What’s wrong with people?

[Spartans9312]

My point was about rhetoric. Not science. I'm saying that "you"* turn this into a "lifestyle" because you don't like this, and that this is a common rhetorical tactic. As Mark already pointed out, it's the same thing "you"* did with the gays.

*Obviously I don't mean "you" personally, just the faction of people that you currently represent in this discussion.

We’ve essentially danced in a circle without any real discussion. Until we are able to answer simple questions such as the ones I offered we will never be able to get to the nuts and bolts of the topic. Until then it will be a theoretical discussion that allows both sides to just throw firebombs at the other side.

By “we” I’m not meaning you and I.

 

[Indianaftw]

Do you have any "brothers in Christ" who don't think exactly like you?

Expound please

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

We’ve essentially danced in a circle without any real discussion. Until we are able to answer simple questions such as the ones I offered we will never be able to get to the nuts and bolts of the topic. Until then it will be a theoretical discussion that allows both sides to just throw firebombs at the other side.

By “we” I’m not meaning you and I.

I disagree. I don't think we can meaningfully address the deeper issues until you admit that the reason you are opposed to trans people/rights is that you simply think they are wrong/sinful/dysfunctional/mentally diseased.

 

[TommyCracker]

My point is...Dems call Pubs fascists all the time when they are complete hypocrites about what they spew. You saw my post it was 100% correct.

Was it?

I've been nudged more to the left simply because I better understand the logic behind the rhetoric vs what is coming out from the right.

For example take lock downs....what makes more sense in behavior (not if it's correct or not but from a strategic motivation).

1. There's a deadly virus going around with no cure so the best offense is a good defense....separate, mask up and when it gets really bad lock down.

Or.

2. The evil Dems released this onto the world to get rid of Donald Trump and to control us.

Which to be honest, if that's true that's pretty f#$king sadistic that would make the biggest sociopath go 'DAAAYUM'! I mean we're killing people all over the world just to get Trump out of office (never mind that a national crisis is normally a great thing for an incumbent because we are much less likely to switch leaders during a crisis).

On top of that what is the benefit for Dems in lockdowns? They aren't permanent. They aren't great for the economy? Sure it started in 2020 but the worst year was 2021...what is the benefit politically in locking down, what did I get for my power grab?

It's not logical.

Take the grooming accusations. Again what is the benefit for lib teachers to groom children to be trans cause I can't think of one. Now grooming them to hate republicans....that at least makes logical sense as THERE IS A BENEFIT for doing so, but to encourage kids to be trans??? What's the benefits to me?

If I was a Marvel superhero and my power was I could turn children into trans....why would I even do that unless I'm a complete sociopath that wants children to live a life of terror?

It doesn't make sense.

On the flip side why does turning to fascist tendencies benefit republicans... because you're growing smaller as a group to where democratic methods are getting tougher and tougher to have work for you. Turning to a strongman and collapsing the rights of the opposition groups benefits you.

Now I definitely could be a paranoid wack job over this (I was stunned that there weren't massive fights at the polls like I thought there would be at the mid terms which caused me to wonder if my bearings are a little too skewed) but the logic behind it makes sense as I can see the benefits for it for your ideology.

Anyway, that's all I ask of anyone who gets into highly charged political discussions...just ask yourself what is the benefit for the accusation.

Appreciate the conversation ftw.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Expound please

Do you have any "brothers in Christ" who think gay marriage should be legal? Who think abortion should be legal in at least some cases? Who think trans people are not all mentally ill?

 

[UncleMark]

Well then what was it that got me banned? Twice, and posts removed??? Please share...I mean usually there is a reason. Was it too many report buttons?

I don't believe you were banned, at least not by me. If your posts were removed (by me) it was because you posted little or nothing more than personal invective aimed at another poster. I did lock one thread that went off the rails beginning on the second post. I think you may have had a big part in that, but don't recall for sure. I do what needs to be done and move on.

 

[Spartans9312]

I disagree. I don't think we can meaningfully address the deeper issues until you admit that the reason you are opposed to trans people/rights is that you simply think they are wrong/sinful/dysfunctional/mentally diseased.

Definitely not sinful.
Wrong in what way?
Dysfunctional…probably. But I could be convinced otherwise.
Mentally diseased…I can’t think of one that I’ve dealt with professionally that did not have a DSM-IV diagnosis.

