Very good 2019-20 preview of BT rosters at

[mushroomgod_1]

Inside the Hall. Titled "A mid-July Look at Who is Coming and going in the Big Ten". Take a look.

Also has so-called T-Rank for each team which one can take for what they're worth.

My personal take is that with a healthy & effective Hunter we could finish 5th or so........hard to see us beating out MSU, MD, Purdue, OSU. if no Hunter, you're probably looking at 8th-9th.

The 'good' news is that there look to be 3-4 awful teams this year: Iowa (if no JB), Minnesota, Nebraska, Northwestern. We could/should be in a middle group that includes Illinois, PSU, Wisconsin, Michigan, Rutgers.

 

[IndyResident16]

Michigan State is in a class of their own.

Maryland and Ohio State are the next two most "talented" teams and I would give the coaching edge to Holtmann.

After those three I don't see a team that will overwhelm the Hoosiers with talent. I've learned not to doubt Matt Painter these last few years but I just don't see how they replace Carsen along with a sharpshooter like Cline. They have some good pieces coming back, but unless an absolute alpha emerges, I think they become very easy to guard without a bunch of shooters who aren't proven to shoot at a high volume.

I'm not sold on Illinois like everyone else seems to be. They do return a bunch from last year, but outside a 10 day 3-4 game stretch, they were awful last year. They have no defensive identity and reminded me a bunch of Crean-coached Hoosier team.

Lamar Stevens is one of the better players in the conference but his supporting cast is meh and Pat Chambers is still their coach.

Ethan Happ will end up being the hardest player to replace in the B10 next year. Trice and Davison is a good back court and Reuvers improved a ton last year but Wisconsin has definitely lost some fire power with Gard on the sideline.

If everything comes together I could see IU finishing as high as 4th but really struggle to see IU finishing any worse than 8th. MSU will likely run away with the B10 crown and I could see 5-6 teams fighting for 3rd-8th with records anywhere from 13-7 to 11-9, IU included in that group.

 

[ufo33]

Inside the Hall. Titled "A mid-July Look at Who is Coming and going in the Big Ten". Take a look.

Also has so-called T-Rank for each team which one can take for what they're worth.

My personal take is that with a healthy & effective Hunter we could finish 5th or so........hard to see us beating out MSU, MD, Purdue, OSU. if no Hunter, you're probably looking at 8th-9th.

The 'good' news is that there look to be 3-4 awful teams this year: Iowa (if no JB), Minnesota, Nebraska, Northwestern. We could/should be in a middle group that includes Illinois, PSU, Wisconsin, Michigan, Rutgers.

If IU finishes in 10th or worse then Archie will be on the hot seat.

 

[Eurocyldon]

IU has too much going on to make a reliable prediction, at this point. Seems many look at them as a worse team than last season so they surmise the result will be worse. I get it. There are a lot of questions and few answers right now.

Any success this season will likely come from their style of play and level of effort. It's defense or die barring some miraculous offensive resurgence. But the difference is they have a chance to match up with size unlike the past several seasons. This team has a chance to play D at a different level than we have become accustomed to seeing. This team will have a legit PG who is not a freshman - a first since Yogi graduated.

They may not score 40 points in an open gym. Who knows? Would like to think the young guys improve, the shooting gets better and they can avoid major injuries. But here is what we do know - they won't be guarding the other team's 7'0 260+ with a 6'6 and 6'8 forward the majority of the game and that's better than last season.

 

[ufo33]

IU has too much going on to make a reliable prediction, at this point. Seems many look at them as a worse team than last season so they surmise the result will be worse. I get it. There are a lot of questions and few answers right now.

Any success this season will likely come from their style of play and level of effort. It's defense or die barring some miraculous offensive resurgence. But the difference is they have a chance to match up with size unlike the past several seasons. This team has a chance to play D at a different level than we have become accustomed to seeing. This team will have a legit PG who is not a freshman - a first since Yogi graduated.

They may not score 40 points in an open gym. Who knows? Would like to think the young guys improve, the shooting gets better and they can avoid major injuries. But here is what we do know - they won't be guarding the other team's 7'0 260+ with a 6'6 and 6'8 forward the majority of the game and that's better than last season.

IU will need to learn how to win low scoring grinder games, make clutch FT, play hard nosed D, and not turn the ball over by valuing each possession.

 

[mushroomgod_1]

Michigan State is in a class of their own.

Maryland and Ohio State are the next two most "talented" teams and I would give the coaching edge to Holtmann.

