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Our Former PresidentsNeed to Act

I give cosmic, shitter, and hickory shit for their entrenched views but despite all of trump's endless warts we still have posters on the right supporting trump for 2024. It's mindboggling. i firmly believe it's a dearth of personal responsibility to go to sources for information and opposing views, and the advent of 24/7 news that substantiate preconceived beliefs. There are certain posters on this board who link exclusively websites/outlets that are as bent as my big toe
. . . what I took from this post is that your big toe is bent . . . . ;)
 
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How about for purposefully misinterpreting me to evade my point?

My mistake was assuming this thread was posted in good faith.
Look dude - I suggested a unifying statement by our former presidents might help heal the nation. You acted like a prick. You claimed I was blaming the former presidents and upped the ante and called it a cowardly act. Then you started acting like a butt hurt prima donna.

Get off your high horse. Everybody can read.

Act like a prick - win prick prizes.

Don't blame me when you let your jerk self shine.
 
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I blame the media. CNN msnbc Fox etc. we aren't going to elevate the intellect of the populace any time soon. If past presidents are able to help they should
I blame soccer. How can we see each other's better angels with a bunch of 1-0 and 2-1 games littering the landscape? And I haven't even gotten to the horror of 0-0 and 1-1 games. If we want to get out of this, we need to listen to people like Megan Rapinoe for answers. 😇
 
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More irony. You shitter and cosmic share the same tunnel vision. You have an entire body of work on this board evidencing same.

I'm the first to tell you Trump is terrible and needs to go. He divides instead of uniting. Linking anything involving Biden regarding unification is a nonstarter. Tether it to msnbc and forget it. Cosmic might as well go back to linking Republicans R Evil.

I don't think you have much room to talk about being entrenched, mr. self claimed moderate lmao.
 
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I blame soccer. How can we see each other's better angels with a bunch of 1-0 and 2-1 games litter the landscape? And I haven't even gotten to the 0-0 and 1-1 games. If we want to get out of this, we need to listen to people like Megan Rapinoe for answers. 😇
My daughter and i were at the bookstore last night and the first book i saw was hers lol. FIng hell
 
Look dude - I suggested a unifying statement by our former presidents might help heal the nation. You acted like a prick. You claimed I was blaming the former presidents and upped the ante and called it a cowardly act. Then you started acting like a butt hurt prima donna.

Get off your high horse. Everybody can read.

Act like a prick - win prick prizes.

Don't blame me when you let your jerk self shine.
A mere four hours later.
 
I don't think you have much room to talk about being entrenched, mr. self claimed moderate lmao.
I liked clinton and obama. I like moderate dems. the summer of love and thereafter is when the tide turned. can you say the same? no.
 
They need to join together and call for tolerance of ideas, and an end to the insults, the on-line intellectual violence and the street violence.

Not a word about Trump. Just Carter, Clinton, Obama and Bush reming us we are co-equal citizens with a right and duty to be treated in a civil manner, and to treat each other with respect, especially those with whom we disagree.

Admirable sentiment. But does anyone think the die hard election denying Trump supporters would listen to anything any of those people say?

I'm going to assume this was posted in good faith, albeit naively. Otherwise, one would have to assume that it was aimed at those who could be expected to take the former Presidents' entreaties to heart. I don't think the people I described above would be among them.
 
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he thinks he's a centrist but posts like an entrenched conservative. He's definitely someone in need of self reflection.
No you just don't recognize how far left your party went with biden and the squad. Now biden attempted to pivot and has to a certain degree, but what we got from the genesis of his tenure was squad politics
 
I don't think you have much room to talk about being entrenched, mr. self claimed moderate lmao.
He's a moderate . . . in St. Louis. That's what most of us don't see . . . is just how little we personally represent . . . we think we're "American" in the sense that the whole of America is like us . . . and it ain't.

I live near Atlanta . . . and near MTG territory too. Think being a moderate here is easy? Try being one in St. Louis . . . or Indiana . . . or Los Angeles . . . or New York . . . or Boston . . .

