President Trump's Executive Actions (orders, proclamations, etc.)

[twenty02]

I understand why you're saying that. You know that I'm well aware that the source of the fiscal bleeding is entitlement growth.

But, ultimately, I disagree with your criticisms of this. Because (a) we can't let the perfect be the enemy of the good...general government could use a haircut, too, and (b) anything will help.

This effort isn't nearly enough. But it's not nothing.

And, to his credit, Musk is saying things I agree 100% with. Like this...

View embedded media

I 1000% disagree. There are short windows for these types of things. And limited political capital. Picking the battles is the biggest choice, and they've picked badly... Horribly.

Here's what will happen. DOGE will run it's course doing more damage than good in the actual operation of govt... While having an irrelevant impact on the fiscal situation. Musk will move on, the entire topic topic will run out of steam and surely be overcome by some next crisis in the world. Attention won't return to this for another serval years, at least... Then the decisions will be even more difficult.


It's a complete swing and miss. It was a farce from the beginning, and becoming more obvious by the day.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

I 1000% disagree. There are short windows for these types of things. And limited political capital. Picking the battles is the biggest choice, and they've picked badly... Horribly.

Here's what will happen. DOGE will run it's course doing more damage than good in the actual operation of govt... While having an irrelevant impact on the fiscal situation. Musk will move on, the entire topic topic will run out of steam and surely be overcome by some next crisis in the world. Attention won't return to this for another serval years, at least... Then the decisions will be even more difficult.


It's a complete swing and miss. It was a farce from the beginning, and becoming more obvious by the day.

Sounds like partisan wish-casting. You don’t actually want DOGE to fail do you?

 

[twenty02]

Sounds like partisan wish-casting. You don’t actually want DOGE to fail do you?

DOGE has already failed by picking the entirely wrong battle.

Why isn't Musk rage tweeting all day about entitlement spending? Instead of stupid ass fights about 5 bullet points in an email to gov workers? It's fake. Total theater and only an idiot would buy into it. But this country is full of them.

 

[mcmurtry66]

I 1000% disagree. There are short windows for these types of things. And limited political capital. Picking the battles is the biggest choice, and they've picked badly... Horribly.

Here's what will happen. DOGE will run it's course doing more damage than good in the actual operation of govt... While having an irrelevant impact on the fiscal situation. Musk will move on, the entire topic topic will run out of steam and surely be overcome by some next crisis in the world. Attention won't return to this for another serval years, at least... Then the decisions will be even more difficult.


It's a complete swing and miss. It was a farce from the beginning, and becoming more obvious by the day.

Sounds like partisan wish-casting. You don’t actually want DOGE to fail do you?

DOGE has already failed by picking the entirely wrong battle

the war isn't over. this isn't their only battles. it's their initial shots

i'm with crazed but also agree with twenty in a bigger picture sort of way. i love what musk is doing. even tho it's being done in a ham-fisted way i love it. and i agree with crazed that but for musk this would not be getting done. but we don't need to get into the minutiae of where cuts are being made and what's next and is it making a difference bc as twenty said it won't last. the inherent flaw with all of htis posturing is that it lacks support from half the country. any short term efforts will later be rescinded, revoked, and revised bc again there isn't universal or even majority support. it's essentially 50/50. half the country wants bigger gov. wants programs. wants entitlements. wants the opposite of what musk is doing. and progressives, whatever vocal percentage they are today, not only are against what's happening are vehemently ideologically against it. they don't want the status quo they want expansion of the state. so again while i love this in the longer term it's an exercise in futility

 

[twenty02]

the war isn't over. this isn't their only battles. it's their initial shots

i'm with crazed but also agree with twenty in a bigger picture sort of way. i love what musk is doing. even tho it's being done in a ham-fisted way i love it. and i agree with crazed that but for musk this would not be getting done. but we don't need to get into the minutiae of where cuts are being made and what's next and is it making a difference bc as twenty said it won't last. the inherent flaw with all of htis posturing is that it lacks support from half the country. any short term efforts will later be rescinded, revoked, and revised bc again there isn't universal or even majority support. it's essentially 50/50. half the country wants bigger gov. wants programs. wants entitlements. wants the opposite of what musk is doing. and progressives, whatever vocal percentage they are today, not only are against what's happening are vehemently ideologically against it. they don't want the status quo they want expansion of the state. so again while i love this in the longer term it's an exercise in futility

Bingo. You need LEADERSHIP.

