Early am tweet from Cig….

[IU_Hickory]

If he was that much of a butthead, players wouldn't have followed him.

Can't wait for the season to start

 

[GR8IUFAN]

No kidding, exactly right.

Those cautioning that this needed to be kept in the locker room, should name names.

Who was called out? Or, more revealing, name which player thinks that they were just publicly called out even without coach naming names?

There was nothing wrong, and a lot right, with that tweet.

Exactly right. Imagine he has watched 5ape and saw where we were soft which contributed to late game collapses. Just saying he is not going to put up with it. Never called anyone out.

 

[Tammany Hall]

CCC is just making a statement about his approach and it’s great.

 

[Rags to Roses]

This is really poor leadership. Or maybe it’s better to say it’s a poor management skills.

Keep that stuff in-house. Tell a player he’s soft. Call him a pussy to his face. Whatever. Putting it on blast like that is ego driven.

Right or wrong, he’s also fixin to find out that the power dynamic has shifted significantly in favor of the players vs coaches over the last few years.

He better win and win quick. Because he is going to lose a locker room in a hurry if they lose.

I have a different view. I don’t think his players were the intended audience. I think he wanted to make a statement to public constituents. Maybe it’s the fans. Maybe he’s preparing the parents of some players for the tough conversations he’s going to have with them when he cuts their sons. I don’t know, but I am willing to give CCC the benefit of the doubt since this isn’t his first rodeo.

 

[Rags to Roses]

View embedded media

Meet Chopper Reid, IU's new team psychologist:

*NSFW*

 

[OpenWheels]

*NSFW*

Hard the #$%^ up

That was good lol.

 

[Al Bino]

This is really poor leadership. Or maybe it’s better to say it’s a poor management skills.

Keep that stuff in-house. Tell a player he’s soft. Call him a pussy to his face. Whatever. Putting it on blast like that is ego driven.

Right or wrong, he’s also fixin to find out that the power dynamic has shifted significantly in favor of the players vs coaches over the last few years.

He better win and win quick. Because he is going to lose a locker room in a hurry if they lose.

What a strange take on that tweet. As other have stated, there were no specific players named. If I was a betting man, I would bet that he relayed the same sentiment directly to the players. I also could believe that many of the players that he was eluding to have either graduated, left the program or were not invited back.

I would think the attitude displayed in that tweet would be a welcomed stance at IU.

 

[kraft cheese+macaroni]

Truth. Wait to see how fans react when he starts calling us soft with a loser mentality.

He’d be right, of course. But a lot of the “old school” folks are going to have a whole different perspective when they’re the butt of it.

Imagine if he told them they couldn’t leave at halftime! They’d suddenly want him fired! lol

 

[TMFT]

I would think the attitude displayed in that tweet would be a welcomed stance at IU.

“Don’t talk about it, be about it.” — William T. Sherman

 

[IUCrazy2]

He didn’t tell a player he is soft. He said that softness would be rooted out. If a player feels called out than that would be their problem. Now is the time to set the expectation. He isn’t chastising anyone. How his players and coaches rally around him would be a strong indication that he knows how to balance his blunt communication with how he administers his team environment. We have been a soft team. It has been a public display the last couple of falls. No need to keep it in house.

Additionally, you can root softness out of a player as well. If you have not treated this with the work ethic and sacrifice it requires to be good, you better adjust your attitude or hit the door. He is basically laying out his expectations on what he will or will not accept.

 

[NWfor3]

This is really poor leadership. Or maybe it’s better to say it’s a poor management skills.

Keep that stuff in-house. Tell a player he’s soft. Call him a pussy to his face. Whatever. Putting it on blast like that is ego driven.

Right or wrong, he’s also fixin to find out that the power dynamic has shifted significantly in favor of the players vs coaches over the last few years.

He better win and win quick. Because he is going to lose a locker room in a hurry if they lose.

Unfortunately, its the way of the world (not mine) to blast things out on social media.

 

[Hoosier Clarion]

“Don’t talk about it, be about it.” — William T. Sherman

So much for not having social media.

 

[Sobchak_Security]

This is really poor leadership. Or maybe it’s better to say it’s a poor management skills.

