11-2, rose bowl victory, #5 ranking in final AP poll isn't very good? Think about what you're saying. So the mid-Tiller years in 2003-2005 weren't impressive when we were consistently a top 25 program? 2 of his last 3 years on his "downswing", we still won 8 games in each of those years. Your last 8-win season was in 1993.
IU vs PU recruiting analysis
- Thread starter gbmhoosier
- Start date
11-2, rose bowl victory, #5 ranking in final AP poll isn't very good? Think about what you're saying. So the mid-Tiller years in 2003-2005 weren't impressive when we were consistently a top 25 program? 2 of his last 3 years on his "downswing", we still won 8 games in each of those years. Your last 8-win season was in 1993.
They finished 11 and 2.Thats not any good?Tillers last game at Purdue was the 62 to 10 win over IU.But then,I guess that wasn't impressive,was it??
Well guess what guys? Joe Tiller isn't walking thru that door.
You have no idea. Tiller wasn't even a huge name when he got to Purdue. I think he was like our 3rd choice. He obviously was a hell of a coach. So are you admitting now that his tenure was impressive?
lol I'm glad you're keeping tabs on random guys that we're recruiting. Not sure why you're giving me a hard time for losing out on a 4* player. The fact that we were in the final 2 for a 4* linebacker speaks volumes to how much different things are now versus under Hazell. If you can't see that then I don't know what to tell you. The fact that we also made Andrew Cunningham's final 5 is impressive too (I realize you guys made the list too) but we have his last scheduled official visit which is a big deal IMO. But thanks for the update. Things will definitely be more interesting between our two programs now that Hazell is gone.
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I find it interesting that you seem to spend more time on "our" board than your own. My reference, as I'm sure you are aware, was your insinuation that you would be replacing a 5.2, 5.3 and 5.4 recruit with a 5.8, 5.7 and 5.6. Could be wrong, but pretty sure Dingle was the 5.8 you were pretty confident on, not sure what other 5.8's you have close to committing. Not sure Dingle is some "random" guy , as you say, he would have been your highest rated recruit and a good get.
Don't think anyone here thinks Brohm is as bad as Hazell, I have repeatedly said I think Brohm is a good coach, but turning around that train wreck could be harder than most PU fans are willing to admit.
I find it kind of amusing that you are already declaring Brohm to be a "can't miss". I heard the same thing from my Purdue friends when both Danny Hope and Hazell were hired. A significant number of Boiler fans were openly happy to see Tiller retire, believing that he had stopped investing in recruiting in his last few years and that his pending retirement was being used by rival programs to scare away top recruits. Hiring Hope to be an assistant and head coach -in-waiting was going to return the Boilers to Tiller's glory years. When that didn't pan out, those same PU fans were declaring the hire of Hazell as the real solution. A successful FBS head coach, a proven recruiter, Ohio State connections, a guy whose ethnicity would help attract top-level minority and urban athletes.
Brohm has had success as a head coach at a level noticeably below P5. So had Hope, so had Hazell. I don't recall Boiler fans declaring either or those guys failures at the time of their hiring. In fact, just the opposite as I stated above.
Brohm might be the next Nick Saban. He also might be the next Darrell Hazell. A little premature to be declaring success I would think.
The majority of Purdue fans weren't on board with Hope being named our coach. A lot of folks wanted Brock Spack or Kevin Sumlin.
How was Hazell a proven recruiter? He probably thought recruiting at Purdue was like recruiting at OSU which couldn't be more different. His ineptitude as a recruiter directly led to several guys ending up on your roster that under normal circumstances would've been at Purdue. He was our fall-back option after Butch Jones told us no thank you. He had one good year at Kent State and while I had hope, a lot of people thought the hire was pretty meh. If you look at the reaction of our coaching hires, national/media people weren't calling Hope and Hazell home-run hires like they have with Brohm. Could Brohm fail? Absolutely. But he's coming in with more accomplishments and praise than either of his predecessors.
Yep that was a good pickup. I knew we wouldn't land the top guys in state this year but at least we're landing that second tier of guys that we weren't landing under Hazell. My hope is we land some of the better in-state guys like Karlaftis and Kiser next year.
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Blue-chip guy in our backyard would be an amazing get for sure. He tweeted out his top 3 of Miami, Michigan, and Purdue yesterday. His dad played at Miami so hopefully we'll have a shot to land him in the end.
So looking at what Purdue has right now, with 21 verbals, they're at 2.5 avg stars. It's the same kind of class Hazzell brought in. I understand being enthused/being excited for a new coach. Given where Purdue has been for the last several seasons, it probably doesn't take much to get excited.
Brohm could indeed turn out to be a win for them but as for right now, as far as recruiting goes, it:s more of the same.
Brohm could indeed turn out to be a win for them but as for right now, as far as recruiting goes, it:s more of the same.
I disagree with you here. Under Hazell, we'd usually end up with a lot of guys in december and January that we were hands down their best offer. Several of the guys that committed never stepped foot on campus before committing. With Brohm, these guys were identified early, were on campus for visits and went through camps/drills and committed after Brohm saw them in person. It's different not having many D1 offers in May/June/July as opposed to not having them in December. Our committed guys could still get offers between now and signing day. He's re-established our presence in Indiana landing 3 solid kids from legit programs in the state. For being as bad as we were for the last 4 years, I think it's a pretty solid class so far.
The numbers say some old. I agree that you may not have needed to patch something together at the end like the last few years. That said, the class is close to finished unless, as you said, kids entertain other offers.
