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Patriot/Patriotism

When see anything with an eagle, flag or the word patriot (in combination) I assume a$$hats are involved.

Tough guys don't tell you how tough they are.
The devout don't tell how religious they are .

And the truly patriotic don't wave a flag in your face.
 
When was patriotism hijacked by the righties?

It seems whenever I open an email by a group with "patriot" in their name, it is always right wing nuts. Have they have patent on "patriot?"

It hasn't been hijacked. The lefties abandoned notions of patriotism because it became contrary to their theme of America being the defining problem.

Civil rights marches used to be a kind of patriotism with American flags in full display.

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Now they aren't.

rtr4sgse.jpg
 
I my view conservatives are way more demonstrative of their patriotism and rank being an American higher on their list of personal values. Same with their religious affiliation..

This doesn't mean. however, liberals are unpatriotic and not thankful for the advantages of being an American.
 
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No.

But the American Flag is an indicia. The question is what has changed?
When I see the military and it's academies with flag displayed out front I'm as proud of this country as can be imagined.

Unfortunately the symbols have been co-opted by the worst people the country has to offer. Wrapping themselves in the flag to peddle bullshit. You know them well; racists, white nationalist, homophobes.
Trump
 
When I see the military and it's academies with flag displayed out front I'm as proud of this country as can be imagined.

Unfortunately the symbols have been co-opted by the worst people the country has to offer. Wrapping themselves in the flag to peddle bullshit. You know them well; racists, white nationalist, homophobes.
Trump

That’s a pretty sorry post. So what if the deplorables show the flag? The question is why does the left not show the flag thereby subordinating your message to that of the deplorables?
 
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That’s a pretty sorry post. So what if the deplorables show the flag? The question is why does the left not show the flag thereby subordinating your message to that of the deplorables?

That's silliness. I'm a "lefty". I fly a flag. I know other "lefties". Many of them fly flags. I'm on set. I'm not currently flying a flag. Am I subordinating my message?
 
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I wear an American Flag pin on my blazer every day to let my coworkers know I'm more patriotic than them.

I also have an American flag bumper sticker, right above my truck nuts.
 
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When was patriotism hijacked by the righties?

It seems whenever I open an email by a group with "patriot" in their name, it is always right wing nuts. Have they have patent on "patriot?"
https://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/w...06/30/harvard-july-4th-parades-are-right-wing
I remembered this story from years ago. If democrats really don't get anything out of 4th of July celebrations, meaning love and respect for country then what does it say about them? Now of course not all Democrats would fall under this, but if it's a large percentage then what does this mean?
 
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https://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/w...06/30/harvard-july-4th-parades-are-right-wing
I remembered this story from years ago. If democrats really don't get anything out of 4th of July celebrations, meaning love and respect for country then what does it say about them? Now of course not all Democrats would fall under this, but if it's a large percentage then what does this mean?
I pledge of allegiance to the flag and to the republic for which it stands. One nation, with liberty and justice for all. The pledge has never been more important to me.
 
That’s a pretty sorry post. So what if the deplorables show the flag? The question is why does the left not show the flag thereby subordinating your message to that of the deplorables?
You asked a question.

I gave my take on your question.

Then you say it's a sorry post because it didn't answer a question you didn't ask to begin with.

Maybe, and I'm spit balling here you're just an argumentative ass that didn't like the answer to the original question.

Now it's back on the blocked list for you.
 
I pledge of allegiance to the flag and to the republic for which it stands. One nation, with liberty and justice for all. The pledge has never been more important to me.
If it's that important to you, shouldn't you know the words? They are:

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 
You asked a question.

I gave my take on your question.

Then you say it's a sorry post because it didn't answer a question you didn't ask to begin with.

Maybe, and I'm spit balling here you're just an argumentative ass that didn't like the answer to the original question.

Now it's back on the blocked list for you.

Lol. “racists, white nationalist, homophobes”.

And you think I’m the argumentative ass?

I don’t need the mental help of a block list. And if I did, I wouldn’t need to announce it.
 
It's actually not very difficult to find pictures from that event with various people in the march flying flags. But of course this is the one picture out of hundreds available that conservatives always post, because it doesn't have a flag in it, so it is somehow proof of your narrative that liberals abandoned the flag, despite obvious evidence to the contrary:

Obama%20Selma%202007-6b53f5ea0dfb3b09adfd1992d34d0a94acd64504-s900-c85.jpg


00020662_medium.jpeg


newsphotos-selma-03.09.15-630x330.jpg


Here's Obama speaking at the event in front of a giant flag while also wearing the requisite flag pin. Double flag!

