You’re overthinking it. Kids have role models. Their teacher is a role model - especially at that age. It’s not hard to quickly get to “my teacher tells us she is LGBTQ, and I want to be just like her!” Would the teacher explain to these 4 yr olds that this isn’t the right approach? Who knows. Who knows if the kids would say anything to their teacher - but the seed has been planted.
The problem with folks like Crazy is they seem to lament your first paragraph because they believe it caused the second.
Totally. That's why I asked about the specifics of what she is doing in the classroom that sets people off. Ranger made some assumptions that I don't think are necessarily on point, so I wondered where the trigger point lies (I think it was you talking about a teaching saying that they had a nice weekend getaway with their vs. talking about hooking up all weekend long.) It's been interesting to me to watch how some people (not the people we're conversing with here) don't blink when a female teacher talks about her husband, but are horrified when she talks about her girlfriend.
Yeah, I'm obviously wrong here. And I also have kids in school. One of which is 4 and will be going into preschool in the fall.How do you say I have no children in school without saying I have no children in school?
Edit: let me educate you.
Kindergarten
www.in.gov
They don’t understand straight vs gay vs XYZ. That’s the point. They don’t think in those terms.
Yeah, I'm trying to tiptoe around what people's motivations or intentions for being upset might be. I can understand why someone might be upset with the vid of the teacher. It might be inappropriate as a discussion to have with a 5 year old who probably just wants to be on the swings outside. It's probably a better conversation another 5 years or so down the road.
I don’t know, teaching children to be accepting and respectful of others, and accepting of themselves, sounds pretty woke to me. It’s horrifying that our nation has come to this.
You show me a thread that gets over 100 posts that doesn't.
That being said...
Agreed. Far more interesting to have an actual discussion as opposed to many others.That being said...
I gotta admit that I do appreciate @IUCrazy2 . I don't agree with much of what he says (almost typed "alot", but remembered my AlohaHoosier lessons), and he is a tad bit overreactive, but he presents his argument with passion, honesty, and a refreshing lack of smarm...unlike some of his gasbag, condescending, patronizing brethren, who try to act like the the most clever guy in the room. Or cray.
Now we are getting closer to the same page. Even if we disagree about some of the other stuff, this basically gets to the heart of everything. These discussions with very young children are dumb. That is exactly what the Florida bill covered and it got labeled "don't say gay", Disney got involved as the Corporate protector of the LGBTQ community and is about to get their nose bloodied, and all this because of wanting to do what you (rightly) indicate is dumb.
I am a total asshole though.That being said...
I gotta admit that I do appreciate @IUCrazy2 . I don't agree with much of what he says (almost typed "alot", but remembered my AlohaHoosier lessons), and he is a tad bit overreactive, but he presents his argument with passion, honesty, and a refreshing lack of smarm...unlike some of his gasbag, condescending, patronizing brethren, who try to act like the the most clever guy in the room. Or cray.
The funniest part of this is watching the two sides completely do a 180 on corporate set asides. We're hypocrites all.
I remember reading a book by Carl Hiaasen, who is obviously liberal, and a great author, absolutely ripping Disney for its status (amongst other things) that DeSantis just stripped away.
Yeah, I mean who can’t get behind: “Don’t tax Disney! Don’t tax Disney!”?
It's more than that. It's that it operated essentially as its own municipality.
Take this for what it is worth, be involved and vigilant about what they are teaching your child. You have every right and it is your job to make sure that your values are being respected in school as well.
Well, sure, everyone wants/needs their own municipality. Isn’t that the goal? You play soccer in mine and you get an automatic $20.00 fine per kick. We have overhead cameras and everything . . .
I agree. There are some topics that are much better discussed in person, so the exact emphasis of one's message can be expressed.
Is it all about Disney or is some of it the redistricting map? DeSantis went all New York and really smashed the Democrats with the Congressional redistricting.
