Results of Denver's Basic Income Program. Pretty Interesting
- Thread starter mcmurtry66
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Not sure how effective it is and thought it was strange they highlighted Laws as a positive outcome. The minimum wage in Denver was 12.85 in 2020. The article said Laws was making 400 dollars a month and the extra 1000 dollars freed him up to be a better father. What the f#ck was he doing? He was working 10 hours a week if he was making 400 dollars a month. He had all the time in the world to be a great father. It’s difficult for me to feel sorry for people who don’t work, assuming they are capable of it.
Since i fall asleep reading, I only got through 3 pages. Their "control group" was given $50 a month.
Was any of the 3 groups given anything else, like mentoring, training, life planning tools. Or was it all just cash and then stand back and study?
That was a major ... hmmmmm. ... moment for me aw well. I think/ suspect, there is more to it than $$. I'm suspecting counseling, with an identified game plan.
Which totally screws the study, unless it was done for all 3 groups. Since I have ZERO trust in any of these click bait progressive "studies", I'm suspect. Also very happy to be proven it was a truly acceptable engineered study.
Are you trying to give him a heart attack? We need him for book club.
I don't really care what people believe politically as long as they work for a living. Seriously, if you work for a living to provide for a family (or just to stay off welfare) we have something in common. More Americans should think this way.
I agree with this wholeheartedly.
This is why a make-work program like the New Deal-era WPA is far preferable to a public assistance program that has few eligibility requirements beyond demonstrated need and a pulse.
I’m sure there are plenty of community organizations that could use volunteers. Maybe in lieu of having or genuinely looking for gainful employment, they could require some form of community service? Pass out the checks at the end of the shift.
We should always tether income to some kind of effort that benefits others.
The good news is that I no longer need the hassle of travel to see the thrird world. That apartment is a little over 5 minute drive from my home. Some of my favorite Mexican eateries and Mercados are nearby. My supermarket, which is a little more than a 5 minute walk in the opposite direction has put a lot of stuff behind locked doors, and removed all the impulse buy crap from the entry because of all the theft. My local Walgreens no longer stocks about a third of its shelf space because of the theft.
The third world presence in many large cities is now permanently established. As Kamala said, we aren’t going back. This is what forward looks like to the Democrats. You can’t make America great for those who have no clue about greatness.
Thank you liberal Democrats and your open border sanctuary city bullshit.
Too bad we can’t force these democrat politicians to live in these third world conditions they are creating.
Unfortunately, that seems to be true. And it's kind of mind-blowing when you think about it. You would think that somebody might examine these kinds of social outcomes and say "OK, this isn't what we had in mind. Where did we go wrong here?"
But that doesn't happen very often. It did with the drug decriminalization experiment in Oregon. I remember thinking it was bound to more more things worse than better when they did that. And, to their credit, they did pull the plug on it when it became obvious that it was a bad idea.
And I just don't think it's likely that blue-state/blue-city politicians are going to face much political backlash for these kinds of outcomes. They've griped to Greg Abbott and Joe Biden about the burdens of increased numbers of illegal immigrants. But have any sanctuary cities/states rescinded those policies...or even so much as publicly questioned them? If so, I'm not aware of any.
Are people from poor countries more likely to be dangerous ?
Could it be there are potentially productive people from poor countries who want to come here to escape crime?
Isn't this part of what the hot debate over amnesty is about?
Trying to be a devil's advocate here who wishes the country could find some agreement on immigration instead off playing politics with all the issues surrounding this topic.
I don’t know anyone against going through the system legally to enter our country.
I am okay with looking at amnesty for those here now illegally. They come forward and get in the system properly and we put them through the process to become citizens. Every single illegal with a rap sheet here or country of origin goes back.
Close the border now and every single person who enters Illegally gets shipped back. No exception.
Seems pretty simple to me.
Couple of things...
I personally don't know anyone that wants to enter illegally but with 12-15 million (or whatever the number is) illegals in the country already there must be a great many who are.
First understand that in probably 95% of the cases today, in order to "get a status" requires the applicant (the illegal or legal immigrant) to GO BACK TO THEIR COUNTRY OF ORIGIN. We'd have to work that out and definitely in a way that offers the same opportunity to those here legally. Going back to their country of origin is costly and cumbersome and probably one of the top reasons people just over stay legal visas.
The US should never close its borders except in a time of war. The USA means something to the world and we've got a giant bronze woman sitting in a harbor with an inscription which means something too. Yes, it should be done legally. I agree with hoot that the abject stupidity and short sightedness of our politics is the biggest problem here.
