What reality? That virtually any coach is a crap shoot?
We have all seen coaches that are good at one school and then not so good at the next school.
What outstanding insight to state the obvious.
Here's my issue with the Archie has us on an upward path argument ...
- Thread starter go_iu
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What reality? That virtually any coach is a crap shoot?
We have all seen coaches that are good at one school and then not so good at the next school.
What outstanding insight to state the obvious.
Until Miller’s transfer rate exceeds the NCAA average (which it hasn’t) relax and have another beer.
That's because you can't see a roster yet. We just had 2 xfers and 1 NBA declarant. CAM has always stated he doesn't like to oversign. Give it some time. You never know how a roster will jell. I thought with their losses, both UM and PU would struggle this year, but they played better than the sum of their parts, and we played worse. Getting another year of development, and losing the probable chemistry problems, might actually allow for improvement. Might also allow guys like RP, DG, AD or RT to step up as leaders, which they may have felt uncomfortable with this year with RL and JM on the roster. I still believe in CAMs ability and approach, so we should see fruits of that... or recognize it ain't happening and move on. He basically predicted roster turnover after year 2, and those are the types of guys that left. I'm confident we'll add an xfer or grad xfer or two beyond Brunk, and that it'll look different come October. I think we have a good nucleus for next year with RP, AD, DD, and TJD for next year and DG and JS certainly have the talent to start, so does JH reportedly. No reason that shouldn't be a tourney team, and if healthy, I believe it should be. Lord knows we're due for some good breaks.
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Not when you inherited what Archie did. Five minimum.
Well, go_iu has been known to start drinking early the past few weeks so I thought I would encourage him. Maybe he will post another one of his crazy rants that the mods have to eventually take down again.
Yeah, but beer? More like moonshine.
f=for pea=p ugh=u = for p u
[compliments of MTIOTF]
He's not even hiding his trolling..
That makes sense because there is no way he's a real IU fan.
Yeah, My Team Is On The Floor had him pegged several months ago...
He's fairly obvious.
4 years sounds about right, although the expectations are on a curve. In some situations it is difficult to recruit and in others it is not.
The other thing that happens a lot, is one good "false year" that keeps somebody around longer than they probably deserve.
The other thing that happens a lot, is one good "false year" that keeps somebody around longer than they probably deserve.
IU will get Brunk I think. And LaRavia (on the all star team) is the kind of kid we will see in the tournament in a couple years and wonder how IU/PU let him get out of the state, he will end up at a P5 school I think.
Why couldn't Brunk take advantage of 2 years of free education and take less hours per semester. If he only gets a year and a quarter done of hours in his two years at IU, he is $50k ahead of the game. Brunk can go to law school and play for IU, he just might have to go an extra summer and semester to graduate. A lot of students do that.
What a BUNCH of BS. Regardless of what you want to delude yourself into believing, Archie's players were FRESHMEN this year. So he doesn't have "his" players.
He has barely gotten the players buying into his system. Of course, there again, only the freshmen were his players.
If you can't see the difference in the defense being played vs. the nine years of the orange wonder, then I can't really help you.
You’re living in a fantasy land. Your way of thinking is what excused Crean’s 3rd year and prevented him being fired. That led to 9 years of Tommy Basketball. Unfortunately Archie is even worse.
His players? Did he not recruit Romeo, Phinisee, Fitzner, Anderson, Forrester, Hunter, Thompson? Man please start a business and let me hire 7 guys who all leave in the first year and I will come to you and say sorry boss these were not my guys. I'm sure most CEOs would be fine this. Not to mention Jones who transfered was a top 50 player. But wait here it comes Jones was a Crean guy it don't count...
You would have wanted coach K fired after year 2, as well as Beilein at Michigan. Your company would be dogshit in no time looking for the next best thing. We have no idea how divisive the locker room was last year with Crean leftovers, a bunch of young injured talent, and a 5 star shooting guard that couldn't shoot.
Our last coach was fired for missing the tournament with 3 NBA prospects after being here almost a decade. You want Archie fired after year 2 because you didnt get your instant gratification. And yet, I can guarantee you envy Purdue right now getting to an elite 8 after 15 years with their coach. Be a little more wishy washy
WTF are you saying? How many "CEOs" let somebody start their businesses? And how many businesses are started with 18 year old kids who will have 4 years of eligibility to "work" for a business? And why would you make a stupid comparison like this? And Romeo left for the NBA payday (it's what OADs do) so why is he in this dumb analogy you use? And Fitzner has no eligibility, so why is he in the dumb analogy? And Hunter isn't medically cleared so why him? And Phinisee, Thompson and Anderson are still here, right? He's had one year of his recruits under his system.
So we lose walkons, graduates, a OAD and two guys who played a total of 3 games worth of minutes, so WTF are you talking about? I hope to god the extent of your working responsibilities starts and ends with the phrase "would you like fries with that", otherwise your employer is getting the short end of the stick,
Jesus Christ the IU fan base seems to shed IQ points by the hour.
I don't understand how recognizing missing the tournament 7 of 11 years is sad makes one a drama queen? It surprises me how many fans are content with mediocrity.Another...
