And the people who live in Orange and Osceola counties may well end up paying for it.
Desantis cost Florida a billion dollars to get even with Disney
- Thread starter kurt cloverdales
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You made the same post consecutively but are missing the point. It isn't that some GOPers don't want to fight or battle over cultural issues. It issue is the manner in which it is done. Personally, I don't have nearly the same problem on this response/action by FL Pubs, but generally speaking, the issue is rarely with DeSantis' policies and more about his Trump-like approach.
We can argue for days about whether or not that is the best approach, but in an age of putrid Congressional approval and inability to progress on anything substantive, I don't think the "Bull in a China" shop method is going to change the trajectory of this country. And to be clear, it comes from both sides of the aisle, but is far more noticeable on the extremes. Their ability to use that approach and the media's obsession with them is precisely part of the problem.
IDK man...Florida is not going to put up with the removal of boys and girls and ladies and gentleman. There are other serious issues that crazy has pointed out as well. I'm glad Desantis is saying ENOUGH! This BS new agenda needs halted. Its not good for anything except CONFUSION and we all know who is the author of that.
DeSantis is riding this culture train. His polling is way up, he's got cash falling out of his pockets, and he's going to have a cakewalk gov race in Nov. It'll be interesting to see if rides that momentum to take on Trump
Desantis would be foolish not to run for potus. He's got serious momentum and is in the news more than any other current politician in the country.
No, I don't just disagree with the message. If your entire duty is to your shareholders, you have every reason as a corporation to stay the hell out of the culture wars. Deflect, obfuscate, give half measure split the child statements only when pressed. Taking a side in the culture wars invariably means that you are going to be taking a position that roughly half your potential customer base does not like. Which can and does shrink your customer pool. So no, Disney was not looking out for their shareholders. Their initial decision was to STFU about the bill but they got pressure from employees to do something and the idiot CEO took their advice and got his company's nose bloodied in a very not good for the shareholders way.
Nobody stopped Disney from doing what they liked. They did what they liked and the person elected to run the state where they had their sweetheart deal said "**** that noise, deal's off." Florida doesn't owe Disney special set asides. Government has gone out of their way to protect that dumb ass company and much of it has been from the right. You can start with copyright law. Listen, there was a give and take on the right between Corporate America and the voters. Corporate America is breaking their pact so a whole bunch of the benefits they used to glean from the right will be reviewed by the same.
The use of government has to be shown as a MAD deal. Otherwise one side is incentivized to use it with impunity. Retaliation is a mother, I am just hoping that enough people have realized that you have to be seen as just as willing to blow the whole thing up in order to bring the other side to the table. They are willing to burn down city streets to get their way and we get weak knees about a government removing special favors that government bestowed to begin with.
Nah man, war. No more whining, no more complaining that they don't play fair. They have set the table on what is acceptable and I want the fight. Maybe some of these guys will come back to a more ragional place if we are seen to be willing to get just as crazy as them.
You want the government our of stuff, you have to convince the people who want government in everything that the involvement of government doesn't just flow in one direction. They pushed and pushed and are on the verge of getting a reactionary right. Sometimes the bully won't listen to reason so you have to play the way they play.
First of all, I will now be calling your "murt" as per Indianawtf.
Second of all, I really don't understand the problem he has with the fact that you are "back and forth". It's almost like you either have to be 100% all in on a politician or you are completely out.
That's how cults are structured...not political parties.
I don’t disagree with many of the points you’ve made throughout this thread. However we differ greatly on how we see these culture wars. You are exercised by them and have a real emotional response. That’s just not my DNA. If it don’t make me happy or make me money, I simply cannot care.
And from where I sit, the extremism that is at the root of these culture wars comes from the far left and far right. Those who trade is this poop slinging are doing it only to illicit that emotional response. I’m just not going to engage.
He's not. You should listen to pollster Richard Baris who was with Desantis just a couple weeks ago and knows him well. He's the probable VP in 2024. A deal has likely been made already. Desantis truly believes that Trump won in 2020 and we owe it to him to give Trump the nomination in 2024. He's absolutely not running against Trump. Look for Trump to eventually switch residency to NJ like Dick Cheney did in Wyoming in 2000.
