Poll: is Trump’s usage of the term “pocohantas” racist?

[Aloha Hoosier]

I think everyone forgets that she was told she had a substantial Native American background by her family. She had been told that since she was a young child. She grew up in Oklahoma, which has the highest percentage of native Americans of any state.

So, I can understand why she claimed it. It’s nit as if DNA tests were a thing in those days. And they haven’t been until really recently.

Still think it was a mistake to try to counter Trump’s bullying on the subject.

I do think she has a great opportunity to help educate folks on what it means to be a Native American. If she simply told us what she learned over the past year or so, I believe she’ll be fine.

Substantial? She says the family lore was that her great-great-great grandmother was “part” Native American. That’s hardly substantial. I met my Native American grandmother as a young kid shortly before she died, so it wasn’t just “family lore,” and it would have been ridiculous for me to claim to be Native American. It was ludicrous for her to claim it, and she did, and even more so now that her DNA test shows any Native American ancestry she has was significantly less than she claims she thought it was. She can’t educate anyone on what it means to be Native American - she’s proved she knows next to nothing about it.

 

[zeke4ahs]

Substantial? She says the family lore was that her great-great-great grandmother was “part” Native American. That’s hardly substantial. I met my Native American grandmother as a young kid shortly before she died, so it wasn’t just “family lore,” and it would have been ridiculous for me to claim to be Native American. It was ludicrous for her to claim it, and she did, and even more so now that her DNA test shows any Native American ancestry she has was significantly less than she claims she thought it was. She can’t educate anyone on what it means to be Native American - she’s proved she knows next to nothing about it.

I’m with you on most of this. She has handled it very poorly. It would be fine if she told stories and passed history down, but once she started marking it as part of her heritage on forms, that was a really bad mistake.

 

[Harry Hondo]

Which is an inaccurate myth continually propagated by Trump, and his parrots that repeat everything he says. The organizations that could’ve used the info to help her have gone out of their way to say that the possible Native American ancestry played zero role in her being awarded her role.

It’s as if Trump has learned that if you repeat something enough, even if it’s blatantly untrue, you can make some people believe that it’s the truth.

The sad part is that Warren has a pretty amazing story. And all some folks can think about her is the nickname “pocohantas”. It’s pretty damn sickening.

BTW, this type of behavior/usage of press is what dictators do in third world countries. They basically create their own reality. Trump did it for years by leaking nasty stuff about others to the press. And also by leaking favorable info to him. Sometimes even in disguise. John Miller used to call people, and “John Miller” was clearly Trump. He got away with it for so long he can’t operate any other way at this point for you, .

Thank god we have a free press to call him out on this type of thing. I just wish folks would start seeking the truth, instead of automatically parroting whatever right wing media/Trump (largely one and the same now) tell them is reality.

Here is a shocker for you, the left was rejected by the voting electorate. They will be in the midterms and in 2020. It isn’t an accepting of Trump as much as it is saying no to the direction Obama and the left wanted to go.

There is where the parroting happens. I hope Obama continues to campaign like no other President has done. You guys still don’t get it.

Looks like you didn't get it

 

[hoot1]

First of all, I don't believe American Indians are a race.

Having said this, how could calling Warren by the name Pocahontas be racist.

IMO it is just a lame attempt by our president at a put down which many of his followers love to use.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Substantial? She says the family lore was that her great-great-great grandmother was “part” Native American. That’s hardly substantial. I met my Native American grandmother as a young kid shortly before she died, so it wasn’t just “family lore,” and it would have been ridiculous for me to claim to be Native American. It was ludicrous for her to claim it, and she did, and even more so now that her DNA test shows any Native American ancestry she has was significantly less than she claims she thought it was. She can’t educate anyone on what it means to be Native American - she’s proved she knows next to nothing about it.

In fairness to Warren, her ancestral genetic test may not accurately track her family tree. I know that mine does not. Her NA ancestors may be a bigger part of her family tree than the genetic test shows.

See

 

[hoosboot]

First of all, I don't believe American Indians are a race.

Having said this, how could calling Warren by the name Pocahontas be racist.