After those three I don't see a team that will overwhelm the Hoosiers with talent. I've learned not to doubt Matt Painter these last few years but I just don't see how they replace Carsen along with a sharpshooter like Cline. They have some good pieces coming back, but unless an absolute alpha emerges, I think they become very easy to guard without a bunch of shooters who aren't proven to shoot at a high volume.

I'm not sold on Illinois like everyone else seems to be. They do return a bunch from last year, but outside a 10 day 3-4 game stretch, they were awful last year. They have no defensive identity and reminded me a bunch of Crean-coached Hoosier team.

Lamar Stevens is one of the better players in the conference but his supporting cast is meh and Pat Chambers is still their coach.

Ethan Happ will end up being the hardest player to replace in the B10 next year. Trice and Davison is a good back court and Reuvers improved a ton last year but Wisconsin has definitely lost some fire power with Gard on the sideline.

If everything comes together I could see IU finishing as high as 4th but really struggle to see IU finishing any worse than 8th. MSU will likely run away with the B10 crown and I could see 5-6 teams fighting for 3rd-8th with records anywhere from 13-7 to 11-9, IU included in that group.

I 'm very pessimistic about this year if Hunter can't come back. I think that in addition to his talent he had the best attitude coming into the season of any player on the roster. That was sorely missed when he got hurt.

Optimistic predictions about this season involve changes in attitude on the part of Smith & Green. I suppose that could happen, based primarily on the fact that both are still here. But I'm very skeptical. And no Hunter + no attitude adjustment on the part of Smith & Green = a disaster.

As to Illinois, I agree with you. Frankly, I think that coach has shown he's not big-time.......OK State was a great job for him.

Maryland should be #2, but again they may come up short due to coaching.

I think OSU could be the surprise team. They lost only Jackson & Woods, who were both mediocre. They gain DJ Carton at PG, plus two top 50 6'7"-6'8" forwards. I think they'll be top 10 by the end of the season.

I 'like' Purdue a lot more than you do. Hunter showed a lot as a freshman, and they should be very good in the rebounding & defense areas. Also, watch out for the High Point transfer as a scorer/shooter. He averaged over 19 points & 3 assists last season, and contended with an injury. The guy is 6'3" 215 lbs. I'm very concerned about this Purdue team.

 

[IndyResident16]

I 'm very pessimistic about this year if Hunter can't come back. I think that in addition to his talent he had the best attitude coming into the season of any player on the roster. That was sorely missed when he got hurt.

Optimistic predictions about this season involve changes in attitude on the part of Smith & Green. I suppose that could happen, based primarily on the fact that both are still here. But I'm very skeptical. And no Hunter + no attitude adjustment on the part of Smith & Green = a disaster.

As to Illinois, I agree with you. Frankly, I think that coach has shown he's not big-time.......OK State was a great job for him.

Maryland should be #2, but again they may come up short due to coaching.

I think OSU could be the surprise team. They lost only Jackson & Woods, who were both mediocre. They gain DJ Carton at PG, plus two top 50 6'7"-6'8" forwards. I think they'll be top 10 by the end of the season.

I 'like' Purdue a lot more than you do. Hunter showed a lot as a freshman, and they should be very good in the rebounding & defense areas. Also, watch out for the High Point transfer as a scorer/shooter. He averaged over 19 points & 3 assists last season, and contended with an injury. The guy is 6'3" 215 lbs. I'm very concerned about this Purdue team.

I think Smith was the only one with an "attitude" problem. I think Green was guilty of trying to do too much but he seems like a very personable guy who his teammates enjoy. His best stretch came at the end of the season and it's when he finally played off the ball in a role he seems much more comfortable with. Green had to play a lot of PG last year and that isn't a position that fits him. I think this is the first time in his career where he doesn't have to look over his shoulder and he'll have the green light at all times.

It's up to Smith to determine his coming role. IU isn't pressed to play Smith like they were his first two years because IU for once has front court depth. I think Smith has a lot of potential but he needs to buy in and Archie isn't forced to play him.

Agree Purdue will be good defensively, but offensively I think they struggle. Guys like Haarms and Williams were good at slipping screens and getting easy buckets at the basket because defenders had to extend their defense on Edwards and Cline because they had in the gym range. I don't see that out of this Purdue team. You could mask the fact that Eastern couldn't shoot outside 5 feet last year, but he's a huge liability on offense. Williams will be a force when he's in, but he's still got a long way to go to get in game shape to play 25 effective minutes a game and he fouls at an astronomic rate. I'll wait to see how their grad transfer performs at the B10 level before passing judgement. Playing against B10 competition is a lot different than playing at High Point. Purdue and their fans touted Boudreaux to high heaven last year because he averaged a double-double at Dartmouth but was completely overwhelmed and didn't even crack the rotation at the end of the year.

