Because it was a reaction thing and not planned. I'm not even sure he was aiming for his nuts because it was behind him and I think he just kicked out trying to push off him to get back up court. I know you were kidding, but hard for me to understand how a Hoosier fan gets so up in arms over something like that. We've seen that Cav harbours some grudges and this feels like that.
Holy Leal
- Thread starter Cavanagh
- Start date
Not sure he even made contact, but Furst sure went all Loyerflop. Furst was objectively the greater villian in that exchange.
Its strange how an IU fan would side with Purdue folks on this one...to me. The entire play was...Furst pulling Leal to the floor, which could have been called a hook and hold Flagrant 1...Furst holding Leal down for a couple seconds (could have been a T or Flagrant 1)...Leal untangling himself and standing up...Furst hooking Leals legs with his right leg (could have been a Flagrant 1)...and then yes, Leal intentionally kicking his leg back to step on, or kick maybe, Furst (could have been Flagrant 1 or 2).
So, to focus on the last kick part, as an IU fan...its interesting to me. I'm glad the officials saw the entire play, and called it accordingly. IU would have likely lost that game without Leal.
Just put Leal in that category with Romeo for guys Cav's going to have a hard on for, as long as he posts here. I don't get it, but that guy will hang onto a grudge. And, he'll defend X and Tamar forever too. I think his X love figures in here because X was ridiculed for a nut punch, but that, to my recollection, was running back up the court, and don't remember if anything precipitated it (it probably did), while Leal's was reactive to trying to get out of a scrum with a guy who just elbowed him in the head and pulled him down. Nothing to see here... unless you're a PU fan.
Yeah...even at that...we all know Cav is far from a PU fan...to not acknowledge the entire play is strange to me, even for him and his obvious Leal bias.
No, I am not saying he's a PU fan. I think he has a tremendous need to feel, and try and prove, he's right.
Lappas had it right, should have been flagrant 1 (Furst), flagrant 2 on Leal. The PROOF is when Leal pointed to heaven when he knew he had done wrong and had gotten away with not getting the F2. Everybody saw the replay and it was pretty clear what happened, Purdue and IU both can try to spin it in their direction. Leal is a hustler that works his fanny off, and its kinda funny that the one player on IU who gives the best effort is collecting the least NIL. Was good to see IU "PRAISE" the chair after the game.
Sure, but to that degree, and to the point that you're trashing a player on the team you support who, with limited athletic talent, has helped the team to several wins we otherwise might not have had? There's a lot wrong with this team, Anthony Leal isn't on the first page of those things. With age, I still want to be right, but I don't have to try and make others think that nearly as much and I also can hear counter arguments a lot better. Cav's still young, imo.
I am open to changing my opinions, but most times I dig in and find more and more validation for said opinions. In this case I don’t think Leal is a good basketball player, don’t think he would start on any good team, and think he relies on dirty tricks to provide value on the court.
I am also positive everyone here would call him Davidson 2.0 for Wisconsin, if he played for them. I don’t magically like that style of play because he has IU on his chest.
Always fair never biased Cavanagh 2028
Changed my mind on JG and lander. I don’t always stick to my original opinion.
I think everyone knows Leal "got away with something"...but there isn't any proof that he intentionally tried to stomp on Furst's balls. It was a rare case where the officials used common sense in a situation where there was no way to know if his intent was Flagrant 2 levels of action. If I were them, I'd have probably called Flagrant 1 on both of them. But calling nothing was a good approach too.
95% of flagrant fouls are not intentional, but if you can not see what Leals intent was, even with slow motion replay, then your not being honest, the protection of the players is paramount I don't care whose teams player it is, Leal was lucky, but the Refs did neither team a service in the no call! Should have been free throws for both teams.
I am sick of the flagrant foul deal. Officials stopping games all the time. Forget flagrant 1 and 2. Guys come down with a rebound and their elbow accidentally hits a guy shouldn’t be a flagrant foul. Swinging your elbows wildly for no reason, fine flagrant foul.
