation about systemic racism is anything more than a dodge. But if there is an agreement about that, I think it’s found in public education.

Education is a problem. Again, I suspect there are class elements. Purely anecdotal, but I grew up relatively poor and a lack of faith that education was important was very endemic. It stretched beyond education, it was even believed that basketball players from my side of town didn't have a shot to play in high school. It didn't matter if they were White or Black. Older, looking back, I believe it became a self-fulfilling prophecy. Those older kids I shared the playground court with that were pretty good developed an attitude that destroyed their chances at the high school level. At the same point, I can see why Blacks would have it worse. If the White kids on those playground courts felt that way when they could easily disguise themselves to fit in, imagine how the Black kids must have felt.

What we need to do is restore the belief in the dream. If someone believes all that ever awaits them is a low-paying job they will hate, if they even get a job, they don't see a need to participate. Even among poor Whites the "why do I need to learn this, it will never apply to my life" was rampant. I doubt that has changed too much in the million years since my youth.

Youd have to admit that many police departments have gone further than many other institutions to correct racist practices. We aren’t perfect, and probably never will be, but you can’t deny the progress.

Up and down the line we have made progress, America is far better today than 60 years ago on race. The question is, are we at the "pat ourselves on the back" moment or the "keep running hard until you hit the tape" moment. Police departments have tried. I, unfortunately, suspect 1) there is no perfect way to screen out racism, and 2) the war on drugs has made areas of racism worse. Private Facebook group for Pittsburgh-area officers shows racism, hostility, hate (nbcnews.com) shows a problem still exists. But yes, police have gotten better.

Conservatives seem FAR angrier that people mention racism than they do about racism itself. It is as if we just never mention the word, it doesn't exist. How many threads have you or Stoll started saying, "here is case of racism that needs addressed"? Do they not exist at all? Or is it not important?
 
Conservatives seem FAR angrier that people mention racism than they do about racism itself.
Anger? No. What is frustrating to me is that Democrats and liberals will subordinate the merits of any issue to race. i Couldn’t believe racism is now part of the GND discussion. That doesn’t make me angry. But I do look on with amazement.
 
I am curious how that responds to the point of the paragraph I linked?

Last summer, three US Fortune 500 companies were led by Blacks. Does that show a problem in the system somewhere or is it just noise and we should entirely ignore it? There are now only 3 Black Fortune 500 CEOS. Here they are. (businessinsider.com)
This and your points in the other posts, while accurate and well-thought out, are quickly lost in a correlation v causation trap. I attended a top tier MBA program. One of my classmates was black. One. You would infer that’s systemic racism and I’d say that’s preposterous. The program had major initiatives to recruit all types of diversity candidates and didn’t get any.

This is what I believe, in no particular order:
  1. There is systemic racism in the US but it is nowhere to scale that the Left would need you to believe and we are making progress every single day.
  2. This is the freest country in the world (for ALL citizens) by a longshot and others need that to change - they need to bring us down.
  3. There are racists on the right and there are bigots on the left.
  4. The Left, in order to consolidate power and gather votes, needs you to believe that white supremacy and white privilege is at the core of all issues facing any community (local or macro) that is struggling overall.
  5. The Right believes in the power of the individual - so much to the point that sometimes we are myopic in forgetting that there is systemic racism at play and the field may not be level
  6. But the left has the loudest voice - and holds all the cards - in how we get to think and act and if we don’t select between their two false choices then we are racists. This false choice leads many otherwise sympathetic white people further into radicalization and is one of the prime reasons Trump won office.
  7. You can only tell a group of people that they are oppressed or something outside of their control is affecting them so many times before the majority will start to believe it. Thus many vocal minorities are now convinced they are oppressed and cannot succeed without things like BLM advocacy and perhaps even reparations
  8. Their are forces at play both domestic and foreign that are gaslighting the populace to further divide us to weaken the country and the media is complicit
  9. I see positive change happening. I see, outside of the usual limo liberals like Lebron or awful NYT woke writers, or horrible liberal arts deans, positive change in the community where people are pushing back on the idea of being oppressed and instead taking action to improve their lot in life. Examples below









 
This and your points in the other posts, while accurate and well-thought out, are quickly lost in a correlation v causation trap. I attended a top tier MBA program. One of my classmates was black. One. You would infer that’s systemic racism and I’d say that’s preposterous. The program had major initiatives to recruit all types of diversity candidates and didn’t get any.