 

[mushroomgod_1]

I think Smith was the only one with an "attitude" problem. I think Green was guilty of trying to do too much but he seems like a very personable guy who his teammates enjoy. His best stretch came at the end of the season and it's when he finally played off the ball in a role he seems much more comfortable with. Green had to play a lot of PG last year and that isn't a position that fits him. I think this is the first time in his career where he doesn't have to look over his shoulder and he'll have the green light at all times.

It's up to Smith to determine his coming role. IU isn't pressed to play Smith like they were his first two years because IU for once has front court depth. I think Smith has a lot of potential but he needs to buy in and Archie isn't forced to play him.

Agree Purdue will be good defensively, but offensively I think they struggle. Guys like Haarms and Williams were good at slipping screens and getting easy buckets at the basket because defenders had to extend their defense on Edwards and Cline because they had in the gym range. I don't see that out of this Purdue team. You could mask the fact that Eastern couldn't shoot outside 5 feet last year, but he's a huge offensively liability. Williams will be a force when he's in, but he's still got a long way to go to get in game shape to play 25 effective minutes a game and he fouls at an astronomic rate. I'll wait to see how their grad transfer performs at the B10 level before passing judgement. Playing against B10 competition is a lot different than playing at High Point. Purdue and their fans touted Boudreaux to high heaven last year because he averaged a double-double at Dartmouth but was completely overwhelmed and didn't even crack the rotation at the end of the year.

With regard to Green, he tended to sulk when he didn't get his way......but the main 'attitude' problem was his selfishness and his lack of judgment. I don't know if you recall an interview he gave at the end of last year where he talked about his 'style' and his relationship with Rob P.......was not encouraging, imo. I WANT him looking over his shoulder. He overrates his abilities. The optimists among us are now saying that his predisposition to take ridiculous shots outside the flow of the offense and his fondness for risky passes is a good thing. We'll have to see.

I think you're under-estimating Purdue. You don't even mention Wheeler, who at times was a stud at the end of the year. Stefanovic can shoot, as can the freshman Newman. I dislike Eastern as much as anyone, but he was a damn good player the last 1/2 of the year, His prowess for ORs more than makes up his shooting woes. We'll see about Proctor....I think he will be quite good. He avg. almost 17 and shot 38% from 3s as a rs jr. Last year he avg 19/4/3...his 3 pt % was a little down, but he was also hurt the first 1/2 of the year. He was rated the #12 transfer by ESPN (Brunk was #14) And he's no dummy.

 

[bailey777]

Inside the Hall. Titled "A mid-July Look at Who is Coming and going in the Big Ten". Take a look.

Also has so-called T-Rank for each team which one can take for what they're worth.

My personal take is that with a healthy & effective Hunter we could finish 5th or so........hard to see us beating out MSU, MD, Purdue, OSU. if no Hunter, you're probably looking at 8th-9th.

The 'good' news is that there look to be 3-4 awful teams this year: Iowa (if no JB), Minnesota, Nebraska, Northwestern. We could/should be in a middle group that includes Illinois, PSU, Wisconsin, Michigan, Rutgers.

I would say anywhere between 5th to 10th. I honestly do not see us breaking into the top four with the roster we have. Finishing 5th or even 6th would be a major success.

 

[bailey777]

If IU finishes in 10th or worse then Archie will be on the hot seat.

Not according to Glass.

 

[IndyResident16]

With regard to Green, he tended to sulk when he didn't get his way......but the main 'attitude' problem was his selfishness and his lack of judgment. I don't know if you recall an interview he gave at the end of last year where he talked about his 'style' and his relationship with Rob P.......was not encouraging, imo. I WANT him looking over his shoulder. He overrates his abilities. The optimists among us are now saying that his predisposition to take ridiculous shots outside the flow of the offense and his fondness for risky passes is a good thing. We'll have to see.

I think you're under-estimating Purdue. You don't even mention Wheeler, who at times was a stud at the end of the year. Stefanovic can shoot, as can the freshman Newman. I dislike Eastern as much as anyone, but he was a damn good player the last 1/2 of the year, His prowess for ORs more than makes up his shooting woes. We'll see about Proctor....I think he will be quite good. He avg. almost 17 and shot 38% from 3s as a rs jr. Last year he avg 19/4/3...his 3 pt % was a little down, but he was also hurt the first 1/2 of the year. He was rated the #12 transfer by ESPN (Brunk was #14) And he's no dummy.

