One conservative’s argument for a Harris vote

[Hoopsdoc1978]

I live in GA. My vote counts. I detest Harris but will vote for her to help prevent Trump from being elected. If that puts this Republican in hell then I’ll enjoy the ride

Just as there were no never Bideners, I’ve never encountered a never Harriser.

You ever wonder why that is?

Because they care more about winning than anything else.

And don’t give me this “well, Trump is different” bs.

Biden was a f*****g vegetable for at least a year before he dropped out and I still don’t know of anyone who said they wouldn’t vote for him because of it.

 

[stollcpa]

That would be a disaster

Yep and it could happen. Therefore vote against her.

 

[T.M.P.]

I lose my temper too easily sometimes. I’ve posted “F Off” to other posters too many times. I’ve tried to stop. I actually started thinking you were part of the TMP clan. I’ve thinned it out. 😂

lol ...

No, you haven't ...

 

[WhyisIUBBcursed]

Sort of like suckin that first penis, Doc, once you do it you’re no longer straight. Be careful.

You don’t know it’s my first 😉

 

[DANC]

You don’t get to tell me what I am

Well, it's kind of obvious.....

 

[WhyisIUBBcursed]

Well, it's kind of obvious.....

Do tell

 

[DANC]

I lose my temper too easily sometimes. I’ve posted “F Off” to other posters too many times. I’ve tried to stop. I actually started thinking you were part of the TMP clan. I’ve thinned it out. 😂

They deserved it

 

[DANC]

You are the most annoying human I’ve never met. Congrats

Goat says hold his beer

 

[snarlcakes]

View embedded media

How do you feel about all the Cheney types aligning with Democrats Brad? The one thing I have been consistent is my disdain for people like him. I couldn’t stand him when I was a liberal in the early 2000s and couldn’t stand him when I became a conservative. I do appreciate Trump and MAGA scaring rent seeking pussies like him out of the party.

 

[BradStevens]

This is nothing more than the Republican elites who got their rear ends kicked by Obama and Trump wanting control back so they can keep losing.

Nah, he makes a rational argument. It's one advanced by Aloha here as well.

 

[stollcpa]

Nah, he makes a rational argument. It's one advanced by Aloha here as well.

Aloha says he’s unfit. That’s not some complicated rational argument.

I say Kamala is more unfit and a socialist to boot.

 

[BradStevens]

Sort of like suckin that first penis, Doc, once you do it you’re no longer straight. Be careful.

 

[BradStevens]

How do you feel about all the Cheney types aligning with Democrats Brad? The one thing I have been consistent is my disdain for people like him. I couldn’t stand him when I was a liberal in the early 2000s and couldn’t stand him when I became a conservative. I do appreciate Trump and MAGA scaring rent seeking pussies like him out of the party.

Never a big fan of Dick Cheney. But his endorsement means nothing to me--there only two choices and there are a near infinite combination of values and weightings one would do to pick a candidate.

Of course, I think democracy in a nation of 300+ million is a joke, so I really don't care who anyone votes for.

 

[BradStevens]

Aloha says he’s unfit. That’s not some complicated rational argument.

I say Kamala is more unfit and a socialist to boot.

OK, but listen to his argument. He lays out his values and why he thinks Trump won't advance them. You can disagree, of course, but there's no harm done hearing him out, is there?

 

[snarlcakes]

AntiNever a big fan of Dick Cheney. But his endorsement means nothing to me--there only two choices and there are a near infinite combination of values and weightings one would do to pick a candidate.

Of course, I think democracy in a nation of 300+ million is a joke, so I really don't care who anyone votes for.

Safe to say, I dislike Cheney more than you.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Nah, he makes a rational argument. It's one advanced by Aloha here as well.

I think he has a couple of really bad premises.

First, that “moderate” Kamala is the real Kamala. That she’s not putting on an act today, she was putting on an act in 2019.

She’s a California politician - Bay Area. I believe her a lot more when she said she wanted to ban fracking, pay for prisoners to have sex changes, have government take over health insurance, etc. than I do when she disavows those things.