150309_POL_ObamaSelmaSpeech.jpg.CROP.promovar-mediumlarge.jpg
 
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If it's that important to you, shouldn't you know the words?
Partisans have wrangled over the wording of the pledge for more than a century. I don't think non-religious people should be required to say "under god" and it makes a mockery of both religious and secular values when non-religious cretins like Trump mouth words they take no more seriously than their wedding vows. Let the religious patriots say one nation under God, let the non-religious patriots leave that phrase out and let all understand that many of those most piously reciting the pledge and waving the flag are loyal to none but themselves.
 
Partisans have wrangled over the wording of the pledge for more than a century. I don't think non-religious people should be required to say "under god" and it makes a mockery of both religious and secular values when non-religious cretins like Trump mouth words they take no more seriously than their wedding vows. Let the religious patriots say one nation under God, let the non-religious patriots leave that phrase out and let all understand that many of those most piously reciting the pledge and waving the flag are loyal to none but themselves.
The Pledge has an ugly history, and it's deeply wrong to compel pledges of loyalty to a flag.
 
When see anything with an eagle, flag or the word patriot (in combination) I assume a$$hats are involved.

Tough guys don't tell you how tough they are.
The devout don't tell how religious they are .

And the truly patriotic don't wave a flag in your face.
Borrowing from an old saying:
Empty carts make the most noise.
 
The Pledge has an ugly history, and it's deeply wrong to compel pledges of loyalty to a flag.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pledge_of_Allegiance_(United_States)

The Pledge was supposed to be quick and to the point. Bellamy designed it to be recited in 15 seconds. As a socialist, he had initially also considered using the words equality and fraternity[15] but decided against it, knowing that the state superintendents of education on his committee were against equality for women and African Americans.[18]

The pledge has a sordid history and loyalty pledges to flags should not be compelled. But the clear statement that the flag stands for the republic and the republic rests on the core values of liberty and justice for all is a powerful statement of what constitutes our core civic culture.
 
But the clear statement that the flag stands for the republic and the republic rests on the core values of liberty and justice for all is a powerful statement of what constitutes our core civic culture.
I think those ideas (and our struggle to make them real) should be central to public education. One way not to do that is make children stand, place their hands over their hearts, and recite a loyalty pledge toward a flag. Even when I was a kid that felt phony.
 
The Pledge has an ugly history, and it's deeply wrong to compel pledges of loyalty to a flag.

Building a common culture out of diverse cultures is a legitimate purpose of public education as acknowledged by many throughout the world and its history. Pledges probably are not vital in this regard, but I don't see the harm.

FWIW, this is why I consistently oppose publicly funded vouchers for private schools. They are contrary to the notion of a common culture.

See e.g.
 
Building a common culture out of diverse cultures is a legitimate purpose of public education as acknowledged by many throughout the world and its history. Pledges probably are not vital in this regard, but I don't see the harm.

FWIW, this is why I consistently oppose publicly funded vouchers for private schools. They are contrary to the notion of a common culture.

See e.g.
I share your perspective about private schools and that pledges are not vital. But I make a distinction between a common civil society and a common culture. The point of America is not to extinguish differences but, rather, to allow those differences to fruitfully and peacefully coexist.
 
I share your perspective about private schools and that pledges are not vital. But I make a distinction between a common civil society and a common culture. The point of America is not to extinguish differences but, rather, to allow those differences to fruitfully and peacefully coexist.

Mostly semantics. However,I do see a disruptive culture clash if "peaceful coexistence" includes limiting free expression and permitting religious supremacy.
 
Mostly semantics. However,I do see a disruptive culture clash if "peaceful coexistence" includes limiting free expression and permitting religious supremacy.
Civic culture necessarily puts checks on pretty much everything. I would expect you could write a book on that.
 
The flag belongs to all of us. It is a symbol around which we remind ourselves that we are in this thing together.

Using the flag to single yourself or a particular cause out is like saying... I, or we, are special. In my view this defeats the whole purpose of the flag. The purpose being to unite us.

Rather than flying a flag outside my home (which requires a strict responsibility to flag etiquette in my book) or wearing a flag lapel pin, I prefer to show my allegiance by doing all I can to make my neighborhood, city, state, and nation,a better place for all of us. If I did fly a flag outside my home, i would display it on special holidays rather than treat it as a personal adornment to my homestead, and I would take it down at sunset..
 
