No cover 2 takes a safety out of the box. Cover 2 does take away the flats in pass coverage which will make it tougher to run bubble and possibly tunnel screens. Perhaps take away a little jet sweeps. But our strength is a downhill runnning game. How is lining two safetys at at 12 yards minimum most of the time they are at 15 - 18 yards. Also if they play the Tampa be soon of cover 2 then the mike linebacker is responsible for the deep middle. So please explain how this will stop a downhill run game.
On to this week...msu
- Thread starter Indianaftw
- Start date
The Tampa 2 and Cover 2 defenses have always relied on downhill safeties in run support. Think John Lynch, Mike Brown, Bob Sanders. Dantonio plays a straight up D that’s always been strong I’m the front 7. They likely won’t have to bring someone down for run support, but that defense absolutely allows for it.
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The C2 exists with typical zone gaps. I see that as an opportunity for PR. I usually think of C2 and T2 as being schemes to limit big and fast receivers not disciplined short game. The corners are used for run support which IMO also makes them prone to be taken advantage of by a QB like PR.
I'll take your word for it...I think you mentioned before you have been a coach for 30 plus years yes?
Most people will roll their coverage to a 1/4 1/4 1/2 coverage against sprint out. Cover 2 is vulnerable to corner routes, post routes, and bender or skinny posts.
Yes and my brother has been a defensive coordinator in small college football for 25 years. He has a young man that he coached in college that is currently the defensive coordinator for the Giants. But I do attend many clinics and listen and learn. Yes it will take away jet sweeps and designed to take away short passing game. The strength of our running attack is down hill. Like I said before lining 2 safety’s at 15- 18 yards is not really conducive to take away a downhill attack.I'll take your word for it...I think you mentioned before you have been a coach for 30 plus years yes?
Most teams now days do line up in a cover 2 shell but either roll into anther coverage. Most people are playing read coverages now any way they may be lined up on one receiver but based on what the number two receiver does tells what they are going to to do.
Yes you do mention 3 great safety’s who did play in a Tampa 2 defense and were exceptional run stoppers but that is 3 out of how many. That was why they were the example as opposed to the rule and that was their defenses were so special.
You need to watch howbthe Bucs, Bears and Colts played it and you’ll have a better understanding of how it attacks the run game from the back.
Well, each of those teams used it and perfected it. Was just pointing out how it was designed to limit certain aspects of an offense, including the run game.
Again it was designed to take away short passing game and with hard corners take away in cuts and take away rhythm passing attack’s.
The Bear defense was an eight man front. Doug Fencik and Gary Plank were basically linebackers playing safety and lining up in the box thus playing a one high safety.
Also the colt teams that Bob Sanders played with were not great. They won games because of their offensive prowess. If they had been great they would have won more than one Super Bowl.
Dantonio’s front 4 were good enough last year to allow him a lot of flexibility (and risk) for his LBs and safeties.
Ramsey managed his way to 22-34 for 158. Cobbs and Timian caught 14. MSU caught 16 for 185. Ramsey was in his 3rd start. Lewerke started as freshman and got hurt after 4 games. Started as a sophomore. Our game was his 11th start.
We ran it 35 times for only 94. Couldn’t get in the end zone. Their DL kept us in check, and their back 7 prevented the long ball, and we could not get open on a short field.
Our DL and our excellent LBs kept LJ Scott out of the end zone for 34 minutes. Almost enough.
Can we run it better this year? Force some more help from their LBs?safeties?loosen it up just a tad for our receivers?
Can we hold Scott under 100 again without Scales and Covington?
Everybody is a year older. Have we gotten bigger, faster, stronger MORE than they did?
I “expect” Ramsey to better.
I expect our OL to be better.
I expect LJ Scott to be better.
If a team gets a return TD or a pick 6, they probably win this one.
But it could also be a crazy race to 50.
Football.
But it’s another opportunity to take a step past “almost”
Let’s see if this bunch is ready to win one they aren’t supposed to win.
Ramsey managed his way to 22-34 for 158. Cobbs and Timian caught 14. MSU caught 16 for 185. Ramsey was in his 3rd start. Lewerke started as freshman and got hurt after 4 games. Started as a sophomore. Our game was his 11th start.
We ran it 35 times for only 94. Couldn’t get in the end zone. Their DL kept us in check, and their back 7 prevented the long ball, and we could not get open on a short field.
Our DL and our excellent LBs kept LJ Scott out of the end zone for 34 minutes. Almost enough.
Can we run it better this year? Force some more help from their LBs?safeties?loosen it up just a tad for our receivers?
Can we hold Scott under 100 again without Scales and Covington?
Everybody is a year older. Have we gotten bigger, faster, stronger MORE than they did?
I “expect” Ramsey to better.
I expect our OL to be better.
I expect LJ Scott to be better.
If a team gets a return TD or a pick 6, they probably win this one.
But it could also be a crazy race to 50.
Football.
But it’s another opportunity to take a step past “almost”
Let’s see if this bunch is ready to win one they aren’t supposed to win.
What are you talking about? The safety I referenced in the Bears version of the Tampa 2 was Mike Brown. This isn’t and never was a discussion about Buddy’s 46. Lol. And we were clearly talking about the Colts D and the role Sanders played in that same Tampa 2 system.