I don't like the practice you are describing in the least, although I do at the end of the day agree with the woman in that TikTok video that I think it would be great for kids to be normalized as to the fact that gay people are perfectly fine and just as morally upstanding as straight people. Cool. But when she starts talking about training "allies" she crosses a line because that is a very specialized term in the social justice community and it carries a lot of baggage.
is your issue with allies age-related in this example? Or the word in general?I don't like the practice you are describing in the least, although I do at the end of the day agree with the woman in that TikTok video that I think it would be great for kids to be normalized as to the fact that gay people are perfectly fine and just as morally upstanding as straight people. Cool. But when she starts talking about training "allies" she crosses a line because that is a very specialized term in the social justice community and it carries a lot of baggage.
That said, using the term grooming here is wrong, in my mind. Grooming has a sexual connotation now:
(Oxford Dictionary)
the action by a pedophile of preparing a child for a meeting, especially via an internet chat room, with the intention of committing a sexual offense.
"online grooming has become a growing cause for concern"
And that's obviously why the word is being used. Of course, the Left misuses words like racism and fascism all the time with similar intentions. That's not good either.
Again, I'll fall back on Orwell who was so prescient:
Politics and the English Language - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
I'm not so sure about that. When I was five, for a brief time during the summer, my best friend was a girl who lived a few houses down. Neither one of us understood when our parents tried to explain to us why a sleepover was inappropriate. Other than vaguely understanding that boys and girls were somehow two different things, we didn't understand what those differences actually were. But, by the time my second grade teacher was getting married, I completely understood that she was a she, and she was marrying a he, and this was completely normal, because boys became men, girls became women, and women married men and started families. I might not have appreciated the clinical realities of sex at the time, but I certainly had the basics of gender and sexuality down pat.
One false assumption you’re teasing out of Ranger lies in this text:
Ranger and others wittingly or unwittingly see LGBTQ as a choice, thus “a seed can be planted” “to want to be like her” and later choose to be so.
I get that, but I'm asking about the application of that which you object to. You assumed what the preschool teacher was talking about, but nobody provided examples of actual behavior that they objected to. I think it was Lars who did a pretty good job of fleshing out some of that and I think that's where some of the disconnects stem from.
For real, I thought you were going to say, "another was an Indian, another was a cowboy, another was a policeman..."
Allies is a social justice warrior word that is basically “if you don’t agree with everything we see - you’re against us.”
I have no problem with young children aspiring to be like their teachers, LGBTQ or not, but I do have a problem with them ascribing to be like them because of their LGBTQ-ness.
Grooming has many uses, including grooming someone at work to be a future leader or an apprentice to be a tradesman. Defenders of activists are choosing to make it a pedo-accusation. That’s not how I think most use it.I don't like the practice you are describing in the least, although I do at the end of the day agree with the woman in that TikTok video that I think it would be great for kids to be normalized as to the fact that gay people are perfectly fine and just as morally upstanding as straight people. Cool. But when she starts talking about training "allies" she crosses a line because that is a very specialized term in the social justice community and it carries a lot of baggage.
That said, using the term grooming here is wrong, in my mind. Grooming has a sexual connotation now:
(Oxford Dictionary)
the action by a pedophile of preparing a child for a meeting, especially via an internet chat room, with the intention of committing a sexual offense.
"online grooming has become a growing cause for concern"
And that's obviously why the word is being used. Of course, the Left misuses words like racism and fascism all the time with similar intentions. That's not good either.
Again, I'll fall back on Orwell who was so prescient:
Politics and the English Language - Wikipedia
It's the term--for those in the social justice community, an ally is someone who actively fights for a political objective or ideology. In short, they are activists. I don't think public schools should be training grounds for people fighting for any political positions.
I think you're being naive. Libs of Tik Tok used the term when posting a video about pedophilia made by someone with a trans identity, in the political context of a movement that goes out of its way to describe the opposing side as a secret cabal of child sex traffickers. The term "grooming" can be used in multiple ways, but there's only one way it's being used here.
Yes, one of the more insidious issues in this: gays (mostly gay men) have been fighting the stereotype that they are all child molesters and pedophiles for a very, very long time.
See even in the LGBTQ world Gen Z is better than Millenials and Zoomers.
www.manhattan-institute.org
