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Top secret documents

Remember that 'risk assessment' they were going to do on Trump's docs?

Wonder why none of that has been reported.....er... leaked.
Their narrative has... Dissolved, went away, found to be totally incorrect, no longer applicable to their goal.
Only one of the 3 people with discovered documents had any chance of de-classifying them. ONLY ONE. all others are totally illegal. His name starts with Trump.
GD, no wonder they hate him. It's their game and he is winning, using their rules.
 
Their narrative has... Dissolved, went away, found to be totally incorrect, no longer applicable to their goal.
Only one of the 3 people with discovered documents had any chance of de-classifying them. ONLY ONE. all others are totally illegal. His name starts with Trump.
GD, no wonder they hate him. It's their game and he is winning, using their rules.
None could declassify without going through the actual process. NONE
 
Do you know that Trump had Military Secrets? For the purpose of my argument, lets take Trump out of it. Do you know if biden had military secrets? how about Pence?
What we do know, no matter of what the doc's may turn out to be (of which we will never honeslty know), there is only ONE of these three that could declassify ANYTHING, with the exception of nuke info. Only one of three where CIC. Once you all understand that and admit it, then we are all on the same playing field together.
DC stinks. If you are already there, you are ruined. If you are on the outside wanting in, you are stained, waiting to stink.
You focus on the $ cause, I focus on the effected and the DC middlemen.

If you go to DC with the country as your focus, there is NO amount of money to buy you from anyone. But here we are, humans and everything has a price.
We need to end this idea about Trump declassifying the classified documents he had. He didn’t. There is absolutely no evidence he did, and if he even tried it would be only show that he had zero regard for our national security. I don’t think he does, actually.
 
You wouldn’t hear about that yet. Why would you expect it to leak?
Oh, I don't know..... maybe because staged pictures of the documents were leaked. Rumor of 'nuclear codes' were leaked.

A better question is, why would you expect it NOT to leak?
 
None could declassify without going through the actual process. NONE
You are wrong. totally wrong. Couldn't be further from the truth. There is no statue that covers how many ways that Trump couldn't declassify them given the circumstances.
We need to end this idea about Trump declassifying the classified documents he had. He didn’t. There is absolutely no evidence he did, and if he even tried it would be only show that he had zero regard for our national security. I don’t think he does, actually.
I understand damn near every post that you have made about this topic. I do not discount anyone of them, I've taken every one of them under total, respectable consideration.
With all of the evidence delivered, I can still think of one very arguable, never dispelled, way that Trump actually could have, "legally" declassified every thing that he said that he did, and you would not be able to argue it, without Months/ yrs of court battles. (exactly what Trump/ any DC rats want).
I've busted your chops in the past. I will bust your chops in the future. That doesn't mean that I don't respect you (If I didn't respect you, I would just walk on past).
You, Bing, Danc and any other Military that I've forgot or not known about, I salute you. But the rules that you observe, and have been taught, your civilian leaders don't GAF about for them.
I'll fight you about Trumps "qualifications" BS. But I'll fight WITH you that the Doc Reg's for them, are different than for you (Bing, Danc.....). Eff that!
 
You are wrong. totally wrong. Couldn't be further from the truth. There is no statue that covers how many ways that Trump couldn't declassify them given the circumstances.

I understand damn near every post that you have made about this topic. I do not discount anyone of them, I've taken every one of them under total, respectable consideration.
With all of the evidence delivered, I can still think of one very arguable, never dispelled, way that Trump actually could have, "legally" declassified every thing that he said that he did, and you would not be able to argue it, without Months/ yrs of court battles. (exactly what Trump/ any DC rats want).
I've busted your chops in the past. I will bust your chops in the future. That doesn't mean that I don't respect you (If I didn't respect you, I would just walk on past).
You, Bing, Danc and any other Military that I've forgot or not known about, I salute you. But the rules that you observe, and have been taught, your civilian leaders don't GAF about for them.
I'll fight you about Trumps "qualifications" BS. But I'll fight WITH you that the Doc Reg's for them, are different than for you (Bing, Danc.....). Eff that!