Keep that stuff in-house. Tell a player he’s soft. Call him a pussy to his face. Whatever. Putting it on blast like that is ego driven.

Right or wrong, he’s also fixin to find out that the power dynamic has shifted significantly in favor of the players vs coaches over the last few years.

He better win and win quick. Because he is going to lose a locker room in a hurry if they lose.

This isn’t his first rodeo. If he had trouble managing a locker room it would have manifested before now. I think this is more uncomfortable to fans because we don’t know what a well led program looks like. A statement like Coach Cignetti made, if it makes you uncomfortable, comes down to 1 of 2 things. You either disagree with the statement, or you don’t like that he pointed it out. If you disagree, then prove him wrong. If you don’t like that he pointed it out, that’s a whole other discussion. The whole LEO culture, while it sounds nice, just didn’t play over time. Look at the great coaches in sport. Most of them are demanding, push players and make them uncomfortable, and hold them to account.

Not sure a lot of that has been happening in IU football of late.

 

[EvansvilleHoosier88]

“Don’t talk about it, be about it.” — William T. Sherman

Did you say the same thing when CTA repeated LEO at every turn? He talked about it plenty. All indications are that CCC is walking it just as much as he is talking it. Is your expectation for him to be mute until week 1?

 

[TMFT]

Did you say the same thing when CTA repeated LEO at every turn? He talked about it plenty. All indications are that CCC is walking it just as much as he is talking it. Is your expectation for him to be mute until week 1?

it’s not the same thing. The equivalent to CTA ending interviews with “L-E-O” would be Cigs saying “Get Tough.” Which would be fine.

LEO was a cultural philosophy/slogan. He didn’t talk about LEO outside of being asked (other than ending interviews with the slogan). When asked about it, he’d talk about it being a philosophy of holding each other accountable, building each other up, sacrificing self for the group, etc.

If Cigs tweeted that he’s a blue collar guy and he prizes toughness more than anything and he’s going to put the guys through the wringer to field the toughest team he can, I’m fine with that. “Rooting out softness” is just an inherently negative POV, in my opinion.

It also is the football equivalent of a virtue signal appealing to a bunch of guys who never played past HS and wouldn’t last 30 seconds in their prime vs the softest kid on the team. Very Dunning Kruger.

I’ve said it since the “Google me” presser. Let’s see how he handles a loss. He’s going to lose games at some point. He’s most likely gonna lose some games big on occasion. In my limited experience of watching him, he’s too full of himself to take responsibility for things. He’s going to blame everyone else possible.

 

[EvansvilleHoosier88]

it’s not the same thing. The equivalent to CTA ending interviews with “L-E-O” would be Cigs saying “Get Tough.” Which would be fine.

LEO was a cultural philosophy/slogan. He didn’t talk about LEO outside of being asked (other than ending interviews with the slogan). When asked about it, he’d talk about it being a philosophy of holding each other accountable, building each other up, sacrificing self for the group, etc.

If Cigs tweeted that he’s a blue collar guy and he prizes toughness more than anything and he’s going to put the guys through the wringer to field the toughest team he can, I’m fine with that. “Rooting out softness” is just an inherently negative POV, in my opinion.

It also is the football equivalent of a virtue signal appealing to a bunch of guys who never played past HS and wouldn’t last 30 seconds in their prime vs the softest kid on the team. Very Dunning Kruger.

I’ve said it since the “Google me” presser. Let’s see how he handles a loss. He’s going to lose games at some point. He’s most likely gonna lose some games big on occasion. In my limited experience of watching him, he’s too full of himself to take responsibility for things. He’s going to blame everyone else possible.

There were a lot of assumptions required to make your points.

He very well may have been virtue signaling to groups outside of the team, and that is very much a part of the job. The politics of a head coaching job can be every bit as critical to the success of a coach and program. He needs those bunch of guys to fill seats. Filling the stadium makes for an advantage on game day and the recruiting trail. Filling the stadium means he can barter for more resources to build the program.

We have been unable to beat quality teams. I don’t think anyone in the fan base would be enthused if he came out and said things have been looking great, but we need a schematic shift. We would all know it was BS.

