He got fired because he didn’t manage the most important position group on the team.
Tuttle and Bazelak quarterback battle
- Thread starter KevinVera
- Start date
...guess I didn't say it plain enough for some...
Sorry, I didn’t see where you said anything about how he managed the quarterbacks or where he came up short. My bad. There was also a huge recruiting mistake that he took the fall for, too.
Coming out of spring practice, the decision was made to not find a grad transfer quarterback to bring in. With #1 missing big chunks of his practice and playing time at IU due to injury, #2 being relatively untested and just off an injury, #3 being out for the season with an injury, #4 being a walk on, and #5 still on high school, they were in a risky situation there, and they decided to stand pat. That blew up on them.
I don’t think Tuttle has been given the best chance to succeed this far, but with DM moving to WR, at least it’s clear he is in a two-man race now. I still think he is wel liked, trusted and has leadership abilities. I also think as much as he has had some bad moments, he too has had some great throws and the OSU opening drive for a TD.
I do t think all the Elite 11 scouts got it wrong. He has talent. He could surprise and win the job, or be next man up and at least will likely have more reps than before.
Will definitely need him to relieve Bazelek throughout the year. Need a running threat at QB as well. Not sure he’ll help there at all.
Tuttle executed the game plan. Play conservative and rely upon the defense.
Was that the recruiting of Charlton Warren to DC? Because that was a huge mistake. If not, what was the huge recruiting mistake?
Ahh, so you're saying that Sheridan decided against getting another qb while Allen wanted to. Or are you saying Allen didn't and pushed it on Sheridan when it blew up?
As a staff, they decided against it. It was partly based on a limited number of available scholarships, who was available to transfer, but also on their (especially NS) belief that what they had was plenty good enough. It’s fair to say he greatly overestimated the skill set of one player and that he paid the price for MP missing huge chunks of playing, practice and prep time. MP was fully healthy physically and mentally when they went to Iowa. But his prep wasn’t nearly enough to go against a D like Parker’s, and he was eaten alive.
Warren was hired with the agreement / understanding that the D wasn’t changing, and it didn’t. We weren’t able to turn teams over like we did the year before, for reasons we have discussed here, but it was the same D. Unfortunately, a key guy who helped a lot in 2020 was no longer there, too (Jerome Johnson). Big loss.
There was no where near the same when it came to the amount of blitzes. They also changed the coverage because they weren't doing a zone and keep your eyes glued to the QB that was constantly being mentioned in 2020.
Maybe the playbook and formations were the same (not sure) but it was definitely being used differently in regards to what was being called and what they had the coverage doing.
They blitzed a ton last year, they just didn’t get home as much (see the loss of JJ as a reason for some of that, just as we didn’t have the corners who could get there from the edge). McFadden came in blitzes often because he was a challenge to block and because dropping on coverage was never a strength. We also lost several guys to injuries for extended time in the back, which made blitzing tougher.
We also didn’t have the luxury of throwing blitz packages and constant pressures at teams that couldn’t practice and prepare normal, as was the case in 2020. That had a huge impact because now teams could prepare, and that lessened the impact for us. But the D formations and calls changed very little, if at all. That was a condition of Warren getting hired. TA told candidates they couldn’t change his D. We just weren’t able to execute it like we did in 2020.
From the Athletic
Key stat to know: The Hoosiers have been one of the most blitz-heavy teams in the Big Ten during Allen’s tenure. Indiana sent five or more rushers on 42.4 percent of its defensive snaps in 2020 and 37.8 percent of its snaps in 2019, which ranked 15th and 17th, respectively, in the FBS, according to Pro Football Focus. But in 2021, decimated by injuries on the back end of their defense, the Hoosiers ranked 71st with a blitz rate of 26.8 percent. A healthier defense and Allen’s move to the play-caller role could mean a return to the attacking mentality teams have come to expect from the Hoosiers.
So, no, we did not blitz as much last year.
Interesting stats for sure but, as I said, we had to back away from it as the season progressed and injuries limited it. It also shows how we amped it up in 2020 to take advantage of the Covid-specific situation and how teams with full preparation were able to negate it. If you remember the targeting call on McFadden, it came on a third and long blitz, which was more common early in the season. Sorry if I wasn’t clear but the D really didn’t change. How we executed it did change. Go watch the games for additional validation of that.
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That is splitting hairs.
