Democrats
Republicans
They
rioters
Nobody
All are stereotypes and generalizations. You can't prove anything with them.
They are who we thought they were
- Thread starter stollcpa
- Start date
Republicans
They
rioters
Nobody
All are stereotypes and generalizations. You can't prove anything with them.
You might want to wait until the weekend to start drinking.
They aren't restructuring our society. They will attempt to push us in a more progressive direction, to be sure. A direction some of you guys don't like, but it's not overturning capitalism or anything like that. In another thread I explained what I meant when I said our debt was illusory: that we borrow money as a way of financing needed stimulus that is especially helpful for those at the lower end of the spectrum. A large portion of the population will get more from the stimulus than they paid in taxes for the year. That's redistribution, but it's fitted onto our existing economic system, and that system ain't changing. I've said something similar in the past about UBI - which I consider inevitable. UBI, much like social democratic programs in Northern Europe and elsewhere, is simply a method of effecting some sort of needed wealth redistribution without giving up our capitalist structure. We're not doing away with private ownership, or anything like that.
In other words, you guys seem to be fearing a fundamental revolution in how our economy works. There is no danger of this. There are going to be tweaks, and you probably won't like the directions most of those tweaks lean, but they will be tweaks, nonetheless. Nothing fundamental is changing.
You're immersed in shit up to your ears with this post.
There 2 weeks of evidence that the goal of the invaders of the Capitol was to disrupt the legal process of certifying Joe Biden's election because they concluded it was stolen. No one has been able to explain the basis for that conclusion. But one need only read the posting history of those who have been arrested to see they discounted contrary opinions as un-American.
I don't support rounding y'all up into camps. At least not those willing to admit lots of folks on your side have a problem with accepting democracy in today's America.
Looks like folks like shooter will come "home"
i have to think about this goat. good post. i'm not sure our debt is illusory. i do agree that ubi is coming, and i'm not entirely opposed. but the latter is tethered to the supposition that the former is accurate. otherwise it's just more entitlements that have to be accounted for somehow
And if you disagree with the sensibility of certain programs, that's fine. I'm more trying to stress here that all of these ideas people come up with are based on keeping our fundamental capitalist market economy.
UBI continues to be tried and studied, but there have not been any developed countries adopting it thus far. Perhaps when EU wealth redistribution is considered, some don't view it as a success, but rather a failure. Below average economic growth and productivity, higher unemployment, debt problems, lack of innovation, etc.
Alaska has dividends each year and it works quite well
Yup. You’ll see a family of five eating whale blubber in an igloo with a new ps5. I watch discovery
Trickle Up. Gains to the economy will pay for it right?
The concept of UBI has always interested me. I can't figure how it is sustainable. But I look at continued automation, artificial intelligence, off shoring of white collar jobs such as wall street research and law, etc. I know I'm a broken record and have said this before, but I do wonder what the hell our kids will do.
I look at the company I'm with. We handle 30 million more accounts and policies than when I started, but with 25k fewer employees. That trend will only accelerate with upcoming projects going in.
A nation of Amazon drivers, until self driving trucks take over? 🤔
And we might simply not be there, yet, but I still believe it is inevitable. We live in a world in which wealth is increasingly concentrated while opportunities to acquire wealth are increasingly curbed. We also are developing a moral sentiment that somehow, someway, the world must ensure that everyone can at least survive comfortably, even if they don't enjoy luxury. All of this is happening in the shadow of increased automation. Wealth distribution is inevitable, I think, for these reasons, and UBI makes the most sense, because it can be done within capitalism, without the need to overthrow it and start from the ground up with an entirely different economic system.
It think this is a process that will happen over the span of decades, so I hope I live long enough to see how it turns out, but I just don't see how any other path is realistic at this point.
I don’t think there was a material growth effect when financed via increased taxes. Sounds like studies suggest financing it (why not, we’ll never repay the debt at this point anyway?)
You say ubi but that means everyone gets the same check. I agree that I don’t see that happening for some time. At just a $1,000 a month that’s 4 trillion bucks-ish. That’s in the neighborhood of our entire budget. The other means based one, I forget the name of it, where it would lift the floor of those who desperately need it, could happen in our lives. To do either would require some significant cuts
I would have voted for Kasich over Clinton and Kasich over Biden, most likely
One place worth starting is a national healthcare plan with a lowered age or phase-in for Medicare. Lots of people like me ( age 61) would happily leave the workforce if there was an affordable health insurance option, opening good jobs for younger folks. Unfortunately, paying 15-20k for health insurance the next four years is a dealbreaker. At my salary and my wife's ( who would also leave) our employers could afford to hire 2 new employees each.
