Said on Twitter that he is not announcing tomorrow and no timetable given. Many seem to think it will come soon though.
Recruiting board…
- Thread starter bsmitty08
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Teams like Uconn, and Florida Atlantic showed us transfers matter unless we're getting 5 stars cant miss kids I am spending most of my time with transfers. Now that being said can Woddy please recruit some shooters.
Ok next year we have a shooter coming in this year we have maybe Mgbako that's it. Now Cupps I'm not high or Newton who seems like Creek two in the making with injuries. To me Woody has been up and down recruiting there have been some misses and some huge wins..
Ugh both of our starting guards are above average shooters. Woody will have up to 5 capable shooters on the floor.
Does anyone even know what injury is keeping Newton on the sidelines? I haven't heard.
Correct. Crazy how our staring guards both shoot 37%+ from 3. We bring in MM and Ware who are both expected to be solid shooters from 3. Gunn thought to be a shooter even though it was rough last year in an extremely limited role. And both Cupps (just won our 3 point contest) and Newton expected to be solid to good shooters. Plus we already landed a good shooter for next year. Yet some people are saying we have done nothing to improve shooting. Smh.
Some will just always complain no matter who we recruit or land.
Don’t sleep on Walker and Malik. Everyone will be shooting it. If they are open it’s bombs away.
Derek Eltson 2.0s from them vbg. Like you said, hopefully the quality of 2%shots will take that edge off some. McNeeley is such a welcomed edition for next season.
Let me guess: you're counting a guy who shot like 8% from three last year as one of those "capable shooters", right? I hope he is, but I think folks are making waaaayyy too much of CJ's shooting and not enough of his overall play and abilities. To me, he showed he can be a great defender and is athletic, but I'm not ready to call him a capable shooter. I think it's a fair criticism. Has been a weakness on our roster for years and hasn't really been addressed.
I think volume will improve. All those guys have the ability to be three level scorers.
Where did I say that? I said starting guards but Woody will give the green light as always. If you are open you shoot it. I still hope Gunn will shoot it in the mid 30s% but I’m not banking on it. Trey and X will shoot it well that I’m sure of. Gunn will be on the floor not for scoring but to not lose a lead while the starters rest. Same for Walker.
Umm, everyone is up and down on recruiting. It's an art not a science. I think recruiting has been one of CMW's real strengths. 5 star or top 50 guys in: Ware, MM, JHS, Reanu, LM and Bates. I think you can criticize last year's class, but personally with the portal, I'd rather us hold spots than take reaches. We missed on the guys he wanted and he held them and turned them into MM, KW, PS and AW. That's a pretty great haul. Now, can he do it every year? But his recruiting has been a strength and he's turned in solid classes when you consider fall and spring recruiting.
Also, of all the guys we have, I think Cupps has the most natural looking shot and I have high hopes for him to have a really good 3pt %. Won't surprise me if he's one of the top 2 on the team. And, all reports on him have been good. I think he's going to have a very solid career and will always be a dependable shooter.
I'm not even sure of either. XJ has a strange shot, but at least he's proven that it will go in across a few years. Trey, hadd a pretty awful looking shot until last year and his improvement was fantastic, but can he keep it up on a higher volume as a lead shooter? I hope so, but we don't really have a guy you'd call a knock down shooter on our roster, and that's why I think it's a fair criticism that we haven't addressed it directly in a recruit so far... until LM at least.
Oh absolutely. Trey made one of the biggest improvements I ever remember, but did it by remaking his shot. I'd agree he was very good last year, but this year he's going to be asked to take more and tougher shots and will be more of a focus of the other team's D, so what I'm hoping for is a near doubling of attempts with his % not falling below 33%. Even after shooting single digits, I'd say the thing I hear about most on here is CJ's shooting ability. I keep saying forget that, focus on the fact that he looked like a really good defender and athletic and do those things well and contribute that way, and then take the open shots when they are there.
If you are a proven 36-45 % shooter at any volume means they have to guard you. That means more floaters and mid range. All these guys can do that. This isn’t 20 years ago. Most top 25 teams only hit 8-9 a game on 36-37%. IU was under that with only 2 shooters. This team will have 4 guys that the other team will have to guard. They are proven enough.