Second is that the far left is on its way out of the Democratic Party. Had it not been for some party maneuvering — especially in 2020 but also in 2016 — there’s a very good chance Bernie Sanders would’ve been the Dem nominee. Even when Biden became the nominee, Sanders was given a lot of influence over the party’s platform…by his own admission.

So I disagree that Frum made a rational argument. It rests upon these kinds of false premises.

There are plenty of good arguments for a conservative not to vote for Donald Trump. But there’s not a good argument for a conservative to vote for a Kamala Harris.

No sale.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

How do you feel about all the Cheney types aligning with Democrats Brad? The one thing I have been consistent is my disdain for people like him. I couldn’t stand him when I was a liberal in the early 2000s and couldn’t stand him when I became a conservative. I do appreciate Trump and MAGA scaring rent seeking pussies like him out of the party.

They aren’t “Cheney types” and you aren’t a conservative.

 

[Morrison]

Never a big fan of Dick Cheney. But his endorsement means nothing to me--there only two choices and there are a near infinite combination of values and weightings one would do to pick a candidate.

Of course, I think democracy in a nation of 300+ million is a joke, so I really don't care who anyone votes for.

I’m not sure what you mean by your second paragraph.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

I think he has a couple of really bad premises.

First, that “moderate” Kamala is the real Kamala. That she’s not putting on an act today, she was putting on an act in 2019.

She’s a California politician - Bay Area. I believe her a lot more when she said she wanted to ban fracking, pay for prisoners to have sex changes, have government take over health insurance, etc. than I do when she disavows those things.

Second is that the far left is on its way out of the Democratic Party. Had it not been for some party maneuvering — especially in 2020 but also in 2016 — there’s a very good chance Bernie Sanders would’ve been the Dem nominee. Even when Biden became the nominee, Sanders was given a lot of influence over the party’s platform…by his own admission.

So I disagree that Frum made a rational argument. It rests upon these kinds of false premises.

There are plenty of good arguments for a conservative not to vote for Donald Trump. But there’s not a good argument for a conservative to vote for a Kamala Harris.

No sale.

On that first point (about which Kamala is the real Kamala), ask yourself this: when and under what circumstances did she begin uttering these moderate positions?

Was it after she dropped out of the 2020 primary? Was it after she was inaugurated as VP?

Nope. It was when she suddenly found herself as the Democratic nominee in July…needing to win elections in places like Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and Michigan.

She did it out of sudden political necessity.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

Aloha says he’s unfit. That’s not some complicated rational argument.

I say Kamala is more unfit and a socialist to boot.

Are you saying I’m not rational?

 

[mcmurtry66]

I think he has a couple of really bad premises.

First, that “moderate” Kamala is the real Kamala. That she’s not putting on an act today, she was putting on an act in 2019.

She’s a California politician - Bay Area. I believe her a lot more when she said she wanted to ban fracking, pay for prisoners to have sex changes, have government take over health insurance, etc. than I do when she disavows those things.

Second is that the far left is on its way out of the Democratic Party. Had it not been for some party maneuvering — especially in 2020 but also in 2016 — there’s a very good chance Bernie Sanders would’ve been the Dem nominee. Even when Biden became the nominee, Sanders was given a lot of influence over the party’s platform…by his own admission.

So I disagree that Frum made a rational argument. It rests upon these kinds of false premises.

There are plenty of good arguments for a conservative not to vote for Donald Trump. But there’s not a good argument for a conservative to vote for a Kamala Harris.

No sale.

Spot on. Add to it her record as the second most lib senator this century and selection of walz

 

[stollcpa]

Are you saying I’m not rational?

What’s rational to you may not be rational to me.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Spot on. Add to it her record as the second most lib senator this century and selection of walz

Yes, I didn’t even think about that.

If the authentic Kamala is the moderate Kamala, why did she not vote that way in the Senate?

His argument against Trump is fine. His argument for Harris falls apart quickly and completely.

Brad, surely you can find a more rational one than this.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Yes, I didn’t even think about that.

