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So Now Biden

Home schooling is gaining historic levels already.
5-10% was not a static #, it was a point of discussion
What teachers that are NOT purple hair rainbow vacuum cleaners are getting the attention? ANYWHERE?
I've got 8 grand kids in school, I'm vested.
Listen I want the crap fized and I have a proposal. You are jaded as this has been your career and it's been ruined. Maybe you had a hand in it, I doubt it honestly, but what you've worked your life loving has become a sidewalk abortion. The numbers don't lie.
Yes I will also add more that 50% of the blame on the parents. They are not involved enough, but now when they are, they get put on a terrorist list for being involved in their own damn kids education THAT THEY PAY FOR. Doesn't that seem odd?
They get put on a terrorist list for threatening teachers, administrators and school boards. They get put on terrorist lists for throwing things at speakers and superintendents at school boards. Doesn’t that seem odd they would do that? Yes, you may have 8 grandchildren, but you know nothing of what goes on in schools.
 
Because I read what you post about schools and teachers. And once people’s kids are out of school, they don’t really go in one anymore. And you aren’t married to a teacher.
Oh. Well I guess you do know then.
I hope you have a great evening.
 
That's not true. They are paid a premium for teaching in inner-city schools.

Why do you continue with your charade?
IDK any teachers that are paid a premium in the inner cities. but u do not live in the inner cities so how would you know.Sir, u r wrong very wrong, They do not pay teachers enough for the responsibilities they have.
 
Sure Mitt Romney, Jeb Bush, Sherrod Brown, Tim Scott ( maybe, need to learn more about him) , Larry Hogan, Breshear….to name a few. I think Holcomb has done a good job in Indiana and voted for him.
not for black people but he is GOP and that is expected.
 
IDK any teachers that are paid a premium in the inner cities. but u do not live in the inner cities so how would you know.Sir, u r wrong very wrong, They do not pay teachers enough for the responsibilities they have.
I have a friend who teaches in Indianapolis Public Schools - IPS - because he can make more there than he can in the suburban schools.

You don't live in the inner city and you don't teach there. No one said they pay enough, but teachers do get paid more to work in inner city schools.
 
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I have a friend who teaches in Indianapolis Public Schools - IPS - because he can make more there than he can in the suburban schools.

You don't live in the inner city and you don't teach there. No one said they pay enough, but teachers do get paid more to work in inner city schools.
Just stop of you don't want it on your door step every day .
i-am-feeling-sick.jpg
 
Teachers are worse paid in the inner cities, where supplies are limited. They deserve a fair wage. They have a huge responsibility to mold the young minds of the future. WHY ARE you cheating them?
No, teachers generally receive less pay in rural areas.


That database is a little dated but I bet you would find that it still mostly holds true. The Lawrence school system and Warren Township schools cover mixed socio-economic areas in Indianapolis but they also overlap with areas where a large proportion of the murders in Marion County occur. Both have average teacher salaries that are among the top 20 in the state. Gary schools are in the Top 25.
 
Because I read what you post about schools and teachers. And once people’s kids are out of school, they don’t really go in one anymore. And you aren’t married to a teacher.
How many kids do you have in school? Are you married to a teacher? When was the last time you were in a classroom?

If we are going to decide who knows what they are talking about, I would think that would be pertinent info to know right? You probably won't answer and you don't have to but based on what you have posted here the answer to those questions is zero, no, and it's been awhile. So you are reacting to what you hear and basing your opinion on that and old experiences you had which may very well not be the case anymore. Same as Dan.
 
How many kids do you have in school? Are you married to a teacher? When was the last time you were in a classroom?

If we are going to decide who knows what they are talking about, I would think that would be pertinent info to know right? You probably won't answer and you don't have to but based on what you have posted here the answer to those questions is zero, no, and it's been awhile. So you are reacting to what you hear and basing your opinion on that and old experiences you had which may very well not be the case anymore. Same as Dan.
Except I'm not a troll.
 
Oh the old they knew what they were getting into trope. No, actually the environment they are in right now, they did NOT know what they were getting into. You’re going to see record numbers of teachers’ openings this year.
My best friend is a history teacher, and his wife a grade school principal in Clarksville, Tennessee. They do very well. They are also Republicans so you would hate them.
 
