You’ve got to remember, some of the group you’re addressing believes Trump is raising an army for a holy war and installing himself as dictator.
Of course it’s absurd, but it isn’t to them.
What do evangelicals believe these days
- Thread starter Marvin the Martian
- Start date
Of course it’s absurd, but it isn’t to them.
Did you not watch the game? That was an exciting one.
You’re telling me that Trump could shoot Pelosi in a White House meeting or Biden during a debate next year and Republicans will forgive and defend him - including Republicans in Congress. I find that so absurd I can’t keep myself from laughing at anyone that believes it. Sorry if that includes you.
I left our house at the start of the second half. On the way to Bloomington for the BB game I kept losing the game on the radio. I got so involved in the game and finding a station I missed all the exits to Bloomington. I had to go about 8-10 miles North towards Martinsville before I got an exit back to Bloomington. Lol. We tried to give the game to Purdue.
The officials didn't help. Lots of key bad calls against IU again in this game. I don't know why the officials can't call blatant holding on IU opponents. Had another one today on one of PU's scoring plays.
We should have won more easily, that was disappointing. But we did win, and that is what counts.
We won but I was hoping we would bury them today.
I cannot wait to find out our bowl. I would not go to Detroit, otherwise I am probably going.
I am hoping Gator Bowl. I don’t want Detroit or Nashville. There’s one in California we’re in hunt for.
And they ignored the slaughter of a journalist, which possibly Jarred at least knew about ahead of time.
I’m not going to Ca, but I’d go to Detroit. Cheap and easy. But we’ll surely do better than that. I’ll be sorely disappointed if not.
I have been to Detroit for baseball, I am not sure why I would ever pay to go back.
The Redbox Bowl in CA is the one most experts seem to predict. I have friends out there so I would like to go, but Florida is the dream.
You made up the Pelosi scenario. Trump said he could shoot someone on 5th avenue and his supporters would stick with him. I think Trump knows his base.
You are right about that. Frankly, at this point it is absurd to assume that there is some bottom for GOP Senators and Congresspeople. We have blown past so many depravities and illegalities. Right now, as we speak, McConnell is blocking legislation that would protect our elections from future Russian interference. Seems they don't mean to discourage foreign interference but, rather, encourage it.
I know, but it seems disappointing that we went there with 6 wins and would go back with 8.
From what I can see, they're further down the pecking order than where we should be. I can't keep everything straight, but I'm seeing Gator, Pinstripe, and Music City as the most likely.
Haven't heard that he has seen fit or need to offer any justification. The GOP didn't pass legislation to protect our elections when they controlled all three branches. Probably the real reason is that the President doesn't want it.
Playing the "states rights" card. At least that's what he says. In reality, he doesn't want to piss off Trump. Trump doesn't want to see even a hint that 2016 might have had problems.
Since you singled me out: In a hypothetical situation where Trump shot someone I would call for his immediate arrest and hanging in the public square. Now, you and I both know that there is no way in hell Trump knows how to shoot a gun.
Yes, I made it up, but it's no more absurd than the 5th Avenue scenario. Let's say the Presidential Motorcade is rolling down 5th Avenue and Trump rolls down the window and shoots a random person lining the streets. He'd still not be President within minutes (hello President Pence) and 100 percent of the Congress would condemn him and only the craziest of the crazy would still support him. There are a lot of stupid things that get repeated in politics and I realize that one is used almost primarily to insult his supporters, but there seem to be people that actually believe that more than the craziest of the crazy would continue to support him in any of those shooting scenarios. That's what I think is ridiculous and absurd.
Again, the 5th avenue scenario was put forward by Trump himself. Like you, I would have thought that such a claim would be a harsh insult of Trump's supporters. But, evidently, we are wrong because Trump supporters do not feel he insults them
Rather than speculate about scenarios that haven't happened yet it is better to look at the way scenarios have so far unfolded. Consider Trump's admitted practice of grabbing young women by their most private parts. Trump is on tape bragging about it and many women came forward to attest that Trump did assault them. How did Trump's supporters respond? Here is one woman at a Trump rally
How did the GOP congresscritters react? They simply ignored it. How are the GOP congresscritters reacting to Trump's extortion and bribery? By talking about Hillary Clinton or Hunter Biden. How is the GOP responding to clear violations of the emoulements clause...by not talking about them AND by scheduling lots of events at Trump properties.
So, Trump's transgressions are celebrated by his base AND simply ignored by the GOP. If Trump were to murder somebody on 5th avenue his base would celebrate this transgression as yet one more display of power and the Republican congress would ignore it and, perhaps, launch hearings into whether Hillary murdered Vince Foster.
You would desperately like to believe that the GOP elected officials or GOP voters will serve as some kind of check on Trump...they can't any longer.