we could argue if Trump needed to follow some procedure regarding declassifying, but it's irrelevant if he did or didn't.

it was illegal for him to possess them, classified or not.

also illegal to lie about it.

same for Biden and Pence and anyone else.

that said, again, how egregious said possession is for any of them, is dependent on the contents of the documents, not the classification.
 
we could argue if Trump needed to follow some procedure regarding declassifying, but it's irrelevant if he did or didn't.

it was illegal for him to possess them, classified or not.

also illegal to lie about it.

same for Biden and Pence and anyone else.

that said, again, how egregious said possession is for any of them, is dependent on the contents of the documents, not the classification.
How? If he, as CIC with total final say on what is or is not, declassified, how would it be illegal for him to posses them? NOW, I'm not saying that he should or should not, but I graduated law with GOAT.
If Trump said, 2 minutes before his presidency ended, that "these docs are declassified", and then 4 minute later, his whitehouse staff was fired but the incoming "elected" Pres and didn't have time to go through the process. Are they declassified or not? This can play out in court for years and I've zero doubt that he will fight it, and not one has an answer. The final verdict will be "who ever is in charge at the time of the decision". WOW, what an Eff'ing law structure we have.
I'f I'm wrong, it'll be obvious in 3-4 yrs. you can either gloat or hide then. But I doubt that I forget ( I may hide though).

Illegal to lie out of DC... OH EFFING PAAAAAAALEASE.

Biden and Pence NEVER (considering the age of the docs) had the executive privilege. They either had a special back door for their doc's or they were planted. I have yet to hear one peep of DC Leagal BS to differ, even from CNN, aloha or karim joan periere.

There's only one that has a face value argument. NOT judgement, but argument.
The more this sinks in, the more I agree, this is how our masters pick who we are allowed to pretend to vote for in 24'. I see blood on the walls in the next few years if this isn't answered accordingly, maybe even if it is. Lord help us all. The horse done left the barn I am afraid.
 
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How? If he, as CIC with total final say on what is or is not, declassified, how would it be illegal for him to posses them? NOW, I'm not saying that he should or should not, but I graduated law with GOAT.
If Trump said, 2 minutes before his presidency ended, that "these docs are declassified", and then 4 minute later, his whitehouse staff was fired but the incoming "elected" Pres and didn't have time to go through the process. Are they declassified or not? This can play out in court for years and I've zero doubt that he will fight it, and not one has an answer. The final verdict will be "who ever is in charge at the time of the decision". WOW, what an Eff'ing law structure we have.
I'f I'm wrong, it'll be obvious in 3-4 yrs. you can either gloat or hide then. But I doubt that I forget ( I may hide though).

Illegal to lie out of DC... OH EFFING PAAAAAAALEASE.

Biden and Pence NEVER (considering the age of the docs) had the executive privilege. They either had a special back door for their doc's or they were planted. I have yet to hear one peep of DC Leagal BS to differ, even from CNN, aloha or karim joan periere.

There's only one that has a face value argument. NOT judgement, but argument.
The more this sinks in, the more I agree, this is how our masters pick who we are allowed to pretend to vote for in 24'. I see blood on the walls in the next few years if this isn't answered accordingly, maybe even if it is. Lord help us all. The horse done left the barn I am afraid.
None of that matters. Besides the fact that it's ridiculous. I mean, why in the world would Trump use his last few moments to declassify the documents he wanted to take back to Florida? That's just f*cking stupid. He probably didn't even know those documents were there. He had them lying around his rooms, and the movers packed them up. It happens (probably). This whole "he declassified them" thing just makes you people look brain-dead. He didn't, okay? They were classified. He f*cked up. It happens.