If the authentic Kamala is the moderate Kamala, why did she not vote that way in the Senate?

His argument against Trump is fine. His argument for Harris falls apart quickly and completely.

Brad, surely you can find a more rational one than this.

I mean, she has a surrogate in Mark Cuban out there saying — during the homestretch of her campaign — that she’s not really going to do what she says she’s going to do viz taxing unrealized capital gains.

So…why is he saying that and not her?

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

I think he has a couple of really bad premises.

First, that “moderate” Kamala is the real Kamala. That she’s not putting on an act today, she was putting on an act in 2019.

She’s a California politician - Bay Area. I believe her a lot more when she said she wanted to ban fracking, pay for prisoners to have sex changes, have government take over health insurance, etc. than I do when she disavows those things.

Second is that the far left is on its way out of the Democratic Party. Had it not been for some party maneuvering — especially in 2020 but also in 2016 — there’s a very good chance Bernie Sanders would’ve been the Dem nominee. Even when Biden became the nominee, Sanders was given a lot of influence over the party’s platform…by his own admission.

So I disagree that Frum made a rational argument. It rests upon these kinds of false premises.

There are plenty of good arguments for a conservative not to vote for Donald Trump. But there’s not a good argument for a conservative to vote for a Kamala Harris.

No sale.

In some states you either have to vote for Trump or Harris because it’s close. I’d vote for Harris if I was in one of them. Other opinions are other opinions. At some point, the conservatives among us have to figure it out.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

In some states you either have to vote for Trump or Harris because it’s close. I’d vote for Harris if I was in one of them. Other opinions are other opinions. At some point, the conservatives among us have to figure it out.

There isn’t any circumstance where I’d vote for her.

But I don’t even know why this topic is getting so much discussion. She’s not going to be getting significantly more than the 6% of the Republican vote that Biden got. All told, she seems to be runnning behind Biden 2020 - if the polling is right, anyway.

I think people confuse prominent Republicans saying they support her with rank and file Republicans voting for her. I realize that the Dick Cheneys of the world get more attention than the Joe Q. Publics of the world. But we’re talking about single digit percentages of 1/3 of the electorate.

 

[hookyIU1990]

I'll listen to an hour of conservative explaining why they won't vote for Trump. I'm not gonna listen to an hour of a "conservative " explaining why they're voting for Harris though. That ain't a conservative. That's a person responsible for why we're in this situation.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

I mean, she has a surrogate in Mark Cuban out there saying — during the homestretch of her campaign — that she’s not really going to do what she says she’s going to do viz taxing unrealized capital gains.

So…why is he saying that and not her?

Whoa now! We’re told constantly by Trump supporters that he can’t be taken seriously on everything he says or that the people around him will control him. At the same time we’re supposed to take everything Harris says seriously and she’s not to be controlled by anyone around her. This is very interesting.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

That's a person responsible for why we're in this situation.

This is so, so true. It absolutely is people like Frum who paved the way for a populist demagogue like Trump to ascend within the party.

They knew there was a schism between the party electeds and the party voters. I’ve heard them discuss it. Stuart Stevens has talked about it.

But they were operating off the flawed premise that Republican voters had nowhere else to turn to in their frustration.

They were thinking Democrats were the only alternative. They were…wrong.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Whoa now! We’re told constantly by Trump supporters that he can’t be taken seriously on everything he says or that the people around him will control him. At the same time we’re supposed to take everything Harris says seriously and she’s not to be controlled by anyone around her. This is very interesting.

You’re missing my point.

Why is Cuban saying this instead of her? This is a policy pronouncement. If it’s true she doesn’t support this tax, shouldn’t she tell us that?

I’m bringing this up in response to Frum’s argument that her true views are the new moderate ones, not the old leftist ones. That has nothing to do with Trump. Because I’m not arguing in his favor. I’m arguing against Frum’s assertion.

 

[stollcpa]

In some states you either have to vote for Trump or Harris because it’s close. I’d vote for Harris if I was in one of them. Other opinions are other opinions. At some point, the conservatives among us have to figure it out.