Now do you want to answer the questions I asked?

 

[UncleMark]

Definitely not sinful.
Wrong in what way?
Dysfunctional…probably. But I could be convinced otherwise.
Mentally diseased…I can’t think of one that I’ve dealt with professionally that did not have a DSM-IV diagnosis.

Do these people chose to be dysfunctional or mentally diseased? That's what your "lifestyle" terminology implies.

 

[Spartans9312]

Do these people chose to be dysfunctional or mentally diseased? That's what your "lifestyle" terminology implies.

Wrong. I’ve said all along that I see two scenarios. It’s either a lifestyle choice or it’s a mental health disorder.
Do you see a scenario that I’m missing?

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Wrong. I’ve said all along that I see two scenarios. It’s either a lifestyle choice or it’s a mental health disorder.
Do you see a scenario that I’m missing?

Wait. All the options above seem to dismiss lifestyle, if that's your definition. Is it lifestyle or mental illness?

I can't answer your questions until I understand your definitions.

 

[Spartans9312]

Wait. All the options above seem to dismiss lifestyle, if that's your definition. Is it lifestyle or mental illness?

I can't answer your questions until I understand your definitions.

Lifestyle is a way you choose to live. You have a choice.
Mental illness is a disease…you don’t have a choice.

 

[anon_6hv78pr714xta]

And that's fine, if that's you're opinion. Just don't fall back on "parental rights" on any other related issues. Because it's clearly not about parental rights.

I'm torn on this issue, but I don't understand how supporting this law exposes one as not caring about parental rights. Parents don't get carte blanche when it comes to their children. They never have and no one here has argued for that.

Society setting limits with what parents can and can't do in order to protect children is pretty standard. And here, it's being done through the legislative process.

I support laws that would outlaw a child using crack cocaine, even with parental consent. Does that mean I can't fall back on parental rights on other issues? Of course not.

 

[UncleMark]

Lifestyle is a way you choose to live. You have a choice.
Mental illness is a disease…you don’t have a choice.

So being transsexual is a choice? Is that your contention? That there is nothing intrinsic about it?

 

[DANC]

Ha not me. I put on my snuggie with sleeves and wait for the sweet release of death to find me

You need a male friend. I'm here for you.

 

[Spartans9312]

So being transsexual is a choice? Is that your contention? That there is nothing intrinsic about it?

So this gets back to my question about what is the definition of trans?
Is it someone that wants to be something they are not? Or is it someone that thinks they are something they are not?

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Lifestyle is a way you choose to live. You have a choice.
Mental illness is a disease…you don’t have a choice.

Not an answer.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

I'm torn on this issue, but I don't understand how supporting this law exposes one as not caring about parental rights. Parents don't get carte blanche when it comes to their children. They never have and no one here has argued for that.

Society setting limits with what parents can and can't do in order to protect children is pretty standard. And here, it's being done through the legislative process.

I support laws that would outlaw a child using crack cocaine, even with parental consent. Does that mean I can't fall back on parental rights on other issues? Of course not.

It's inconsistent with the other posts people made about schools usurping parental rights when it comes to gender identity.

 

[Spartans9312]

Not an answer.

Whatever. Just say you don’t want an honest discussion.

 

[anon_6hv78pr714xta]

Do these people chose to be dysfunctional or mentally diseased? That's what your "lifestyle" terminology implies.

Obviously they don't. And they don't choose to be gender dysphoric. I'm uncomfortable calling a surgery to remove a healthy body part (I didn't use the "m" word you don't like, so give me some kudos) a "lifestyle" choice (I don't think that fits at all), but I'm also uncomfortable calling a physical operation to remove a body part so as to ensure a person won't kill themselves a typical medical procedure. I think the latter, in fact, defines the person as mentally ill.

As to public health coverage, if we could determine that we could stop severely depressed suicidal people from committing suicide by taking pills, wouldn't we cover those pills? I guess it would depend on how expensive it was (and yes, cost is a consideration).

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Whatever. Just say you don’t want an honest discussion.

I do want an honest discussion. I think my history in this thread backs me up on that point.

 

[anon_6hv78pr714xta]

It's inconsistent with the other posts people made about schools usurping parental rights when it comes to gender identity.