But, anyway, it doesn't matter. He was never going to get in trouble for having classified docs. No one is. They all live in a different world where that's not really a (wink wink) crime. He was only going to get in trouble for obstruction of justice, because unlike anyone else with any common sense, instead of playing ball, he tried to get all shitty about it.

And now, he probably won't even get in trouble for that, because Biden and Pence gave him cover. It's over. No one gets in trouble.

But please stop playing this "it was declassified" card. It makes you look exceedingly stupid.
 
We need to end this idea about Trump declassifying the classified documents he had. He didn’t. There is absolutely no evidence he did, and if he even tried it would be only show that he had zero regard for our national security. I don’t think he does, actually.
That doesn't even make sense (that Trump could snap his fingers and something would be declassified on the spot). Even I don't think the government people are that stupid. Common sense would tell you that there is a procedure. However, he treats people so rudely it wouldn't surprise me if there was evidence it would be conveniently lost. :)
 
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You are wrong. totally wrong. Couldn't be further from the truth. There is no statue that covers how many ways that Trump couldn't declassify them given the circumstances.

I understand damn near every post that you have made about this topic. I do not discount anyone of them, I've taken every one of them under total, respectable consideration.
With all of the evidence delivered, I can still think of one very arguable, never dispelled, way that Trump actually could have, "legally" declassified every thing that he said that he did, and you would not be able to argue it, without Months/ yrs of court battles. (exactly what Trump/ any DC rats want).
I've busted your chops in the past. I will bust your chops in the future. That doesn't mean that I don't respect you (If I didn't respect you, I would just walk on past).
You, Bing, Danc and any other Military that I've forgot or not known about, I salute you. But the rules that you observe, and have been taught, your civilian leaders don't GAF about for them.
I'll fight you about Trumps "qualifications" BS. But I'll fight WITH you that the Doc Reg's for them, are different than for you (Bing, Danc.....). Eff that!
Lol. Nope. You are wrong. Just because Trump says so doesn't make it true.

How would the government be able to know what was classified and what was not classified if even a single person could declassify stuff without telling anyone?

Plus, you can't take original documents with you whether classified or not. That is called government property.

Multiple people who have actually worked with classified documents have said there is a procedure for declassifying that even a president would have to follow. But you seem to think the liar in chief was being honest.

So if Biden came out and said Obama declassified everything, would you say yup, that sounds legit?
 
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Oh, I don't know..... maybe because staged pictures of the documents were leaked. Rumor of 'nuclear codes' were leaked.

A better question is, why would you expect it NOT to leak?
There was no leak about nuclear codes. Someone made up a scam Trump fundraising email about Trump having nuclear codes asking for money amounts matching the numbers. Also, Trump defenders like you claimed that’s what they were. That was a very lame defense, by the way.
 
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Ya’ll just can’t stand people who are smart. Guess it intimidates people who like a man like Trump.
His ability to regurgitate facts has nothing to do with his ability to lead. He's "smart" but can't effectively do his job. The latter matters much more than the former.
 
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You are wrong. totally wrong. Couldn't be further from the truth. There is no statue that covers how many ways that Trump couldn't declassify them given the circumstances.

I understand damn near every post that you have made about this topic. I do not discount anyone of them, I've taken every one of them under total, respectable consideration.
With all of the evidence delivered, I can still think of one very arguable, never dispelled, way that Trump actually could have, "legally" declassified every thing that he said that he did, and you would not be able to argue it, without Months/ yrs of court battles. (exactly what Trump/ any DC rats want).
I've busted your chops in the past. I will bust your chops in the future. That doesn't mean that I don't respect you (If I didn't respect you, I would just walk on past).
You, Bing, Danc and any other Military that I've forgot or not known about, I salute you. But the rules that you observe, and have been taught, your civilian leaders don't GAF about for them.
I'll fight you about Trumps "qualifications" BS. But I'll fight WITH you that the Doc Reg's for them, are different than for you (Bing, Danc.....). Eff that!
Roger. Just be aware that among the findings of the Special Counsel will not be, "all's good, Trump declassified the documents." I'm certain that it never happened and so certain that i'd be willing to bet a sizeable chunk of change on it. However, it's not a fair bet for anyone that would take me up on it and would be like stealing money. I don't want to do that to anyone here.