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Oh the old they knew what they were getting into trope. No, actually the environment they are in right now, they did NOT know what they were getting into. You’re going to see record numbers of teachers’ openings this year.
It's not a trope dumbass. The only ones who don't know what they are in for aren't paying attention.
 
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I have a friend who teaches in Indianapolis Public Schools - IPS - because he can make more there than he can in the suburban schools.

You don't live in the inner city and you don't teach there. No one said they pay enough, but teachers do get paid more to work in inner city schools.

Dallas public schools pay much more than the private schools in the city. Younger teachers often opt for the public schools, until they have kids, at which point a transition to the lower paying private schools makes sense when given tuition discounts.

Have had several friends/coworkers wives follow that route.
 
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IDK any teachers that are paid a premium in the inner cities. but u do not live in the inner cities so how would you know.Sir, u r wrong very wrong, They do not pay teachers enough for the responsibilities they have.
What?!?!?! You aren’t aware of the fantastic salaries teachers are making? JFC, the only reason people go into teaching is for the money. Every rich neighborhood I’ve ever seen is loaded with pretty much just doctors and teachers.
 
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What?!?!?! You aren’t aware of the fantastic salaries teachers are making? JFC, the only reason people go into teaching is for the money. Every rich neighborhood I’ve ever seen is loaded with pretty much just doctors and teachers.
There are a ton of teachers living in my community and I'm in a middle to upper middle class area.

The average salary in Indiana is $48,253 and the average teacher salary in Indiana is $54,126.
 
There are a ton of teachers living in my community and I'm in a middle to upper middle class area.

The average salary in Indiana is $48,253 and the average teacher salary in Indiana is $54,126.
54k is not a great salary, especially considering the hours outside of work. Also, I’m genuinely curious, is that average only including primary and secondary ed teachers? I’m wondering what the differences are between elementary and high school pay.

I did find this…

“As of Jul 13, 2023, the average hourly pay for a Public School Teacher in Indiana is $20.03 an hour. While ZipRecruiter is seeing salaries as high as $37.22 and as low as $8.32, the majority of Public School Teacher salaries currently range between $15.72 (25th percentile) to $24.52 (75th percentile) in Indiana.”

I can take you to plenty of plants, mills & factories within 30-40 miles of where I’m originally from where you can make a lot more than that. No college education and years of study required. You don’t get accused of being overpaid. You don’t get accused of brainwashing children. You don’t have people threatening you at meetings.

A buddy of mine, couple of years older, went to work for Ford right out of high school. He retired when he was 49 with a full pension/benefits/medical coverage for life. He got in when they still had pensions before switching to all the 401k stuff.
 
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There are a ton of teachers living in my community and I'm in a middle to upper middle class area.

The average salary in Indiana is $48,253 and the average teacher salary in Indiana is $54,126.

How Chicago teacher pay compares​

Mayor Lori Lightfoot says the offer on the table would make Chicago Public Schools teachers among the highest-paid in the country. So how do CPS salaries stack up against large school systems around the country and Illinois?
Local National

Starting salaries for teachers at Illinois school districts, 2018-19​

Includes pay and pension contributions for all Illinois districts with more than 12,000 students.​

DistrictStarting salary with bachelor'sStarting salary with master'sHighest possible salary
CPS$56,665$60,590$108,242
Palatine HS 211$53,851$59,237$131,221
Naperville Unit 203$48,149$54,144$118,413
Algonquin Unit 300$46,623$51,398$111,995
Aurora East 131*$45,820$51,539$117,106
Indian Prairie Unit 204 (Aurora)$44,770$54,328$110,931
Wheaton Unit 200$44,744$54,264$95,115
Valley View 365 (Romeoville)$44,220$49,780$104,115
St. Charles Unit 303$43,753$49,436$97,860
Plainfield Unit 202$43,215$47,222$108,641
Elgin Unit 46$42,805$50,510$104,555
Aurora West Unit 129$42,802$49,015$110,314
Schaumburg Elementary 54$42,320$46,976$107,493
Oswego Unit 308$40,800$44,616$109,600
Palatine Elementary 15$39,944$44,037$89,130
Waukegan Unit 60$39,890$42,113$121,488
Springfield Unit 186$39,416$45,402$83,033
Rockford Unit 205$38,212$44,171$89,874
McLean County Unit 5$37,832$42,372$86,258
Peoria Unit 150$37,718$40,735$84,489
*District's figures do not include pension contributions.
Source: Illinois State Board of Education
Created by the Chicago Tribune dataviz team. On Twitter @ChiTribGraphics
 
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54k is not a great salary, especially considering the hours outside of work. Also, I’m genuinely curious, is that average only including primary and secondary ed teachers? I’m wondering what the differences are between elementary and high school pay.