IMO it is just a lame attempt by our president at a put down which many of his followers love to use.

I think President Trump should totally run with your semantic defense of his name-calling, hoot. It's a really important distinction.

 

[zeke4ahs]

First of all, I don't believe American Indians are a race.

Having said this, how could calling Warren by the name Pocahontas be racist.

IMO it is just a lame attempt by our president at a put down which many of his followers love to use.

I’ve got a suggestion. Go up to a black man and call him Sambo and see how that goes.

 

[iuwclurker]

Everyone, especially candidates, should call Trump Pinocchio.

 

[hoot1]

I’ve got a suggestion. Go up to a black man and call him Sambo and see how that goes.

In my younger years to cap off a night on the town I approached a group of dark skinned fellows and declared, " God loves you Woolies". They were stunned into inaction

 

[meridian]

Everyone, especially candidates, should call Trump Pinocchio.

Pinocchio against Pocahontas, that would be the race to watch!
For that to realize, I I may vote for Warren in the primary.

Go Pinocchio!
Go, Pocahontas!

 

[wiede]

First of all, I don't believe American Indians are a race.

Having said this, how could calling Warren by the name Pocahontas be racist.

IMO it is just a lame attempt by our president at a put down which many of his followers love to use.

Cmon man. That’s really bad. You can do better. Stop trying to justify what he’s doing.

This is going to sound harsh, but I see your views as ignorant about what the usage of the term means to other people.

Native Americans are a group of people. Trump derisively refers to Warren as one of the most famous members of the group. And it’s not as if he’s elevating that group of people by using the name. Clearly, he’s using it in a derogatory way towards Warren. As if it’s a bad thing that she identifies as a Native American.

Put another way, he could call her out by being wrong without using a group stereotype to do it. He should know better by now, but no one has shut him down from doing it. In fact, he’s been encouraged in most of the right wing media world.

If Warren claimed to be of Argentinian descent, and he kept calling her Eva Peron, wouldn’t that be out of bounds? He’s basically saying that all members of the group are exactly like Pocahontas, which is blatantly wrong. Native Americans as a while were a pretty diverse group.

Plus, like many historical figures (like Eva Peron), she’s not always seen as the most positive historical figure by the descendants of her group. Pocohantas may be seen as a positive figure by you, but that’s not a universally shared opinion/view. Her legacy is mixed, as are the legacies of many historical figures. Have you ever thought that some native Americans view her as one of the forces that led to their demise in this country? Or, that the Disney type depicticion of her allows non native Americans to feel better about what America did to native Americans?

How did you take his “trail” comment? I’ve heard people suggest that he’s not that smart, but we all know he’s always reading about himself, and by default, his attacks on others. Right wing media LOVES putting down Warren. She’s the new Hillary, in many respects. So, I’m pretty sure he knew what he was doing. It’s not the first time he’s said racist things, so I tend to view this as another one.

When it comes to trying to demean someone, the guy takes the time to do it well. In a very childish way, but it’s one of the things he takes great pride in doing. He gets some kind of sick joy out of fighting.

For me, it was abundantly clear what the intent was behind his tweet. Evoking the trail of tears in some kind of twisted joke is beyond the pale. Along with the Japanese internment camps and slavery, this event is within the triad of American shame re: racism. Yet another brick in the wall that is Trump’s overt racism, IMO. The guy either doesn’t try to understand (super entitled and narcissistic), or understands and doesn’t care. It’s unnaceptable either way. This type of stuff should be out of bounds for anyone, let alone the leader of our country. How can you expect others to “be best”, when your leader doesn’t even pretend to try?

This is the problem with not even recognizing racist behavior. I’ve seen several interviews with tribal leaders post Trump’s election, and none of them appreciate Trump’s continued usage of the term. And if they’re offended, that’s what actually counts. Not how you view it.

You’d be better served and educated on this issue if you just kept that simple way of looking at it in mind. In other words, it ain’t about you. You’re not the one affected, or unwillingly involved. If they’re offended, it’s offensive.