Keep in mind that if they were declassified, it's a requirement to mark them as declassified. Any document with classification markings on them have to be handled appropriately to the classification level. It doesn't matter if someone, even the President, started the process to declassify them. It's an open and shut loser defense if his defense was dumb enough to try it in the event there was any sort of prosecution to come out of this situation.
 
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How? If he, as CIC with total final say on what is or is not, declassified, how would it be illegal for him to posses them? NOW, I'm not saying that he should or should not, but I graduated law with GOAT.
If Trump said, 2 minutes before his presidency ended, that "these docs are declassified", and then 4 minute later, his whitehouse staff was fired but the incoming "elected" Pres and didn't have time to go through the process. Are they declassified or not? This can play out in court for years and I've zero doubt that he will fight it, and not one has an answer. The final verdict will be "who ever is in charge at the time of the decision". WOW, what an Eff'ing law structure we have.
I'f I'm wrong, it'll be obvious in 3-4 yrs. you can either gloat or hide then. But I doubt that I forget ( I may hide though).

Illegal to lie out of DC... OH EFFING PAAAAAAALEASE.

Biden and Pence NEVER (considering the age of the docs) had the executive privilege. They either had a special back door for their doc's or they were planted. I have yet to hear one peep of DC Leagal BS to differ, even from CNN, aloha or karim joan periere.

There's only one that has a face value argument. NOT judgement, but argument.
The more this sinks in, the more I agree, this is how our masters pick who we are allowed to pretend to vote for in 24'. I see blood on the walls in the next few years if this isn't answered accordingly, maybe even if it is. Lord help us all. The horse done left the barn I am afraid.
Biden and Pence appear to have mishandled classified information . . . same as Trump. ;)
 
None of that matters. Besides the fact that it's ridiculous. I mean, why in the world would Trump use his last few moments to declassify the documents he wanted to take back to Florida? That's just f*cking stupid. He probably didn't even know those documents were there. He had them lying around his rooms, and the movers packed them up. It happens (probably). This whole "he declassified them" thing just makes you people look brain-dead. He didn't, okay? They were classified. He f*cked up. It happens.

But, anyway, it doesn't matter. He was never going to get in trouble for having classified docs. No one is. They all live in a different world where that's not really a (wink wink) crime. He was only going to get in trouble for obstruction of justice, because unlike anyone else with any common sense, instead of playing ball, he tried to get all shitty about it.

And now, he probably won't even get in trouble for that, because Biden and Pence gave him cover. It's over. No one gets in trouble.

But please stop playing this "it was declassified" card. It makes you look exceedingly stupid.
If the Prez has the magical power over classified v declassified docs, then why can’t Biden say he “thought” all Trumps docs back into classified mode immediately upon taking office and “thought” all his own can docs were declassified?

Imagine every prosecution of every case of classified dox: you’d have to interview every former President to see if they “thought” away the classified nature of the docs in question.

It’s a silly argument. But Joes right about how long the Courts can take in disposing of silly arguments.
 
None of that matters. Besides the fact that it's ridiculous. I mean, why in the world would Trump use his last few moments to declassify the documents he wanted to take back to Florida? That's just f*cking stupid. He probably didn't even know those documents were there. He had them lying around his rooms, and the movers packed them up. It happens (probably). This whole "he declassified them" thing just makes you people look brain-dead. He didn't, okay? They were classified. He f*cked up. It happens.

But, anyway, it doesn't matter. He was never going to get in trouble for having classified docs. No one is. They all live in a different world where that's not really a (wink wink) crime. He was only going to get in trouble for obstruction of justice, because unlike anyone else with any common sense, instead of playing ball, he tried to get all shitty about it.