I did find this…

“As of Jul 13, 2023, the average hourly pay for a Public School Teacher in Indiana is $20.03 an hour. While ZipRecruiter is seeing salaries as high as $37.22 and as low as $8.32, the majority of Public School Teacher salaries currently range between $15.72 (25th percentile) to $24.52 (75th percentile) in Indiana.”

I can take you to plenty of plants, mills & factories within 30-40 miles of where I’m originally from where you can make a lot more than that. No college education and years of study required. You don’t get accused of being overpaid. You don’t get accused of brainwashing children. You don’t have people threatening you at meetings.

A buddy of mine, couple of years older, went to work for Ford right out of high school. He retired when he was 49 with a full pension/benefits/medical coverage for life. He got in when they still had pensions before switching to all the 401k stuff.
i don't think the salaries on ziprecruiter and indeed and all those online things are accurate. as for your ford comment i had friends who went to chrysler straight from high school. they'd work shifts and holidays etc and made a fortune. they got whacked when chyrsler left and have struggled since but the car manufacturers provided a hell of a good life for people. plus no lost earnings of college years. no college years expenses etc
 
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What?!?!?! You aren’t aware of the fantastic salaries teachers are making? JFC, the only reason people go into teaching is for the money. Every rich neighborhood I’ve ever seen is loaded with pretty much just doctors and teachers.
You said rich neighborhood,s not inner cities.
 

How Chicago teacher pay compares​

Mayor Lori Lightfoot says the offer on the table would make Chicago Public Schools teachers among the highest-paid in the country. So how do CPS salaries stack up against large school systems around the country and Illinois?
Local National

Starting salaries for teachers at Illinois school districts, 2018-19​

Includes pay and pension contributions for all Illinois districts with more than 12,000 students.​

DistrictStarting salary with bachelor'sStarting salary with master'sHighest possible salary
CPS$56,665$60,590$108,242
Palatine HS 211$53,851$59,237$131,221
Naperville Unit 203$48,149$54,144$118,413
Algonquin Unit 300$46,623$51,398$111,995
Aurora East 131*$45,820$51,539$117,106
Indian Prairie Unit 204 (Aurora)$44,770$54,328$110,931
Wheaton Unit 200$44,744$54,264$95,115
Valley View 365 (Romeoville)$44,220$49,780$104,115
St. Charles Unit 303$43,753$49,436$97,860
Plainfield Unit 202$43,215$47,222$108,641
Elgin Unit 46$42,805$50,510$104,555
Aurora West Unit 129$42,802$49,015$110,314
Schaumburg Elementary 54$42,320$46,976$107,493
Oswego Unit 308$40,800$44,616$109,600
Palatine Elementary 15$39,944$44,037$89,130
Waukegan Unit 60$39,890$42,113$121,488
Springfield Unit 186$39,416$45,402$83,033
Rockford Unit 205$38,212$44,171$89,874
McLean County Unit 5$37,832$42,372$86,258
Peoria Unit 150$37,718$40,735$84,489
*District's figures do not include pension contributions.
Source: Illinois State Board of Education
Created by the Chicago Tribune dataviz team. On Twitter @ChiTribGraphics
Those are not great salaries. LOOK at TEACHERS IN Gary where they are closing public schools. 2 of the schools I went to are closed and condemned.
 
There are a ton of teachers living in my community and I'm in a middle to upper middle class area.

The average salary in Indiana is $48,253 and the average teacher salary in Indiana is $54,126.
Gary IN is closing public schools.2 of the public schools I went to are closed and condemned.
 
I have a friend who teaches in Indianapolis Public Schools - IPS - because he can make more there than he can in the suburban schools.

You don't live in the inner city and you don't teach there. No one said they pay enough, but teachers do get paid more to work in inner city schools.
no they do not 60k is not enough for all that teachers do.
 
no they do not 60k is not enough for all that teachers do.