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As bad as the Democrats are (and talk about undermining the benefit of 50 years of gov experience with Biden's total incompetence) it would be totally predictable for the Repubs to run Trump. Literally the only thing that would give Democrats hope. At that point I will delete my account here and vow to never pay a second of attention to politics again
That's common amongst numerous posters. You have to be lockstep with your team to the man and to the issue. And it's on both sides here. I've never understood it. Joe Hoopsier. HIckory. On and on
Disagree.
The right has been under this delusion that we are dueling under the same rules. We walk the ten paces and prepare to fire our single shot pistol at the opponent only to see that they have a 12 gauge pump that they unload into us. We say, "Hey, you cheated, those are not the rules..." They reply, "No we didn't." They win that duel.
So we all huddle together and though some say, "Hey, we need to get a shotgun for the next duel or they will kill us again." And those people are tut-tutted that we must not stoop to their level. These are the rules. Our principles are to stick to the rules.
So the next duel is set up and we start our paces and at the 8th step they unload the 12 gauge into our single shot, musketball armed dueler's back and kill him as well. We get all indignant, "What the actual ****, you shot him in the back."
"No I didn't," is the reply.
So again we go back to our huddle. Again it is brought up that these rules are getting us killed. But our thought leaders again tell us that these are our principles and we must follow them.
On and on it goes and on and on our dueling partners are basically murdered. They are dead, but they died a principled death.
Respectfully, if you ascribe to a set of rules that your opponent does not, you are accepting second class status as a principled loser. Your principles mean nothing because they do not exist in the real world. You need to pick up a shotgun, unload in a few backs at 2 paces, and then see if the other side wants to revisit that conversation about principled rules or if they wish to continue watching their duelist get shot. Only then, when you have reached a level of MAD can you bring the conversation back to the center...or it all blows up. If that happens, it is not much different for you for continuing to lose anyway.
(This is all metaphorical if that was not clear, I am not talking about actually shooting people...it is tactics to advance your ideas.)
Do you honestly believe that the left doesn’t feel the same way?
Bulky...Anyways you got where I was coming from on Desantis I hope. A few weeks back he was too divisive for you. Then the fathers thing...he won you back...Now the Disney thing and your back on the tightrope again. Its all good, there are things politicians do all the time and whether I'm right or left if they do something I agree with then kudos I'll give props. If they piss me off then I'll voice my disagreement. All Good!
Ceding the culture and just allowing yourself to be bludgeoned by an activist press and spineless corporations is a sure fire way for the GOP to lose elections. The GOP needs to strike a balance between guys like McCain and Romney who just let themselves be walked over and Trump.
DeSantis strikes that balance as good as anybody.
Agreed. The days of McCain and Romney are over. DeSantis goes too far the other way. I think the balance is somewhere between. And honestly the Dems are in the same boat.
Do you really feel the GOP is that big of a victim in the culture war? You have painted them as helpless, huddling whiners who are the victims of merciless beatings.
I think you are taking it waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too far, even as a metaphor.
Not engaging means ceding the power to those who are willing to. That's my whole point. Politics is downstream of culture. You want to make money and operate in a capitalist society that is similar to what you have grown up in, then you have to fight.
The BLM ladies, avowed Marxists. The people who are heavily into all the intersectionality stuff? Not really friendly to the whole "mainstream America" that we in the middle all used to inhabit. They don't need to convince you that capitalism, individualism, propert rights, etc. is bad. All they need to do is convince enough of the kids coming up that are replacing the elders who are dying off that it is.
If you don't care about culture, by the time they get around to areas where you do care, it will be too late.
There will be no “winner” in the culture wars. There can’t be one. They are only divisive and do not advance the country one bit. They are destructive. I refuse to participate.
Another Democrat who doesn’t know WTF he is talking about. Nothing to see here.
BTW, am I wrong, or if we are using the influx of people moving to a state as a measure for a governor's effectiveness, wouldn't you have to be a total f-up to screw that up in Florida?
Hell, tout the 5 zillion miles of beaches, the lack of state income tax, hand out water bottles after a hurricane, and keep the corrupt home construction groups happy and under the radar, and a dog could be successful.
Right?
The question assumes facts not in evidence sir.