And now, he probably won't even get in trouble for that, because Biden and Pence gave him cover. It's over. No one gets in trouble.

But please stop playing this "it was declassified" card. It makes you look exceedingly stupid.
I think the bolded sentence is probably accurate for Biden, Pence and Trump. The issue with all of them is that they should not have been lying around anywhere in their offices or wherever the packers packed them. They were clearly mishandled. We have a problem, Houston. This sloppy handling of classified documents by elected officials needs to be stopped. If any good comes from this, it will be fixing that. A man can hope.
 
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I think the bolded sentence is probably accurate for Biden, Pence and Trump. The issue with all of them is that they should be lying around anywhere in their offices or wherever the packers packed them. They were clearly mishandled. We have a problem, Houston. This sloppy handling of classified documents by elected officials needs to be stopped. If any good comes from this, it will be fixing that. A man can hope.
Some people have said the classification system is out of control. It’s often used to conceal embarrassment instead of state secrets. Can you walk us through how a particular document becomes classified?

Can a west wing staffer mark his memo to POTUS classified on his own volition? If POTUS thinks the memo is no big deal, and leaves it lying around to be eventually packed in a box, is that a crime?
 
Pence self-reported. Biden and Trump got caught. I would think that is important for the sienter requirement.
I've not read that Biden got caught. I read that they were found at his office when they were cleaning it out, then they decided they needed to look in the boxes that he had in his house. It's probably going to be political problems for Biden and Pence (he had no chance for President anyway), though I'd be good with at least fining all three of them. This sloppy handling of classified information needs to be stopped.
 
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I think the bolded sentence is probably accurate for Biden, Pence and Trump. The issue with all of them is that they should be lying around anywhere in their offices or wherever the packers packed them. They were clearly mishandled. We have a problem, Houston. This sloppy handling of classified documents by elected officials needs to be stopped. If any good comes from this, it will be fixing that. A man can hope.
I have the impression ignorant staffers marked documents classified when they really were documents subject to executive privilege. Those aren’t the same thing, but I wouldn’t expect many staffers to know the difference.
 
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I've not read that Biden got caught. I read that they were found at his office when they were cleaning it out, then they decided they needed to look in the boxes that he had in his house. It's probably going to be political problems for Biden and Pence (he had no chance for President anyway), though I'd be good with at least fining all three of them. This sloppy handling of classified information needs to be stopped.
Biden didn’t self report. Some documents were in his personal office in his home to be found by the FBI. I have to assume Biden either put them there or knew they were there. It has been reported that the Biden documents appear to have been selected. If so I think that is a major problem. We can’t verify that without knowing at least the subject matter of the documents. If not the actual material.
 
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Article might be accurate, but I also think using “anti-abortion activist” rather than the preferred “pro-life activists” exposes their bias the same as using “pro-abortion activists” would. Shouldn’t have done that if they want to be perceived as neutrally reporting the news.
You're telling journalists what words they have to use to be "objective"? More "if you're not with me, you're agin me" bullshit.

I respect you Aloha, but not this. This will knock you off the pedestal I've put you on. Probably a good thing.
 
Biden didn’t self report. Some documents were in his personal office in his home to be found by the FBI. I have to assume Biden either put them there or knew they were there. It has been reported that the Biden documents appear to have been selected. If so I think that is a major problem. We can’t verify that without knowing at least the subject matter of the documents. If not the actual material.
Good grief. Biden's team first found the documents when they were cleaning out an office to shut it down. They self-reported.
 
Pence self-reported. Biden and Trump got caught. I would think that is important for the sienter requirement.
You claim to be a lawyer but you frequently struggle with legal terms. It's "scienter."

Biden didn't "get caught." His team found classified documents and immediately advised the National Archives. The National Archives, in turn, notified Justice.

In Trump's case, the National Archives realized Trump had taken documents that belonged to them, and they requested their return. Trump and his team then stonewalled for a year and a half, resulting in a warrant and the FBI search last August.
 