. . . much less DC.
 
He's a moderate . . . in St. Louis. That's what most of us don't see . . . is just how little we personally represent . . . we think we're "American" in the sense that the whole of America is like us . . . and it ain't.

I live near Atlanta . . . and near MTG territory too. Think being a moderate here is easy? Try being one in St. Louis . . . or Indiana . . . or Los Angeles . . . or New York . . . or Boston . . .

. . . much less DC.
There's a lot of truth in that.
 
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he thinks he's a centrist but posts like an entrenched conservative. He's definitely someone in need of self reflection.
Biden went far left. For most "moderates" he lost us. He's pivoted back to a degree. As much was reflected in his state of the union. He endeavored to be transformative when all most of us wanted was a quiet break and some peace from trump and a bridge to the next guy. Biden got co-opted by the summer of love and the squad and the media. he left most of us behind.

 
He's a moderate . . . in St. Louis. That's what most of us don't see . . . is just how little we personally represent . . . we think we're "American" in the sense that the whole of America is like us . . . and it ain't.

I live near Atlanta . . . and near MTG territory too. Think being a moderate here is easy? Try being one in St. Louis . . . or Indiana . . . or Los Angeles . . . or New York . . . or Boston . . .

. . . much less DC.

I guess I should have used the word independent rather than moderate. My point was that he is not middle of the road on the political spectrum where his vote might go either way.

Notice his ire is 99% directed at liberals and vast majority of his likes in political debates are posts made by other conservatives.

He's just as entrenched as a conservative as I am a liberal.
 
He's a moderate . . . in St. Louis. That's what most of us don't see . . . is just how little we personally represent . . . we think we're "American" in the sense that the whole of America is like us . . . and it ain't.

I live near Atlanta . . . and near MTG territory too. Think being a moderate here is easy? Try being one in St. Louis . . . or Indiana . . . or Los Angeles . . . or New York . . . or Boston . . .

. . . much less DC.
i have a good from buddy from chicago now living in dallas, ga. very true in what you write re mtg.
 
The biggest problem with his responses with Goat - and vice versa - is that the responses feel personal to the rest of us. Personal posting ain't good when it results from being triggered by the post to which the poster is responding. For either side . . . it causes retrenchment and narrow thinking.

Perhaps some voluntary time away can freshen the perspective a bit. I don't know whether Goat can take time what with his modding and all . . . but MTIOTF ain't a mod, so he can take some voluntary time off . . . .

I like both guys . . . when they're not this. I'm pretty sure MTIOTF is not sure he likes what he's posting right now . . . seems to be pugnacious because he feels cornered. Not good to be cornered or to corner someone for the sake of forcing the other poster to respond . . . the responses all-too-often aren't well thought-through.

Very seldom does one need to checkmate the other guy in a conversation on the Cooler. There are occasions when it's helpful . . . but all too often we need to recognize when we've won the battle, even before the tit-for-tats begin, and be happy with that. And I'd say making your point is enough to "win" even if it's later challenged . . . the post you made is still up for people to assess your idea/information.
I didn't think I was taking it personally, but in hindsight, perhaps you are right. If I was overly defensive, that would be a clear indicator.
 
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I guess I should have used the word independent.

Notice his ire is 99% directed at liberals and vast majority of his likes in political debates are posts made by other conservatives.

He's just as entrenched as a conservative as I am a liberal.
Again you don't read. I liked clinton and obama. I don't like far left, progressive politics. That's what has dominated the biden years. This isn't hard.

 
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MTIOTF, You make a good case for not including Trump.

The irony being without him, how can the past presidents bring us together as Trump still has tons of supporters ? So with, or without him, lots of Americans will continue to be upset.

By the way, you brought up an interesting idea.
Haven't you guys heard? Trump is trying to turn down the heat!

 
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I meant moderate as in just as likely to vote dem as vote GOP. Or just as likely to agree with dems as with gop.