This is what I believe, in no particular order:
  1. There is systemic racism in the US but it is nowhere to scale that the Left would need you to believe and we are making progress every single day.
  2. This is the freest country in the world (for ALL citizens) by a longshot and others need that to change - they need to bring us down.
  3. There are racists on the right and there are bigots on the left.
  4. The Left, in order to consolidate power and gather votes, needs you to believe that white supremacy and white privilege is at the core of all issues facing any community (local or macro) that is struggling overall.
  5. The Right believes in the power of the individual - so much to the point that sometimes we are myopic in forgetting that there is systemic racism at play and the field may not be level
  6. But the left has the loudest voice - and holds all the cards - in how we get to think and act and if we don’t select between their two false choices then we are racists. This false choice leads many otherwise sympathetic white people further into radicalization and is one of the prime reasons Trump won office.
  7. You can only tell a group of people that they are oppressed or something outside of their control is affecting them so many times before the majority will start to believe it. Thus many vocal minorities are now convinced they are oppressed and cannot succeed without things like BLM advocacy and perhaps even reparations
  8. Their are forces at play both domestic and foreign that are gaslighting the populace to further divide us to weaken the country and the media is complicit
  9. I see positive change happening. I see, outside of the usual limo liberals like Lebron or awful NYT woke writers, or horrible liberal arts deans, positive change in the community where people are pushing back on the idea of being oppressed and instead taking action to improve their lot in life. Examples below









Wonderful post
 
This and your points in the other posts, while accurate and well-thought out, are quickly lost in a correlation v causation trap. I attended a top tier MBA program. One of my classmates was black. One. You would infer that’s systemic racism and I’d say that’s preposterous. The program had major initiatives to recruit all types of diversity candidates and didn’t get any.

This is what I believe, in no particular order:
  1. There is systemic racism in the US but it is nowhere to scale that the Left would need you to believe and we are making progress every single day.
  2. This is the freest country in the world (for ALL citizens) by a longshot and others need that to change - they need to bring us down.
  3. There are racists on the right and there are bigots on the left.
  4. The Left, in order to consolidate power and gather votes, needs you to believe that white supremacy and white privilege is at the core of all issues facing any community (local or macro) that is struggling overall.
  5. The Right believes in the power of the individual - so much to the point that sometimes we are myopic in forgetting that there is systemic racism at play and the field may not be level
  6. But the left has the loudest voice - and holds all the cards - in how we get to think and act and if we don’t select between their two false choices then we are racists. This false choice leads many otherwise sympathetic white people further into radicalization and is one of the prime reasons Trump won office.
  7. You can only tell a group of people that they are oppressed or something outside of their control is affecting them so many times before the majority will start to believe it. Thus many vocal minorities are now convinced they are oppressed and cannot succeed without things like BLM advocacy and perhaps even reparations
  8. Their are forces at play both domestic and foreign that are gaslighting the populace to further divide us to weaken the country and the media is complicit
  9. I see positive change happening. I see, outside of the usual limo liberals like Lebron or awful NYT woke writers, or horrible liberal arts deans, positive change in the community where people are pushing back on the idea of being oppressed and instead taking action to improve their lot in life. Examples below










That is a well thought out post, thanks for it. I do not have time to adequately respond. I will suggest this as my quick response, in many issues Blacks are more conservative than much of the rest of the Democratic party. As a group Blacks voted Biden over Bernie and is why Biden won. Most people know Biden is far more moderate (a few will lie and pretend otherwise).

But the GOP has a big problem with the Black vote. Things like trying to outlaw Sunday voting is a large part of it. No one pretends there is fraud in Sunday voting, it is a coordinated effort to reduce Black turnout. There is no other explanation.

A lot of Blacks say there are issues with police relations, including upper-middle class Blacks, including Senator Scott. Too many conservatives the answer is, "You are wrong, there is not a problem and if there is, it is all your fault". It may be too many conservatives just pick their words poorly.

You mention the Black CEO issue. That might make sense but what about sports? Far more Blacks play football and basketball professionally, they have their MBA in their sport (frankly a doctorate). But Blacks are too often underrepresented in coaching and even more underrepresented in management.