Native Americans deserve better than what we’ve done to them, and the least we can do is to avoid rationalizing this type of crap.

Not trying to be harsh Hoot- just want to point out a few things that I’m sure you haven’t thought of about this topic.

 

[IUCrazy2]

In my younger years to cap off a night on the town I approached a group of dark skinned fellows and declared, " God loves you Woolies". They were stunned into inaction

What have you got against Chewbacca?

 

[Stuffshot]

I suppose it's debatable, but one thing IS for sure. It's un-Presidential. His tweet last night was disgusting. This is the President of the United States:

View embedded media

Kudos for his reference to the Trail of Tears. The man is mentally ill.

I still doubt that Trump is smart enough or educated enough to even know what the Trail of Tears is. But Junior Trump apparently Tweeted something today that establishes the racism in Trump's Tweet.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

He’s basically saying that all members of the group are exactly like Pocahontas, which is blatantly wrong.

Ah, the old it's terrible to stereotype... except when its white males.

 

[MrBing]

I’m with you on most of this. She has handled it very poorly. It would be fine if she told stories and passed history down, but once she started marking it as part of her heritage on forms, that was a really bad mistake.

I am too but I'll vote for her over Trump if she wins the nomination. I have her last on the major Democratic candidate list now.

 

[meridian]

I still doubt that Trump is smart enough or educated enough to even know what the Trail of Tears is.

You've got it all wrong! Trump once bragged that he is one of the smartest persons because he had an uncle, who was a professor of Physics (or was it engineering?) at UPenn or something to that effect.

 

[wiede]

Ah, the old it's terrible to stereotype... except when its white males.

The only time I’ll ever do that is when I see white males completely blind to their white privilege. And even then, it’s not everyone.

It’s not all of us, but it does affect a LOT of us. That includes me at times, still to this day. It’s hard to leave behind, especially as you age.

What stereotypes have you seen about white males on here? Curious now.

 

[toastedbread]

*

 

[wiede]

I'd like to challenge you on white privelege.

First, I'll concede that there is white privelege for the sake of this discussion, though I would like to note that scientific research on the subject is limited and evidence flimsy.

Second, if you believe that there is such a thing as white privelege, do you also believe that black privelege exists?

Case in point: Justin Farifax. If he was a white male, he would already be out of office imo. 4 staffers have resigned, forced out of legal practice, 2 horrendous allegations by individuals of the highest character. He smears his accusers and other politicians. He then says "prove your claims in a court of law". Virginia Congressional Black caucus stands by his side and protects his toches. Today, they prevented an attempted impeachment. I'm sorry but my perspective is that they are saving his butt solely because he is black.

I see his behavior as being very much like white privilege. The same type of behavior can be present elsewhere. White privilege is a bit different, however (more on that later).

In fact, I see privilege (in general) being stronger at times with folks that are minorities, or didn’t come from the most wealthy settings. It’s as if sometimes folks that came out of less than ideal circumstances can be some of the worst re: privilege. I guess they feel special for arising out of those circumstances.

This guy is acting just like some of the worst white privileged folks I’ve seen. But again, it might be a little worse.

I know that was the case for me. No one from my mother’s side had ever graduated college, and I ended up getting my JD, was licensed in A few states & practiced for a while. And I definitely had a huge sense of being “special”, and I was a very entitled @sshole for a while.

In other words, privilege isn’t just white. But thats usually where you see it.

White privilege behavior is unique in that there’s an expectation that everything will conform to your will/worldview. Because, it’s been that way since this country started. Even poor white people generally have it. That’s in large part what got Trump elected.

Does that make sense?

And, he needs to go. Yesterday. There’s no place for this stuff. Did you read what the second victim said? Apparently she was also raped/assaulted by a future NBA player at Duke. She reported it, and it went nowhere. She told Fairfax, and he raped her. When she confronted him after the rape, he said that he knew she wouldn’t say anything because she was too scared after the tape by the b-ball player.

That’s beyond sick.

One person could be a he said/she said, but now there’s two. And it’s clear they told people after the events happened years ago. I’m all for an investigation, but he should step aside while that happens.