The portal deluge has started. It has been said before that next year might look like Crean's first year and I'd say that is accurate. We are expecting the Woodson staff to hit homeruns for next year's roster when all they have proven is that they are singles hitters. Thank goodness IU is a football school.....oh wait, never mind.
Ooo boy this is gonna get ugly.....as expected.
- Thread starter Carib04
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I don't think very many people are expecting home run recruiting from the portal.
I expect them to sign guards who aren't as good as Shifino, Johnson, Gunn or Bates....or Armaan Franklin. You gotta build your team and hold onto your guys.
The portal crap is for patching gaps, not for starting from scratch.
I expect them to sign guards who aren't as good as Shifino, Johnson, Gunn or Bates....or Armaan Franklin. You gotta build your team and hold onto your guys.
The portal crap is for patching gaps, not for starting from scratch.
Nobody expects anything but a wasted year similar to Archie's year four. The reason Mike wants to rely on the portal is that it's most like free agency and he can just rely on buying players than actually having to put in effort on the recruiting trail and building a culture.
Mike Woodson is easily one of the laziest college coaches I've seen in my lifetime and he's currently stealing 4.5 mil a year from IU until he's fired.
I don’t see the parallels at all assuming Reneau and Mgbako are back, which by most accounts seem likely. I think we lose one player of significance (Ware) from
team that won 19 games this year compared to 6 in Crean’s first season. I firmly believe that if the staff can properly construct a roster ie two quality guards from the portal to pair with MR and MM, we’re much closer to a 20 win team with a chance to make the tournament than a 6 win team.
Probably not enough for Woodson to keep his job, but far from the doom and gloom hysteria written in your post.
I'm glad you are an optimist but I suspect MM is probably gone. Maybe Malik comes back but but being a foul out threat every game hardly gives me the warm fuzzies.
For one he might enter draft for feedback two the portal for more money better team.
Definitely expect him to test the waters and ultimately return once he’s not given a first round grade.
He could go to a better team via the portal but he’d be taking a pay cut to play a lesser role which could have a significant impact on his future draft prospectives.
"If the staff can properly construct a roster..."
They had 2 years to land ZERO 2024 recruits. Why would they be able to piece it together now?
I don't think its all about the money. I mean Kansas could offer as much money or a little less and have a better team around him something Indiana can't guarantee. If I were a betting man I would bet there's a 60 percent chance he comes back.
It’s a simple question. Does he want better coaching, or not? The only way he’s ever gonna make nba loot is to learn the game and become something more than a decent 3 point shooter. I don’t see this staff getting him over “the hump.”
Where does Mgbako fit in at Kansas next year? They’re going to have a front court of Dickinson, KJ Adams, Flory Bidunga, and most likely now Liam McNeeley. There’s no way Kansas is going to pony up that kind of money for a guy they don’t exactly need. Why in Mgbako’s case would he take less money to play a lesser role? How does that help him get to the NBA?
It’s a lot more complex than simply “better coaching”. You gotta produce to make NBA loot. Tough to produce as a 4th or 5th option.
Mgbako shared co-freshman of the year under this staff by the way and was easily playing his best basketball at the end of the year.
I don't think this is "likely" at all, that said even if they are we still need two stud guards, a replacement for Ware, and some depth for the bench just for the current staff to sneak in the tournament.
Mgbako and Ware announced they are putting on a youth basketball camp in Bloomington in April. It’s probably part of their exit plan because Woodson is so terrible.
Again, why doesn’t this seem likely? Where are they going to go? I concede that if MM gets a first round grade while testing the waters he’s gone, however unlikely that is, but where is Reneau going? Why would he leave?
That’s the worst case scenario for the future of the IU BB program, imho.
My doom and gloom scenario is that we do bring back those you mention, buy a couple of guards like you say, and slide into the tourney as a bubble team next year. The bar is low. Exceeding terrible expectations with a program philosophy that clearly will not work in the long run will just exasperate the cycle of program destruction that we are caught up in.
The NBA or another school. Our coach is on the hottest of hot seats, the fans are done, we're going to have at least 6 open spots and we ZERO recruits committed. The one recruit we did have committed hadn't even been reached out to by Woodson since he signed.
This is the very definition of a dsfunctional program and good players leave dysfunctional programs when they get the chance. Did MR look like he was having fun at the end of the year?
The true fans aren’t done.
Portal deluge? What am I missing: you're really sweating over losing Gunn, Banks and Sparks? Now, there may be others, but those aren't changing the trajectory of next season, which hinges on MR, MM, and probably Cupps. When/if we lose any of those, it's reason for greater worry.
So, there's no reason for great worry right now? The season that just ended was only as good as Ware was, not MR and MM...Ware took the pressure off of both of them and was still the dominant player on IU's side.
