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Infrastructure Bill passes with bipartisan votes

How much does the right misappropriate communist/socialist for emotional effect?

And sometimes racist things simply need to be pointed out in a 'dude, that's kindof racist' way.

Other more dangerous times is when purposely racist behavior is deflected by complaining that it's being called out.

Like screaming 'cancel culture' when Gaetz is investigated for banging teenage girls or when Aaron Rodgers is busted lying so he tries to divert it by saying 'the woke mob' is after him.

So, yeah.
So you saying planting trees a serious racist problem?
 
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It’s a well-documented problem only in hindsight. Highways to and through city centers ran along existing and unused rail corridors, waterfronts, vacated industrial zones and other property of low value. If you’ve ever driven the Indiana Toll Road and Chicago Skyway into Chicago you’ll see exactly what I’m talking about. Yeah, those properties are where most of the minorities lived, but highway location was not racism because of that. Highway projects were also planned in connection with urban renewal districts development of which coincided with the interstate highway system. A lot of urban planning mistakes were made with the housing built in conjunction with highway construction and clearing blighted areas, and those mistakes affected minorities, but that wasn’t racism, it was just poor judgment. The Dan Ryan is a perfect example. Waterfront areas are probably where the biggest road building mistakes were made. Now that waterfronts are seen as valuable community assets, we have spent huge sums of money removing, rebuilding, or relocating highways to enhance waterfront neighborhoods. Projects like that in Boston, Portland, Seattle, and even Denver (along the South Platte) are fairly well known.

I'm pretty sure there wasn't a whole lot of racism involved in building the Toll Road thru Lake County. In Gary it runs very close to the mills and the Grand Calumet River. And the river was not (still is not) prime real estate when the ITR was built. In Hammond it only disrupted Polish neighborhoods. In East Chicago it ran mainly south of now long gone factories that are now EPA sites.
 
For those arguing no racism, how about this paragraph:

“In Atlanta, the intent to segregate was crystal clear,” Princeton University historian Kevin M. Kruse has written. “Interstate 20, the east-west corridor that connects with I-75 and I-85 in Atlanta’s center, was deliberately plotted along a winding route in the late 1950s to serve, in the words of Mayor Bill Hartsfield, as ‘the boundary between the white and Negro communities on the west side of town.”​
 
For those arguing no racism, how about this paragraph:

“In Atlanta, the intent to segregate was crystal clear,” Princeton University historian Kevin M. Kruse has written. “Interstate 20, the east-west corridor that connects with I-75 and I-85 in Atlanta’s center, was deliberately plotted along a winding route in the late 1950s to serve, in the words of Mayor Bill Hartsfield, as ‘the boundary between the white and Negro communities on the west side of town.”​
More dumbing down of language. “Racism in effect”? WTF us that? Racism is deliberate. Note to the woke mob: Disparate impact of benign acts is not racism.
 
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For those arguing no racism, how about this paragraph:

“In Atlanta, the intent to segregate was crystal clear,” Princeton University historian Kevin M. Kruse has written. “Interstate 20, the east-west corridor that connects with I-75 and I-85 in Atlanta’s center, was deliberately plotted along a winding route in the late 1950s to serve, in the words of Mayor Bill Hartsfield, as ‘the boundary between the white and Negro communities on the west side of town.”​
No wonder I cant sleep at night, racism is the cause of everything isn't it? Meanwhile highest fuel and heating prices in a long time . That is racism too right? Anything is racism right? It will cost lower income people more than upper income so automatically racist.
 
More dumbing down of language. “Racism in effect”? WTF us that? Racism is deliberate. Note to the woke mob: Disparate impact of benign acts is not racism.
So ‘the boundary between the white and Negro communities on the west side of town.” is not racism, I notice you avoided the damn quote. Stop being obtuse.. you made up crap about Savannah out of thin air, you ignore the quote, is this all you got? Building a Berlin Wall between White and Black is fine by the guy who thinks we should completely ignore race. Got it
 
No wonder I cant sleep at night, racism is the cause of everything isn't it? Meanwhile highest fuel and heating prices in a long time . That is racism too right? Anything is racism right? It will cost lower income people more than upper income so automatically racist.

Answer the damn quote, is it racism to wall off Blacks from Whites.
 
No wonder I cant sleep at night, racism is the cause of everything isn't it? Meanwhile highest fuel and heating prices in a long time . That is racism too right? Anything is racism right? It will cost lower income people more than upper income so automatically racist.
No, not at first glance but say something came across like... to offset rising heating prices we have to reduce the amount of homes by 30% to lower consumption to meet supply.