Was more speaking to the back court with that comment but Banks stands to grow a lot this year I would think.
I don’t think offense will be the issue. I think defense is the question. That’s my take anyway.
OK, you're giving a lot of leeway to what's considered a "shooter". Ware supposedly has a nice stroke for a 7'er, but not here to be a knockdown shooter. MM also supposedly has a nice looking stroke, but what might make him a solid shooter is the threat of his drive. Gunn? C'mon. Even in limited stretches "shooters" don't shoot 8% from 3. Believe it when I see it. Cupps has a solid looking shot and I expect will be a good shooter for the # he takes. Newton I thought was known more for his athleticism. Banks I expect to be solid, but not a knockdown shooter. LM is really the first guy I'd say Woody's recruited, maybe since Tamar, who was known to be a good shooter. Not to say he won't, but he's not prioritized shooting so far, imo.
People judging a minuscule data set are going to be in for a real treat these next few years. Playing within the rhythm of an actual offense is one thing, jacking up an end of a shot clock 3 in a 25 point blowout is another.
You’ve mentioned a bunch of different players, and to me the question is what have they proven (in college)?
Some, maybe all of those listed, will be good shooters, but until I see it (in an IU uniform), I am in a wait and see mode.
Certainly kids can improve (Trey, Franklin) and kids can have stretches where they shoot well and others where they are ice cold (Bates). Still, for every AJ Guyton there are a bunch of players that look awesome playing against MiddleTown central that can’t carry that over to college.
And you are putting words in my mouth. I said we have clearly recruited to address shooting. Gunn and Banks both shot 38% from 3 in high school. Newton shot 34%. Cupps can clearly shoot though I am not sure what he shot in high school. MM and Ware didn’t shoot the 3 great but are expected to be solid 3 point shooter for their positions.
I agree that we don’t have a knock down 3 point specialist but I don’t think Woodson wants that. He wants 4-5 players who can all do multiple things to include shooting the 3.
So yes I stand by that we have recruited to address shooting even without a 3 point specialist.
Hope so. My real criticism wasn't that CJ shot poorly, it was that he shot so many 3s, relatively speaking, for the time he was in there. Amazing that you think somehow the ball always ended up in his hands at the end of the shot clock. 3PA/minutes, he was shooting one about every 6.25 minutes... the most on the team. More than MK, TB, JHS and TG. All I'm saying is that your own internal voice should be telling you to slow down and look for better attempts than to keep chucking. I've just cooled on expecting/hoping he's going to be a knock down 3 guy and want to see him become the most effective player he can be, and I think he can be very effective without hunting 3 opportunities.
You're a coach, something I've wondered about is does CJ elevate too much on his shot? Very few outstanding 3 pts shooters elevate that much, which to me adds a degree of variability to a shot, when you are seeking consistency. Do you think he over-elevates on his shot?
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I just think shooting #s in HS are not necessarily indicative vs when you get to college for most guys. Let's say you're a typical HS player and you have to guard Gunn, Newton, or Banks in HS. How are you playing them? Most are going to give up the outside shot and overplay the drive because they are way more athletic than their defenders. Not so in college and I think that's why Gunn's #s flatlined. Also why I'm excited about LM's shooting. At the level he was playing at, he was probably being closed out on and guarded more closely and similarly to how college will be, so I think his 3 pt % will translate better to college. I don't think of a 34% shooter in HS as anything special, and don't expect those #s to translate to college for the reason's stated.
I can’t argue what you said there at all. You are correct. It is a bit of a crapshoot on hs shooting translating to college.
The only problem I have with anything that has been said is those saying Woodson hasn’t addressed shooting while recruiting. I believe he has. Will it translate? I don’t know at this point but I am hopeful.
Another issue I have is those looking at 3 point shooting alone. There are hs players out there that are elite shooters but can’t guard, pass, rebound at a high level. I would take Gunn all day over a kid who brings shooting 3s and nothing else. That remains true even if he is a career 30% 3 point shooter over 4 years. Personally I think he will end up mid to high 30s.
