Palisades fire

[crazed_hoosier2]

I'm not saying anything.

I'm just pointing out that some of the cuts were to one time purchase items, civil positions that were already vacant and firefighters got a raise that wasn't in the budget in time to be confirmed.

OK. And it’s important to have all the relevant information.

I just don’t think this really refutes the crux of Crowley’s complaint. Having budget cuts doesn’t necessarily mean that the department’s budget as a whole went down. What the chief has been saying is that they’ve been deprived of critical resources that they’ve been begging for.

Whether or not those resources would be making a significant difference in outcomes here, I have no idea. Maybe they wouldn’t. But it still seems to me that LA is institutionally unprepared not only to reduce the risk posed by these fires, but to minimize their destruction when/if they do happen.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I think we see a thousand year fire, to put it in flood terminology. We saw cities in Indiana hammered by a thousand year flood, Columbus hospital was flooded out in 2008 as an example. We struggle when the black swan occurs.

I agree there probably should have been more done, more water towers on hills would be the best answer. Even more pumps to pump up to them.

But we aren't going to ever spend the money to defeat the 1000 year problem in an area as large as Southern California. These winds gusting to 100 just is more than we can really adequately fight. We can prepare for X, but know that 2X is going to be a problem. We can handle another Mt St Helen's, Yellowstone blows and we are just screwed.

 

[BradStevens]

My bad, Brad. That was really directed at crazed, who didn't want to answer a direct question about it and just opine vaguely. Sorry for being grouchy about it. I knew your heart was in the right place on that.

I get it. It must be stressful to even be near that much devastation. And rather than just watch it and take it all in, my mind went to thinking of fixing it to avoid thinking about the bad stuff. Men, am I right?

Here’s a partial answer: the salt is corrosive to the machinery, dampens the firefighting effect of the water, carries a charge that might be dangerous to the firefighters, and will run off into groundwater afterwards, perhaps making it unusable.

Here is why California can’t use ocean water to help fight the wildfires

Salt water can wreck a fire, but it can also wreck equipment and vegetation as well

www.the-independent.com

 

[Baller23Boogie]

OK. And it’s important to have all the relevant information.

I just don’t think this really refutes the crux of Crowley’s complaint. Having budget cuts doesn’t necessarily mean that the department’s budget as a whole went down. What the chief has been saying is that they’ve been deprived of critical resources that they’ve been begging for.

Whether or not those resources would be making a significant difference in outcomes here, I have no idea. Maybe they wouldn’t. But it still seems to me that LA is institutionally unprepared not only to reduce the risk posed by these fires, but to minimize their destruction when/if they do happen.

I'm sure there are things to certainly improve on, but I think 80+ miles an hour winds are something that no matter how much you prepare for, it's just game changing when it's all said and done.

 

[Joe_Hoopsier]

I think we see a thousand year fire, to put it in flood terminology. We saw cities in Indiana hammered by a thousand year flood, Columbus hospital was flooded out in 2008 as an example. We struggle when the black swan occurs.

I agree there probably should have been more done, more water towers on hills would be the best answer. Even more pumps to pump up to them.

But we aren't going to ever spend the money to defeat the 1000 year problem in an area as large as Southern California. These winds gusting to 100 just is more than we can really adequately fight. We can prepare for X, but know that 2X is going to be a problem. We can handle another Mt St Helen's, Yellowstone blows and we are just screwed.

I get it. Start with simply accepting defeat, instead of building the infrastructure to start with. I wouldn't expect any differnt from 1)the swamp 2) California 3) the left (unless they have control of the voting machines program). Nothing to see here. Just accept your shit being burnt down.

Oh, we can't ever walk on the moon so don't try... ooops.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I get it. Start with simply accepting defeat, instead of building the infrastructure to start with. I wouldn't expect any differnt from 1)the swamp 2) California 3) the left (unless they have control of the voting machines program). Nothing to see here. Just accept your shit being burnt down.

Oh, we can't ever walk on the moon so don't try... ooops.

You must be talking about yourself. You know, one of those who pretends AGW doesn't exist because you don't want to be bothered to do anything to fight it. Get that fricking redwood out of your eye before discussing my mote.

 

[Univee2]

What cracker jack media site reported such a firing in the first plenty?

I believe it was the Daily Mail.

 

[jet812]

How so?

We're all quarterbacks on Monday.

The FD Chief has said that they have not been given the resources needed to fight the fire. The mayor has proposed tens of millions in cuts. Which is wrong?

 

[jet812]

Budget cuts have impacts? And here I thought there was all kinds of waste to be rooted out of government.