Yup lets all get right on that...Lets go study 3 HOF players because thats what msu is bringing to the party this week. #clueless #purduetroll #douchebag
Sorry forgot one #GFY
Well the year or 2 that Sanders was healthy the whole season, the Colts has a pretty solid defense. But Sanders and the other examples of running stopping safeties says it that the cover 2 needs exceptional talent at the safety spot to have success against the run. Plus something else the Colts has was an amazing pass rush, which is currently MSUs biggest weakness
Was just trying to talk defense with another poster. No need for you to be here. Aren’t you the guy who said ME would be starting over Dobbins and Weber at OSU?
Again the colts defense was not a great run stopping defense. They fed off the offense getting quick leads or getting the opposing offense off schedule and being able to get their smaller quicker d line into pass rushing situations.
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Regarding the Indianapolis Colts' Super Bowl championship team, it seemed like that defense was truly mediocre when Bob was hurt. He came back later in the year if I'm remembering correctly, and suddenly his presence on the field elevated that defense into a completely different animal.
He was absolutely instrumental in our Super Bowl victory that year. It was very obvious that without Bob, there was going to be no SB victory.
Bob was a little man, TBH. I saw him a time or two in person and he was pretty short in stature. Well built, but certainly a lack of height.
He was absolutely instrumental in our Super Bowl victory that year. It was very obvious that without Bob, there was going to be no SB victory.
Bob was a little man, TBH. I saw him a time or two in person and he was pretty short in stature. Well built, but certainly a lack of height.
Don’t disagree totally different d with him there. But to my point he was a different animal. He was special a fun stopper in s cover 2 not many can do that. That is why you cannot name many run stopping safety’s in a cover because it is not a run stopping defense.
No I'm the guy that got you to lose your own argument a couple weeks back. You took a break after that because of how absolutely foolish you looked and now your back. Same ole story. You argue with yourself and look foolish constantly. And now you are questioning a guy thats coached 30 years??? Arguing with HOF professional players??? AND pro defenses??? You question everything IU football and look like a total fool doing it. Go Away Troll!
I am not saying I know everything there is to know about football but I do know a few basic things and I know cover two is not a run stopping defense. But that is his mo bring up extremes instead of norms our facilities not on spar with Alabama or Clemson or Oregon. Our players are not as good as them. Now as was previously stated by another poster he talks about HOF safetys.
He is one of about 24+ IU players who can run over 20 MPH in way they test speed now. (Last year it was about 4 players I believe, so team is faster and Ramsey specifically has in past gotten kind of bad rap but he's more athletic than given credit for. I agree that he is in kind of mold of the MSU, PSU, Wiscy, Iowa type QB's: not the DeShawn Watson/Lamar Jackson kind of athleticism, but very heady player, tough, can hurt you with feet, won't turn it over a lot, and seems to be able to make things happen. A winner! (And the kid in on deck circle is a lefty freshman who reminds many of the AL Lefty Tagoviailoa, who you may see Sat night too, but will definitely see over next 3 years!)
Given I believe teams improve a lot in early weeks, I don't think the week 3 bye week was as valuable to MSU vs. having another game and working at game speed. Hoosiers improving every week. I'm taking IU in a big win for the program over MSU, who all of IU fans do take very seriously and would consider them favorites.
Given I believe teams improve a lot in early weeks, I don't think the week 3 bye week was as valuable to MSU vs. having another game and working at game speed. Hoosiers improving every week. I'm taking IU in a big win for the program over MSU, who all of IU fans do take very seriously and would consider them favorites.
The year the Colts won the SB. They were not rolling, till their ground game and Sanders and the defense got healthy. A good defense was lacking, a lot on those Colts teams.
There you go SpartanJD...IU may look a lot bigger and faster than you guys have seen in the past. I get feeling MSU faithful doesn't see this game like an Illinois or Rutgers lay down. But IU doesn't think MSU is a gimme win either trust me. But IU fans see a program on the rise for sure.
Ramsey has quick feet and is fast
He cant bang, but he can get a first down if you give him any room.
And he can control tempo and clock with a 75% pass efficiency too.
It will be harder to sack him this year - our OL is better.
If LJ Scott can run better than last year - you probably win.
If our new Stevie Scott can run better than last year's Morgan Ellison, we probably win.
Turnovers will be deadly.
Special team plays will be deadly.
Your defense has strength
Ours has speed
We have a couple of things you haven't seen yet.
Can't wait - gonna be a great game.
Ali/Frazier.
Hearns/Leonard.
Somebody is gonna take an ass whipping.
I have no idea what alleged argument you’re talking about. Was it about Ellison starting at Ohio State over Dobbins and Weber? Otherwise, I can’t remember ever reading anything you’ve posted here.
You mean the ones with Mike Brown and Lance Briggs and Brian Urlacher that got them to the Super Bowl against the Colts and that featured the Tampa 2 defense (actually, both teams played it)?
It was valuable because we are banged up and just lost our punter. Normally I’d agree but it actually was a timely bye for us.
Coach Allen and Coach Debord coached not to lose and it killed us, particularly late. It was a brilliant effort by the players on both sides of the ball. The players deserved better.
IU gave it away. I hope they've all learned from that day.
Just my opinion.
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