His track record is what his track record is for now. Predicting how he will react if his track record changes doesn’t do much for us. He said google me because the large majority of people he was speaking to do not spend time in an IUFB message board and they probably have no clue who Curt Cignetti is and what he has done. Let them find out and get excited!

 

[vesuvius13]

There were a lot of assumptions required to make your points.

He very well may have been virtue signaling to groups outside of the team, and that is very much a part of the job. The politics of a head coaching job can be every bit as critical to the success of a coach and program. He needs those bunch of guys to fill seats. Filling the stadium makes for an advantage on game day and the recruiting trail. Filling the stadium means he can barter for more resources to build the program.

We have been unable to beat quality teams. I don’t think anyone in the fan base would be enthused if he came out and said things have been looking great, but we need a schematic shift. We would all know it was BS.

His track record is what his track record is for now. Predicting how he will react if his track record changes doesn’t do much for us. He said google me because the large majority of people he was speaking to do not spend time in an IUFB message board and they probably have no clue who Curt Cignetti is and what he has done. Let them find out and get excited!

It is amazing how posters resist a different approach to IUFB when they we calling for a change a few years ago. I think we are so used to failure that some blanch at a coach that has had success and believes in what he is doing will work at IU.

 

[Courtsensetwo]

I have a different view. I don’t think his players were the intended audience. I think he wanted to make a statement to public constituents. Maybe it’s the fans. Maybe he’s preparing the parents of some players for the tough conversations he’s going to have with them when he cuts their sons. I don’t know, but I am willing to give CCC the benefit of the doubt since this isn’t his first rodeo.

I think he is selling tickets.

His team already knows what he is about.

 

[Hoosier Clarion]

it’s not the same thing. The equivalent to CTA ending interviews with “L-E-O” would be Cigs saying “Get Tough.” Which would be fine.

LEO was a cultural philosophy/slogan. He didn’t talk about LEO outside of being asked (other than ending interviews with the slogan). When asked about it, he’d talk about it being a philosophy of holding each other accountable, building each other up, sacrificing self for the group, etc.

If Cigs tweeted that he’s a blue collar guy and he prizes toughness more than anything and he’s going to put the guys through the wringer to field the toughest team he can, I’m fine with that. “Rooting out softness” is just an inherently negative POV, in my opinion.

It also is the football equivalent of a virtue signal appealing to a bunch of guys who never played past HS and wouldn’t last 30 seconds in their prime vs the softest kid on the team. Very Dunning Kruger.

I’ve said it since the “Google me” presser. Let’s see how he handles a loss. He’s going to lose games at some point. He’s most likely gonna lose some games big on occasion. In my limited experience of watching him, he’s too full of himself to take responsibility for things. He’s going to blame everyone else possible.

Let's see, he was a QB in HS, QB at Pitt, collegiate recruiting director, assistant to Saban, HC at a couple 3 different levels while moving up to the next level. Yup he's got no clue about negative results, pressure from a rock and a hard place and just a good old fashioned ass whoopin.
Here's my take, he's a troubleshooter, a problem solver and surrounds himself with good people so less time has to be spent on the 1st and he gets maximum effort for the 2nd.

 

[OpenWheels]

...

It also is the football equivalent of a virtue signal appealing to a bunch of guys who never played past HS and wouldn’t last 30 seconds in their prime vs the softest kid on the team. Very Dunning Kruger.
...

Wrong.

Lot's of people have worked their ass off in life, physically or mentally, and it helped them greatly. Others didn't train themselves that way, or get that training. (Most of us are tougher in some ways, softer in others, and we work to improve.)

That's what he's talking about with a simple tweet. He want's the entire program to embrace toughness, overcoming, working, training, keeping your word.

He' not talking about whether internet message board tough guys, men or women, are as good of athletes or as physically tough as his players.

No wonder you didn't like his tweet. You thought it was about being strong and athletic. That's an outcome of toughness, not the starting requirement.

 

[DANC]

This is really poor leadership. Or maybe it’s better to say it’s a poor management skills.

Keep that stuff in-house. Tell a player he’s soft. Call him a pussy to his face. Whatever. Putting it on blast like that is ego driven.

Right or wrong, he’s also fixin to find out that the power dynamic has shifted significantly in favor of the players vs coaches over the last few years.