You need a President that takes a major reform issue and goes out and hammers it all day ever day. Trump does this but it's with immigration. Not this stuff. He doesn't care about this stuff and even worse is actually fundamentally opposed to the idea of reforming these areas.

 

[BCCHoosier]

the war isn't over. this isn't their only battles. it's their initial shots

i'm with crazed but also agree with twenty in a bigger picture sort of way. i love what musk is doing. even tho it's being done in a ham-fisted way i love it. and i agree with crazed that but for musk this would not be getting done. but we don't need to get into the minutiae of where cuts are being made and what's next and is it making a difference bc as twenty said it won't last. the inherent flaw with all of htis posturing is that it lacks support from half the country. any short term efforts will later be rescinded, revoked, and revised bc again there isn't universal or even majority support. it's essentially 50/50. half the country wants bigger gov. wants programs. wants entitlements. wants the opposite of what musk is doing. and progressives, whatever vocal percentage they are today, not only are against what's happening are vehemently ideologically against it. they don't want the status quo they want expansion of the state. so again while i love this in the longer term it's an exercise in futility

All this chaos will continue to fuel fear and consumer negativity. Even if you feel your private job is safe, seeing your neighbor lose their job or even the constant news about it has a psychological impact.

Combine this with all the tariff talk and businesses don't know what to think.

Maybe their goal is to tank the economy so interest rates have to be cut. If so, he's evil genius and on the right track.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Why isn't Musk rage tweeting all day about entitlement spending?

Because Trump has maintained since 2015 that he isn't going to touch entitlements.

I don't like that he's made that pledge. But he has made it, repeatedly. And, frankly, he probably doesn't get elected either time if he doesn't make the pledge. And that's because what's stopping it from happening isn't Trump or Musk or Biden or Obama or Johnson or Thune or Pelosi, etal...

What's stopping it is us.

We not only want unicorns, we demand them. And we'll send anybody who doesn't tell us they'll give us the unicorn straight to the political guillotine. That unicorns don't actually exist is of little concern to most voters. We want the benefits, we don't want the costs. Find another way to pay for them.

Since as far back as Hellenistic Greece and the Roman Republic, politics has always been the art of the possible. And what you (and I) want to see happen is simply beyond the Overton Window.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

I have zero knowledge about the cost comparison between federal employees and contractors. But I will say that the piece you linked claims that contractors are more expensive.

Contractors cost between two and three times as much as federal employees to do the same work, POGO found.​

I always take these kinds of "findings" with a huge grain of salt. Because so many of these sorts of studies are done with an agenda behind them. As such, they typically start with a desired conclusion and are then supported by whatever data they can find which serves it. I'm sure the people with interest in contractors would claim the opposite, and would have their own data to demonstrate that.

So I'm not saying this is correct -- just that it was claimed.



Yeah, I know a DOD guy who is sweating his job right now, too.

But, honestly, would they be any more sanguine about it if job cuts were happening the way Clinton did them? At the end of the day, isn't it more about the job itself than what method is used to eliminate it?

They are more expensive overall in the present, but far less expensive in the long-term. I've seen government studies about contractors that ignore the benefits savings (present and long-term) because the agenda is to have federal civilian workers rather than contractors.

Actually, I think most would be fine with a Clinton style analysis and reduction of the workforce. It's orderly and far less stressful on them. It also avoids mission failures. I'm 100 percent certain we'll see several mission failures due to what DOGE is doing. We've seen some relatively minor ones now with the NPS, nuclear energy safety (hope it stays minor), FDA food safety is probably coming.