My mother taught for 35+ years in Indiana. My wife taught for 3 in inner-city schools (Houston then Chicago). I'm well aware of how much teachers work outside of school. It's not as much as they complain about.

https://nces.ed.gov/programs/statereform/tab5_14.asp

Most school days are 7 hours long (approx. 8-3). Let's assume teachers are working that entire time (they aren't): that's 1,260 hours a year spent doing their job. Compare that to someone who works 9-5 throughout the year, with a month total of time off (VERY generous). That comes out to 1920 hours a year. Compare that to an entry level lawyer at a medium to small sized firm, who might make about 60-70k, but has to BILL 2,000 hours a year (lawyers cannot and do not bill close to all the time they spend working). And I haven't even brought in the benefit package a teacher gets (in Illinois, an amazing pension, great health care).

So, on average, I think it is hard to say teachers are over-worked and underpaid, especially given the actual results they are achieving.
 
Those are not great salaries. LOOK at TEACHERS IN Gary where they are closing public schools. 2 of the schools I went to are closed and condemned.
Why are they closed and condemned?

population-graph

That is a population graph for Gary. They aren't going to keep schools open if there aren't kids to fill them. Gary's population size has fallen off a cliff. It was 116,000 in 1990 and is now less than 70,000.
 
How many kids do you have in school? Are you married to a teacher? When was the last time you were in a classroom?

If we are going to decide who knows what they are talking about, I would think that would be pertinent info to know right? You probably won't answer and you don't have to but based on what you have posted here the answer to those questions is zero, no, and it's been awhile. So you are reacting to what you hear and basing your opinion on that and old experiences you had which may very well not be the case anymore. Same as Dan.
Well, you might think that, but you’d be very wrong, Last time I was in a classroom was yesterday. Helping my friend set up for her kids coming back next week. She teaches in IPS. I’ll be back in Pike to volunteer, like I do every year. I have friends who are teachers, principals, and two superintendents in neighboring districts. I’ve given a few seminars and still tutor some. So you’d be pretty wrong about that.
 
My mother taught for 35+ years in Indiana. My wife taught for 3 in inner-city schools (Houston then Chicago). I'm well aware of how much teachers work outside of school. It's not as much as they complain about.

https://nces.ed.gov/programs/statereform/tab5_14.asp

Most school days are 7 hours long (approx. 8-3). Let's assume teachers are working that entire time (they aren't): that's 1,260 hours a year spent doing their job. Compare that to someone who works 9-5 throughout the year, with a month total of time off (VERY generous). That comes out to 1920 hours a year. Compare that to an entry level lawyer at a medium to small sized firm, who might make about 60-70k, but has to BILL 2,000 hours a year (lawyers cannot and do not bill close to all the time they spend working). And I haven't even brought in the benefit package a teacher gets (in Illinois, an amazing pension, great health care).

So, on average, I think it is hard to say teachers are over-worked and underpaid, especially given the actual results they are achieving.
What are they doing if they aren’t working 8-3? Yes, they get 30 minutes for lunch but many have to work through that lunch. While the children may be at school only 8-3: I don’t know any schools where the teacher didn’t have to be there before and after schools. There are multiple meetings , IEP cases, performances, family nights, etc where teachers are expected to attend. How do you know that teachers don’t work as much as they ”complain” about? Maybe your two examples didn’t work much at home. My school was filled with cars on the weekend. I don’t know how you can teach, grade, record, answer phone calls and e-mails, fit in your meetings, and plan, without spending at the very least 10 hours a week. How do you measure those results? I know multiple college graduates who start out over $100;000. In Indiana a teacher would never reach that. Illinois does have a very generous benefits program, which I couldn’t believe when I heard about it. Most states are not close to that package.
Addendum: There probably are certain type of teachers that don’t have to work from home extra. Some middle and high school teachers do the same instruction multiple times a day, but their grading is probably more strenuous. Also not mentioned is the amount of their own money teachers spend every year on their classroom.
 
There are a ton of teachers living in my community and I'm in a middle to upper middle class area.

The average salary in Indiana is $48,253 and the average teacher salary in Indiana is $54,126.
That’s supposed to be a good salary? Lol. That’s pitiful. Wonder why there aren’t any men in education? Trying to support a family on $54,000 is laughable.
 
