the best thing about this movie is that Abrams removed or didn;t use the dumb things of ep V, VI, I, II, III....
Ep I.II, and III tired to be both adult and childish at that same time. To the point that children get bored with all the political blah blah blah and the adults hate the dumb crap like Jar Jar. He who chases two rabbits catches none. This was done in direct response to V, VI being too much like a commercial for toy sales (which they were).
Those are the things that Abrams got right. Less is more and it was a much better movie. What he didn't do was actually add anything. I truly believe the book on him is correct. He's much better with short stories, and has no real inherent talent for actual storytelling and no idea how to do epic storytelling. Star Trek is a much better medium for him.
Much has to do with his writing style, he's a story boarder. Kasdan also is ill equipped he's a scene card writer. What they need was a old school writer who writes directly to the page. It just promotes better storytelling where scene cards and story-boarding are better for short stories, dialogue, and action.
It was nice to see more live action as opposed to the computer animated crap like the prior movies.
One doofus sitting next to me gasped when Han was killed. He must've been the only one in the world who didn't know that Harrison Ford didn't want to do another Star Wars.
I wonder how much longer Mayhew will play Chewie. He's had health issues and needed double at times.
I watched an interview with JJ about that. The thought was taking the general theme or plot from 4, reforming it and making old new with new characters. Build towards something new and then use episode 8/9 to go somewhere completely new.
Using a car analogy... If you're going to design a new car start with what you know works, 4 wheels, a frame and an engine... From there it's all you.
3 characters, 1 baddy, light side, dark side, great loss, search for something mythical, companion droid... Redemption
I think most are thinking this will follow the same arc of redemption for someone, but something tells me the next two movies will be very different from Empire Strikes and Return of the Jedi
It was nice to see more live action as opposed to the computer animated crap like the prior movies.
One doofus sitting next to me gasped when Han was killed. He must've been the only one in the world who didn't know that Harrison Ford didn't want to do another Star Wars.
I wonder how much longer Mayhew will play Chewie. He's had health issues and needed double at times.
I'll probably see the movie at some point, but an awful lot of people don't follow it as closely as it seems many of you do. Guess I know what the spoiler is now...
I watched an interview with JJ about that. The thought was taking the general theme or plot from 4, reforming it and making old new with new characters. Build towards something new and then use episode 8/9 to go somewhere completely new.
Using a car analogy... If you're going to design a new car start with what you know works, 4 wheels, a frame and an engine... From there it's all you.
3 characters, 1 baddy, light side, dark side, great loss, search for something mythical, companion droid... Redemption
I think most are thinking this will follow the same arc of redemption for someone, but something tells me the next two movies will be very different from Empire Strikes and Return of the Jedi
So basically the same thing he did with Lost, where they wrote episodes weekly using proven plot devices but had no clue what the story actually was or where is was going to end? No wonder ...
I'll probably see the movie at some point, but an awful lot of people don't follow it as closely as it seems many of you do. Guess I know what the spoiler is now...
I'll probably see the movie at some point, but an awful lot of people don't follow it as closely as it seems many of you do. Guess I know what the spoiler is now...
It was nice to see more live action as opposed to the computer animated crap like the prior movies.
One doofus sitting next to me gasped when Han was killed. He must've been the only one in the world who didn't know that Harrison Ford didn't want to do another Star Wars.
I wonder how much longer Mayhew will play Chewie. He's had health issues and needed double at times.
Most of the EU is no longer cannon... As to your comment re Lost, JJ isn't writing the final 2 just ep 7 so he can't do that
His quote was essentially, desert planet hero, loner, search for someone/something lost, someone in need of redemption and "trench battle" make it feel like an old one.
There's a ton of Dan service but seeing as how the first 3 episodes are a disservice to fans this feels right
I'm not huge on bigger Death Star but it worked. It wasn't super easily destroyed and there was more to it than shoot torpedo down hole
Most of the EU is no longer cannon... As to your comment re Lost, JJ isn't writing the final 2 just ep 7 so he can't do that
His quote was essentially, desert planet hero, loner, search for someone/something lost, someone in need of redemption and "trench battle" make it feel like an old one.