We didn't blitz as much as we did in 2019 and 2020 (2021 was the outlier) and we moved to more man coverage instead of zone coverage, which meant the secondary wasn't watching the QB as much and thus not able to jump the passes as well for interceptions. Those are major differences in the D so saying it really didn't change is not accurate at all.
We were nearly always in man, with press on the outside, whenever we blitzed and regardless of the season. That’s the trade you make when you bring pressure. The exception was when we brought slot pressure or boundary pressure, and then we usually rolled a safety down to cover the wideout / slot receiver TE in the slot.. And it is obvious why it worked on 2020, and the factors that prevented it from being nearly as effective last year. Tom Allen made his D coordinator hire based on the understanding that the D wouldn’t change. Go watch the games again, look at the personnel, understand the uniqueness of 2020. It’s not splitting hairs. It’s why it worked in 2020 and was less viable in 2021.
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The system was always the same but the play calling and instruction came from C. Warren last year. In 2019 Allen gave Wommack the play calling duties after Wommack had been in the Allen structure for a year learning the ropes. Warren was new and trying to run a system that wasn't his, its Toms.
Allen is now going back to calling the plays and instructing the defense. Wilt is basically his right hand man. So I feel like simply saying its the same defense is undermining the fact that it was someone new trying to run it.
You don’t really “call plays” on defense, but that’s a different conversation. I think Warren had latitude to call the D last year with a huge amount of input from Coach Allen, but he had to bend what Allen wanted to do (with TA’s support) when it became clear that we didn’t have the personnel or the advantages we had in 2020. Of you watched TA’s involvement on the sideline with the D and compared it to the O, it was completely different. He was extremely engaged with that unit.
What no one saw coming and couldn’t prepare for in 2020 was easier to diagnose and react to by our opponents in 2021. Couple that with our personnel changes on the D line and in the D backfield and it’s no wonder the results were different. We had to adjust because it wasn’t working. We only stopped Idaho and MSU, sort of. Everyone else figured it out, especially as the season wore on.
Its semantics. Generally you don't call "a play" on defense. You design a scheme.
You call a coverage: zone, man, cover 2, etc.
You call select a front. 3 man, 4, etc
You dial up a pressure package. Stunts, LB blitz, etc.
These 3 calls are interchangeable. But they aren't really plays.
Find a coach or player who says you “call plays” on D. It’s not how it’s ever referred to. Was just making making light of it.
Nope.
In 2020 our scoring defense was 19th in the nation at 20.3 ppg - we played all Big Ten opponents - no OOC
In 2021 our scoring defense was 109 at 33.3 ppg - we benefitted from games against lesser opponents Idaho and Western Kentucky (who torched us for 31)
If Wommack and Warren both used the 5-4-2 and Wommack called 100 blitzes and Warren called zero, they are still using the "same system." That statement is not relevant to determining why our defense plummeted under Warren.
Covid was not the difference either. Everybody had the same Covid problems. Plus, everybody saw us run the 5-2-4 under both Allen and Wommack - it was not new to the Big Ten in 2020.
In 2020, we had 23 QB hurries in 8 games. Jerome Johnson had one.
In 2021, we had 17 QB hurries in 12 games.
In 2020, we had 25 sacks in 8 games. Jerome had 4.
in 2021, we had 17 sacks in 12 games.
THE difference was the NUMBER and FREQUENCY and DIVERSITY of blitz calls. Wommack's play calling was better, more effective, more aggressive BECAUSE he knew we could not lay back with our lesser talent. We had to blitz more often from more positions to keep the QB off balance - to keep the QB on the move - to keep him from just standing back and selecting his receiver of choice while our front 4 and 1 LB every third play got blocked by superior talent. Wommack sometimes sent 2 LB's and a corner and a safety. But he almost ALWAYS sent SOMEBODY. The QB was HARASSED CONSTANTLY. Even when nobody got to him. The QB could take no plays off - he had to worry about blitzes every snap - even when we didn't send anybody. Warren tried to select and time when to blitz. And so most plays, the QB was comfortable. Warren made personnel excuses to be docile. It KILLED us as a defense,
Warren played too careful, and let the talent difference affect us, He should have INCREASED our pressure if we had less talent - not decreased.
I know my comment is 20-20 hindsight. But why didn't TA just tell him to blitz more? Every press conference he kept saying "we need to create more pressure" and "we need more takeaways". Why do you think he just let Warren continue what he was doing?