So we end up taking it out the poor neighborhoods including small minority business buildings via eminent domain.

Yeah, that would be a bit racist in intent.

I'm sure in this hypothetical that some future generations would just play dumb and say dumb shit like 'you're crazy, heating oil isn't racist, it's heating oil' or 'homes aren't racist, they're buildings' while bitching that the poor just can't seem to lift themselves up....they just must be lazy low lifes that are inferior.

I don't get why it's so offensive to own and acknowledge shit with our past. How are we as a society supposed to get better, learn, maybe even adjust and change if we can't even admit that how we got where we are was not all lollypops and candy corn?
 
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The quote below sums up the problem. Blighted neighborhoods were chosen as a form of urban renewal. What determined blight?

This is a ‘melting pot’ area and is literally honeycombed with diverse and subversive racial elements. It is seriously doubted whether there is a single block in the area which does not contain detrimental racial elements … It is hazardous residential territory and is accorded a general medial red grade – Original FHA evaluator report for Boyle Heights, California​

Roads were the tool used to eliminate Black working poor neighborhoods which Whites called blight. That doesn't mean every inch of interstate had this problem. Certainly not. But wherever possible redlined districts were sought for removal. Redlining was a racist policy, is that fair to say? So targeting redlined neighborhoods is somehow clean from any racism? Add in the fact redlining depressed home and business values in these districts and it is clear the residents were screwed.

And back to Pete's point, again the man who made the claim in the book worked for Moses for a number of years. What makes everyone so convinced he must be lying about the overpasses?
 
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The quote below sums up the problem. Blighted neighborhoods were chosen as a form of urban renewal. What determined blight?

This is a ‘melting pot’ area and is literally honeycombed with diverse and subversive racial elements. It is seriously doubted whether there is a single block in the area which does not contain detrimental racial elements … It is hazardous residential territory and is accorded a general medial red grade – Original FHA evaluator report for Boyle Heights, California​

Roads were the tool used to eliminate Black working poor neighborhoods which Whites called blight. That doesn't mean every inch of interstate had this problem. Certainly not. But wherever possible redlined districts were sought for removal. Redlining was a racist policy, is that fair to say? So targeting redlined neighborhoods is somehow clean from any racism? Add in the fact redlining depressed home and business values in these districts and it is clear the residents were screwed.

And back to Pete's point, again the man who made the claim in the book worked for Moses for a number of years. What makes everyone so convinced he must be lying about the overpasses?
I think I dislike Pete more than any politician I can name. First it's his virtue signaling paternity leave now it's his racism. His agency oversees the number one issue facing our country today and he's playing woke politics. F Pete. Fix the bottlenecks. Dereg. Whatever.

As for all the racist stuff in the thread I agree with you Marv. Some was and is disparate impact falling on the poor, but some was intentional to separate blacks.
 
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I think I dislike Pete more than any politician I can name. First it's his virtue signaling paternity leave now it's his racism. His agency oversees the number one issue facing our country today and he's playing woke politics. F Pete. Fix the bottlenecks. Dereg. Whatever.

As for all the racist stuff in the thread I agree with you Marv. Some was and is disparate impact falling on the poor, but some was intentional to separate blacks.
Obviously I will not change your mind, but if a high profile person believes family leave is an important issue why would using it be virtue signaling and not be a case study on why it is good for all Americans?
 
Obviously I will not change your mind, but if a high profile person believes family leave is an important issue why would using it be virtue signaling and not be a case study on why it is good for all Americans?
Because timing matters. Optics matter. You have an Admin telling people to work 24/7. You have a guy making 250k not only taking paternity leave but taking it earlier than anyone else would ever be eligible. Privileged. Him above us. His needs before the needs of people desperate for vital products, supplies. You can state that you believe in something while also working. You can also recognize the urgency of a situation. He wants to virtue signal about paternity leave and racism while also saying oh yeah this could take years. He's a perfect combo of inept, tone deaf and entitled. Identity politics. That's what Pete's about.

The Dems are so clueless they think VA and NJ and Buffalo were bc they weren't getting things passed. No they were backlash to woke bs in schools and police etc. They are removed from reality. The infrastructure bill was great. The party needs to take a hard right turn from the identity politics of the far left or midterms are going to be a bloodbath.
 