The devil is in the details. But we should work to figure it out.
Has a Hispanic lady come into one of my branches last week trying to deposit several checks into her account from individuals other than herself (third party checks). When we wouldn't do it she and her daughter basically threw a fit. The issue is the checks she was trying to deposit were for individuals who can't obtain any type of account because they are not here legally. I will never understand how you can be here and want to work but are not willing to go through the proper channels to become eligible to do the basic things like open an account in order to cash a check?
I suspect most could/would not be allowed legal entry due to some past transgressions.
Per Dmb' s post..
"You invite the third world you become the third world. It's pretty simple".
My Irish Mother claimed her Irish ancestors left raising horses in Ireland (circa 1850) to escape the potato famine.
My libertine Uncle Frank upon hearing this exclaimed, "More than likely they were stealing horses".
"You invite the third world you become the third world. It's pretty simple".
My Irish Mother claimed her Irish ancestors left raising horses in Ireland (circa 1850) to escape the potato famine.
My libertine Uncle Frank upon hearing this exclaimed, "More than likely they were stealing horses".
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Democrats can’t police themselves on this because they’ll be labeled as racists and xenophobes. Woke kills societies.
Interesting happening in my office few years ago. Befriended young waitress in my favorite local Mexican Restaurant. She was pretty and smart. We always tipped her $100. During chit chat she learned what I did. Her husband dropped their tax information off with my receptionist. I went through it and there was no W-2 from the restaurant. I called her husband and he told me she gets paid in cash and there’s no W-2. I agonized a few days and finally called him back and told him I couldn’t do their return since I knew she had income they weren’t reporting. He threw a fit and called me a few names. I apologized and told him I just couldn’t do return.
I never went back to my favorite Mexican Restaurant in town. Wasn’t sure what the reception would be.
Possibly the thousands of criminal gang members released from 'poor' prisons in Venezuela and Honduras 'might' be dangerous.
Becoming eligible means immigration knows where you are. I mean, I get what you're saying, but I woudnl't expect illegal immigrants (especially the ones who never had a visa to begin with) are going to start acting rationally. Or at least what we see as rationally.
I actually doubt this. The process to get any kind of visa from certain parts of the world (and they ain't white, but that's for another discussion) is incredibly difficult. From time immemorial folks have tried to sneak into territories and countries more prosperous than their own. The Romans used to force them into military service to get citizenship. I'm not saying we need to do that but there's a shit ton of roads and bridges which need re done.
Hopefully some of them are starting to see how foolish this approach has been.
At the very least, it seems the politics have turned against them on it - and that they realize that. It’ll almost certainly get worse for them if they don’t.
But there are compelling reasons why they (and many Republicans) been so obstinate about it.
To extend a common analogy used for immigration, we need to secure the windows and expand the size of the door.
But the former needs to come first. The refusal to make it first is what killed the 2013 Gang of 8 bill that passed the Senate. It’s also what killed the Senate bill earlier this year.
I’ll be shocked if any Democrat in a leadership position drafts or sponsors any serious window-closing immigration legislation. It’s clear to me they’re terrified of the Woke and the opportunity cost of forgoing thousands of votes that are streaming across the border.
That falls under the 'no good deed goes unpunished' category.
Bet he's catching hell for her missing out on some big tip money.
Editor's note, July 11, 2024: This story was updated with context about the findings from the Denver basic-income pilot's control group. The story, which originally focused on the pilot's overall findings, now notes that the pilot's organizers did not identify major differences in outcomes between the test groups and the control group. This suggests that giving more money to participants didn't significantly improve their outcomes after 10 months. The story was also updated to clarify findings involving participants' mental health. While some individual participants did report improvements to their mental health, participants on average scored higher on the Kessler 10 test at the pilot's 10-month mark than they did at the beginning, indicating increases in stress.
Read a book many years ago about crime in America.
The author claimed the underground economy was equal to about 25% of the reported economy.
Would bet these days it is higher.
So Venezuelan and Honduran gang bangers are engineers now?
Surprise!
They were the same people, just smoking better gange, talking on better phones and sippin better cognac..
Stress comes from knowing the handouts aren't permanent.
Does this dude realize the kind of trouble you could get in for knowingly preparing a fraudulent tax return on a client's behalf? Good grief, man. In fact, I'll bet you're supposed to take some kind of action simply for suspecting it...let alone putting your signature on it.
I wouldn't have agonized over this myself, although I understand why you did.
