Player Loss Excuses

[mollautt]

=>Every super major basketball power school with great coaches, except Kansas and Duke (one exception is noted below) and, has had to go through this after losing players.

1) UK wins the 2012 NCAA title. In 2013, UK loses to Robert Morris in the 1st round of the NIT 2 seasons ago. Why? Terrance Jones, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Doron Lamb, Anthony Davis, Marquis Teague went pro early. Darius Miller also
graduated and went to the NBA.

2) In 2009, UNC wins the NCAA title. In 2010, UNC lost 17 games, went 5-11 in the ACC, ended the regular season with a .500 record. Somehow, UNC got invited to the NIT (ended up runner-up after winning 2 games on the road). Why? Ty Lawson and Wayne Ellington decide to go pro early.

3) a) Florida this year, ended up with a losing record in both the SEC (8-10 - Tied for 8th) and overall (16-17). Florida is not playing in the postseason. And that was after 4 straight Elite 8 or Final 4 appearances (was the #1 overall #1 seed last year by the way). Florida did not have anyone go pro early, the losses were all to graduation!!!
b) Florida wins the 2006 and 2007 NCAA titles. Over the next 3 years, Florida loses 36 games, 22 SEC league games (26-22 record), makes the NIT twice, and loses in the 1st round of the NCAA in the only Big Dance appearance. Why? Then Al Horford, Taurean Green, Joakim Noah, and Corey Brewer leave early for the NBA.

4) UCLA made 3 Final Fours, won 3 PAC 10 titles, and had 1 PAC 10 runner-up finish from 2006 to 2009. Worst league record in those 4 years was 13-5. UCLA in 2010 went 14-18/8-10. Why? Jrue Holiday announced he would leave early
after the 2009 season and Darren Collison graduated to the NBA.

5) a) UConn Huskies won the NCAA tournament last year. UConn is playing in the NIT this year. Why? DeAndre Daniels left early for the NBA. Shabazz Napier graduated and went to the NBA.
b) Jim Calhoun leads UConn to the Final Four in 2009. In 2010, UConn ends up in the NIT. What happened??? Hasheem Thabeet went pro early and some other key losses to graduation.

6) Arizona wins the PAC 12 in 2011, wins 30 games, and makes the Elite 8. In 2012, Arizona loses at home in the
NIT opener to Bucknell. Why? Derrick Williams decide to go pro early.

7) In 2007, Ohio State is 35-4/15-1 in the B1G plus will the B1G tournament. tOSU ends up losing to Florida (see above) in the NCAA championship game. In 2008, tOSU is in the NIT. Why? Greg Oden, Daquan Cook, and Mike Conley went pro early.

8) What about Sparty? Michigan State reaches the Final 4 in 2005. Over the next two years, MSU fails to have a winning record in the B1G and finished tied for 6th in 2006 and tied for 7th in 2007. MSU loses 24 games in those 2 years. Why? Maurice Ager and Alan Anderson graduated and went the NBA after the 2005 season. Then after 2006 season, Shannon Brown went pro early plus Paul Davis graduated.

9) In 2009, Rick Pitino leads UofL to 31 wins, a Big East Championship (16-2) and tournament title in arguably the strongest BE season since 1985, and a #1 seed in the Midwest. Cards lose in the Elite 8. Then in 2010, the Cards end up with the same record as the 2015 Indiana Hoosiers (20-13) and a 1st round NCAA loss. Why? Earl Clark went pro early and Terrance Williams graduated on to the NBA.

10) In 1996, Syracuse finishes runner-up in the NCAA tournament. In 1997, Syracuse loses in the 1st round of the NIT. Why? John Wallace went on the NBA.

11) In 1994, Duke is NCAA runner-up. In 1995, Duke goes 13-18/2-14 and no postseason. That is followed up with 18-13/8-8 and a first round loss to Eastern Michigan in the 1996 NCAA tournament. Why? Grant Hill and Antonio Lang graduated into the NBA after the 1994 season.
NOTE: Coach K also missed all but 1 game of the ACC season in 1995, but that was not the reason for the losses. He is a great coach, but not that great! Duke had already lost 4 games before Coach K left the team. Plus, Coach K was on the bench for all of the 1996 season.

Point is, players going pro and graduating hurts even the highest of the high programs and the best of the best coaches.

So we can blow off IU's NBA departures as "making excuses," but that does not make them any less true.