Some people have said the classification system is out of control. It’s often used to conceal embarrassment instead of state secrets. Can you walk us through how a particular document becomes classified?

Can a west wing staffer mark his memo to POTUS classified on his own volition? If POTUS thinks the memo is no big deal, and leaves it lying around to be eventually packed in a box, is that a crime?
Some people say that, and it may happen here and there, but it's not my experience. Early in my career I did see that, but not since. Early examples were ship schedule to include the dates of departing home port. Just about everyone in the port or on the base and friends and families all knew that information. Classifying that at the Confidential level was just dumb and we don't do that any longer. Classification process is complicated and tightly controlled. Easiest is if the source is classified, the new document containing that information is classified the same - at least that part. A document can have classification for each paragraph. If it's new information we have classification guidance spelled out in Classification Guides. Here's an example (obviously, it's unclassified):

 
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You claim to be a lawyer but you frequently struggle with legal terms. It's "scienter."

Biden didn't "get caught." His team found classified documents and immediately advised the National Archives. The National Archives, in turn, notified Justice.

In Trump's case, the National Archives realized Trump had taken documents that belonged to them, and they requested their return. Trump and his team then stonewalled for a year and a half, resulting in a warrant and the FBI search last August.

Could you imagine them taking the same stance if Trump had been a dem and did this? They refuse to take a step back and actually look at the situation outside of the need to defend their side.
 
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I have the impression ignorant staffers marked documents classified when they really were documents subject to executive privilege. Those aren’t the same thing, but I wouldn’t expect many staffers to know the difference.
Doesn't sound very plausible. It doesn't happen that way, and documents would have the classification in the print within the documents. Besides, why would they do that for 130 or so documents and leave thousands of others unmarked? Why not shove them all into boxes and write Secret or Top Secret on the boxes? It would take a high level of ignorance and stupidity for anyone to do that and cause a ton of programs, but it would make more sense than marking a fraction of the documents due to some ignorant staffer's concept of Executive Privilege.
 
His ability to regurgitate facts has nothing to do with his ability to lead. He's "smart" but can't effectively do his job. The latter matters much more than the former.
He’s smart. He does a lot more than regurgitate facts. He will be a thorn in the side of conservatives for a very long time.
 
I have the impression ignorant staffers marked documents classified when they really were documents subject to executive privilege. Those aren’t the same thing, but I wouldn’t expect many staffers to know the difference.

You really think staffers are given the power to mark stuff as classified?

This isn't like just having to become a notary in order to notarize stuff lol. I doubt staffers are able to put classified markings on documents. Plus, that doesn't explain how archives knew about the missing classified documents if those documents weren't really classified to begin with.

Keep digging for an excuse. That one doesn't stick.
 
Biden didn’t self report. Some documents were in his personal office in his home to be found by the FBI. I have to assume Biden either put them there or knew they were there. It has been reported that the Biden documents appear to have been selected. If so I think that is a major problem. We can’t verify that without knowing at least the subject matter of the documents. If not the actual material.
Timeline I've read in various articles was that first documents were found at his think tank office (don't recall where that was, but I think it was at a university) and those were turned in. Then it's been reported that Biden's lawyers/staffers invited the FBI to search the boxes in his garage and his house for any additional classified documents. Maybe he did deliberately take some. I don't know and hopefully the special counsel finds out and it's reported. I think it's clear that all three of them are a least guilty of gross negligence which is exactly what HRC was guilty of despite the decision not to prosecute. At this point I don't see prosecution as possible for mishandling classified information by any of them, unless there is some intent found, and of course we have the dumb rule that our President can't be prosecuted while in office. They could impeach him, but the Senate would never convict him. Unless the special counsel finds something really explosive with Biden's case. Intent, disclosure to others, etc.

We're not going to know what's actually in the documents. We could learn subjects of some or all of the documents or maybe categories of the information.
 
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