The Thrill is Gone

[CO. Hoosier]

Can't say it better than B.B. King



Marc Thiessen said this election is a searing indictment of the Republican Party. He might be right but I think the state of the GOP is a symptom of a larger problem in all of politics.

We have a large majority of people saying the country is on the wrong track, real wages are in the midst of the worst decline in decades, inflation is the highest in decades, energy (the currency of life) is in short supply and expensive, transportation is a mess, human relationships and the nuclear family are under stress and the stress is increasing, our general mental health is in decline, the use of prescription and non-prescription mind altering drugs is increasing, parts of great cities are like the third world, the boarder is in chaos, violent crime is becoming common in in certain locales, respect for law and the police at a low ebb . . . . . . .

and voters keep the status quo?

Thiessen is right in that the GOP put up some candidates that had no business running, (with the help of Democrats in several primaries!). However, many more quality GOP candidates bit the dust. Congress has approval ratings below used car salesmen, but nothing important will change.

All the problems facing the US and us don't seem to be determinative of elections. What is determinative? Trump!, abortion, Trump!, climate change, Trump!, health care, Trump!, energy, Trump! civil rights, Trump!, minimum wage. I'm old enough to remember when politics was about ideas and proposals, not about Trump, Mega MAGA, and vague dangers to democracy. Even on this board, mosts posts about ideas will sooner or later devolve into a discussion about Trump. (Somebody even posted about Trump in the Books and Movie thread!) A few solid and smart conservatives overly-focus on Trump. As I said a few days ago, I wish Trump would go away, and I don't give a shit about him, but that is not where the US is. Thiessen is right. I think the hand of Trump caused the GOP disaster and directed the voters toward keeping the county on the wrong track. But that is on the voters, not on Trump. The Trump effects are everywhere cuz of us, not cuz of him. This isn't for me.

The final verse of The Thrill is Gone:

You know I'm free, free now, baby
I'm free from your spell
I'm free, free, free now
I'm free from your spell
And now that it's all over
All I can do is wish you well​

 

[Bowlmania]

our general mental health is in decline,

Speak for yourself.

the boarder is in chaos,

Border.

I'm old enough to remember when politics was about ideas and proposals, not about Trump, Mega MAGA, and vague dangers to democracy.

I'm old enough to remember when the harm from Trump's sociopathy and recklessness was limited to his businesses and personal life.

The Trump effects are everywhere cuz of us, not cuz of him.

Let me know when you're out of that delusion.

 

[MyTeamIsOnTheFloor]

Heres a picture of the victory celebration:

 

[MyTeamIsOnTheFloor]

The new Pa. Senator learns of victory:

 

[larsIU]

Perhaps, and stay with me here, it's not as bad as the far left/far right make it out to be.

America, what a place.

 

[Joe_Hoopsier]

All the problems facing the US and us don't seem to be determinative of elections. What is determinative? Trump!, abortion, Trump!, climate change, Trump!, health care, Trump!, energy, Trump! civil rights, Trump!, minimum wage. I'm old enough to remember when politics was about ideas and proposals, not about Trump, Mega MAGA, and vague dangers to democracy.

I totally underestimated a lot of peoples meaningful thinking abilities.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

Perhaps, and stay with me here, it's not as bad as the far left/far right make it out to be.

America, what a place.

You mean people got tired of the fear mongering from both sides?

 

[El Drado]

The people need to demand more from politicians. We need to keep them hyper-focused on healthcare, inflation, infrastructure.......problems that effect all of us. The right needs to stfu about this woke boogeyman, and the left needs to stfu about trump........vote El Dorado '24

 

[larsIU]

You mean people got tired of the fear mongering from both sides?

God I hope so. It would give me some faith.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

You mean people got tired of the fear mongering from both sides?

I know I got tired of the commercials. We can't blame all that on the politicians given far and away most commercials I saw were PAC commercials. But they suck.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

God I hope so. It would give me some faith.

Like Charlie Brown and the football.

 

[Farva2.0]

I'm not sure what lessons to draw from last night as a GOP voter. Some scattered thoughts....

First off, I am very disheartened with PA, Oz was far from a perfect candidate, I'm not sure what his message was it seemed scattered, and he faced major headwinds with the governors race. Still, I thought he would hold out. I'm close to writing PA off for the GOP, but it's hard to win Presidential elections if you do so.

Kemp wasn't able to provide near the cover for Walker that it seems Fetterman received from Shapiro (I understand the margins were different). Ron Johnson is a little wacky but it looks like he will pull it out, Laxalt was a good candidate and looks like he will do the same. Perhaps we underestimated the importance of abortion on driving D turnout, frustrating because that is unlikely to ever be a federal issue issue in the near term.