*******

Is it just making excuses to say IU may have 2 to 5 more banners in AH if...Scott May had not broke arm in 1975, Alan Henderson not messed up his knee in 1993, Isiah Thomas not went pro after his soph year, if Kirk Haston had not gone pro after 2001 season?

This post was edited on 3/21 11:24 AM by mollautt

 

[Dubiak5454]

There will always be an excuse from crean because he's not a good coach. You don't need excuses when you produce at a high level. The youth excuse is his favorite even though he created it with creanings.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[bsmitty08]

Issue is we didn't win a national title or go to a final 4. Has last year and this years season ah
Owned after a national title I am pretty sure not many would be bitching...

 

[PanDatrick]

All of those teams you just mentioned won a title or went to the final four. Making the Sweet 16 isn't close to the same success those teams had before having some down years. So, your point doesn't really resonate with the current situation.

 

[bettinvet]

That is just plain nonsense. This Creaning you speak about would indicate he is getting rid of players who become stars elsewhere. Name a few of those players. Zeller, Oladipo, Vonleh, Fischer all apparently left of their own accord. The only two I can think of were Williams and Story who left during the darkest of times at IU. He certainly did not recruit over the four I named and if he had many would have accused him of Creaning and at the same time complain that he did not have a backup plan if they left and he did not recruit over them.

 

[bsmitty08]

Roth and Bobby C wold have been nice depth guys...

Another question is why are guys like Abell, Etherington, Fischer, all transferring? Also had Patterson class of been over signed I would almost have guaranteed he would have been admitted.

 

[booyah31183]

dumb*

*
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[Slow Happy Boy]

No one debates there being a cycle...

It is a matter of how high your highs are and how low your lows are.

Rebuilding after an NC is different than rebuilding after getting embarrassed in the SS game with 2 of the top 4 draft picks on your roster. Some of us believe Indiana has the built in resources and advantages to warrant expecting a top tier program, but no one thinks we must win it all every year - that's a straw man.

A top tier program has higher peaks than the SS and rarely if ever misses the tourney.

Eliminate CTC's first 2 years and here are our results:
miss
SS
SS
miss
lose in 1st round

Help me understand how I'm supposed to see any future hope from those results?

 

[TheSpa]

There's another issue that few want to acknowledge: Getting kids to Bloomington, especially out of state kids, isn't as easy as people think. A small town in the middle of nowhere that doesn't have an interstate highway, a commercial airport with even modest service to the outside world, or much in the way of activities or attractions outside of the school. For people who grew up in the state, it's no big deal, but for kids from outside the area, it often doesn't stack up as well against other schools as IU people believe it does.

 

[bsmitty08]

Kansas isn't having trouble recruiting and they are more in the middle of nowhere than IU. IU has been ale to recruit well enough to win more than they are.

 

[TheSpa]

They're within a half hour of Kansas City right off the interstate. Again, you've made my point. Look at the power conferences and make a list of all the schools that have neither a commercial airport or an interstate highway. You won't need much paper.

This post was edited on 3/21 12:44 PM by TheSpa

 

[IU Scott]

Bloomington is 45 minutes

from Indianapolis with one of the best airports in the country.

 

[Candy Stripes]

You are just really unbelievable ...yeah, there's nothing

to do in Btown outside of IU ... you are clueless and I question your motivation in all the BS you spew. Apparently you want TC here forever, even though you support him and all odds are against him getting good players to come here ... laughable, I think you're more delusional than he is.

 

[Candy Stripes]

Yeah you must be right since KC is the high point of culture that it is nt

nt

 

[TheSpa]

Re: You are just really unbelievable ...yeah, there's nothing

Sorry to bombard you with facts, but it's another truth that you're unwilling to accept. Guessing you live in or near Bloomington and have your entire life.

 

[bsmitty08]

Yet IU has still recruited at a pretty high level....construction of classes is questionable but we have landed some elite players. So I would say recruiting has been a problem for IU ever. Coaching and admin is the issue right now.

 

[TheSpa]

Re: Bloomington is 45 minutes

Which interstate do you take to get to that airport an hour away? Go through the five power conferences and make a list. If you don't think it makes a difference to many, you're not paying attention.

 

[TheSpa]

Probably not

Though it's generally a good comparison to Indy in that it's a nice small city. Go through the power conferences and see what you come up with.

 

[Candy Stripes]

I do live in Btown and you are clueless ... and NO, I haven't

lived here my whole life, but it is consistently ranked as one of the best places to live. There is more culture here than Indy, even outside the university.

 

[TheSpa]

But a "pretty high level" isn't good enough, by your own admission, so it is a problem. Again, you've helped make my point.