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So, what do you folks think about what’s in the infrastructure bill?
There's a lot to like:

110b for roads/bridges
39b for public transit (I'm sure we could argue this should be more/less, etc)
66b to fix Amtrak's problems
7.5b for electric vehicle charging stations and 5b for electric/hybrid school buses
65b for expanding broadband internet access. This could be huge for WFH possibilities in rural communities, no?
65b for electric grid modernization
25b for airport improvements
55b for water/wastewater upgrades, etc.

Looks like we can use 200b or so of the unspent COVID relief to start paying for it though I'm sure we'll go into debt anyway.

On its face it appears to be an enormous expenditure of money. However, we have a lot of airports, bridges, roads, pipes, etc. I suspect we'll need to supplement this in 5-10 years. As we should.
 
So ‘the boundary between the white and Negro communities on the west side of town.” is not racism, I notice you avoided the damn quote. Stop being obtuse.. you made up crap about Savannah out of thin air, you ignore the quote, is this all you got? Building a Berlin Wall between White and Black is fine by the guy who thinks we should completely ignore race. Got it
Anything from Jim Crow south being racist isn’t surprising. I never denied there could be examples of segregation imbedded in urban design including highways. I do deny that was a dominant priority for the interstate system as you and Boots seem to imply.

And talking about racism in terms of desperate impact is laughable, which was a big takeaway from your link. But keep on yacking about racism, that seems to be the only talking point liberals have.

As far as the Port Savannah is concerned, a few days ago, I was up next to the ships and cranes in a small boat with my Stoker and a friend touring the port and nearby nature preserve. Glorious sunny day and being at sea level, I don’t think the air was thin. I took the guide’s deposition about port operations including how they keep track of the thousands of containers, how they keep track of incoming and outgoing containers, how they get them on their way, the order they are loaded and unloaded, who owns and operates the port and much more. I wish Mayor Pete was with us. I now know more about ports than he does.
 
Anything from Jim Crow south being racist isn’t surprising. I never denied there could be examples of segregation imbedded in urban design including highways. I do deny that was a dominant priority for the interstate system as you and Boots seem to imply.

And talking about racism in terms of desperate impact is laughable, which was a big takeaway from your link. But keep on yacking about racism, that seems to be the only talking point liberals have.

As far as the Port Savannah is concerned, a few days ago, I was up next to the ships and cranes in a small boat with my Stoker and a friend touring the port and nearby nature preserve. Glorious sunny day and being at sea level, I don’t think the air was thin. I took the guide’s deposition about port operations including how they keep track of the thousands of containers, how they keep track of incoming and outgoing containers, how they get them on their way, the order they are loaded and unloaded, who owns and operates the port and much more. I wish Mayor Pete was with us. I now know more about ports than he does.
Savannah is such a great town. St Patrick's day there is something else.
 
For those arguing no racism, how about this paragraph:

“In Atlanta, the intent to segregate was crystal clear,” Princeton University historian Kevin M. Kruse has written. “Interstate 20, the east-west corridor that connects with I-75 and I-85 in Atlanta’s center, was deliberately plotted along a winding route in the late 1950s to serve, in the words of Mayor Bill Hartsfield, as ‘the boundary between the white and Negro communities on the west side of town.”​
70 years ago there was racism in the south? Who knew🙄
 
No, not at first glance but say something came across like... to offset rising heating prices we have to reduce the amount of homes by 30% to lower consumption to meet supply.

So we end up taking it out the poor neighborhoods including small minority business buildings via eminent domain.

Yeah, that would be a bit racist in intent.

I'm sure in this hypothetical that some future generations would just play dumb and say dumb shit like 'you're crazy, heating oil isn't racist, it's heating oil' or 'homes aren't racist, they're buildings' while bitching that the poor just can't seem to lift themselves up....they just must be lazy low lifes that are inferior.

I don't get why it's so offensive to own and acknowledge shit with our past. How are we as a society supposed to get better, learn, maybe even adjust and change if we can't even admit that how we got where we are was not all lollypops and candy corn?
I think it’s racist that you associate poor with blacks…
 
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Yes Americans have great faith in these people. Let's give them more money

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Anything from Jim Crow south being racist isn’t surprising. I never denied there could be examples of segregation imbedded in urban design including highways. I do deny that was a dominant priority for the interstate system as you and Boots seem to imply.

And talking about racism in terms of desperate impact is laughable, which was a big takeaway from your link. But keep on yacking about racism, that seems to be the only talking point liberals have.