He better win and win quick. Because he is going to lose a locker room in a hurry if they lose.

Yeah, he doesn't know today's players at all. He hasn't been coaching for the last 30 years.....

Geezus.

 

[DANC]

Those players not able to handle Bob Knight’s public belittling stayed little.

Knight was all over Daryl Thomas' ass, always calling him soft and making fun of him in front of the team.

He seemed to turn out all right.

 

[DANC]

No kidding, exactly right.

Those cautioning that this needed to be kept in the locker room, should name names.

Who was called out? Or, more revealing, name which player thinks that they were just publicly called out even without coach naming names?

There was nothing wrong, and a lot right, with that tweet.

The people liking that post generally are those who don't post much when we have success but come out of the woodwork when we're struggling. They don't know what it takes to win and are secretly disappointed when IU has success. It's called self-loathing.

 

[DANC]

it’s not the same thing. The equivalent to CTA ending interviews with “L-E-O” would be Cigs saying “Get Tough.” Which would be fine.

LEO was a cultural philosophy/slogan. He didn’t talk about LEO outside of being asked (other than ending interviews with the slogan). When asked about it, he’d talk about it being a philosophy of holding each other accountable, building each other up, sacrificing self for the group, etc.

If Cigs tweeted that he’s a blue collar guy and he prizes toughness more than anything and he’s going to put the guys through the wringer to field the toughest team he can, I’m fine with that. “Rooting out softness” is just an inherently negative POV, in my opinion.

It also is the football equivalent of a virtue signal appealing to a bunch of guys who never played past HS and wouldn’t last 30 seconds in their prime vs the softest kid on the team. Very Dunning Kruger.

I’ve said it since the “Google me” presser. Let’s see how he handles a loss. He’s going to lose games at some point. He’s most likely gonna lose some games big on occasion. In my limited experience of watching him, he’s too full of himself to take responsibility for things. He’s going to blame everyone else possible.

I, for one, hope he's a bad loser. Handling a loss badly is what I expect.

 

[hoosier roadtrips]

This isn’t his first rodeo. If he had trouble managing a locker room it would have manifested before now. I think this is more uncomfortable to fans because we don’t know what a well led program looks like. A statement like Coach Cignetti made, if it makes you uncomfortable, comes down to 1 of 2 things. You either disagree with the statement, or you don’t like that he pointed it out. If you disagree, then prove him wrong. If you don’t like that he pointed it out, that’s a whole other discussion. The whole LEO culture, while it sounds nice, just didn’t play over time. Look at the great coaches in sport. Most of them are demanding, push players and make them uncomfortable, and hold them to account.

Not sure a lot of that has been happening in IU football of late.

It is hard to imagine a Bob Knight, Vince Lombardi or Mike Ditka doing the LEO mantra. You don't have to be a nice guy to be successful. Leo Durocher was the opposite of that.

 

[red hornet]

This reminds me of Leo Durcher's famous quote "nice guys finish last".

 

[76-1]

It is hard to imagine a Bob Knight, Vince Lombardi or Mike Ditka doing the LEO mantra. You don't have to be a nice guy to be successful. Leo Durocher was the opposite of that.

Actually they all did it but in a different fashion...

Doing your job and not letting your teammates down is the very essence of LEO and what all three of those Coaches were about... They just didn't use it as a punch line; or as an excuse to allow repeated failure to be rewarded...

 

[red hornet]

Actually they all did it but in a different fashion...

Doing your job and not letting your teammates down is the very essence of LEO and what all three of those Coaches were about... They just didn't use it as a punch line; or as an excuse to allow repeated failure to be rewarded...

Yes, Bobby Knight always swore the best player motivator was fear.

 

[DANC]

Yes, Bobby Knight always swore the best player motivator was fear.

Anyone who has been in the military knows Bob Knight and his motivational techniques.

He learned it at West Point. Anyone who has gone through military Basic Training has had a Bob Knight-type drill instructor.

 

[abraxis]

Anyone who has been in the military knows Bob Knight and his motivational techniques.

He learned it at West Point. Anyone who has gone through military Basic Training has had a Bob Knight-type drill instructor.