I'm not optimistic about the GA run off, especially if Trump decides to announce in the next month. Very sad.

A lot of conflicting forces, I'm heartened by the fact that good GOP executive candidates seem to be able to lift their states, even Zeldin, was effective in flipping a few house seats. Dewine, Kemp and of course the God King Ron (who looked hilariously haggard at his Hurricane briefing this morning, perhaps he was up late partying) I suppose are the silver lining.

The one through line I see through all of it is "Trump" candidates seemed to meet or underperform expectations generally. I just hope Republicans keep that in mind.

 

[larsIU]

Like Charlie Brown and the football.

I'm a romantic

 

[hoot1]

Can't say it better than B.B. King

View embedded media

Marc Thiessen said this election is a searing indictment of the Republican Party. He might be right but I think the state of the GOP is a symptom of a larger problem in all of politics.

We have a large majority of people saying the country is on the wrong track, real wages are in the midst of the worst decline in decades, inflation is the highest in decades, energy (the currency of life) is in short supply and expensive, transportation is a mess, human relationships and the nuclear family are under stress and the stress is increasing, our general mental health is in decline, the use of prescription and non-prescription mind altering drugs is increasing, parts of great cities are like the third world, the boarder is in chaos, violent crime is becoming common in in certain locales, respect for law and the police at a low ebb . . . . . . .

and voters keep the status quo?

Thiessen is right in that the GOP put up some candidates that had no business running, (with the help of Democrats in several primaries!). However, many more quality GOP candidates bit the dust. Congress has approval ratings below used car salesmen, but nothing important will change.

All the problems facing the US and us don't seem to be determinative of elections. What is determinative? Trump!, abortion, Trump!, climate change, Trump!, health care, Trump!, energy, Trump! civil rights, Trump!, minimum wage. I'm old enough to remember when politics was about ideas and proposals, not about Trump, Mega MAGA, and vague dangers to democracy. Even on this board, mosts posts about ideas will sooner or later devolve into a discussion about Trump. (Somebody even posted about Trump in the Books and Movie thread!) A few solid and smart conservatives overly-focus on Trump. As I said a few days ago, I wish Trump would go away, and I don't give a shit about him, but that is not where the US is. Thiessen is right. I think the hand of Trump caused the GOP disaster and directed the voters toward keeping the county on the wrong track. But that is on the voters, not on Trump. The Trump effects are everywhere cuz of us, not cuz of him. This isn't for me.

The final verse of The Thrill is Gone:

You know I'm free, free now, baby
I'm free from your spell
I'm free, free, free now
I'm free from your spell
And now that it's all over
All I can do is wish you well​

CoH, Bill Maher addressed this as taken from your post... "Thiessen is right in that the GOP put up some candidates that had no business running",

Maher in his interview on the Fareed Zakaria show said many Republicans will tolerate politicians with personal flaws as long as they aren't woke Democrats. i am paraphrasing here, but think I captured Maher's thinking. Furthermore, he may be on to something here.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

I know I got tired of the commercials. We can't blame all that on the politicians given far and away most commercials I saw were PAC commercials. But they suck.

I was listening to a podcast today and he mentioned that back in the 2020 election his kid would watch YouTube videos. Before the videos would play, campaign ads would constantly play.

After the elections, she didn't see the ads anymore so she asked if "radical" Jon Ossoff had won. She legit thought his first name was radical because of all the ads having radical before his first name (she was 7 at the time he said and didn't know any better).

I thought of that story reading this.

 

[larsIU]

I was listening to a podcast today and he mentioned that back in the 2020 election his kid would watch YouTube videos. Before the videos would play, campaign ads would constantly play.

After the elections, she didn't see the ads anymore so she asked if "radical" Jon Ossoff had won. She legit thought his first name was radical because of all the ads having radical before his first name (she was 7 at the time he said and didn't know any better).

I thought of that story reading this.

All I know is I have not received a single text from anyone this morning other than my wife looking for her car keys, a regular occurrence. After reminding her to look in her purse, I also realized I heard no ads on the radio. Peaceful.

 

[mrhighlife]

Perhaps, and stay with me here, it's not as bad as the far left/far right make it out to be.

America, what a place.

This. The far right/left need to chill out. Democracy isn't dying. Their isn't going to be a civil war. No one in the middle has time for that shit.

Basically... "Lighten up Francis."

