Coach Tweet
- Thread starter HillzHoozier
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He mismanaged the most important brand that he was responsible for. Woodson asked for the job after Crean. Again, how easy was his job? But he wanted to do it his way, thus, why I will always criticize him. I trust you could have done a better job.
Thankfully, the Trustees intervened and made the decision to fire Crean when they did, or that regime would’ve continued under Glass, who had no intention of firing TC. The Miller hire wasn’t a bad move by the standards of the day but, as Mike Woodson alluded to, the process was poorly managed by Glass, which was a hallmark of his AD stewardship. No chance MW is the coach today had Glass not “retired”. To his credit, he helped improve the facilities, which were badly lagging, and they now fit nicely in the mid-range of the Big 10. Football is obviously at a crossroads, with the anomaly of 2020 followed by the reality of 2021 and the prospect of a major rebuild in Year 6 of the Allen regime. That’s scary, but that’s the reality of the situation. Again, a lack of leadership led to that result, and hopefully a higher level of stewardship under Dolson will lead to something far better.
Dolson knew a change needed to be made and he made it happen. He somewhat foolishly went down the Stevens rabbit hole, which had zero chance of succeeding, but showed wisdom in reaching out to the basketball alumni to help convince Woody that the leadership change at the department merited him (Mike) taking another look at the job. Happy he’s here and, though much needs to be done, the future looks much brighter.
Being the old man that I am, it's pretty cool to hear them call him sir. I like their respect of him.
I'd like scott a lot more if he got tom allen to replace Hiller with even a mediocre OL coach.
He was a facilities guy and, in that regard, he deserves a solid B. As a steward of individual programs and a hirer of coaches, he’s a D, at best. As you said, he’s gone.
The only "damage" you need/want to know about likely involved a forceps delivery with 'complications'.
Really? Who gave Crean the contract extension based on a preseason ranking? Who hired Archie Miller?
You think hiring Todd was a mistake? REALLY???
The extension was a mistake and I bet FG would acknowledge that but AM was only mistake seen in hindsight. Quit practicing revisionist history.
The extension was brilliant. Otherwise, Crean surely would have gotten an extension after the 15/16 season that would have cost IU tons more. And no way IU punts on an extension after 15/16 with only 3 years remaining and the buyout only being 500k. Plus. Crean did take us from nothing to #1 and respectability. He is not elite.
And Archie was nationally thought to be a good hire at the time. RMK liked the hire too. It just didn't work out.
My criticism has never been about hiring Archie Miller, as I agree 100% with you, he was viewed as a "can't miss" and on everyone's short list. My criticism (and in fairness, I don't even know if it's valid, as it could have been done behind the scenes) is that it didn't seem like they did a comprehensive search. I think FG fell in love with AM and thought that would make everyone happy and so he targeted him. I'd have liked a more exhaustive search with a small committee of folks you respect, just so you don't get misled by infatuation with a particular candidate. If you always went with the "can't miss" guy, we'd have never hired a 30 year old coach from Army back in 73.
Some where nervous. My nephew and I weren’t sure. It’s not like Hoosier nation was 100% behind the hire. Came very quick. Their were no other candidates seriously considered. He zoned in on Miller only. That was Fred’s downfall. He hit the easy button on Miller.
Woodson alluded to this when he spoke of his dissatisfaction and disappointment in the process that resulted in Miller‘s hiring. It was a none-too-subtle shot at Glass, who was firmly in control of that situation. He locked in on Miller and didn’t bother to consider anyone else, which is always a mistake. Glass dropped that ball, and it rolled off his foot out of bounds, like a number of his other hires. Identifying and managing coaches was obviously not his strength.
Spilled milk, though. Let’s see how we do going forward.
The athletic director is evaluated for being right and wrong not for doing what is popular. It was Glass’s job to fix IU basketball. He failed. Any other explanation is an excuse to pad his legacy.
In retrospect the AM hire was a poor choice that was widely supported outside of the IU circle.
The thing we will never know is who would have been the choice had Fred been allowed to move on TC earlier when he wanted to and what the outcomes would have been.
Regardless, I like where we are today and kudos to Scott for having the stones to move on AM when he did.
Broken record I know...but just imagine where we would be with AM right now.
The Trustees intervened and gave him “help” when it became apparent to several of them that he wasn’t able to be an effective steward of that program, among several others. His unwavering support of Crean coupled with his botched hiring of Miller made his lack of effectiveness evident to the powers that be. It was no mystery that he ended up leaving at the end of all that.
IMO, you have some strange logic.
FG hired AM and "he was viewed as a "can't miss" and on everyone's short list" and I agree with that statement but then you question the lack of a search? First of all, does anyone know the extent of the "search"? AND, if you hire a can't miss candidate, what would a more extensive search reveal? You already have a "CAN'T MISS" coach.
Almost seems like a catch 22 situation.
Unfortunately, AM was a total miss, an air ball but no one was predicting that at the time and unfortunately, FG didn't have a crystal ball.
The AM hire was viewed as a great choice, and was routinely applauded, because the program needed so much help. He didn’t need to turn IU into Duke, or even Wisconsin to be viewed as a success. Had he just turned us into an Iowa or Illinois he’d still be here. The bar for him being a home run hire was set low, but unfortunately he couldn’t clear it.
I can’t believe anyone thought IU was going to become elite again under Miller. Or at least anyone aside from a few crazy folks on this forum.
The hire was widely applauded outside of IU circles but unfortunately it became evident he was not going to be a good fit.
Yes the fit was terrible.
sadly, he was viewed as a home run hire because expectations for the program were so low. He couldn’t even meet those low expectations, however, and I suspect that you are right and was due to the poor fit.
What would you say were Archie's shortcomings that were obvious at the time of his hire?
Poppycock. Expectations have been the same since BK. The 'powers' thought they were hiring the next Coach K, not settling for an upgrade. Swing and a miss. It happens.
not so much shortcomings as what are the expectations?
In other words, if he had been hired by UK, UNC or Duke, would their fans have thought it was a home run hire? What if he had been hired by Evansville?
I am always concerned about supposed up and coming coaches taking a leap to a bigger program.
i hoped he could build us into a poor man’s PU or Wisconsin type program. Teams that were better than the sum of the individual parts, got old and stayed old, and we would become much more consistent than the Crean years.
my concerns were that we would need better athletes and players than he would bring in, and that’s why I viewed him as a low ceiling high floor type of coach.
I was wrong on the floor part, VBG.
None of those programs would have hired Woodson, but so far he's everything we'd hoped for (along with the staff, of course).
The expectations for Miller was that his philosophies were sound and proven, and with the talent he would get at IU we'd be set. Turned out he seemed to be a drag to play for and guys didn't really show much improvement.
A search would’ve allowed for all sorts of comparisons among candidates, and it’s far more likely Miller’s less desirable qualities would’ve shown through. As it was, Glass cut himself off from that necessary phase of hiring by declaring love at first sight, an error often committed by those who tend to not be the deepest of thinkers. Again, Woodson derisively alluded very specifically to the way that search was conducted, and it was apparent he viewed it as amateur hour. Turns out he was right.
That's all true. I'd add he had a team full of players who couldn't hit water falling out of a boat, a few of which are still on the roster. That CAM couldnt adjust to that and motivate more winning effort is squarely on the coach.
It was another attempt to hire outside of Knight’s legacy. Asking someone to build a program at IU is the wrong question altogether. This job was always meant for a Hoosier.
Woody has a unique fit with IU, so no...none of those programs would have hired him.
and yes...those programs listed would have called AM a good hire, that was not unique to IU.
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