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54k is not a great salary, especially considering the hours outside of work. Also, I’m genuinely curious, is that average only including primary and secondary ed teachers? I’m wondering what the differences are between elementary and high school pay.

I did find this…

“As of Jul 13, 2023, the average hourly pay for a Public School Teacher in Indiana is $20.03 an hour. While ZipRecruiter is seeing salaries as high as $37.22 and as low as $8.32, the majority of Public School Teacher salaries currently range between $15.72 (25th percentile) to $24.52 (75th percentile) in Indiana.”

I can take you to plenty of plants, mills & factories within 30-40 miles of where I’m originally from where you can make a lot more than that. No college education and years of study required. You don’t get accused of being overpaid. You don’t get accused of brainwashing children. You don’t have people threatening you at meetings.

A buddy of mine, couple of years older, went to work for Ford right out of high school. He retired when he was 49 with a full pension/benefits/medical coverage for life. He got in when they still had pensions before switching to all the 401k stuff.
Unless you are in a private school, the district pays teachers at different levels the same, elementary, middle, or high school.
 
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https://www.forbes.com/advisor/student-loans/average-salary-college-graduates/. This is an interesting article and chart. So, as someone above said, teachers know what they are getting into salary wise, how do you expect to attract good teachers now, with a low salary and the current environment? And when you get them, how do you keep them? Teachers are leaving the profession in record numbers, 35% of teachers say the plan to quit in the next two years.
 
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That’s supposed to be a good salary? Lol. That’s pitiful. Wonder why there aren’t any men in education? Trying to support a family on $54,000 is laughable.
How is 54K pitiful?

So what should teachers be making? Noone ever answers with a dollar amount.
 
What are they doing if they aren’t working 8-3? Yes, they get 30 minutes for lunch but many have to work through that lunch. While the children may be at school only 8-3: I don’t know any schools where the teacher didn’t have to be there before and after schools. There are multiple meetings , IEP cases, performances, family nights, etc where teachers are expected to attend. How do you know that teachers don’t work as much as they ”complain” about? Maybe your two examples didn’t work much at home. My school was filled with cars on the weekend. I don’t know how you can teach, grade, record, answer phone calls and e-mails, fit in your meetings, and plan, without spending at the very least 10 hours a week. How do you measure those results? I know multiple college graduates who start out over $100;000. In Indiana a teacher would never reach that. Illinois does have a very generous benefits program, which I couldn’t believe when I heard about it. Most states are not close to that package.
Addendum: There probably are certain type of teachers that don’t have to work from home extra. Some middle and high school teachers do the same instruction multiple times a day, but their grading is probably more strenuous. Also not mentioned is the amount of their own money teachers spend every year on their classroom.
Not all degrees are worth the same, Zeke. People getting over $100,000 out of college must be some pretty advanced, smart, accomplished people. Or they have skills that only a tiny fraction of people do. They are also going to work way more than a teacher. Want to add an extra hour on a day for before and after school? OK. That brings it up to 1440 hrs a year., still nearly 500 hours fewer than a normal 9 to 5er, even with generous vacation time. These are facts and that is how labor markets work.

You're exaggerating the number of teachers working on the weekend. Maybe it happened once or twice a year. It's easily provable though. When you come up here to visit, stay over a Friday night (I'll buy the margaritas!) and we'll drive around to ten schools of whatever age group you want and see how many teachers are in the schools working. I'll set the over/under on 10% of the teachers for any given school, and I'll take the under.

As for your other factors, every job has those. You don't think every job comes with the requirement that you be there a little before and after your real work schedule? That there aren't endless tasks technically not job related that they have to do? That answering the phone, emails, etc. doesn't go on all day and night for some? That they aren't spending their own money on their jobs?
 
That’s supposed to be a good salary? Lol. That’s pitiful. Wonder why there aren’t any men in education? Trying to support a family on $54,000 is laughable.
A first year, 21-22 year old making $54,000 is pitiful? That's more than about half the workers in Indiana make, while working much, much less. With a summer job at $20/hr., 40 hours a week (gasp! The humanity!) that $54,000 could be over $60K. Many small-firm, first-year lawyers don't make that much, while working far, far more and being far, far more in debt after going to school for longer.


"The report found the median annual salary in Indiana is $55,500. That's just below the national average of $57,600."
 
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