There's a ton of Dan service but seeing as how the first 3 episodes are a disservice to fans this feels right
I'm not huge on bigger Death Star but it worked. It wasn't super easily destroyed and there was more to it than shoot torpedo down hole
Yea, that's kinda the sore spot, EU wasn't good enough for Disney to continue it, but was good enough for Abrams to steal from and insert into his tracing of Ep IV. I suspect there's going to a lot of that in the next few films too.
Imagine what the team that wrote Legacy feel about this movie. It's their characters, down to some conversations, (Han and Leia about Jacen er I mean Kylo Revan, er I mean Ren) and plots that helped reap 5B last week for someone else. Of all the different art mediums, filmmakers are by far the most creatively lazy and lacking in character. Imagine what the artist for KotOR thought seeing his design creation on screen under a different name in the art credits?
Anyone else but a filmmaker would be embarrassed by doing a tracing, but Abrams actually has the balls to rationalize it.. Why not say, "I'm unimaginative, lazy and scared so I just stole proven material and characters from someone else." I would respect that.
Hopefully they do steal Jaina being trained by Boba Fett to destroy Jacen by fighting Mandalorian dirty. Opps I meant Rey and Kylo Revan, ... Ren.
Of course since the source work was good to begin with, the movie was good, but very few understand that Lucas and his EU writers wrote the real treatment for this movie years ago and Abrams only deserves the minimal amount of credit.
So basically the same thing he did with Lost, where they wrote episodes weekly using proven plot devices but had no clue what the story actually was or where is was going to end? No wonder ...
After the pilot, Abrams became less and less involved with Lost. That was Damon Lindeloff and Carlton Cuse. He would visit the set, and wrote the premier of season 3, but he was more involved with Mission Impossible.
He has a history of doing that...left Felicity to concentrate on Alias, Alias to work on Lost, Lost to work on movies.
Overall, the movie was great. I'll start with the non-spoilery stuff:
1. I thought the new characters were all well done, and the new actors were all great. Adam Driver and Daisy Ridley were especially good. John Boyega also deserves props, and the scenes that developed the relationship between Finn and Rey were all extremely well acted.
2. This film captured the sense of the original trilogy more than the prequels, by far. Abrams' decision to cut back on CGI in favor of more traditional special effects was key, and probably the most important directorial decision he made.
3. A little too long, but I understand that they had to introduce all the new characters properly.
4. "A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away..." still gave me chills. I felt like we should all start applauding when the title card popped up.
Now, some minor spoilery things:
1. The BIL's first comment when it was over, which is entirely accurate, and matches what others have said: "That was just A New Hope with different characters." The different aspects of Luke's journey were divided among Poe, Finn and Rey, but the plot was the same. Starkiller was the Death Star.
2. The references to the original trilogy, meant to draw on our desire for nostalgia, became a little overbearing at times. There were borrowed lines ("I have a bad feeling about this") and thematic references (the resistance base during the final battle).
3. A lot of what happened was obvious ahead of time. Once it got going, there were really no surprises. When Finn faced Kylo, I immediately knew that he was going to be disarmed, and where that would lead.
And some major spoilers:
1. Speaking of predictable, I was not surprised to find out who Kylo Ren was, and when Han saw him walking across that bridge, I immediately knew everything that would happen in that scene. I could have practically lip-synced the lines. When he told Han he knew what he had to do, and asked if he would help him, you'd have to be brain dead to not realize what he was talking about. Which makes me wonder, was Han brain dead, or did he accept it?
2. Who the hell is Rey? I figured she was Kylo's sister, but Sister Goat says she thinks she's Luke's kid. If I were right, I'd think we would have found out at the end of the movie. Leia couldn't have continued to keep that a secret from her, after what happened, right? So maybe Sister Goat is right. I suppose we'll find out in about 18 months.