With all due respect, I don't think you have any clue about what Karen Bass is doing or not doing in Los Angeles and I don't see anything other than political hackery in your assessment.

It doesn’t matter where the cuts come from? Either no departments have waste or all do? Interesting take..🤔

 

[Joe_Hoopsier]

You must be talking about yourself. You know, one of those who pretends AGW doesn't exist because you don't want to be bothered to do anything to fight it. Get that fricking redwood out of your eye before discussing my mote.

Accepting Self defeat is something that I don't aspire to accept.
There is an identified reason for failure. Go fix it! It's only impossible if one never tries. Cali has set a stake that they are ok with Billions of $$ of damage, without attempts to cure it, are ok. Lets trade Greenland for CAli! That whole mentality can go away and it won't be soon enough.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Accepting Self defeat is something that I don't aspire to accept.
There is an identified reason for failure. Go fix it! It's only impossible if one never tries. Cali has set a stake that they are ok with Billions of $$ of damage, without attempts to cure it, are ok. Lets trade Greenland for CAli! That whole mentality can go away and it won't be soon enough.

I appreciate your answer, in a lot of areas it makes sense. But we don't build damns to hold back any conceivable rain. What level of earthquake is your home built to withstand? Can it withstand an F5 tornado? An EF3 will pretty much destroy any standard built Hoosier home. If I were to suggest we should upgrade code, it would be rejected as costing too much. Using screws instead of nails alone would make a big difference.

There is more that could be done, but are you going to agree homes in the Midwest should be built/retrofitted for earthquakes for when New Madrid goes next? That is an easy one, we know it will sometime. Heck, I have earthquake insurance and I know from my agent that is very rare in southern Indiana.

 

[BadWakeboarder]

What way do you think is a good option to get quickly water three miles inland from the ocean to the Palisades fire that fire officials aren't already doing? There are already helicopter teams dropping ocean water on the Palisades fire. It's much further inland to the Altadena fire.

As the community rebuilds, there has to be a way to build with fire-retardant materials, isn’t there?

 

[Bulk VanderHuge]

I think we see a thousand year fire, to put it in flood terminology. We saw cities in Indiana hammered by a thousand year flood, Columbus hospital was flooded out in 2008 as an example. We struggle when the black swan occurs.

I agree there probably should have been more done, more water towers on hills would be the best answer. Even more pumps to pump up to them.

But we aren't going to ever spend the money to defeat the 1000 year problem in an area as large as Southern California. These winds gusting to 100 just is more than we can really adequately fight. We can prepare for X, but know that 2X is going to be a problem. We can handle another Mt St Helen's, Yellowstone blows and we are just screwed.

I mean, we know for a certainty there is a piece of space rock out there with our names on it somewhere. What are we doing? I don't think Bruce Willis or Robert Duvall are in any shape to save us, much less this guy...

 

[twenty02]

I get it. Start with simply accepting defeat, instead of building the infrastructure to start with. I wouldn't expect any differnt from 1)the swamp 2) California 3) the left (unless they have control of the voting machines program). Nothing to see here. Just accept your shit being burnt down.

Oh, we can't ever walk on the moon so don't try... ooops.

Bet you were very bad at math in school

 

[The Original Happy Goat]

I appreciate your answer, in a lot of areas it makes sense. But we don't build damns to hold back any conceivable rain. What level of earthquake is your home built to withstand? Can it withstand an F5 tornado? An EF3 will pretty much destroy any standard built Hoosier home. If I were to suggest we should upgrade code, it would be rejected as costing too much. Using screws instead of nails alone would make a big difference.

There is more that could be done, but are you going to agree homes in the Midwest should be built/retrofitted for earthquakes for when New Madrid goes next? That is an easy one, we know it will sometime. Heck, I have earthquake insurance and I know from my agent that is very rare in southern Indiana.

Those are all reasonable concerns, but they don't mean anything in contrast to the opportunity to blame a Democratic politician for something.

 

[BadWakeboarder]

Accepting Self defeat is something that I don't aspire to accept.
There is an identified reason for failure. Go fix it! It's only impossible if one never tries. Cali has set a stake that they are ok with Billions of $$ of damage, without attempts to cure it, are ok. Let’s trade Greenland for CAli! That whole mentality can go away and it won't be soon enough.

I’m completely lost.

 

[BadWakeboarder]

The FD Chief has said that they have not been given the resources needed to fight the fire. The mayor has proposed tens of millions in cuts. Which is wrong?

Usually somewhere in the middle.

 

[The Original Happy Goat]

I’m completely lost.

This is common.