I think there have always been examples of Blacks working to better themselves. HBUs are a prime example of a longstanding endeavor. Or here is a great example of Black philanthropy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madam_C._J._Walker

I think you and I agree that one that cannot afford boots cannot pull themselves up by their bootlaces.

You admit systemic racism exists, we can quibble over amounts but we are closer than you might think.

And I agree things have gotten better. The question before us is 1) have we made enough progress 2) if not, can we speed up progress and 3) if so, how?

Which goes back to some of the old discussions here. Too often racists have used the confederate flag as a symbol of White superiority. But it has been slow to make that clear to some of our conservative brethren. The same is true for rebel statues. The Germans figured it out, it is awful hard to build a statue to a WW2 military hero without sending a terrible message to the Jewish population (and other groups). It was not a coincidence our rebel statues building exploded under Jim Crow. But we are supposed to act like it was all purely innocent. And I think you at least see my point, a few other conservatives will not.

I am not Black and I hate posting like this as I have no right to speak for Blacks. But Bing is seldom around and we are poorly represented in Black participation.
 
There is no inherently biological reason that most starting running backs in the NFL are black or most CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are white

WHAT? Are you seriously telling me there are no biological and genetic differences between groups of people based on their historical ethnic makeup?

There are plenty of rational reasons why both may be the case.
 
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WHAT? Are you seriously telling me there are no biological and genetic differences between groups of people based on their historical ethnic makeup?

There are plenty of rational reasons why both may be the case.
Guess he never listened to jimmy the Greek
 
That is a well thought out post, thanks for it. I do not have time to adequately respond. I will suggest this as my quick response, in many issues Blacks are more conservative than much of the rest of the Democratic party. As a group Blacks voted Biden over Bernie and is why Biden won. Most people know Biden is far more moderate (a few will lie and pretend otherwise).

But the GOP has a big problem with the Black vote. Things like trying to outlaw Sunday voting is a large part of it. No one pretends there is fraud in Sunday voting, it is a coordinated effort to reduce Black turnout. There is no other explanation.

A lot of Blacks say there are issues with police relations, including upper-middle class Blacks, including Senator Scott. Too many conservatives the answer is, "You are wrong, there is not a problem and if there is, it is all your fault". It may be too many conservatives just pick their words poorly.

You mention the Black CEO issue. That might make sense but what about sports? Far more Blacks play football and basketball professionally, they have their MBA in their sport (frankly a doctorate). But Blacks are too often underrepresented in coaching and even more underrepresented in management.

I think there have always been examples of Blacks working to better themselves. HBUs are a prime example of a longstanding endeavor. Or here is a great example of Black philanthropy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madam_C._J._Walker

I think you and I agree that one that cannot afford boots cannot pull themselves up by their bootlaces.

You admit systemic racism exists, we can quibble over amounts but we are closer than you might think.

And I agree things have gotten better. The question before us is 1) have we made enough progress 2) if not, can we speed up progress and 3) if so, how?

Which goes back to some of the old discussions here. Too often racists have used the confederate flag as a symbol of White superiority. But it has been slow to make that clear to some of our conservative brethren. The same is true for rebel statues. The Germans figured it out, it is awful hard to build a statue to a WW2 military hero without sending a terrible message to the Jewish population (and other groups). It was not a coincidence our rebel statues building exploded under Jim Crow. But we are supposed to act like it was all purely innocent. And I think you at least see my point, a few other conservatives will not.

I am not Black and I hate posting like this as I have no right to speak for Blacks. But Bing is seldom around and we are poorly represented in Black participation.
I completely agree re coaches. I’m flabbergasted at the lack of superstar coaches to be honest. As to the rest we can keep the dialogue going. I get you, man, and hopefully someday you get me. But I admire you an awful lot.
 
I'll sidestep the racism discussion..... but I do think the filibuster should be eliminated.... or greatly restricted. It has no legitimate constitutional role. And eliminating it would stop allowing it to be used as an safety blanket for the majority party (whichever it may be, from time to time)

Both parties will have to put up or shut up with their rhetoric.... most of which I don't believe many really buy into. It's easy to scream and foam at the mouth on issues when you are 100% sure the minority party will give you the cover of never actually moving controversial legislation forward.

I actually think it may end up having more moderate/bipartisanship legislation move that's long been stalled.

The current system isn't working.
 
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