Partisans have wrangled over the wording of the pledge for more than a century. I don't think non-religious people should be required to say "under god" and it makes a mockery of both religious and secular values when non-religious cretins like Trump mouth words they take no more seriously than their wedding vows. Let the religious patriots say one nation under God, let the non-religious patriots leave that phrase out and let all understand that many of those most piously reciting the pledge and waving the flag are loyal to none but themselves.
They may wrangle now and then, but the words are the words whether you personally like them (or two of them) or not. If you don’t like those two words, don’t recite them. That’s your right and I have no issue with it.
 
“Freedom” too.

When was patriotism hijacked by the righties?

It seems whenever I open an email by a group with "patriot" in their name, it is always right wing nuts. Do they have patent on "patriot?"
 
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Aren't all nations "under God" for those who are believers.

Thus, doesn't it go without saying.
Wouldn't bother me if Congress changed the pledge by taking those two words out. It also doesn't bother me if they don't.
 
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It's actually not very difficult to find pictures from that event with various people in the march flying flags. But of course this is the one picture out of hundreds available that conservatives always post, because it doesn't have a flag in it, so it is somehow proof of your narrative that liberals abandoned the flag, despite obvious evidence to the contrary:

Obama%20Selma%202007-6b53f5ea0dfb3b09adfd1992d34d0a94acd64504-s900-c85.jpg


00020662_medium.jpeg


newsphotos-selma-03.09.15-630x330.jpg


Here's Obama speaking at the event in front of a giant flag while also wearing the requisite flag pin. Double flag!

150309_POL_ObamaSelmaSpeech.jpg.CROP.promovar-mediumlarge.jpg
I wouldn't count the upside down flag . . .
 
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They may wrangle now and then, but the words are the words whether you personally like them (or two of them) or not. If you don’t like those two words, don’t recite them. That’s your right and I have no issue with it.
The pledge is not important to me as part of a ritual or ceremonial recitation. I can't remember the last time I recited it. The pledge is important to me as simple and clear statement of some of our common civic values. I am not interested in wrangling over the words. I find the version with under God in it needlessly polarizing but if those words weren't there religious folks might feel a need to add them. Glad to know it wouldn't bother you if I left those words out. Your choice to say the approved text would not bother me in the least either. In fact, much more important to me is that we could both endorse the values the pledge articulates.
 
The pledge is not important to me as part of a ritual or ceremonial recitation. I can't remember the last time I recited it. The pledge is important to me as simple and clear statement of some of our common civic values. I am not interested in wrangling over the words. I find the version with under God in it needlessly polarizing but if those words weren't there religious folks might feel a need to add them. Glad to know it wouldn't bother you if I left those words out. Your choice to say the approved text would not bother me in the least either. In fact, much more important to me is that we could both endorse the values the pledge articulates.




Faith will be rewarded...

 
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I wear an American Flag pin on my blazer every day to let my coworkers know I'm more patriotic than them.

I also have an American flag bumper sticker, right above my truck nuts.

Your hero, Trump has other ideas of what your flag looks like. Maybe its time for a change?


lol.gif
lol.gif
 
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It hasn't been hijacked. The lefties abandoned notions of patriotism because it became contrary to their theme of America being the defining problem.

Civil rights marches used to be a kind of patriotism with American flags in full display.

1124532221.jpg


Now they aren't.

rtr4sgse.jpg
Good lord you are a special kind of tool
 
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No.

But the American Flag is an indicia. The question is what has changed?
You.

There’s a deeper question, which comes back to the extraordinary Western landscape and the high American idea enshrined in it. Americans elected Trump. Nobody else did. They came down to his level. White Christian males losing their place in the social order decided they’d do anything to save themselves, and to heck with morality. They made a bargain with the devil in full knowledge. So the real question is: What does it mean to be an American today? Who are we, goddamit? What have we become?

Trump was a symptom, not a cause. The problem is way deeper than him.

For William Steding, a diplomatic historian living in Colorado, American individualism has morphed into narcissism, perfectibility into entitlement, and exceptionalism into hubris. Out of that, and more, came the insidious malignancy of Trump. It will not be extirpated overnight.
Your typical post exemplifies the morph from individualism to narcissism and exceptionalism to hubris. Don't shoot the messenger -- it's on you to self-reflect, just as it is on me.
 
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