It makes sense to periodically take a good look at agencies and departments to see if they are properly and efficiently manned to execute their missions. This happens in the military. I've been through these manning studies and have seen manning reduced (most usual outcome), but in some cases seen it increased because ships aren't properly manned to properly support some of the systems that come along with modernizations. In fact, a manning assessment usually accompanies the modernizations. That's the right way to do it, but that doesn't always happen.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Bingo. You need LEADERSHIP.

You need a President that takes a major reform issue and goes out and hammers it all day ever day. Trump does this but it's with immigration. Not this stuff. He doesn't care about this stuff and even worse is actually fundamentally opposed to the idea of reforming these areas.

I'll tell you what would probably be required if this is ever to happen.

We'd need to elect an Independent President who doesn't mind being a political martyr -- who, in fact, seeks to be a political martyr.

It would have to be an independent, because neither party is going to want this president associated with them. Odds are long on this, though.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

Because Trump has maintained since 2015 that he isn't going to touch entitlements.

I don't like that he's made that pledge. But he has made it, repeatedly. And, frankly, he probably doesn't get elected either time if he doesn't make the pledge. And that's because what's stopping it from happening isn't Trump or Musk or Biden or Obama or Johnson or Thune or Pelosi, etal...

What's stopping it is us.

We not only want unicorns, we demand them. And we'll send anybody who doesn't tell us they'll give us the unicorn straight to the political guillotine. That unicorns don't actually exist is of little concern to most voters. We want the benefits, we don't want the costs. Find another way to pay for them.

Since as far back as Hellenistic Greece and the Roman Republic, politics has always been the art of the possible. And what you (and I) want to see happen is simply beyond the Overton Window.

In my dreams Trump passes entitlement reform on his way out the door, to seal his administration in the record books as the GOAT.

 

[twenty02]

They are more expensive overall in the present, but far less expensive in the long-term. I've seen government studies about contractors that ignore the benefits savings (present and long-term) because the agenda is to have federal civilian workers rather than contractors.

Actually, I think most would be fine with a Clinton style analysis and reduction of the workforce. It's orderly and far less stressful on them. It makes sense to periodically take a good look at agencies and departments to see if they are properly and efficiently manned to execute their missions. This happens in the military. I've been through these manning studies and have seen manning reduced (most usual outcome), but in some cases seen it increased because ships aren't properly manned to properly support some of the systems that come along with modernizations. In fact, a manning assessment usually accompanies the modernizations. That's the right way to do it, but that doesn't always happen.

Lot easier to pivot missions with contractors. Or get rid of underperformers at both the contract and individual employee level

 

[Baller23Boogie]

Sounds like the definition of low information voter.
They should start bugging the shit out of their Congressional leadership.

They do that, they'll be labeled as bad actor dems.

It's already the rallying call.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

Lot easier to pivot missions with contractors. Or get rid of underperformers at both the contract and individual employee level

Another benefit of contractors is if they're not doing what they're paid to do you can have them replaced quickly by the contractor's company. Far more quickly than a federal civilian worker.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

They do that, they'll be labeled as bad actor dems.

It's already the rallying call.

Well the one making headlines in Roswell, Georgia was indeed bad actor Dems. Not sure about the others. Don’t be dismissive when you’re wrong.

 

[twenty02]

Because Trump has maintained since 2015 that he isn't going to touch entitlements.

I don't like that he's made that pledge. But he has made it, repeatedly. And, frankly, he probably doesn't get elected either time if he doesn't make the pledge. And that's because what's stopping it from happening isn't Trump or Musk or Biden or Obama or Johnson or Thune or Pelosi, etal...

What's stopping it is us.

We not only want unicorns, we demand them. And we'll send anybody who doesn't tell us they'll give us the unicorn straight to the political guillotine. That unicorns don't actually exist is of little concern to most voters. We want the benefits, we don't want the costs. Find another way to pay for them.

Since as far back as Hellenistic Greece and the Roman Republic, politics has always been the art of the possible. And what you (and I) want to see happen is simply beyond the Overton Window.