Not over-estimating anyone. I think Purdue has some good and interesting pieces next year, but they also lose a lot. None of which you stated about Eastern disputes the fact that he's a very limited offensive player. He can't shoot past 5 feet and he's very inconsistent shooting free throws. You could hide Eastern's liabilities in a line up with Carsen and Cline. Purdue doesn't have that next year. And with Purdue likely to play Haarms and Williams a lot together next year (who also can't shoot) it really bogs the lane and he's not going to be able to bully his way into the lane. There's no spacing. Sasha was a good shooter by % last year, but I don;t see him being a volume shooter in the sense that guys like and Cline were. He's very weak with the ball and turns it over a lot. And Newman is a freshman. Tough expectations asking a freshman to be relied on as that type of shooter.

I believe the gap between Michigan St at 1 and Purdue at 4 is much larger than the gap between Purdue at 4 and IU at 10. Purdue has some quality players and are well-coached, but I don't see a collection of players that is going to overwhelm IU on the offensive end or anybody for that matter.

 

[TommyCracker]

It seems to me that GT tend to under performs vs over.

Remember last year NW picked up Taylor or whoever was the leading scorer in the MVC from Evansville and he barely made a dent.

Remember when OSU picked up the big guy from Temple and...he was out of the rotation by the end of the season.

We remember Fitzner last year of course.

Even Reid Travis wasn't the same Reid Travis that he was at Stanford.

Experience overall in a system, team mates and conference is probably more important than we're giving it credit, especially coming from a LM to a HM.

It's not a video game.

 

[mushroomgod_1]

IU has too much going on to make a reliable prediction, at this point. Seems many look at them as a worse team than last season so they surmise the result will be worse. I get it. There are a lot of questions and few answers right now.

Any success this season will likely come from their style of play and level of effort. It's defense or die barring some miraculous offensive resurgence. But the difference is they have a chance to match up with size unlike the past several seasons. This team has a chance to play D at a different level than we have become accustomed to seeing. This team will have a legit PG who is not a freshman - a first since Yogi graduated.

They may not score 40 points in an open gym. Who knows? Would like to think the young guys improve, the shooting gets better and they can avoid major injuries. But here is what we do know - they won't be guarding the other team's 7'0 260+ with a 6'6 and 6'8 forward the majority of the game and that's better than last season.

There are just too many uncertainties to be optimistic about the season. Easily the hardest BT team to evaluate. It's very difficult to project what we are likely to get out of so many players---Hunter, Davis, Green, Smith, Rob, Thompson. I feel like I only have a good handle on Durham & TJD. I expect it to be a very interesting, and potentially dreadful, season.

 

[ufo33]

I think Smith was the only one with an "attitude" problem. I think Green was guilty of trying to do too much but he seems like a very personable guy who his teammates enjoy. His best stretch came at the end of the season and it's when he finally played off the ball in a role he seems much more comfortable with. Green had to play a lot of PG last year and that isn't a position that fits him. I think this is the first time in his career where he doesn't have to look over his shoulder and he'll have the green light at all times.

It's up to Smith to determine his coming role. IU isn't pressed to play Smith like they were his first two years because IU for once has front court depth. I think Smith has a lot of potential but he needs to buy in and Archie isn't forced to play him.

Agree Purdue will be good defensively, but offensively I think they struggle. Guys like Haarms and Williams were good at slipping screens and getting easy buckets at the basket because defenders had to extend their defense on Edwards and Cline because they had in the gym range. I don't see that out of this Purdue team. You could mask the fact that Eastern couldn't shoot outside 5 feet last year, but he's a huge liability on offense. Williams will be a force when he's in, but he's still got a long way to go to get in game shape to play 25 effective minutes a game and he fouls at an astronomic rate. I'll wait to see how their grad transfer performs at the B10 level before passing judgement. Playing against B10 competition is a lot different than playing at High Point. Purdue and their fans touted Boudreaux to high heaven last year because he averaged a double-double at Dartmouth but was completely overwhelmed and didn't even crack the rotation at the end of the year.