Farmers call it chaff separating from wheat. Drill sergeants call it Marboro men distinguishing themselves from momma's boys in survival of the fittest.

 

[iueyedoc99]

Actually they all did it but in a different fashion...

Doing your job and not letting your teammates down is the very essence of LEO and what all three of those Coaches were about... They just didn't use it as a punch line; or as an excuse to allow repeated failure to be rewarded...

Allen didn’t either.

Y’all make waaaaay too big of a deal out of “LEO”. I think most IU fans don’t actually understand what it was supposed to be about. It’s an easy target since TA failed (as has every other football coach at IU to some level), but him failing had pretty much nothing to do with “LEO”.

 

[Courtsensetwo]

Allen didn’t either.

Y’all make waaaaay too big of a deal out of “LEO”. I think most IU fans don’t actually understand what it was supposed to be about. It’s an easy target since TA failed (as has every other football coach at IU to some level), but him failing had pretty much nothing to do with “LEO”.

Agree. Nothing wrong with LEO as a culture IMO. They did not continue the winning that happened in 19/20 and you can blame that on whatever/whomever you wish.

 

[76-1]

Allen didn’t either.

Y’all make waaaaay too big of a deal out of “LEO”. I think most IU fans don’t actually understand what it was supposed to be about. It’s an easy target since TA failed (as has every other football coach at IU to some level), but him failing had pretty much nothing to do with “LEO”.

Never crossed my mind that it did...

 

[ce36ei]

This is no different from what Dan Campbell has done in Detroit. Let’s enjoy the ride.

 

[jsenleo]

I agree... I don't think using LEO as his motivator had anything to do with CTA's failure....

But, if he'd used one of the other zodiac signs like Pisces or Virgo then I'd say, yes.

 

[76-1]

Allen didn’t either.

Y’all make waaaaay too big of a deal out of “LEO”. I think most IU fans don’t actually understand what it was supposed to be about. It’s an easy target since TA failed (as has every other football coach at IU to some level), but him failing had pretty much nothing to do with “LEO”.

Actually his failing wasn't directly tied to LEO (which I like, a lot, by the way) but his twisting it to encompass a weird version of "never having to say you're sorry" morphing into zero real accountability for constant on field errors by both players and staff sure was...

 

[DANC]

Allen didn’t either.

Y’all make waaaaay too big of a deal out of “LEO”. I think most IU fans don’t actually understand what it was supposed to be about. It’s an easy target since TA failed (as has every other football coach at IU to some level), but him failing had pretty much nothing to do with “LEO”.

If you put 100 people in a room, you'd get 100 different definitions of LEO.

 

[abraxis]

If you put 100 people in a room, you'd get 100 different definitions of LEO.

Well there you go…Allen’s acronym left so much ambiguity it proved to be ineffective. Everyone had their own idea of understanding what the hell “love each other” really meant, that is, it’s hidden meaning, it lacked in solidarity as a motivational rallying cry. Who knew!

LEO - so eloquent in its simplicity on the outside, so worthless in complexity on the inside.

 

[Big Red Crimson Buffalo]

in the end, LEO never really left.
It’s playing out across the parking lot in SSAH. No accountability.
Miss some free throws? No problem. Pat on the butt. Mistakes repeat. Repeat again. Ho -hum. No urgency.

 

[DANC]

Well there you go…Allen’s acronym left so much ambiguity it proved to be ineffective. Everyone had their own idea of understanding what the hell “love each other” really meant, that is, it’s hidden meaning, it lacked in solidarity as a motivational rallying cry. Who knew!

LEO - so eloquent in its simplicity on the outside, so worthless in complexity on the inside.

He explained it many times, but it seems like it contained something different each time. Maybe something added to pertain to whatever situation he was talking about.

It could be used for anything and everything. To me, the whole idea when Bob Huggins' West Virginia team was playing and one of their guys got hurt. Huggy ran out on the floor and literally held this kid's head in his head and was literally crying over him. The announcers couldn't say enough how much he loved his kids, cared for them, etc. This was some time ago, but I noticed guys started talking about getting 'love' from their coaches or teams.

I think it was some culture thing Allen was trying to tap into. Some bought into it, but it wasn't well defined.