Well you could drive an aircraft carrier between what Trump says and actually does. He didn't know anything about P2025 either but all the people who wrote it are now in his govt and executing it.

 

[IUINSB]

You want debt reduction? Lift the cap on individuals contributions to SS. Found cheating, huge fines.
Want to reduce fraud? Go after the healthy a$$holes claiming SS and VA disabilities and those that aid and abet.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Here's something that will brighten everybody's day about our fiscal reality.

This is from a 2023 report put together by Janet Yellen -- The Financial Report of The United States Government (Link).

Apparently, it made a lot of waves in the Beltway -- among pols, staffers, lobbyists, thinktanks, etc. But everybody is kind of avoiding talking about it (and the chart below shows why). There's a whole lot of heavy wonky stuff in here. I've perused through some parts of it.

But the biggest takeaway from it is Yellen's estimation of the Present Values of Costs Less Revenues through the "infinite" (75 year) horizon of Social Security and Medicare. And, boy howdy, is it an eye-opener.

These two programs combined are $175 Trillion underfunded over the course of the next 75 years.

 

[snarlcakes]

. I predict a big loss for the Republicans in the mid-terms.

Define big loss?

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Well you could drive an aircraft carrier between what Trump says and actually does. He didn't know anything about P2025 either but all the people who wrote it are now in his govt and executing it.

Well, he's been POTUS for 4 years and 1 month now -- and there's been no indication to this point of any notion of breaking that pledge. And if it was going to happen, it would have to be happening now -- because he's almost certain to have a Democratic House (if not Senate) in his final 2 years.

Some things he says I get the sense that he actually does mean. The border is one of them. And this is another.

He also followed through on his judges pledge in the first term -- which was pretty much the only reason I voted for him.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

Define big loss?

Losing the House and Senate.

 

[snarlcakes]

Losing the House and Senate.

That is bold. The most likely outcome is they lose House and continue to control the Senate. I’d take they maintain controlling both House and Senate, before losing both.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

That is bold. The most likely outcome is they lose House and continue to control the Senate. I’d take they maintain controlling both House and Senate, before losing both.

Roger. Lot of time left. We'll see.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

That is bold. The most likely outcome is they lose House and continue to control the Senate. I’d take they maintain controlling both House and Senate, before losing both.

Not a snowballs chance in Georgia Republicans lose the senate.

Speaking of Georgia, that’s one guaranteed Republican flip right there.

Democrats playing defense in Michigan, Virginia and Minnesota as well.

Odds are better that Republicans increase their senate margin than lose control.

 

[IUCrazy2]

I understand why you're saying that. You know that I'm well aware that the source of the fiscal bleeding is entitlement growth.

But, ultimately, I disagree with your criticisms of this. Because (a) we can't let the perfect be the enemy of the good...general government could use a haircut, too, and (b) anything will help.

This effort isn't nearly enough. But it's not nothing.

And, to his credit, Musk is saying things I agree 100% with. Like this...

View embedded media

You are cutting things that government should legitimately be involved in because entitlement spending can't be touched and saying that is a-okay because cuts are cuts. It is like having gangrene in a toe on your left foot and a huge infection in your right leg. Both need dealt with but the leg thing seems more scary so you tell the doctor to cut off your foot. Yeah you just needed the toe cut but that gets rid of some of the infection and some is better than none right? I mean the infection in the right leg is still gonna kill you anyway, but hey, you did something.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

You are cutting things that government should legitimately be involved in because entitlement spending can't be touched and saying that is a-okay because cuts are cuts. It is like having gangrene in a toe on your left foot and a huge infection in your right leg. Both need dealt with but the leg thing seems more scary so you tell the doctor to cut off your foot. Yeah you just needed the toe cut but that gets rid of some of the infection and some is better than none right? I mean the infection in the right leg is still gonna kill you anyway, but hey, you did something.

You're assuming this. Really, we don't presently have a great idea what the end result of DOGE is going to look like. It might not end up looking like much at all, frankly. And we also don't know how and what Congress is going to end up doing. It's all very unclear -- which may be intentional or may just be sloppiness.