Learning to be a Head Coach takes time too.
Allen was likely trying to walk lines between “interfering” and “meddling” and trying to be a good boss, etc. Too much emphasis on LEO-ing young men and too little on field results?
“Nice guys finish last.” Leo Durocher.
Everyone did not have the same Covid problems. Our biggest Covid issues were, by far, in the summer. By late September, it had mostly run through the team. Most other programs weren’t so lucky. The success of a heavy blitzing package confirmed that. Teams who were already having trouble getting full compliments of players on the field to practice were hopelessly behind in things like pass protection, which is one of the most challenging aspects of any offense.
In 2021, with our space eating DT gone and with loads of tape that opponents could now prep for, our aggressive approach was less effective. When our top three corners all missed games due to injury, our ability to bring pressure from the slot or the boundary was even more of a negative. And having to move guys around at the corners meant man / press cover when we blitzed was way too risky, so we had to back away. It’s why the effectiveness of certain strategies and tactics changes from year to year, and why the same approach didn’t work in 2021 like it did in 2020.
Because the risk was too great. Teams figured out their protections and we weren’t getting home. When that happens, you exposed your secondary to big plays. Allen has been a D guy his entire career. He understood the changing landscape and reacted accordingly. We could’ve blitzed more but it very likely would’ve resulted in us being n a bigger hole offensively, and we were already a million miles behind the curve there.
Edit: By the way, love the discussion and the variety of opinions offered. Always enjoy chatting with and learning from fellow IU fans.
Go Hoosiers.
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One of the major problems was not playing more players and keeping the same ones on the field until injured that was the major problem you don't admit. Players that were on the field in 2021 didn't see the field. It is the reason that coach told the two defensive coaches to find new teams. You make too many excuses for Warren when he was the big problem on not substituting like in 2021.
Go look at the box scores of our 2020 games and you will see the expected offensive names that our defense played against. The main “missing“ player was LB Micah Parsons from Penn State.
The idea that Covid gave Indiana‘s defense some unique advantage in the 2020 Big Ten is a stretch even before you check the film.
It’s a team game, not just one of certain stars. I remember one coach saying that hadn’t practiced with a full squad in nearly three weeks due to Covid. It was a major issue for many teams trying to prepare.
OK. Show me.
You're the one claiming IU got to prepare fine during 2020 Covid but our opponents had practice problems due to Covid that allowed IU’s defense to be more effective than it otherwise should have been.
The stats on QB hurries and sacks disagree. I even looked through the the actual game reports and saw that our opponents put their offensive stars on the field against our defense.
If you claim those opposing offenses were prevented from proper practice by Covid - show me - prove it.
Link me some articles about how the week before our games, our opponents were being hurt by Covid. If your assertion is correct, it should be easy. Covid did not erase the internet.
I recall Big Ten cancellations early, but them they let everybody play, made them test, made them isolate and quarantine when positives showed up. Even our final 2020 game with Pee Ewe was cancelled. You claim to recall unidentified coaches saying they could barely field a practice. So show me how our defense got to play against Covid-impacted unprepared defenses. Don't just say it - show your work.
I think Allen doesn’t get enough credit for keeping his team together in 2020. We didn’t have anyone sit out and it‘s evident from the lack of COVID outbreaks (until the end of the season) that the players sacrificed some of their social life for the good of the football team. That probably had as much to do with the advantage we had that year as anything.
Here is a quote in the Athletic article I mentioned earlier, quoting an unnamed B1G assistant talking about IU FB: “It was more about who handled the external environment in the weirdest year ever,” one Big Ten staffer said. “I think they just handled it better than some other teams.”
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I think if you followed the Big ten then you’d maybe have a better feel for how difficult it was for teams to prepare that year. Paul Chryst said they went nearly three weeks without being able to practice much at all. And, since our Covid hit was mostly before the abbreviated season, we weren’t as impeded by it. Couple that with TA and KW’s extremely wise strategy to exploit one of the toughest parts of the game to prepare for (pass protection), we created a huge advantage for ourselves. It doesn’t diminish what we accomplished at all, but it does help explain why, when teams could adequately prep for us, we came back to earth last year.
Once again, this was smart football and great defensive coaching by Tom Allen. If you’re still not convinced, you should watch some of the games if you can find them and you’ll see what we were able to do. I think you’ll be impressed.
Call a coverage, select a font, select a pressure package....aka Calling plays