I don't see the potential in Smith. An Illinois Perea. 4* athletically with 1* Basketball Skills. Smith can not shoot from the perimeter, he is a poor FT shooter, can not dribble, looses the ball in traffic, not a good finisher, on defense he tends to rely on his leaping ability to defend rather than good positioning and footwork. If Hunter is healthy and Damezi regains his confidence then Smith's role will be reduced. Smith needs to find his Rodman role, rebound, play D, block shots.

 

[IndyResident16]

There are just too many uncertainties to be optimistic about the season. Easily the hardest BT team to evaluate. It's very difficult to project what we are likely to get out of so many players---Hunter, Davis, Green, Smith, Rob, Thompson. I feel like I only have a good handle on Durham & TJD. I expect it to be a very interesting, and potentially dreadful, season.

I think you can expect improvement from Phinisee. He was fine when healthy last year and actually a big asset. Had almost a 3:1 A/TO ratio as a true freshman and was a quality defender. I think you know what you're going to get with Davis by now. He played the last third of the season at about 60-70% and was able to play 20 mpg and averaged 9 ppg while shooting better than 60% from the field. I think that's worst case scenario for him. If he can play at 90-100% no reason not to think he can't play ~25 mpg scoring double figures.

Smith I don't think you have to worry much about. His role likely diminishes now that IU has a legitimate front court and he simply adds depth. We know he can defend well and has shown in spurts can be very productive on the offensive end. Worst case he's coming off the bench providing minutes but if he's playing 25+ minutes a game it's because he's figured it out and that's a positive.

I think you'll get good and bad Green next year but IU is going to have to live with it. There's going to be games where he's going to score 20+ points and some nights where he'll turn the ball over 4-5 times and leave you wanting to pull your hair out, but it is what it is. He's IU best pure scorer along with shooter and he's going to get his minutes.

I think the two really relative unknowns are Thompson and Hunter. I think a healthy Thompson is an immediate upgrade from Moore, Fitzner and Forrester, who IU unfortunately had to rely on too many times last year, especially on the defensive end. I don't know if Hunter will ever be the player he was billed to be but he has a lot more skill and BBIQ than somebody like Justin Smith.

 

[IndyResident16]

I don't see the potential in Smith. An Illinois Perea. 4* athletically with 1* Basketball Skills. Smith can not shoot from the perimeter, he is a poor FT shooter, can not dribble, looses the ball in traffic, not a good finisher, on defense he tends to rely on his leaping ability to defend rather than good positioning and footwork. If Hunter is healthy and Damezi regains his confidence then Smith's role will be reduced. Smith needs to find his Rodman role, rebound, play D, block shots.

Smith has 10x the basketball skills that Perea had, he just lacks on-court awareness. Perea was all athleticism with little skill and no IQ. Smith scored as many points as a freshman as Perea did in his 3 years at IU. Smith isn't cut out to be a starting PF in the B10, I'll be the first to admit that. But there's a definitely a role for him off the bench if he can embellish it. Perea struggled at ETSU. If IU can get 7-8 ppg out of Smith off the bench next year it's a win. But playing him 25 minutes at the starting 4 is a lose-lose for everyone.

 

[mushroomgod_1]

I think you can expect improvement from Phinisee. He was fine when healthy last year and actually a big asset. Had almost a 3:1 A/TO ratio as a true freshman and was a quality defender. I think you know what you're going to get with Davis by now. He played the last third of the season at about 60-70% and was able to play 20 mpg and averaged 9 ppg while shooting better than 60% from the field. I think that's worst case scenario for him. If he can play at 90-100% no reason not to think he can't play ~25 mpg scoring double figures.

Smith I don't think you have to worry much about. His role likely diminishes now that IU has a legitimate front court and he simply adds depth. We know he can defend well and has shown in spurts can be very productive on the offensive end. Worst case he's coming off the bench providing minutes but if he's playing 25+ minutes a game it's because he's figured it out and that's a positive.

I think you'll get good and bad Green next year but IU is going to have to live with it. There's going to be games where he's going to score 20+ points and some nights where he'll turn the ball over 4-5 times and leave you wanting to pull your hair out, but it is what it is. He's IU best pure scorer along with shooter and he's going to get his minutes.

I think the two really relative unknowns are Thompson and Hunter. I think a healthy Thompson is an immediate upgrade from Moore, Fitzner and Forrester, who IU unfortunately had to rely on too many times last year, especially on the defensive end. I don't know if Hunter will ever be the player he was billed to be but he has a lot more skill and BBIQ than somebody like Justin Smith.

Davis has never been healthy for a full season, has he? I would think at best 60-40 to make it full a whole season healthy.