Yes, I heard about the Ebola thing and other items that have been, but shouldn't have been, impacted. And, yes, that's an indictment of the ham-fisted way they're going about all this.


I'll just keep repeating: I would much, much rather be seeing a serious bipartisan effort involving Congress and the administration to slay the fiscal dragon -- or at least rough it up a little bit.

But I do not think that would be happening...if only Trump and Musk weren't doing what they were doing. I think what they're doing is the only possible thing at this point that could be done.

Congress is tied up in knots with a Mexican standoff....and all they really seem interested in doing is slitting each others' throats -- because they both know we're at a fork in the road of our nation's history.

 

[twenty02]

You're assuming this. Really, we don't presently have a great idea what the end result of DOGE is going to look like. It might not end up looking like much at all, frankly. And we also don't know how and what Congress is going to end up doing. It's all very unclear -- which may be intentional or may just be sloppiness.

Yes, I heard about the Ebola thing and other items that have been, but shouldn't have been, impacted. And, yes, that's an indictment of the ham-fisted way they're going about all this.


I'll just keep repeating: I would much, much rather be seeing a serious bipartisan effort involving Congress and the administration to slay the fiscal dragon -- or at least rough it up a little bit.

But I do not think that would be happening...if only Trump and Musk weren't doing what they were doing. I think what they're doing is the only possible thing at this point that could be done.

Congress is tied up in knots with a Mexican standoff....and all they really seem interested in doing is slitting each others' throats -- because they both know we're at a fork in the road of our nation's history.

More brilliant DOGE actions...

Trump’s border crackdown faces hurdles as immigration judges are terminated

Trump’s border crackdown faces hurdles as immigration judges are terminated. Scripps News spoke with one of those terminated officials.

www.wrtv.com

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

More brilliant DOGE actions...

Trump’s border crackdown faces hurdles as immigration judges are terminated

Trump’s border crackdown faces hurdles as immigration judges are terminated. Scripps News spoke with one of those terminated officials.

www.wrtv.com

Once they’re in front of an immigration judge, the battle is already lost.

Approval rate hovers between 30 and 50 percent. Presumably much higher with judges appointed by Garland.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Once they’re in front of an immigration judge, the battle is already lost.

Approval rate hovers between 30 and 50 percent. Presumably much higher with judges appointed by Garland.

Well, the point he's making here is that we're already short on immigration judges. And we are short on them -- that was one of the things that Lankford etal were wanting to expand in the dumb "we'll let 5000 a day cross" bill they put out.

The backlog for asylum and refugees is massive -- especially because they exploded after Biden took office and did away with all of the Trump 1.0 policies. The courts are adjudicating something like 5-10% of the applications annually.

 

[Spartans9312]

You are cutting things that government should legitimately be involved in because entitlement spending can't be touched and saying that is a-okay because cuts are cuts. It is like having gangrene in a toe on your left foot and a huge infection in your right leg. Both need dealt with but the leg thing seems more scary so you tell the doctor to cut off your foot. Yeah you just needed the toe cut but that gets rid of some of the infection and some is better than none right? I mean the infection in the right leg is still gonna kill you anyway, but hey, you did something.

The infection probably started in the toe

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

Well, the point he's making here is that we're already short on immigration judges. And we are short on them -- that was one of the things that Lankford etal were wanting to expand in the dumb "we'll let 5000 a day cross" bill they put out.

The backlog for asylum and refugees is massive -- especially because they exploded after Biden took office and did away with all of the Trump 1.0 policies. The courts are adjudicating something like 5-10% of the applications annually.

We’re short immigration judges because of a bastardized approach to asylum and an open border. We have 3X the asylum judges we had in 2015.

Get to the root of the BS asylum claims, don’t pour more resources into adjudicating them by hiring more judges and officers.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Exclusive: Hegseth orders Cyber Command to stand down on Russia planning

The secretary of Defense has ordered U.S. Cyber Command to stand down from all planning against Russia, including offensive digital actions, sources tell Recorded Future News.

therecord.media