Notice his ire is 99% directed at liberals and vast majority of his likes in political debates are for conservatives.

He's just as entrenched as a conservative as I am a liberal.
Ever spent time in Missouri? You'd have to be faaarrr left to admit to voting Democratic there. Same with Rome GA. Same with Washington, IN, I'd bet.

In Luavuhl, voting for conservatives could be being a conservative, or it could be being a moderate . . . there's so much room to have an opinion there.

My guess is that if a bunch of us were sitting around talking about local issues or what to do in a business, we'd likely see things pretty much the same. When I talk about Trump supporters, I see the rabid folks down here who are ready to shoot me, but don't . . . I've had conversations with those folks and they quickly cancel culture me because I don't hew to their politics. I'm not sure that stoll would be that guy . . . he might be, but I'm not sure. MTIOTF . . . naw, I don't see him that way at all. Or RZ . . . they just are playing the Cooler game according to the rules as they see those rules. Same with Mc. And you too.
 
i have a good from buddy from chicago now living in dallas, ga. very true in what you write re mtg.
Dallas is 12 miles from Sopehaus. Granny Sope lives in Dallas . . . as a "liberal" from SEMO. That's right: 'liberal" and "SEMO" in the same sentence. As if there were such a thing . . . .

Everybody else gives her a wide berth in the old folks home . . . they're all Trump supporters. They'd be on board with Ron Johnson's idea to get rid of Social Security and Medicare . . . even though all of them would raise hell until they got theirs restored. It's mind boggling.

What you see helps determine who you are. In my case I see a whole bunch of rabid Trump supporters . . . who can blame me for wanting to be something else?
 
Admirable sentiment. But does anyone think the die hard election denying Trump supporters would listen to anything any of those people say?

I'm going to assume this was posted in good faith, albeit naively. Otherwise, one would have to assume that it was aimed at those who could be expected to take the former Presidents' entreaties to heart. I don't think the people I described above would be among them.
It's not just "the die hard election denying Trump supporters" who won't listen to Trump.

Trump doesn't even listen to himself -- at the same time he claims to be trying to contact Merrick Garland to ask how he/Trump can turn down the heat of anger in the nation, he is still personally, directly trying to decertify the election that he lost 21 months ago:


 
Opportunity for an attaboy missed.
Yes, it was conciliatory instead of inflammatory. It was also a bipartisan proposal, and those are rare. So kudos to him for that.

Here's the thing, though. Trump has more influence than the other former presidents combined. If he made a statement simply saying that he expects to be fully exonerated (one of his favorite words) while asking people to tone down the dangerous anti-feds/anti-law enforcement rhetoric and be civil - - - and if he followed through himself - - the country would be in a much better place. He needs to stop the reckless and false claims like Biden knew of the search in advance, the FBI planted evidence at Mar-A-Lago, and that the feds let Obama off the hook for taking millions of government documents to Chicago at the end of his presidency. (“President Barack Hussein Obama kept 33 million pages of documents, much of them classified. How many of them pertained to nuclear? Word is, lots!” - DJT).

Once again, he's fanning the flames and somebody's going to get hurt.
 
Yes, it was conciliatory instead of inflammatory. It was also a bipartisan proposal, and those are rare. So kudos to him for that.

Here's the thing, though. Trump has more influence than the other former presidents combined. If he made a statement simply saying that he expects to be fully exonerated (one of his favorite words) while asking people to tone down the dangerous anti-feds/anti-law enforcement rhetoric and be civil - - - and if he followed through himself - - the country would be in a much better place. He needs to stop the reckless and false claims like Biden knew of the search in advance, the FBI planted evidence at Mar-A-Lago, and that the feds let Obama off the hook for taking millions of government documents to Chicago at the end of his presidency. (“President Barack Hussein Obama kept 33 million pages of documents, much of them classified. How many of them pertained to nuclear? Word is, lots!” - DJT).

Once again, he's fanning the flames and somebody's going to get hurt.