Rob....yes in certain games he was very good. So is he one of the top 4-5 PGs in the league? Does he upgrade his outside shooting? Or does he play 2nd fiddle to Green? What does he think of Green, anyway? Does he play one more year with him & get ticked off so much he wants to transfer? Because he kind of looked disinterested/flustered at the end of the year.

That's what I'm talking about.....a tremendous amount of uncertainty surrounding this team.

 

[IndyResident16]

Davis has never been healthy for a full season, has he? I would think at best 60-40 to make it full a whole season healthy.

Rob....yes in certain games he was very good. So is he one of the top 4-5 PGs in the league? Does he upgrade his outside shooting? Or does he play 2nd fiddle to Green? What does he think of Green, anyway? Does he play one more year with him & get ticked off so much he wants to transfer? Because he kind of looked disinterested/flustered at the end of the year.

That's what I'm talking about.....a tremendous amount of uncertainty surrounding this team.

I don't know what he thinks of Green, I've never spoken too him. I don't see where you get the impression that Phinisee looked "disinterested/flustered" at the end of the year? IU was playing it's best basketball towards the end of the year and Green and Phinisee were big reasons why. I think you're grasping for straws. The team will be Rob's in 2020 and 2021.

As far as Phinisee improving? I think it's natural for guys to get better as they get older. Yogi shot 30% from 3 as a freshman and became one of the all-time greats at IU. No reason not to think Rob doesn't improve his outside shot. Most freshman don't come in and set the world on fire from 3 point range. It takes an adjustment from difference in length from high school to college as well as the speed of defenders closing out.

 

[Hatchets7times]

Illinois...Imo way to many drinking the orange koolaid.
Mushroomgod_1 you have some good observations..

 

[IndyResident16]

Davis has never been healthy for a full season, has he? I would think at best 60-40 to make it full a whole season healthy.

Davis has suffered one major injury and that was a torn achilles. Davis was more than likely rushed back into action too early as he was playing 9 months removed from a major surgery and that's because guys like Thompson and Hunter were unavailable and Fitzner, Moore, and Forrester weren't practical options. In a perfect world where those two start out the year healthy, Davis probably doesn't start playing until mid-December and he's back 100%. But because that option didn't exist, he played at <50% to start the year. They shut him down for a few weeks in January and his numbers coming back starting with the game at Michigan State till the end of the year were night and day different than the first 20 games. No reason to think with the offseason Davis doesn't start the year 100% healthy. And in the unfortunate event Davis does get hurt again, it's why they brought in Joey Brunk. Between those two, both should be able to play the full 40 minutes at the 5 and provide production that hasn't been here since Archie took over.

 

[TR32]

IU has too much going on to make a reliable prediction, at this point. Seems many look at them as a worse team than last season so they surmise the result will be worse. I get it. There are a lot of questions and few answers right now.

Any success this season will likely come from their style of play and level of effort. It's defense or die barring some miraculous offensive resurgence. But the difference is they have a chance to match up with size unlike the past several seasons. This team has a chance to play D at a different level than we have become accustomed to seeing. This team will have a legit PG who is not a freshman - a first since Yogi graduated.

They may not score 40 points in an open gym. Who knows? Would like to think the young guys improve, the shooting gets better and they can avoid major injuries. But here is what we do know - they won't be guarding the other team's 7'0 260+ with a 6'6 and 6'8 forward the majority of the game and that's better than last season.

This is a really good post and I just want to add that having veteran guards is always a benefit to a team trying to build an identity.
Green, Durham, and Phinisee are all solid contributers at both ends of the floor.

Play sound, play defense, play hard. Be tough to beat. Achieve those things and take it one game at a time and see what they can achieve. A lot of cliche but it is true.

 

[TR32]

Davis has suffered one major injury and that was a torn achilles. Davis was more than likely rushed back into action too early as he was playing 9 months removed from a major surgery and that's because guys like Thompson and Hunter were unavailable and Fitzner, Moore, and Forrester weren't practical options. In a perfect world where those two start out the year healthy, Davis probably doesn't start playing until mid-December and he's back 100%. But because that option didn't exist, he played at <50% to start the year. They shut him down for a few weeks in January and his numbers coming back starting with the game at Michigan State till the end of the year were night and day different than the first 20 games. No reason to think with the offseason Davis doesn't start the year 100% healthy. And in the unfortunate event Davis does get hurt again, it's why they brought in Joey Brunk. Between those two, both should be able to play the full 40 minutes at the 5 and provide production that hasn't been here since Archie took over.