As far as the Port Savannah is concerned, a few days ago, I was up next to the ships and cranes in a small boat with my Stoker and a friend touring the port and nearby nature preserve. Glorious sunny day and being at sea level, I don’t think the air was thin. I took the guide’s deposition about port operations including how they keep track of the thousands of containers, how they keep track of incoming and outgoing containers, how they get them on their way, the order they are loaded and unloaded, who owns and operates the port and much more. I wish Mayor Pete was with us. I now know more about ports than he does.
So you think Savannah is unique in tracking? You think the Department of Transportation doesn't know of tracking?

This dashboard is designed to provide a snapshot of the Port's current operational status, including real-time cargo-tracking data tools for Port supply chain partners, including marine terminal operators, railroads, chassis providers, truckers, warehouse operators and more. The data is available as a service of the Port of Los Angeles.​
 

Yes Americans have great faith in these people. Let's give them more money

Americans with common sense have faith in them.. Much more than the last administration. Although common sense isn't very common these days so probably more accurate to go with sense.
 
There's a lot to like:

110b for roads/bridges
39b for public transit (I'm sure we could argue this should be more/less, etc)
66b to fix Amtrak's problems
7.5b for electric vehicle charging stations and 5b for electric/hybrid school buses
65b for expanding broadband internet access. This could be huge for WFH possibilities in rural communities, no?
65b for electric grid modernization
25b for airport improvements
55b for water/wastewater upgrades, etc.

Looks like we can use 200b or so of the unspent COVID relief to start paying for it though I'm sure we'll go into debt anyway.

On its face it appears to be an enormous expenditure of money. However, we have a lot of airports, bridges, roads, pipes, etc. I suspect we'll need to supplement this in 5-10 years. As we should.
That’s my take too. It seems indisputable that the US has long neglected infrastructure. The bill has come due. Plus, the US actually building things seems to be about as local as you can get for impact spending.
 
Im just saying, he can easily come back with something like 'newborns aren't concerned with your work schedule nor do they apologize for not being convenient' when that gets tossed his way (which it will and you and McM will owe me a beer when he bats it back).

Just saying, he's got leverage in this argument.
"Mayor Pete is correct, newborns and children do not wait and he has shown that in a crisis that he will put the needs of his family above the needs of this country. That is an admirable quality as a parent but when this country faces a disaster, the top public servant sometimes does not get the luxury of putting his family first, because he is responsible for 100 million families."

This is a net loss for Pete IMO.


The money being doled out, the shipping crisis...those are things he is going to have to answer for.
 
Americans with common sense have faith in them.. Much more than the last administration. Although common sense isn't very common these days so probably more accurate to go with sense.
Hmmmm 72% of America or IU Hickory on the question of common sense huh.... That's a tough one. You'd have to think with 72% there's bound to be some smart people in that group. After all it's millions and millions of people. Or IU Hickory. It's a tough one.
 
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"Mayor Pete is correct, newborns and children do not wait and he has shown that in a crisis that he will put the needs of his family above the needs of this country. That is an admirable quality as a parent but when this country faces a disaster, the top public servant sometimes does not get the luxury of putting his family first, because he is responsible for 100 million families."

This is a net loss for Pete IMO.


The money being doled out, the shipping crisis...those are things he is going to have to answer for.

Maybe he should take his family to Cancun instead. ;)

I'm guessing working from home is a lot easier than working from Cancun...ask Cruz.
 
For those arguing no racism, how about this paragraph:

“In Atlanta, the intent to segregate was crystal clear,” Princeton University historian Kevin M. Kruse has written. “Interstate 20, the east-west corridor that connects with I-75 and I-85 in Atlanta’s center, was deliberately plotted along a winding route in the late 1950s to serve, in the words of Mayor Bill Hartsfield, as ‘the boundary between the white and Negro communities on the west side of town.”​
Shocker that there was racism in Georgia in the '50s.......

What does that have to do with today?
 
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There's a lot to like:

110b for roads/bridges
39b for public transit (I'm sure we could argue this should be more/less, etc)
66b to fix Amtrak's problems
7.5b for electric vehicle charging stations and 5b for electric/hybrid school buses
65b for expanding broadband internet access. This could be huge for WFH possibilities in rural communities, no?
65b for electric grid modernization
25b for airport improvements
55b for water/wastewater upgrades, etc.

Looks like we can use 200b or so of the unspent COVID relief to start paying for it though I'm sure we'll go into debt anyway.

On its face it appears to be an enormous expenditure of money. However, we have a lot of airports, bridges, roads, pipes, etc. I suspect we'll need to supplement this in 5-10 years. As we should.
So the government will run charging stations?

$66 billion for Amtrack, that already requires massive subsidizing, seems absurd.
 
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