3. Who the hell is Finn? He's not obviously strong in the force* like Rey, but he was still able to use the lightsaber. Is there something more to him? Perhaps his inability to stay loyal to the First Order was because of something deeper, force-related.
4. Speaking of black guys, where was Lando? It seems unlikely that he'd just drop off the face of the galaxy. Although Han was important, Leia and Luke were reduced to plot devices. Similarly, meaningless appearances by Admiral Akbar and others strengthened the connection to the original trilogy. So, why couldn't Disney throw Billy Dee a few thousand bucks for a cameo? Note: he might come back.
* NB: I said "not obviously." I didn't say "obviously not."
Top to bottom, I'd rank it above Jedi, right up there with A New Hope and Empire. It wasn't the end all be all, but it was a satisfactory next step in the Star Wars saga, and, most importantly, unlike Jedi and the prequels, it was objectively well-done from a film-making standpoint.
Overall, the movie was great. I'll start with the non-spoilery stuff:
1. I thought the new characters were all well done, and the new actors were all great. Adam Driver and Daisy Ridley were especially good. John Boyega also deserves props, and the scenes that developed the relationship between Finn and Rey were all extremely well acted.
2. This film captured the sense of the original trilogy more than the prequels, by far. Abrams' decision to cut back on CGI in favor of more traditional special effects was key, and probably the most important directorial decision he made.
3. A little too long, but I understand that they had to introduce all the new characters properly.
4. "A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away..." still gave me chills. I felt like we should all start applauding when the title card popped up.
Now, some minor spoilery things:
1. The BIL's first comment when it was over, which is entirely accurate, and matches what others have said: "That was just A New Hope with different characters." The different aspects of Luke's journey were divided among Poe, Finn and Rey, but the plot was the same. Starkiller was the Death Star.
2. The references to the original trilogy, meant to draw on our desire for nostalgia, became a little overbearing at times. There were borrowed lines ("I have a bad feeling about this") and thematic references (the resistance base during the final battle).
3. A lot of what happened was obvious ahead of time. Once it got going, there were really no surprises. When Finn faced Kylo, I immediately knew that he was going to be disarmed, and where that would lead.
And some major spoilers:
1. Speaking of predictable, I was not surprised to find out who Kylo Ren was, and when Han saw him walking across that bridge, I immediately knew everything that would happen in that scene. I could have practically lip-synced the lines. When he told Han he knew what he had to do, and asked if he would help him, you'd have to be brain dead to not realize what he was talking about. Which makes me wonder, was Han brain dead, or did he accept it?
2. Who the hell is Rey? I figured she was Kylo's sister, but Sister Goat says she thinks she's Luke's kid. If I were right, I'd think we would have found out at the end of the movie. Leia couldn't have continued to keep that a secret from her, after what happened, right? So maybe Sister Goat is right. I suppose we'll find out in about 18 months.
3. Who the hell is Finn? He's not obviously strong in the force* like Rey, but he was still able to use the lightsaber. Is there something more to him? Perhaps his inability to stay loyal to the First Order was because of something deeper, force-related.
4. Speaking of black guys, where was Lando? It seems unlikely that he'd just drop off the face of the galaxy. Although Han was important, Leia and Luke were reduced to plot devices. Similarly, meaningless appearances by Admiral Akbar and others strengthened the connection to the original trilogy. So, why couldn't Disney throw Billy Dee a few thousand bucks for a cameo? Note: he might come back.
* NB: I said "not obviously." I didn't say "obviously not."
Top to bottom, I'd rank it above Jedi, right up there with A New Hope and Empire. It wasn't the end all be all, but it was a satisfactory next step in the Star Wars saga, and, most importantly, unlike Jedi and the prequels, it was objectively well-done from a film-making standpoint.