You can stand by it all you want. What do you suspect other coaches say about defending IU?
I don’t care what they say. If we shoot well enough to spread the floor offensively we will be fine. Everyone doesn’t have to be a knockdown shooter. They just have to shoot well enough that they don’t ignore them like TJD and Race were ignored when they stepped out.
Not at all as long as it's one fluid motion and straight up and not falling forwards or backwards. The higher you elevate the better arch you get on the ball and the shorter distance the ball has to travel.
UConn took 25 and hit 9 for 36%.(not exact)2 players shot 40% or better. 1 shot 38%. The rest were just good enough to keep you honest. That’s what woody is building. 35-38% from 3 as a team on 8-10 makes. That’s the formula. Hawkins took the most. If IU can hit 2 more a game than they did last year that would do wonders. Preferably from the 3-4 guys.
Another aspect is how good this IU team can be offensive rebounding on 3 attempts.
I'm sure somewhere out there are stats on offensive rebounding on 3 attempt stats,
I would like to see those and what the improvement this season looks like.
Also what is the effective FG% when you offensive rebound a 3 attempt.
I mean how many games in years past does it feel like IU is at an 6 to 8 point deficit to the opponent due to the opponents ability or "luck" to get those offensive 3 rebounds.
The higher you elevate, the more variability to your shot, and the more likely you get bumped and knocked off balance. I knew a guy who would give you a little nudge at your waist as you were going up, and it will blow up your shot and is pretty subtle and not often called (Iowa had a defender who I'd heard accused of doing this). Were you a coach? Go look at the best shooters and ask yourself why they don't elevate as high as they can then. Curry, Klay Thompson, Bird, Luka... based on your description, why don't they elevate more? See a trend? Ray Allen is one of the only great shooters that I can think of who really elevated even a reasonable amount on his shot. Kobe elevated a good amount, but Kobe was a freak. I'd say CJ elevates more on his shot than anyone I've mentioned other than Kobe possibly. I don't see any correlation between arc and how high you jump, in fact I'd guess it's maybe inverse. The guys I think of with great arc (Bird, Curry, etc...) shot a low jump shot. I remember seeing a computer generated "perfect" arc and then they superimposed Birds shot arc and it was identical.
Last year we made 5.6 threes a game. So, saying we “just” need to make 2 more per game (which would get us to 7.6) we need to make 36% more per game. Getting to 9 made per game means making 71% more .
I agree with what you are saying, but I guess my point is that while 8-10 made per game sounds small, we weren’t anywhere close to that.
Then throw in the fact that we attempted around 500, but we lost Kopp (152), Hood (111) Bates (99), and even Race (43). Trey shot around 65, IIRC. Now, we do get back a healthy X who shot 38.3 % on 94 the prior year.
It will be interesting to see, what our numbers are this year.
Call me a contrarian, but I have a feeling that Trey may be more of a Scorer this year than last, but not with increased usage or production from 3. I think we may see those numbers go down, but see him more rely on the driving / layups/ floaters game.
Think you ought to go back and look at some old videos of Pete Maravich shooting a basketball. There's a reason he's known as the "Father of Shooing" and why his form was taught and emulated for years.
Michael Jordan too.
That’s my hope and 7.6 is close to 8.😜 what will help is you have MM who if you close out can drive the ball. Plus Ware will drag his guy out. This should open the floor a bit and I do believe floor spacing won’t be that big of an issue. Just have to hit them.
Pistol definitely elevated... but you're going back 50 years? And, if you only work as hard as the guy who likely worked on his game more than any other, you'll be OK? For every great shooter who elevated enough to make it notable, there are dozens who didn't. I think it might be a problem for CJ. I've noticed many times how high he elevates, right before I noticed how often they didn't go in.
He was a 2000 pt scorer in high school and is LN’s ppg career scoring leader, the same school who has produced multiple top 10 picks, with the same form. The lift on his jump shot isn’t the problem. Getting meaningful minutes and playing within a structured offense however is and something he hasn’t been afforded the opportunity yet.
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