His message to Garland was probably meant as a "let me off the hook, and i'll turn down the heat"

He is trying to rile up his base so that he can use them as a negotiating tool.
 
Yes, it was conciliatory instead of inflammatory. It was also a bipartisan proposal, and those are rare. So kudos to him for that.

Here's the thing, though. Trump has more influence than the other former presidents combined. If he made a statement simply saying that he expects to be fully exonerated (one of his favorite words) while asking people to tone down the dangerous anti-feds/anti-law enforcement rhetoric and be civil - - - and if he followed through himself - - the country would be in a much better place. He needs to stop the reckless and false claims like Biden knew of the search in advance, the FBI planted evidence at Mar-A-Lago, and that the feds let Obama off the hook for taking millions of government documents to Chicago at the end of his presidency. (“President Barack Hussein Obama kept 33 million pages of documents, much of them classified. How many of them pertained to nuclear? Word is, lots!” - DJT).

Once again, he's fanning the flames and somebody's going to get hurt.
Fair points all, but they still amount to little more than "but Trump." I'd rather hear a discussion about who the persuadables might be. I don't think there are any to speak of, but I'm willing to be convinced otherwise.
 
Fair points all, but they still amount to little more than "but Trump." I'd rather hear a discussion about who the persuadables might be. I don't think there are any to speak of, but I'm willing to be convinced otherwise.
Persuadables on what topic?

Perhaps if his supporters demanded that he provide evidence to support any of his allegations we'd be on the right track.
 
Dallas is 12 miles from Sopehaus. Granny Sope lives in Dallas . . . as a "liberal" from SEMO. That's right: 'liberal" and "SEMO" in the same sentence. As if there were such a thing . . . .

Everybody else gives her a wide berth in the old folks home . . . they're all Trump supporters. They'd be on board with Ron Johnson's idea to get rid of Social Security and Medicare . . . even though all of them would raise hell until they got theirs restored. It's mind boggling.

What you see helps determine who you are. In my case I see a whole bunch of rabid Trump supporters . . . who can blame me for wanting to be something else?
Your comment about people wanting to get rid of Social Security is similar to what I said today about Trump's reaction to a search warrant -- Republicans just don't think it (whatever it is) will ever happen to them.

Search warrants always are issued ex parte and always come as a surprise and most of the time the searchers won't let anybody watch what they are doing and the searchers just grab everything to take with them instead of painstakingly reading it all on site. Trump's comments this week sound like a guy who never cared what normal people go through when a search warrant is served and never thought it would happen to him.

The Trump supporters at the old folks home you described were willing to end Social Security but apparently thought they would still get theirs anyway.

Republicans auto-bitched about "election fraud" but a significant number of Republican voters (as well as Democrats) were convicted of voting illegally, sending in a ballot for a deceased lived one etc.
 
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Your comment about people wanting to get rid of Social Security is similar to what I said today about Trump's reaction to a search warrant -- Republicans just don't think it (whatever it is) will ever happen to them.

Search warrants always are issued ex parte and always come as a surprise and most of the time the searchers won't let anybody watch what they are doing and the searchers just grab everything to take with them instead of painstakingly reading it all on site. Trump's comments this week sound like a guy who never cared what normal people go through when a search warrant is served and never thought it would happen to him.

The Trump supporters at the old folks home you described were willing to end Social Security but apparently thought they would still get theirs anyway.

Republicans auto-bitched about "election fraud" but a significant number of Republican voters (as well as Democrats) were convicted of voting illegally, sending in a ballot for a deceased lived one etc.
It reminds me of the overheard conversation in which one person says they're for getting rid of Obamacare. And the other person asks what are you gonna do about health insurance? The first person responds "That's easy. I'll just sign up under the ACA."
 
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Persuadables on what topic?

Perhaps if his supporters demanded that he provide evidence to support any of his allegations we'd be on the right track.
The call for civility that the former Presidents were supposed to make. That's what MTIOTF was proposing.
 
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