Overall, the movie was great. I'll start with the non-spoilery stuff:
1. I thought the new characters were all well done, and the new actors were all great. Adam Driver and Daisy Ridley were especially good. John Boyega also deserves props, and the scenes that developed the relationship between Finn and Rey were all extremely well acted.
2. This film captured the sense of the original trilogy more than the prequels, by far. Abrams' decision to cut back on CGI in favor of more traditional special effects was key, and probably the most important directorial decision he made.
3. A little too long, but I understand that they had to introduce all the new characters properly.
4. "A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away..." still gave me chills. I felt like we should all start applauding when the title card popped up.
Now, some minor spoilery things:
1. The BIL's first comment when it was over, which is entirely accurate, and matches what others have said: "That was just A New Hope with different characters." The different aspects of Luke's journey were divided among Poe, Finn and Rey, but the plot was the same. Starkiller was the Death Star.
2. The references to the original trilogy, meant to draw on our desire for nostalgia, became a little overbearing at times. There were borrowed lines ("I have a bad feeling about this") and thematic references (the resistance base during the final battle).
3. A lot of what happened was obvious ahead of time. Once it got going, there were really no surprises. When Finn faced Kylo, I immediately knew that he was going to be disarmed, and where that would lead.
And some major spoilers:
1. Speaking of predictable, I was not surprised to find out who Kylo Ren was, and when Han saw him walking across that bridge, I immediately knew everything that would happen in that scene. I could have practically lip-synced the lines. When he told Han he knew what he had to do, and asked if he would help him, you'd have to be brain dead to not realize what he was talking about. Which makes me wonder, was Han brain dead, or did he accept it?
2. Who the hell is Rey? I figured she was Kylo's sister, but Sister Goat says she thinks she's Luke's kid. If I were right, I'd think we would have found out at the end of the movie. Leia couldn't have continued to keep that a secret from her, after what happened, right? So maybe Sister Goat is right. I suppose we'll find out in about 18 months.
3. Who the hell is Finn? He's not obviously strong in the force* like Rey, but he was still able to use the lightsaber. Is there something more to him? Perhaps his inability to stay loyal to the First Order was because of something deeper, force-related.
4. Speaking of black guys, where was Lando? It seems unlikely that he'd just drop off the face of the galaxy. Although Han was important, Leia and Luke were reduced to plot devices. Similarly, meaningless appearances by Admiral Akbar and others strengthened the connection to the original trilogy. So, why couldn't Disney throw Billy Dee a few thousand bucks for a cameo? Note: he might come back.
* NB: I said "not obviously." I didn't say "obviously not."
Top to bottom, I'd rank it above Jedi, right up there with A New Hope and Empire. It wasn't the end all be all, but it was a satisfactory next step in the Star Wars saga, and, most importantly, unlike Jedi and the prequels, it was objectively well-done from a film-making standpoint.
There are a lot of reasons to think that Rey is Luke's daughter. His lightsaber calls to her. Luke's theme seems to follow her as she gets engaged with the main action. Mazz seems to know who she is and wasn't surprised or alarmed when Rey wandered into her cellar/dungeon/basement. As Mazz talks about her not looking back but looking forward, Rey says, "Luke," and Mazz confirms that's her future. It's possible she could just mean from a Jedi training perspective, but it's not likely.
The interesting discussions among those who really sink their teeth into Star Wars (I'm just a movie fan), is how does Rey get to Jakku, does Luke know right off who she is, did Luke know where she was, and why does it always have to be isolated desert planets?
The thought is Luke doesn't specifically know Rey is his daughter, and while he does know he has a child, the mother was likely whisked away when he went into exile. From there, Luke would have no idea where the child was, and the scene in Rey's vision where she is a crying child, it could be her mother or someone keeping her from her mother. (Is her mother still alive, and does she know where Rey was?)
One of the great things about this movie is there is a lot of mystery, that the plot was "simple" on purpose. Because of how EP 4-6 went, we know nothing is truly straight forward. A New Hope didn't really have loose ends unless you already knew of 5 and 6, let alone 1-3. So The Force Awakens comes in carrying the rebirth of a franchise, which it pulls off, and it comes in with some people simply thinking movies shouldn't have questions lingering.