Who knows, maybe some of these kids will rise in the rankings over their senior season. Maybe some 5 star comes from out of what the hell happened there and ends up at Purdue. For now, it looks the same to me.
I don't know if Darrell ever had 13 three stars at this point.
i appreciate you coming to the board and posting. I am a lurker on the PU board also for years just to keep tabs on what is going on. I don't think anyone would say that the past 4 years has not been a nice run for IU vs PU but frankly, it has been a bit depressing to see what has happen to PU football. With that said, I think the coaching hire is great and PU has an opportunity to climb back into respectability.... and be a thorn in IU's side looking for that extra win for bowl nominations.
It is clear to me that this recruiting class for PU is far better than past classes and should improve with a positive year. What I mean by positive is not necessarily 5-6 wins (which I don't think is possible) but just seeing the team be positive and mentally tough. It's been hard to be a PU player the last few years.
We have been (even worst) in the same position PU is in. Depth is the biggest issue in the B10 when a team falls to the depths of PU. The good news is you don't have 50 years of it to over come and you are in the West. Your coach doesn't have to try and guess what coaches were thinking before he was born that went to the Rose Bowl. But it takes more than 2-3 seasons to build that depth back that is needed at the B10 level.
Brohm has been associated with winning football for as long as I know. I'm from the Louisville area. The family eats and breathes football. I think better things are coming for PU. I just hope ...not so good on the last day of the schedule
Last years class is only
i don't know if he ever had 13 stars in a class.
2017- 11 3* players
2016- 6 3* players
2015- 12 3* players
2014- 8 3* players
So Brohm is clearly doing a better job and he still has room to add more 3* talent to the mix as well.
What people are missing here is that Purdue is at 21 recruits. They are at max capacity. Schools like Alabama and GA are at 7 and 9 recruits. IU is at 13 or now 14 with last nights commit. So Purdue is going to be stalled out here soon with available schollies while other schools are getting players to commit throughout the fall/winter/spring. In the end, unless PU has some ungodly amount of schollies open, they will end up in the 60-70 range in the recruiting rankings which is pretty much on par with past years. That I think is where a lot of the confusion is. Brohm has just got to the same point faster than his predecessors.
From Hammer and Rails:
" I expect Purdue's recruiting class to be a round 20 members before all is said and done."
https://www.hammerandrails.com/2016...tball-recruiting-2017-scholarship-grid-update
I'm not trying to bash Purdue or say they aren't making progress or Brohm was a bad hire. The first class is always the hardest for a coach so even being able to provide more of the same is at least a decent sign. I just wouldn't look too far into this class as a step up. I think we will see that come end of season and over the next couple of classes. TBD.
Why you'd ever quote hammer and rails is beyond me. Our main reporter likely said we'll be in the 25-28 range this year. So yeah it'll slow down but we will still take up to 7 more guys (and we could still lose some commits too).
Ok.....well I guess we shall revisit this thread in the coming months and see what comes to fruition. I like my odds...
And of course no one knows how good any schools class is until about three or four years down the road.
Let's face it. IU and PU are not power football schools. Arguing over who's better is like fighting over the cream of the crap. One problem we both have is location. A small state population with multiple power 5 schools surrounded by football powers makes recruiting challenging. Truthfully if the state of Indiana had one power 5 school that school would compete better on a national level and make more sense financially for taxpayers.
Fire away.
Respectfully,
Fire away.
Respectfully,
There is an advantage for IU in both areas, but it's not nearly as large as some want to believe, and scheme can be an equalizer, as KW showed. Neither school recruits particularly well compared to the rest of the BiG, and that will continue to be the biggest impediment to moving up in the league.
Both historically and more recently, the best players in Indiana don't go to either IU or Purdue. A quick look around college football confirms this.
Respectfully, I really have a problem with this line of thought. It suggests that IU is forever destined to suck, due to static circumstances beyond its control. I don't buy that. Stay tuned. With the enthusiasm, charisma and skill of the new HC, we are a winning season away from a sea change in the perception of the program and a dramatic improvement in recruiting.
Well, IU will never recruit on the level of OSU or Michigan. But if they could ever string together some good seasons (8-9 wins), they could recruit similar to Wisconsin or Nebraska. But that's a big, "IF."
The great equalizer for KW's offense was that IU recruited 5 future NFL players in his first 2 classes. While scheme played a role, IU was 3rd in the conference (7) behind OSU and Mich in terms of getting offensive players drafted during KWs tenure. And while all these guys greatly over performed their rankings, they were still all decently ranked, and Sudfeld/Wynn/Coleman were more highly regarded than any player Brohm has recruited so far.
And while IUs advantages may not be overly large, relative to the conference as a whole, its still large enough that it will take at least 4 years if not longer for Brohm/PU to pull close to IU unless recruiting changes dramatically (IU falls off and/or PU really picks it up)
Keep in mind that Wilson did have a class that brought it in 5 or 6 ☆☆☆☆ guys. Now, besides Fant and Latham, those guys didn't really pan out. But, it was still a very good class on paper.
I think it'd take a lot to recruit on Nebraska's level on a consitent basis. They are a blue blood program who have sold out every game for 90+ years who recruit extremely well every year. Wisconsin is more attainable but Nebraska is well above IU and Purdue's level.
At the end of signing day. THAT is where that ranking matters. All this talk right now about a coach performing great on the trail means very little.