Placing health insurance costs on the backs of private (or public) employers is a huge job killer in the US. I have never been able to fathom why conservatives are so opposed to the idea of national health care. Forget the moral arguments, a national healthcare system makes economic sense. How many US jobs are outsourced to countries that have national healthcare systems so those employers can save those $ vs. operating in the US ? How many employers in the US could hire more employees or pay higher wages if they weren't paying exhorbitant healthcare premiums for employees ? And how antiquated is a system that puts health insurance in the hands of for-profit corporations who have every incentive to deny coverage to anyone who might really need to use it ? Not to mention how much more efficient healthcare records management would be in a single-payer system where every person's info would be immediately available to providers.
A small increase in the Medicare tax to 2 or 2 1/2 % and a small increase in in SS tax to 6.5 or 7 % would barely be noticeable to most workers. Tax every dollar earned instead of capping at 120k or whatever the max is now. People earning those high salaries won't miss the extra takeaway. Doing away with the estate tax entirely and cutting the capital gains rate could offset the extra FICA obligation for the wealthy. With those changes, FICA programs become far more sustainable into the future. To discourage abuse, set a deductible based on the previeous years AGI for every individual (even those over 65. My mother-in-law had full medicare coverage in her 70's and 80's even though she had a six-figure annual income and a couple million plus in assets). Low income households would have an affordable plan, but still have incentive to be judicious and shop for best prices.
Unfortunately, the health insurance industry is a powerful lobby and those in government collecting big campaign contributions and raking in dividends from those for-profit insurers aren't anxious to see that golden goose disappear. They can use the bogeyman of "socialized medicine" to keep the cash flowing and spook constituents into supporting a system that costs this country jobs and guarantees that high health insurance premiums will continue to rob workers of take-home pay.
Sorry for the rant and maybe there are huge holes in my logic. But as technology continues to depress wages and limit job creation in this country, it seems to me that moving older workers out of the labor force at a faster rate is an economic win.
Lol. Funny you mention that as the bush people had to go to the pokey over that very dividend check. They were collecting the check while residing in calif
Again, for reasons I've already explained, I think these bookkeeping concerns are largely illusory. However, I will grant you that the numbers are easier if we start with a means-based system. I'm just not sure UBI gets implemented that way for political concerns. I think the "Everyone gets the same" method is an easier pill to swallow. Look at Covid relief. How do you think it would have gone over if the feds had implemented means-testing to save money before mailing the checks?
You said they were rioting because Democrats shouldn't be allowed to lead that country.
That's a lie and now you're trying to justify basing your argument on a lie.
You are so convinced of the shit-sandwich being fed to you by MSNBC and CNN that you have to lie to justify the narratvie.
Well, with IU BB i have no reason to get excited, so i ain't losing sleep when they lose. ND is good enough to where I would have to care, only to be crushed - like they were against Alabama.
Brian Kelly was right though in his post game after Alabama. It's not just a Notre Dame problem, everyone else is trying to figure out how to beat these guys (Alabama/ Clemson). Not sure how you close the recruiting gap, but that's what is going to need to happen for ND, Ohio State, Georgia, LSU Oklahoma and the rest of that second tier to compete with them consistently.
Yea, the same shit-sandwich is we’re all a members of a cult. For me it’s simple, Trump got me and many other people who weren’t paying attention aware of the shit show elites running this country. Instead of taking the blue pill like I had my whole life in believing everything authority and government told me I took the red pill and started questioning everything the bastards told me on all sides.
These people go to Washington and forget all the reasons they went. It becomes nothing but a power trip and getting elected again.
Dr Biden will need to be on Joe’s hip 24/7. He hasn’t a clue most hours of the day.
disagree. i think the everyone gets the same wouldn't get support bc of unnecessary waste. same deal with so many who have complained about stimulus checks going to folks who don't need it. i think the only way guaranteed income makes sense is if it is means-tested.
as for your belief on national debt and servicing same, that obviously plays an important role in ubi or even means-tested guarantees. in fairness i don't know enough economics to know whether you are right or wrong. i just think about how much of my life has been spent hearing "we've got to pay down the debt." hell it likely cost bush re-election. he raised taxes to pay down the debt.
all of that being said i don't believe that ubi (in any form) and paying down the debt is compatible. again to give every one a grand a month equates to nearly 4 trillion dollars a year. the only way ubi is possible is if you are correct about the national debt being illusory.
I dunno. College football and basketball at the highest levels really don't have anything to do with college anymore. It's just a minor league. Which frustrates me. I swear I'm going to just start following DII teams so I don't feel dirty.
I’d be interested in long term effects of UBI on cost of living, inflation, etc. I could see a boon for landlords & drug dealers in the short term though....
me too. i just don't know enough about economics. part of me thinks that there would just be an in-kind inflation. like you said with landlords wouldn't they just say oh more money i'm raising rents
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