 

[IU Scott]

In a few months you will have interstate 69

which is being built to go from Indianapolis to Evansville. Also i really doubt a college kid really cares about interstates and airports when deciding were to go to college. If all the kids cared about was those things along with the night life then all the kids would go to City schools in huge cities like New York and Chicago

 

[Candy Stripes]

Um, that would be 37 ... which tells me you are not and IU fan nt

Go away!
This post was edited on 3/21 1:03 PM by Candy Stripes

 

[TheSpa]

if you're not from the area

it's viewed as pretty far off the beaten path. The lack of a commercial airport and interstate demonstrate that very conclusively. Since you've been there your entire life (or nearby), I wouldn't expect you to understand this.

 

[IU Scott]

Indianapolis is one of the best cities in the country

when it comes to hosting sports and if you haven't heard that most commentators say it is the best city hosting the final four and we actually hosted the super bowl as well so it is more than a nice little city.

 

[TheSpa]

Re: Um, that would be 37 ... which tells me you are not and IU fan nt

State road 37 isn't an interstate highway.

 

[PanDatrick]

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills

For the love of God man, it is 2015. Do you really think a kid or a family is like "ehh you know, 37 is a 4-lane highway, but it isn't CALLED an interstate and there are these weird stoplight things, so, ya know, we aren't coming here"?

Bloomington is routinely voted one of the best college towns in the nation. Indianapolis is 45 minutes away on that "non-interstate" terrible road. What do these big cities offer that college kids care about that they don't have in Bloomington? What are they missing?

Lansing is pretty sweet ya know, HUGE city. So is Storrs, Connecticut! Metropolis! Norman, Oklahoma? Best city ever.

What a joke.

 

[IU Scott]

Who cares about interstate or airports

All you have to do is get on HWY 37 and go to Indianapolis and it will take less than an hour to get there. By the way there will be an interstate going through Bloomington shortly because they are expanding Interstate 69

 

[PanDatrick]

Re: if you're not from the area

What in the hell is your obsession with interstates?! It isn't like its a gravel road leading into Bloomington and there WILL be an interstate shortly, which will still be 37 but just a change in the name. That is ALL that matters. Just change the name of the road now and we are good!

 

[TheSpa]

It's about access Scott

And IU isn't particularly easy to get to. Linking it by interstate to Evansville (and someday, possibly, to Indy) still means that it's way out there to many people who aren't from the area. It impacts recruiting, especially for high profile kids who have choices.

 

[Candy Stripes]

No, it the cultural heart beat of Indiana ..

we have the best restaurants, the best co-ops, the same shopping opportunities as Indy. The only thing we really lack is a Home Depot!

 

[IU Scott]

You answered about Kansas

saying it was near an interstate and only 30 minutes form Kansas City which is about the same as Bloomington from Indy and there will be an interstate that goes from Bloomington to Indy shortly.

 

[TheSpa]

Re: Who cares about interstate or airports

It's going to Evansville and maybe someday to Indy. Again, if you're from in state, it's not a big deal but it is for kids from out of state. It's a very small town off the beaten path.

 

[PanDatrick]

Re: It's about access Scott

There isn't a kid in the country that pays one damn bit of attention to whether or not it has an interstate running through it. Hell, quiz all of the recruits in the nation and ask them which schools have interstates and which don't and it would be comical. You live in a strange world my friend.

 

[PanDatrick]

LOL

Off the beaten path. Hell, you might have to even caulk the wagon to float across the creek that cuts across that there dirt road. Holy hell man. This is the most entertainment I have had all day. Thanks.

 

[TheSpa]

Re: if you're not from the area

They've been around since the 50's and link the major cities of America. Towns, cities and regions without interstate access (and commercial air access) tend to be underdeveloped in many ways). Check out the power five schools and see how many lack access to one, let alone both.

 

[Candy Stripes]

Well then can we please re-assign Tom Crean to build us a new interstate

instead of coaching the team for 3M .... we could send him to Purdue for an engineering degree easily for that ... better yet IUPUI, maybe it's free

 

[TheSpa]

Re: LOL

I guess if you could provide an effective counter argument, you would have already done that by now.

 

[bsmitty08]

For the coach we have no he hasn't but a good basketball coach can win with the talent coming through.

 

[TheSpa]

Indy is a great small city.

IU, however, isn't in Indy.

 

[St_Henry_Buckeye]

LOL

Now you have hit nearly rock bottom in your pitiful defense of Crean. Thanks for the laugh.