I don't want any fight waged. I think culture should handle culture wars. As Cortez accurately states: "there will be no winner." If you get what you want/believe someone won't. So I believe companies should do what they want and enjoy/suffer the consequences. Schools should be left to local norms and the community. And gov should do less not more, including staying out of it unless absolutely forced.
There are issues that will arise. Twitter is a problem imo if it censors speech yet is used by politicians. "Favored" politicans. That's a problem. The NCAA allowing men to compete as women. That's a problem.
What Disney wants to do is up to Disney. What Tots daily learning wants to do should be up to the local community
You are measuring wins vs. losses by "who's yelling the loudest and complaining the most". Democrats are expected to get routed in voting this November based on their nonsense.
I'd prefer to let the votes do the talking.
Did you mean to link your FB page?You are underestimating Democratic potential
What are we looking at here, exactly?
Where have we won anywhere Bulk? We are helpless, huddling whiners.
What conservative messages do you feel are spread through entertainment media? Name me 10 openly conservative actors without googling. 10 openly conservative singers without googling. I can give you dozens for each on the other side. Name a movie that is blatantly conservative and isn't some independent film.
Show me public schools where the teachers are lining up to push traditional values on sexuality, civics, government, etc. I provide you all with examples all the time where that isn't the case. Should be easy to come up with a conservative teachers union movement similar to the NEA who fight for the opposite things.
We "fought" on abortion but you can still get it everywhere. In the time it took us to get to a point where you could discuss any types of restrictions (50 damn years) the left marched through everything up to the point of men playing women's sports and is changing our language so that we cannot even use the normal pronouns that have been in the English language for centuries anymore.
Conservatives e times more likely to be banned or shut up on Twitter. Corporations got Pence to back off of RFRA by forcing people to leave. I don't feel I can have some of the discussions we have on this board with my actual name attached because it is likely to get me fired. Do you feel you have to downplay your politics around people?
We haven't won shit. We whine and we complain that things are going the way they are but we never do anything but whine and complain about it. And the GOP gets in office and they just don't have the votes to get stuff through...never can do it. Never seems to stop the Democrats. 1 guy. 1 guy stopped a 50/50 Senate from completely overhauling our economy and probably knowingly getting wrecked for it in the next election. Democrats always move the ball. Their activists always move the ball. Consequences be damned. They just shout down and harass opposition out of existence. And they usually have the government, media, news, etc. to help. Someone gets to uppity, you sick Taylor Lorenz on them to shut them up.
There are things the Democrats fund through government that is just finding their leftist activists. They take over organizations and then those organizations become part of the Borg.
I will make this more simple. Conservatives have said they were for smaller government since basically when everyone on this board has been alive. Government has never shrunk in any of our lifetimes. The GOP is a coward party who is more worried about what happens at DC wine parties then they are in winning. The proof is in the pudding.
It's A measure not The measure. Fla has very serious issues, particularly in So. Fla (Dade/Broward/Palm). Way too many people. Third largest population in the country. Too little water. High Crime. Environmental shit. Massive division in wealth. And it's insane. It's not segregated like places in Saint Louis. In Fla you have Palm Beach, Jupiter Island, and Riviera Beach all within a few miles. Riviera Beach is like East Saint Louis poor. Plus you have a massive hispanic community. It's hard to get everyone on the same page. I think it would be a really challenging state to govern
Yes.
Have you been living under a rock?
Crazy,that portion is true of both parties. Most only care about being reelected, enhancing their power and bloviating when on camera.
So what, we win an election, then what? I don't consider winning an election to be winning anything. Something has to come from those elected people. I would suggest that the party we elect is terrified to do anything. So we aren't winning, we are just changing the warden at the prison.
Say a Romney type gets elected or a Holcomb. You think they are changing any of the stuff I have mentioned or do hou think they will be afraid of the -ist and -phobe label so will move to something a little more palatable like taxes? You and I both know the answer to that. You think they work on the border or does that -ist thing come into play again? Immigration reform? Lol.
The GOP is supposedly for small government. When have they ever reduced its size in your lifetime? They have had the opportunity. They are chickenshits whose sole purpose has been to win elections and their focus on that means that nothing else gets done. They are opposed to wielding the power of the thing they seek to control and they are opposed to reducing its power when in control and therefore they lose and lose and lose. The only thing elections do is adjust the speed at which they lose.
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