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Perhaps, and stay with me here, it's not as bad as the far left/far right make it out to be.

America, what a place.

Time for one of my favorite quotes:

John Milton:

“The mind is its own place, and in itself Can make a heav'n of hell, a hell of heav'n. What matter where, if I be still the same, And what I should be, all but less than he Whom thunder hath made greater?”

This is Satan trying to convince himself that he can make hell seem like heaven.

The important part is what goes on between our ears, not what is on in the outside or in America. Those who worry about Trump, politics, America, or posters that they can’t stand, need to understand this. None of those things can take you to hell or heaven.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Democracy isn't dying.

Well, campaigns and voting aren’t dying. But democracy is much more than that. Democracy at least means that those we entrust to represent us operate with full transparency and in open debate. We don’t do that. Democracy means basic honesty with important information. We don’t have that. The economic divide and inequalities are worsening and will worsen more as our education system is more dysfunctional for those who need it the most. Democracy doesn’t address that.

 

[Stuffshot]

The people need to demand more from politicians. We need to keep them hyper-focused on healthcare, inflation, infrastructure.......problems that effect all of us. The right needs to stfu about this woke boogeyman, and the left needs to stfu about trump........vote El Dorado '24

Just so you know -- he-who-must-not-be-named specifically campaigned in 2016 on the issues of healthcare and infrastructure, loudly proclaiming that he was the only one in the world who could fix things (and then did nothing about them).

 

[T.M.P.]

Can't say it better than B.B. King

He didn't write the song ...

 

[MyTeamIsOnTheFloor]

I'm not sure what lessons to draw from last night as a GOP voter. Some scattered thoughts....

First off, I am very disheartened with PA, Oz was far from a perfect candidate, I'm not sure what his message was it seemed scattered, and he faced major headwinds with the governors race. Still, I thought he would hold out. I'm close to writing PA off for the GOP, but it's hard to win Presidential elections if you do so.

Kemp wasn't able to provide near the cover for Walker that it seems Fetterman received from Shapiro (I understand the margins were different). Ron Johnson is a little wacky but it looks like he will pull it out, Laxalt was a good candidate and looks like he will do the same. Perhaps we underestimated the importance of abortion on driving D turnout, frustrating because that is unlikely to ever be a federal issue issue in the near term.

I'm not optimistic about the GA run off, especially if Trump decides to announce in the next month. Very sad.

A lot of conflicting forces, I'm heartened by the fact that good GOP executive candidates seem to be able to lift their states, even Zeldin, was effective in flipping a few house seats. Dewine, Kemp and of course the God King Ron (who looked hilariously haggard at his Hurricane briefing this morning, perhaps he was up late partying) I suppose are the silver lining.

The one through line I see through all of it is "Trump" candidates seemed to meet or underperform expectations generally. I just hope Republicans keep that in mind.

Too complicated

Trump's toxicity and SCOTUS's overturning Roe (anybody wonder NOW why it leaked early?) cost the GOP a rout in the House and a re-taking of the Senate

Dumb Dems will read it as "our message got through" and continue to call people fascists

The GOP will further divide between opposing accusations of "you are a RINO" - "Uh uh, YOU are a RINO" and the fight for/against Trump will again destroy the party's chances of being a party.

BUT the nation will enjoy two years of preventing Dumb Dem policies from hitting the House floor and maybe that fixes the economy.

 

[NPT]

"Thiessen is right in that the GOP put up some candidates that had no business running",

Yep... and my question is why? Surely both sides could come up with better candidates ... I think they've reached rock bottom and started digging.

 

[Harry Hondo]

BUT the nation will enjoy two years of preventing Dumb Dem policies from hitting the House floor and maybe that fixes the economy.

A lot of American’s aren’t buying that Biden is to blame for inflation, hence there was no red wave. Anyone can see that inflation right now is a worldwide problem and is mainly due to the post Covid hangover with major supply chain issues and high oil prices.

 

[twenty02]

Yep... and my question is why? Surely both sides could come up with better candidates ... I think they've reached rock bottom and started digging.

Blame our atrocious primary system that incentivizes the nuttiest of nutballs.

I don't know if the solution is in some of these other election models (blanket/ jungle primary, ranked choice, etc).... or what. But what we've got right now doesn't seem to be working well

 

[IUCrazy2]

Blame our atrocious primary system that incentivizes the nuttiest of nutballs.

I don't know if the solution is in some of these other election models (blanket/ jungle primary, ranked choice, etc).... or what. But what we've got right now doesn't seem to be working well

Repeal the 17th amendment....