EP 1-3, amid being poorly directed and acted, didn't leave much mystery. Not just in overall plot, but it spelled everything out as it went. TFA didn't do that, and that's great.
Not following the EU or paying attention to any rumors, I didn't really know Harrison Ford wanted Han dead in EP6, but Lucas overruled him. I also didn't know Ford campaigned with Abrams to have Han killed in this episode. Once Han walked onto the catwalk, I said to the guy next to me, "Crap, he's dead."
The F-ing catwalk didn't have a railing. Someone was dying and falling, and it wasn't going to be Kylo.
What I'll be interested in is if Leia "felt" it through Han or Kylo. I think she felt Kylo's pain in killing Han, and that it will play a big role as Kylo struggles. I fully expect him to be a badass in EP 8, and what I HOPE happens is that he is a badass in EP 9 and wins the day, opening up another set of movies where he finally gets corralled and returns to Leia.
So I want 8 and 9 to be the rise of Kylo and the development of Rey, and I want 10-12 to be all out war. And there needs to be a an unofficial EP 6.5 in between 9 and 10 where we see the Jedi Academy started and disassembled.
In EU, Jacen (son of Han) a darklord in making kills Luke's wife Mara Jade, which makes Luke question his teaching abilities and the New Jedi Order he has created, which then causes him to disappear looking to a mystical force imbibed planet for his answers.
Seeing that nothing else in this story is actually original, I'm guessing that Kylo killed Rey's Mother which was Luke's wife. Do you guys really think that she's not a damn Skywalker? Come on... I'm hoping she isn't but with all the regurgitated source material already used and so extensively, I think it highly improbable that would be what he would change. But knowing Abrams, he may not actually know and is just making up as he goes along.
I am almost willing to bet Kylo killed Rey's mother. Which made Luke question his teaching abilities, which led him to seek out the first Jedi Temple for his answers. The dumping of a child who is The Chosen One on a desert planet was Luke's path redone.
Also in the first movies the black guy was a traitor to Han, in this movie the black guy is a traitor to the Empire. WTF man,...
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In EU, Jacen (son of Han) a darklord in making kills Luke's wife Mara Jade, which makes Luke question his teaching abilities and the New Jedi Order he has created, which then causes him to disappear looking to a mystical force imbibed planet for his answers.
Seeing that nothing else in this story is actually original, I'm guessing that Kylo killed Rey's Mother which was Luke's wife. Do you guys really think that she's not a damn Skywalker? Come on... I'm hoping she isn't but with all the regurgitated source material already used and so extensively, I think it highly improbable that would be what he would change. But knowing Abrams, he may not actually know and is just making up as he goes along.
I am almost willing to bet Kylo killed Rey's mother. Which made Luke question his teaching abilities, which led him to seek out the first Jedi Temple for his answers. The dumping of a child who is The Chosen One on a desert planet was Luke's path redone.
Also in the first movies the black guy was a traitor to Han, in this movie the black guy is a traitor to the Empire. WTF man,...
If Abrams goes completely off in his own direction, doesn't he take heat like he has from some vocal Star Trek critics? In his two Star Trek movies, he's taken heat just for their tone and the Jim Kirk objectifies women.
As a non-EU guy, I don't care either way beyond discussion. I'm listening to some hard core Star Wars nerds (Rebel Force Radio, Current Geek and The Incomparable) who agree this is a retelling, but they feel there is nothing wrong with this. The main reasons, as I have said on the IC (if the IC exists), they don't care is because Star Wars EU isn't exactly an original story either, just original characters, and that this movie is just damn good.
TFA is still heavy on characterizations, and with RIan Johnson up next, that should continue in a huge way. Star Wars has always been more about the characters than the plot, which Lucas completely screwed up in 1-3.