It's not. The people making those arguments were assuming that being trans is worse than being cis and that the parents need to know if their child is identifying that way so that they can "do something"* about it.

*I don't know if they can do anything that will help, but they want to try.

 

[DANC]

Aren’t Progressives currently having a conniption because people are objecting to grown men in dresses and makeup with assless chaps reading stories to children?

How far a jump is it from that to pedophilia really?

The people that peddle this nonsense break down into roughly three groups.

True Believers: This is the smallest group. These are your cultural marxists, your sexual freaks, pedos. People that six or seven decades ago would’ve been killed or jailed before they reached middle adulthood.

Opportunists: This is most D politicians. They don’t necessarily believe the crap, but it’s useful ritualism and make for good wedge issues. Plus anything you cram under the banner of “discrimination” makes for a good opportunity for government power grabs.

Followers/ Lemmings: This is the largest group. Think your Hickory’s, Zeke’s, Outside Shooters. They don’t have much individual thought, have never said anything that they didn’t hear someone else say previously. But they lack community and purpose and this offers them a semblance of that.

Saw a meme that hit home. Can't find it, but it said something like: Why is the issue drag shows performing in front of children when the issue is why would trans people WANT to perform for children.

It's pretty obvious why - but it's something no one wants to address.

 

[Indianaftw]

Do you have any "brothers in Christ" who think gay marriage should be legal? Who think abortion should be legal in at least some cases? Who think trans people are not all mentally ill?

Boy here we go...They all believe the same as me GOAT...People that want and need a savior understand. Those that don't, don't care. I'm fully committed and believe. I do not doubt the 500 plus people that saw Christ after he died. Also, as I read daily I'm blown away at Gods word. It reads me, while I read it. Its all in Romans 1, 2, 3 and I read out of a KJV...Why? The blood trail, a lot of people died bringing us an english version (KJV) of Gods word. (See Book of martyrs)

Is gay marriage legal in the bible? No. Its between a man and a woman.

For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

GOAT read my signature profile. Thats in Pauls Gospel which is given unto this generation today.

Abortion when a man and woman conceive, a baby is being formed. Is that too difficult to understand? I get you though Goat...Rape and such IDK...I have no scripture for that except the sin debt. Which is Romans 1

Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

30Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

31Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

You tell me...
Every dad on this board knows they have talked to their babies in the womb and they react.

I don't have a verse for abortion I'll ask my brothers what they say and pass it along.

Trans people? The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

There...I hope my answer is sufficient for you.

Those of you who want to fight the answer? Your fighting with God, its his scripture not my opinion.

 

[Spartans9312]

I do want an honest discussion. I think my history in this thread backs me up on that point.

I answered your questions. You have avoided the very basic questions that I asked.

 

[DANC]

Aren’t Progressives currently having a conniption because people are objecting to grown men in dresses and makeup with assless chaps reading stories to children?

How far a jump is it from that to pedophilia really?

The people that peddle this nonsense break down into roughly three groups.

True Believers: This is the smallest group. These are your cultural marxists, your sexual freaks, pedos. People that six or seven decades ago would’ve been killed or jailed before they reached middle adulthood.

Opportunists: This is most D politicians. They don’t necessarily believe the crap, but it’s useful ritualism and make for good wedge issues. Plus anything you cram under the banner of “discrimination” makes for a good opportunity for government power grabs.

Followers/ Lemmings: This is the largest group. Think your Hickory’s, Zeke’s, Outside Shooters. They don’t have much individual thought, have never said anything that they didn’t hear someone else say previously. But they lack community and purpose and this offers them a semblance of that.

This is so spot on - it needs to be in a textbook.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

It's not. The people making those arguments were assuming that being trans is worse than being cis and that the parents need to know if their child is identifying that way so that they can "do something"* about it.

*I don't know if they can do anything that will help, but they want to try.

That's exactly what I was saying! They may even be right, but at that point, it's about what is or is not right/natural. It's not about parental rights. That's all I was pointing out.

 

[Indianaftw]

I don't believe you were banned, at least not by me. If your posts were removed (by me) it was because you posted little or nothing more than personal invective aimed at another poster. I did lock one thread that went off the rails beginning on the second post. I think you may have had a big part in that, but don't recall for sure. I do what needs to be done and move on.

Then next time PM me...GOAT did a long time ago when I joined, explained why, and I removed the post. Fair Enough?