Archie is worse than Crean... Dude, you've completely lost it. Go get some help. You need it.
There is nothing wrong with recognizing missing the tournament 7 of the past 11. There is nothing wrong with it making you sad or angry or even despondent. There is nothing wrong with pointing out the that mistakes were made in hiring going back even further than 11 years.
There IS something wrong about laying the entirety of that 16 years of inconsistency and mismanagement @ the feet of the current coach who just completed his second season. There IS something wrong about firing a coach before you give him a sufficient amount of time to get the job done. There IS something wrong about whacking a 6th head coach (5 and 1 interim) in 19 years.
Now is NOT the time to cut bait. There is a bigger picture to think about and pulling the trigger on CAM after such an unreasonably short amount of time is ridiculous on a number of levels and for a number of reasons. IMHO, IU is developing a reputation as a coaching meat grinder as it is. You fire a guy like CAM, who is a good and respected coach, after 2 or even 3 fecking seasons without a damned good reason you galvanize that reputation. IU won't only have lost it's status as a destination gig, it will now lose any appeal it has as a reclamation project.
Just give the guy the time to sink or swim FFS. If we are still sitting here in season 4 wondering why Archie isn't getting it done, then there will be consensus, you and yours can have your "I told you so" moment, I will offer my mea culpa with hat in hand and we can all debate whether IU hits a home run with the impending new coach. For now though, I am still holding out hope that IU already has.
Good grief. Basically read what All4You stated, that was pretty succinct.
But I do want to ask, you state and list seven names and say they are all leaving. That is news to me since FOUR of the names are still on the team as of today. One is going pro and everyone knew he was going pro from day one and the last name has no eligibility left. So, now your list is down to ONE name that is leaving of his own volition. Of course it just looks better and is more dramatic to say seven guys are leaving even if it isn't true.
Excellent post, sound reasoning.
The first year of law school has a set course load. You can't "take less hours." If you're full time, you have to take the classes they put you in--and they are difficult, with hours of reading per night along with other commitments. Their STRONG recommendation is that people don't even work a part time job during the first year. It would be impossible to go to law school, play basketball, and get good grades.
Law school is graded on a pretty crazy curve though, so he could probably do it if he didn't mind getting bad grades. But it's nearly impossible to get one of those high paying jobs people covet with bad grades. I guess it might be possible for Brunk...because an alumni might cut him some slack.
Plus, Brunk has two years of eligibility left. The second year of law school is worse, because there are a bunch of "add-on" things you need to do to distinguish yourself, like moot court and law review. That would be pretty tough.
No it's not. IU isn't and hasn't been a meat grinder for coaches. Tom Crean was here for 9 damn years and barely won half of his games. Mike Davis got 6 years. If CAM doesn't make the tourney, next year, he should be fired. The last time IU fired a coach after 3 seasons (excluding Sampson who was fired for cheating) was almost 50 years ago. IU will still be a destination gig if Archie is fired after 3 years.
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No kidding. The reputation we're developing is that of a mediocre program not a meat grinder for coaches. Wow..we're at rock bottom & fans are acting like they're afraid of failure. Reality is we're already a laughing stock nationally, because of losing. Not because of having two different coaches in the last dozen years
Yes, you're right. Deliberately writing like you're still in 3rd grade always makes you appear more authoritative.
Fire Archie after 2 years as many on here (including you) were calling for, and we would've been on our 3rd coach in 3 years/4 seasons.Fire Archie after next season, and that's still 3 in 4 years. That's the epitome of a coaching meat grinder, one with high expectations and a short leash. As an example you point out that Crean got 9 years, but in reality people were bitching year 2 and 3. It took him extra time (3 seasons) to get IU back on track from the total tear down after Sampson. I didn't like Tom Crean, as I view him as a zealous motivator whose shtick will wear on guys, a weak X&O guy who is only going to go as far as his staff and recruiting will take him. That said, his final 6 years with IU he went 138-69 (.667) with 3 trips to the Sweet 16 and 2 regular season conference titles in those 6 years. All that success during years 4-8 did was set the bar higher for further success, and when that wasn't met he was axed. Another definition of a coaching meat grinder is when your past success raises the bar of expectations to the point you are fired when they aren't met.
Simply put, IU was a destination gig in a perfect world with perfect timing, but we never had the timing down. It was toxic when RMK was fired, we kept Davis 1-2 years too long, reached on a talented cheater in Sampson which bit us in the ass and took us from destination gig to reclamation project, then we bought a car salesman's pitch with Crean and he never was able to transition IU from reclamation project back to destination gig (he was close, but it was beyond the reach of his ability) which brings us back to CAM. I think most of us knew it was a moment to reset expectations regarding a quick build when CAM was hired (me included) and some used where Crean left off as a starting point for setting expectations (you). I think I am being realistic and you are not.
good points. I do know several attorneys in Indy that went part-time while working a corporate job. They both took 7 hours for two semesters and 3 hours in the summer. I know it was tough for them. After getting the equivalent of one year done over 2 years, they left and finished full time in a year and summer. IF Brunk wants to go that route, he can. He can get in the classes, as IU athletes get preferential treatment there. But we don't know what he wants, as he may be going to Kelley.