Sorry, I honestly think that’s silly and it’s hard to believe you could possibly think it’s not.Again, the 5th avenue scenario was put forward by Trump himself. Like you, I would have thought that such a claim would be a harsh insult of Trump's supporters. But, evidently, we are wrong because Trump supporters do not feel he insults them
Rather than speculate about scenarios that haven't happened yet it is better to look at the way scenarios have so far unfolded. Consider Trump's admitted practice of grabbing young women by their most private parts. Trump is on tape bragging about it and many women came forward to attest that Trump did assault them. How did Trump's supporters respond? Here is one woman at a Trump rally
How did the GOP congresscritters react? They simply ignored it. How are the GOP congresscritters reacting to Trump's extortion and bribery? By talking about Hillary Clinton or Hunter Biden. How is the GOP responding to clear violations of the emoulements clause...by not talking about them AND by scheduling lots of events at Trump properties.
So, Trump's transgressions are celebrated by his base AND simply ignored by the GOP. If Trump were to murder somebody on 5th avenue his base would celebrate this transgression as yet one more display of power and the Republican congress would ignore it and, perhaps, launch hearings into whether Hillary murdered Vince Foster.
You would desperately like to believe that the GOP elected officials or GOP voters will serve as some kind of check on Trump...they can't any longer.
I gave you three occurrences of exactly the kind of absurd behavior you claim is impossible. Case 1. "I like to grab them by the pussy"; Case 2. the routine self-dealing Trump does directing government business to his private properties; Case 3, the response of the GOP to Trump's on the record extorting bribes from Ukraine. The GOP behavior has been absurd in exactly the way I describe.
That's almost the same as murdering someone?
I take no pride in the response to any of those and I still cannot stand the man, but it's a far cry from murdering someone.
Didn't say it was the same. Rather I said that in every instance regarding Trump's criminal actions so far the GOP base has exulted and the GOP elites have behaved absurdly in just the way you assure me they wouldn't.
The mindset is the same. When confronted with a leader who is a corrupt criminal, many supporters celebrate the corruption and criminality, while others ignore it, including almost all of the GOP in Congress. Extending that to homicide is simply a matter of degree, not kind.
The hypothetical shooting is just that - hypothetical. It's not going to happen. But the mindset that would allow someone to ignore or even celebrate that hypothetical event is the very same mindset that is currently pulsating throughout most of the GOP.
You think it's self-evident that the hypothetical shooting is so outrageous that the party would abandon him en masse. That's fine. There's no right or wrong when it comes to hypotheticals that will never happen. But there's a reason you depend on it being self-evident. So far, all the evidence we have suggests just the opposite. No matter what outrage Trump commits, the GOP finds the ability to celebrate/ignore it, and continue to support him. It's possible that there is a line the party won't cross, and if Trump does, he'll find himself alone. But we certainly haven't found that line yet, and we've crossed quite a few crazy lines already.
Then there's the contention put forth by Trump (through his counsel) that even then, he could not be held responsible for this exact absurd hypothetical without going through the impeachment process. That counsel would even be willing to make that argument in a US appellate court is mind boggling.
Trump's done exactly what I told republican friends of mine that he'd do; he's broken the republican party. The part I didn't count on was the chance that he could break the country.
Your answer is obviously correct, but then that requires me to ask, do you find Trump saying you would still follow him to be an insult?
Not literally, but I think he is saying his followers pretty much worship him, not conservatism or ideas. A cult of personality if you will.
I recall from 2016, February of 2016 so long before Trump was the nominee, that authoritarianism was the great predictor of Trump supporters.
I think his statement plays to that concept. As long as he is an authoritarian, scandals will not break that support. Or at least if they do, they have to be massive scandals. People who want an authoritarian leader are not going to give the leader up for acting like an authoritarian.
Is it really much different from the mindset that allows otherwise intelligent people to honestly believe that Trump is setting himself up as dictator and encouraging his supporters to raise an army for a holy war? I mean, we’re talking absurd unrealistic hypotheticals, right?
Also, Trump doesn’t have the support of the entire GOP. Far from it.
The essential feature of Aloha's hypothetical is that everyone observes the President do something that they all acknowledge is obviously horrendously criminal and wrong. In that event Aloha says that the President would be quickly removed from office. That hypothetical will never take place in reality. Either the President's supporters will think what the President did is not wrong or they will deny there is sufficient evidence for them to BE SURE that he did it. Moreover, they will rally to the President. In the real world outrageous transgressions help Trump more than they hurt him.
I do think that Goat is right that it is a question of degrees. Where's the line?
If during a meeting with Pelosi and Schumer the President said, "You should do what I ask or things could go bad for you" while pulling out a handgun and setting it on the table pointed at Nancy, would all GOP Congresspeople condemn him and demand his resignation?
If Chuck Schumer insulted the President's daughter and the President responded by choking Schumer and then bodyslamming him, would all GOP Congresspeople condemn him and demand his resignation?
Where do you think the line is?