Oh no, there's a ton of reasons to worry, but those 3 leaving isn't really unexpected and doesn't have much bearing on next season. From my perspective I've been saying for weeks and weeks now that Dolson should be having weekly meetings with CMW to review the concerns and how he intends to address them, and then when weighing factors, determine if he should be let go. I think there was enough smoke with 0 commits, poor roster construction, lack of energy/success recruiting, to make the call, but he wasn't able/didn't do that so we know who our coach is next year and those 3 transfers will have little impact, were mostly expected, and are relatively easy to overcome.
I have little concerns of MR leaving. There's not another school out there who can offer what IU can in terms of both role and money. My only concern with MM leaving is him getting a single first round grade enticing him to keep his name in the draft and even then I don't see that happening. MM isn't going to transfer to another school to take a pay cut and a lesser role.
MM production is very close to lottery picks of early kicks last year. Hendricks, Black, Wallace.
Doesn't have anywhere close to the athleticism of any of those kids. Those kids were projected lottery picks all year and all went in the first round. MM isn't close to a first round pick as it stands.
My point exactly. So I don’t think production matters either…he isn’t NBA athletic
I don’t say this to defend Woody, but MM’s improvement throughout his 1st season strongly suggests that he is learning the game and becoming more than a 3-pt. shooter under Woody.
He's going to have to produce at a high level to mask his lack of athleticism to have a shot in the NBA. A team isn't going to take a flyer on him this year. That's why transferring to a better school to take on a lesser role doesn't make a whole lot of sense. There isn't a team out there who can pay more while offering a premier role like IU can. That's why I believe it's silly to think Mgbako is transferring.
Yeah, it's really a shame because had LM stayed, CMW would've actually had the makings of what could be a pretty competitive roster and a transition to a more modern 4 out, 1 in team with MR in the post and MM, LM, TG and a solid PG who can knock down shots, and then added shooters and depth. Instead, feels like we'll be starting over. I expect that one of MR or MM will not be here next year.
Agree to an extent…if you add him to a team that super athletic like a UK or Baylor. I think he thrives even more because the floor gets spaced better and allows him to be more a shooter.
Its o.k. to defend Woody where he deserves defending. And Kelel and Mack's improvement call for that, in my opinion.
Malik, however, I don't think has improved much. His footwork and positioning defensively are still really bad. He isn't really any better passing out of double teams than he was when he arrived in Bloomington. I don't think he's expanded his game all that much.
He improved his body, which helped his stamina, which probably helped his production. But I think the main thing that led to his increased points, rebounds, etc... was just that TJD and Race were out of the way.
My only concern with Malik possibly transferring out is that maybe he isn't responding to Woody's program, and realizes that, and knows with his size and skill, his future in the NBA will rely on him expanding his game out further from the basket...and maybe he knows like we do, that Woody isn't the guy to help him with that.
Also, his body language got worse and worse as the year wore on. And his overall game devolved the last month or so. When others seemed to galvanize, and start pulling in the right direction. Malik fell apart. Didn't seem like he was on the same page as the rest of the core guys.
He also may get tired of being glared at by woody, like a grandma glairs at a grandkid to get their act together.
I think Malik is at his best in a modern offense. He thrives in single coverage because of his strength. He gets in trouble when teams continuously dig and double because we aren't a threat from the perimeter. I think Woodson knows his clock is ticking and I don't see him going all out to get an elite big this offseason. I do think he'll be forced to play a more guard-heavy offense and we'll subsequently have better perimeter play.
From the portal, the staff needs:
-two guards who can start right away (this is where the bulk of your NIL goes)
-a shooter(s) off the bench to take on 7th/8th man role
-a defensive big who can play 15-20 mpg
-a forward with some athleticism to provide depth
Feels like he knows he would be a better fit somewhere else, but the $ is a few hundred grand higher at IU where we are desperate to keep him. In the end I'd guess he stays.
losing Ware, Sparks, and Walker... we need 2 post players in some configuration. Logically a freshman post to develop would've made sense, but... Maybe CMW will find another freshman decommit post.
He was also playing out of position the entire year. He's not a 4 no matter how much he or the staff want to think he is. He's a traditional big that just so happens to be 6'9. He's a bull that's almost impossible to guard one on one due to his strength and footwork. He gets in trouble when guards dig down on him or draws a double team by playing a 2nd big opposite of him. He needs space to operate, that happens by playing a more perimeter oriented offense. He has a chance to put up huge numbers next year playing in a more friendly system. But he's always going to struggle if the staff is hell bent on playing two traditional bigs.
Could be...
But the more I think about it, the more worried I get on Malik's status at IU...more so than Mack's actually.
Make no mistake, getting to the NBA is THE primary decision driver for kids of their caliber. If I'm Malik, and/or Malik's people... I'm more than a little worried about Malik not really being any better defending away from the basket, not really being any better passing the ball effectively, not being asked/pushed/"systemed" to play away from the basket offensively.
He could go back to a school like Florida, or Alabama maybe...play for a better team, play in a system that will help his NBA aspirations more, be closer to home, probably have less daily pressure than he has at IU... He'd probably have to take an NIL pay cut though. I don't know...I could definitely see it happening.
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