That’s certainly not a rational thing for a conservative to do as far as I am concerned. It would be 100% against everything this conservative believes.

 

[mcmurtry66]

On that first point (about which Kamala is the real Kamala), ask yourself this: when and under what circumstances did she begin uttering these moderate positions?

Was it after she dropped out of the 2020 primary? Was it after she was inaugurated as VP?

Nope. It was when she suddenly found herself as the Democratic nominee in July…needing to win elections in places like Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and Michigan.

She did it out of sudden political

Yes, I didn’t even think about that.

If the authentic Kamala is the moderate Kamala, why did she not vote that way in the Senate?

His argument against Trump is fine. His argument for Harris falls apart quickly and completely.

Brad, surely you can find a more rational one than this.

She’s from Calif with a record. And to be honest she’s just not very good. Mealy-mouthed. And I’m not sure her handlers are very bright either.

Answers are easily contrived. My record? Yes. I’m from a very liberal district in a very liberal state where I was elected to represent and advocate for those ideals. And I did so well enough to win re-election and be chosen vp and now president. As president my constituents are more diverse and I will be considerate of same as I craft policy that contemplates the diverse positions and opinions of our entire party and country

Prices are high bc of your polices. That is true in part. But our policies also staved off a recession and created jobs. We were facing a once in a century pandemic. That along with closures gave rise to an anxious country. In an effort to ameliorate the anxiety we all felt we thought it important to at least provide our citizens with the financial resources they needed to meet their basic needs. Did it contribute to prices going up? Yes. But again it also kept people employed and staved off a recession. With the economy fortified we’re going to focus on prices.

Border. Biden actions. Yes. And I’m going to be very honest. We all saw the heartrending stories of families denied access, separated, we wanted to provide a more humanitarian approach. Unfortunately we didn’t anticipate the numbers we’ve seen. So we have taken measures that are working to reduce numbers as we work to reach a bipartisan resolution that at once closes the border and provides a pathway to citizenship

Blah blah. Her answers sound like someone wholly uninformed who is trying to wing it with bs

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

That’s certainly not a rational thing for a conservative to do as far as I am concerned. It would be 100% against everything this conservative believes.

Well, Aloha’s premise is that somebody living in a swing state has to vote for one or the other. And that’s obviously not true.

Many people in the swing states will be voting for somebody other than Trump or Harris. I don’t even understand why he said that.

 

[mcmurtry66]

I'll listen to an hour of conservative explaining why they won't vote for Trump. I'm not gonna listen to an hour of a "conservative " explaining why they're voting for Harris though. That ain't a conservative. That's a person responsible for why we're in this situation.

Correct

 

[stollcpa]

She’s from Calif with a record. And to be honest she’s just not very good. Mealy-mouthed. And I’m not sure her handlers are very bright either.

Answers are easily contrived. My record? Yes. I’m from a very liberal district in a very liberal state where I was elected to represent and advocate for those ideals. And I did so well enough to win re-election and be chosen vp and now president. As president my constituents are more diverse and I will be considerate of same as I craft policy that contemplates the diverse positions and opinions of our entire party and country

Prices are high bc of your polices. That is true in part. But our policies also staved off a recession and created jobs. We were facing a once in a century pandemic. That along with closures gave rise to an anxious country. In an effort to ameliorate the anxiety we all felt we thought it import to at least provide our citizens with the financial resources they needed to meet their basic needs. Did it contribute to prices going up? Yes. But again it also kept people employed and staved off a recession. With the economy fortified we’re going to focus on prices.

Border. Biden actions. Yes. And I’m going to be very honest. We all saw the heartrending stories of families denied access, separated, we wanted to provide a more humanitarian approach. Unfortunately we didn’t anticipate the numbers we’ve seen. So we have taken measures that are working to reduce numbers as we work to reach a bipartisan resolution that at once closes the border and provides a pathway to citizenship

Blah blah. Her answers sound like someone wholly uninformed who is trying to wing it with bs

She’s not smart enough to even think of those good lies.