Agreed, and potentially TJD, Smith and Hunter or Thompson could play together against smaller teams.

 

[minneman]

There are just too many uncertainties to be optimistic about the season. Easily the hardest BT team to evaluate. It's very difficult to project what we are likely to get out of so many players---Hunter, Davis, Green, Smith, Rob, Thompson. I feel like I only have a good handle on Durham & TJD. I expect it to be a very interesting, and potentially dreadful, season.

Yes, lots of questions heading into the season. I think how well TJD will adjust to the college game is open for question. Interior players seem to take a bit longer than guards unless the player is a beast physically. And until some of the returning players show an ability to hit 3s teams can drop back to make it even more difficult for him.

I feel that even if Hunter plays (I think he will) that next season may be a struggle for him. He'll basically be a freshman that hasn't played in a year so there will probably be rust combined with adjusting to the college game. He redshirted but had very little practice before sitting out. I think in 2 years we'll see him really shine.

Davis I think will be solid.

Green - I just don't know. I hope he improves and becomes consistent but I don't have a lot of confidence that will happen.

I have way less confidence that Smith will improve.

I am hopeful for Phinisee since he looked good at times and has a year of experience.

Thompson can be an asset (probably role player) if he can stay healthy which seems to be a big if going back to his HS career.

Brunk I expect to help but I don't see him tearing it up. I think he'll have decent stats but his leadership will be the most important addition to the team.

I'm hoping a season of little PT will be extra motivation for Anderson to improve.

Durham I hope for continued improvement in his shooting but I don't see him ever being a guy that carries the team. He could develop into the type of player that can help keep a defense honest, though.

Next season could be anywhere from pretty good to decent to outright terrible. Just no way to know at this time. Definitely too many questions.

 

[cryano]

When predicting win-loss records...keep in mind who is on the sideline and how the game/team has been managed the last two years...

 

[IndyResident16]

When predicting win-loss records...keep in mind who is on the sideline and how the game/team has been managed the last two years...

CALL MORE TIMEOUTS ARCHIE!!!

But yes, I'm actually very interested to see Archie coach a collective group of players the he predominately recruited. Tough to manage a core group of kids you didn't recruit especially when they're injured and unavailable.

 

[cryano]

CALL MORE PURPOSEFUL TIMEOUTS ARCHIE!!!

But yes, I'm actually very interested to see Archie coach a collective group of players the he predominately recruited. Tough to manage a core group of kids you didn't recruit especially when they're injured and unavailable.

FIFY

 

[IndyResident16]

FIFY

Yeah because purposeful adds soooo much more meaning.

 

[cryano]

Yeah because purposeful adds soooo much more meaning.

well - of course it does..

 

[fpeaugh]

CALL MORE TIMEOUTS ARCHIE!!!

But yes, I'm actually very interested to see Archie coach a collective group of players the he predominately recruited. Tough to manage a core group of kids you didn't recruit especially when they're injured and unavailable.

You won’t be very interested after you see a few games.

 

[jimmygoiu]

You won’t be very interested after you see a few games.

I can guarantee you that I will be interested in ALL of the games, just like hundreds of thousands of IU fans throughout Hoosier Nation. I really enjoy IU bball and the upward direction that it is headed.

 

[Squonk too]

I can guarantee you that I will be interested in ALL of the games, just like hundreds of thousands of IU fans throughout Hoosier Nation. I really enjoy IU bball and the upward direction that it is headed.

Seconded. I just wish that instead of vs. Portland State we were opening with someone more substantial, say, Northern Kentucky.

 

[fpeaugh]

I can guarantee you that I will be interested in ALL of the games, just like hundreds of thousands of IU fans throughout Hoosier Nation. I really enjoy IU bball and the upward direction that it is headed.

Upward direction? Is that sarcasm? I understand if you want to be eternally optimistic, even just blind sunshine, but to say we’re headed in an upward direction is just pure fiction.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

Upward direction? I fart storm clouds in your direction!

 

[Paterfamilias]

Upward direction? Is that sarcasm? I understand if you want to be eternally optimistic, even just blind sunshine, but to say we’re headed in an upward direction is just pure fiction.

I've got to agree with you on this one. I started listening to IU games while watching other games at some point during the losing streak. At least I enjoy time spent with Fisch win or lose. Maybe not seeing all of last season, with my eyes, allows me to be a bit more optimistic

I do like the way the roster has transitioned away from the positionless/smallball structure that the prior regime preferred. That's substantial progress to me, even if it has yet to manifest results in the win column. Unless Archie sucks, a turnaround is at hand imo

 

[ufo33]

Upward direction? Is that sarcasm? I understand if you want to be eternally optimistic, even just blind sunshine, but to say we’re headed in an upward direction is just pure fiction.