 

[larsIU]

Repeal the 17th amendment....

Never gonna happen. We'd have 64 Republican Senators (or something close to that as last I checked Pubs controlled 32 statehouses).

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Let me know when you're out of that delusion.

The Trump phenomenon takes two sides, the phenomenonor and the phenomenonee.

As a whole, I think the country‘s emotional investment in POTUS and government is on an upward trend. I don’t think that is good. This is a result of several factors. Trump is not a an acceptable object if that investment for the vast majority of us.

 

[UncleMark]

Never gonna happen. We'd have 64 Republican Senators (or something close to that as last I checked Pubs controlled 32 statehouses).

That's what he wants.

 

[IUCrazy2]

That's what he wants.

Did not even enter my calculus. I think you would end up with more technocrat/bureaucrat insider politicians in the Senate and the House would be the populist body it was intended to be.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Never gonna happen. We'd have 64 Republican Senators (or something close to that as last I checked Pubs controlled 32 statehouses).

Not necessarily. Repeal of the 17th would increase democracy by increasing the importance of federalism and increasing the importance of state elections. Instead of the special interests buying 2 candidates from each state, they would have to buy hundreds. That is a good thing.

 

[larsIU]

That's what he wants.

I don't think that was his sole intention. But that would be the outcome today.

Did not even enter my calculus. I think you would end up with more technocrat/bureaucrat insider politicians in the Senate and the House would be the populist body it was intended to be.

I agree the candidates might be better b/c they (probably) wouldn't have to survive the primary season and vetting that goes on.

Not necessarily. Repeal of the 17th would increase democracy by increasing the importance of federalism and increasing the importance of state elections. Instead of the special interests buying 2 candidates from each state, they would have to buy hundreds. That is a good thing.

The little reading I did on the 17th seemed to show that it was put in place to curb some of the excesses of party bosses and state legislatures who were more than a little corrupt.

I don't think those two things have changed and might have gotten worse.

I do like the idea of Senators being chosen by legislatures in the abstract though I'm pretty certain there is no way in hell the 17th would ever be repealed.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Did not even enter my calculus. I think you would end up with more technocrat/bureaucrat insider politicians in the Senate and the House would be the populist body it was intended to be.

You think statehouses are bastions of reasoned thinking?

 

[stollcpa]

I think I just heard a Biden interview where he said he wouldn’t do anything different and country supports what he’s doing. SMH

 

[stollcpa]

I think I just heard a Biden interview where he said he wouldn’t do anything different and country supports what he’s doing. SMH

This is more accurate. He is brain dead just like Fetterman. Maybe they can hold up in the same basement the next two years.

Joe Biden said he'll do 'nothing' differently after the midterm elections because he's 'confident these policies are working': 'I'm not gonna change'

"The more they know about what we're doing, the more support there is," Biden said of voters during a nearly hour-long news conference.

news.yahoo.com

 

[snarlcakes]

I think I just heard a Biden interview where he said he wouldn’t do anything different and country supports what he’s doing. SMH

Why should he? They/he had a good night. Fetterman who is literally recovering from a stroke won easily and Democrats performed well overall. Obviously, the country isn’t that upset by him/them or they would vote them out of office. If I was Biden, I would be calling up Hunter and @mcmurtry66 to see if they wanted to party. Hunter could bring the good stuff.

 

[stollcpa]

Why should he? They/he had a good night. Fetterman who is literally recovering from a stroke won easily and Democrats performed well overall. Obviously, the country isn’t that upset by him/them or they would vote them out of office. If I was Biden, I would be calling up Hunter and @mcmurtry66 to see if they wanted to party. Hunter could bring the good stuff.

75% of those voters said the country was headed the wrong direction. I guess most are stupid. They voted for the same people who led us in the wrong direction.

 

[twenty02]

I think I just heard a Biden interview where he said he wouldn’t do anything different and country supports what he’s doing. SMH

Considering we literally just voted.... it seems that close to half the county agrees. Or at the minimum they agree more than the alternative

If you were him, why would you say anything differently?

 

[twenty02]

75% of those voters said the country was headed the wrong direction. I guess most are stupid. They voted for the same people who led us in the wrong direction.

Those numbers have been stagnant for a long while, including while Trump was in office. What direction those people want can be very different....a significant portion want the country to go in the opposite direction you want.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Considering we literally just voted.... it seems that close to half the county agrees. Or at the minimum they agree more than the alternative

If you were him, why would you say anything differently?

Amazing how many Repubs want to respond to this by denigrating Dem policy instead of asking where the GOP went wrong.