 

[DANC]

Trump can line up a whole room of pornstars to bang them all, one by one, with his tiny tool, and he can pay them all off. Nobody cares.

For the umpteenth time. He's not charged with banging porn stars or even with paying them off.

He is charged with business fraud, tax evasion, conspiracy, election law violations, etc. all related to MONEY LAUNDERING, through a lackey who already was convicted and went to jail for much of the same stuff, following orders of DJT, the orange messiah of GiggetyGoo.

is this hard?

BUELLER?

How do you know the size of his tool.

Don't answer that......

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

I answered your questions. You have avoided the very basic questions that I asked.

No, you didn't.

 

[anon_6hv78pr714xta]

Saw a meme that hit home. Can't find it, but it said something like: Why is the issue drag shows performing in front of children when the issue is why would trans people WANT to perform for children.

It's pretty obvious why - but it's something no one wants to address.

Don't you think its because they just want to normalize who they are? I doubt It has anything to do with ****ing the children.

They want these kids to grow up thinking trans people are normal. That is, they want to be normal and accepted as normal. That's a nearly universal human desire, much more so for outcasts. This is also, at bottom, why these people on Libs of TikTok brag about what they do to little kids--they are trying to normalize all these 1,000s of genders and inculcate into the next generation the notion that gender fluidity is scientific and acceptable.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Boy here we go...They all believe the same as me GOAT...People that want and need a savior understand. Those that don't, don't care. I'm fully committed and believe. I do not doubt the 500 plus people that saw Christ after he died. Also, as I read daily I'm blown away at Gods word. It reads me, while I read it. Its all in Romans 1, 2, 3 and I read out of a KJV...Why? The blood trail, a lot of people died bringing us an english version (KJV) of Gods word. (See Book of martyrs)

Is gay marriage legal in the bible? No. Its between a man and a woman.

For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

GOAT read my signature profile. Thats in Pauls Gospel which is given unto this generation today.

Abortion when a man and woman conceive, a baby is being formed. Is that too difficult to understand? I get you though Goat...Rape and such IDK...I have no scripture for that except the sin debt. Which is Romans 1

Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

30Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

31Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

You tell me...
Every dad on this board knows they have talked to their babies in the womb and they react.

I don't have a verse for abortion I'll ask my brothers what they say and pass it along.

Trans people? The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

There...I hope my answer is sufficient for you.

Those of you who want to fight the answer? Your fighting with God, its his scripture not my opinion.

So, no. None of your "brothers in Christ" think differently than you. That's all I wanted to know.

 

[Spartans9312]

No, you didn't.

Yes I did.
You’ve stalled long enough that I’m out of beer.
Enjoy your evening

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Yes I did.
You’ve stalled long enough that I’m out of beer.
Enjoy your evening

You really didn't. But cheers. Try again tomorrow.

 

[anon_6hv78pr714xta]

That's exactly what I was saying! They may even be right, but at that point, it's about what is or is not right/natural. It's not about parental rights. That's all I was pointing out.

But it IS about parental rights, Goat. They want to be informed and they want to make the decision about what is right and wrong. That doesn't mean they don't think there are limits.

 

[UncleMark]

Saw a meme that hit home. Can't find it, but it said something like: Why is the issue drag shows performing in front of children when the issue is why would trans people WANT to perform for children.

It's pretty obvious why - but it's something no one wants to address.

In a previous life I dated a hot children's librarian. She loved reading to children because she loved reading to children. No one thought she might have an ulterior motive.

 

[UncleMark]

Then next time PM me...GOAT did a long time ago when I joined, explained why, and I removed the post. Fair Enough?

Post content rather than gratuitous shit slinging aimed at other posters and we will get along fine.

 

[anon_6hv78pr714xta]

In a previous life I dated a hot children's librarian.

Need pics.

 

[UncleMark]

Need pics.

Before digital.

 

[DANC]

The argument against is two fold....

1. trans kids aren't making it to adulthood.

2. Doing this shit after you've gone through puberty is much worse and painful. Blockers just buy the person more time and they are (supposedly) 100% reversible (okay 99%).

Bullshit

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

But it IS about parental rights, Goat. They want to be informed and they want to make the decision about what is right and wrong. That doesn't mean they don't think there are limits.

No, they only want them to make the decision about what is right and wrong if it isn't wrong. That's the point.