False.
Archie actually recruits and uses post players
Defense is a focus now
Positionless basketball gone and true post players are in
Reduce Turnovers
More Balanced roster construction.

 

[Moops]

Race will be Monster

 

[fpeaugh]

False.
Archie actually recruits and uses post players
Defense is a focus now
Positionless basketball gone and true post players are in
Reduce Turnovers
More Balanced roster construction.

These are all just vague hopes that you’re using to justify the sunshine. There is nothing factual at all to prove we’re on an upward trajectory. None. Quite the opposite actually.

 

[iubud]

I think Smith was the only one with an "attitude" problem. I think Green was guilty of trying to do too much but he seems like a very personable guy who his teammates enjoy. His best stretch came at the end of the season and it's when he finally played off the ball in a role he seems much more comfortable with. Green had to play a lot of PG last year and that isn't a position that fits him. I think this is the first time in his career where he doesn't have to look over his shoulder and he'll have the green light at all times.

It's up to Smith to determine his coming role. IU isn't pressed to play Smith like they were his first two years because IU for once has front court depth. I think Smith has a lot of potential but he needs to buy in and Archie isn't forced to play him.

Agree Purdue will be good defensively, but offensively I think they struggle. Guys like Haarms and Williams were good at slipping screens and getting easy buckets at the basket because defenders had to extend their defense on Edwards and Cline because they had in the gym range. I don't see that out of this Purdue team. You could mask the fact that Eastern couldn't shoot outside 5 feet last year, but he's a huge liability on offense. Williams will be a force when he's in, but he's still got a long way to go to get in game shape to play 25 effective minutes a game and he fouls at an astronomic rate. I'll wait to see how their grad transfer performs at the B10 level before passing judgement. Playing against B10 competition is a lot different than playing at High Point. Purdue and their fans touted Boudreaux to high heaven last year because he averaged a double-double at Dartmouth but was completely overwhelmed and didn't even crack the rotation at the end of the year.

I agree with you on Green and Smith. Green played int the NIT with more focus and played play more under control. His shot selection was better as if he wasn't in a hurry to put up a high volume of attempts. I noticed this earlier when he had to play a lot of minutes due to others being out.

Green was described by his dad as someone that needs to hear that people believe in him and responds very well to praise. Being the #1 option at the 2 should make him more comfortable. We will see.

Smith can be good at times. Hopefully Smith and Archie can figure out what makes him play well. One thing is he has to work on his outside shot. He may have to play the 3 if he wants to play this year.

I am not sold on PU. Eastern give me the feeling of a player with an exaggerated opinion of himself that can rock the boat in a team setting. Haarms is big, but doesn't worry me. Someone will have to make the big shots that Edwards and Cline took.

 

[IndyResident16]

I agree with you on Green and Smith. Green played int the NIT with more focus and played play more under control. His shot selection was better as if he wasn't in a hurry to put up a high volume of attempts. I noticed this earlier when he had to play a lot of minutes due to others being out.

Green was described by his dad as someone that needs to hear that people believe in him and responds very well to praise. Being the #1 option at the 2 should make him more comfortable. We will see.

Smith can be good at times. Hopefully Smith and Archie can figure out what makes him play well. One thing is he has to work on his outside shot. He may have to play the 3 if he wants to play this year.

I am not sold on PU. Eastern give me the feeling of a player with an exaggerated opinion of himself that can rock the boat in a team setting. Haarms is big, but doesn't worry me. Someone will have to make the big shots that Edwards and Cline took.

Green pressed too much his sophomore year and early last year. He wasn't a starter and tried to do too much to prove that he should be starting. He played way too much PG out of necessity his first two years under Archie. He looked very comfortable off the ball last year down the stretch. Going into this year Green has to know that he is IU's lead guard. He doesn't need to look over his shoulder and think that if he makes a bad play or doesn't produce that he's coming out. It's all about confidence with him. He has the tools and skill to be a very good guard next year.

 

[ufo33]

These are all just vague hopes that you’re using to justify the sunshine. There is nothing factual at all to prove we’re on an upward trajectory. None. Quite the opposite actually.

The Chicken before the Egg
Improved and more balanced Roster
Cause and Effect
... wait for it...eventially will lead to more wins... and the NCAA Tournament