It’s seems to me an overwhelming number of the flagrant 1 and 2s are incidental contact during normal basketball plays.
The "money shot" so to speak is what PU fans will solely focus on for obvious reasons and others who see it casually don't care enough to look at the whole play they just see the highlight.
Furst has underachieved and whines..a lot, but I was surprised to see this from him honestly.
Remember when some fans were pissed that IU didn't land Furst? Dodged a bullet.
Flagrant 1 for both of them then. As I said. Focusing solely on Leal's kick back, is absurd. And its why the refs, I'm sure, ruled how they did.
I'm sure the convo with the refs was similar to this...
"IU kid sure looks like he kicked Purdue kid on purpose."
"Definitely, but is he kicking at a specific area, or just kicking back at him?"
"And then if we call IU kid for flagrant, we have to call Purdue kid for flagrant too, for pulling him down."
"Yep, and then hooking him with his leg. That can be a dangerous play too."
"No way to tell how malicious either of them were. Lets just call nothing and move on."
"Agreed."
NO, Leal was the lucky one( he knew to), Period! If Leal had landed his foot as intended, Furst could of been hurt bad. Leal was lucky his stupid move did not cost him or IU. Stop turning yourself into a pretzel trying to spin it differently. I have no problem calling a flagrant on both, for the most part it was just BT basketball, but Leal's intent was obvious and was not a basketball move. Funny thing is if they had called flagrant fouls on both, IU probably would of come out on top, Leal is a better FT shooter than Furst! What Leal did was STUPID!
Furst has a higher FT% than Leal, but that's not the point. Furst started it with the pull down and then kept going with the attempted tripping. If Furst had any balls, he'd have been hurting. Luckily for him, he has no balls. I know you can relate to that.
In the end they had a conversation and decided it was best to let it go, and I think that was the best call. Throwing Leal out for what he did and Furst getting to stay with all he did would have been unfair as hell.
Unless Furst gets tossed for two F1s? The sling to the floor and then the trip...do two F1s get you tossed? I don't know that rule.
That dude.....
Biggest turd amongst starting players in the B1G. Still amusing, thinking back to Boiler fans saying he was going to be a 3.
He's essentially the same mediocre player today as he was during his freshman campaign.
You even sure Buie is talking about Leal? I've watched it repeatedly and Furst isn't getting kicked if he doesn't come down with his elbow on Leal's head or neck and then drag him down and tangle up his legs to keep Leal from getting going. Then yes, Leal kicked him intentionally, and happened to be in the groin area. Big deal. I think Furst was mad about getting blocked out under the basket. Leal got back in the play and Furst sat and whined. About sums up the second half.
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I think the kick was an intentional parting shot after what Furst did, but as I recall Leal was looking down the floor at the play and I doubt he intended it to land where it did. Hence his prayerful thanks when he didn't get an F2, he knew what it looked like after the fact.
I was pissed, he had bigly upside but never developed.
He may have done well in Btown.
That's what I meant, Leal was trying to get upcourt and kick the douche who elbowed him and pulled him down then tried to tangle up his legs. He just kicked back and I don't think knew Furst was sitting there with his legs spread.
No one knows what Leal's intent was. And no one especially knows where Leal was intending to kick him. He didn't look backwards the entire play, so to say he "meant" to kick him in the nuts is absurd.
Trying to be impartial on this...Furst committed a dangerous, non basketball play, when he pulled Leal's shoulder back and pulled him down with him as he was falling. Or...Furst was falling and just grabbed Leal out of instinct. That "could" have been deemed either a Flagrant 1 or Flagrant 2. Flagrant 2, in that situation, would have been excessive, but a hook and hold would have been a perfectly appropriate call on that specific part of the play. Then they landed on the ground, neither of them threw an elbow or anything, but as Leal was getting up, Furst hooked his right leg around Leals leg, purposely tripping him. Or...Furst was just trying to pull his legs close to get himself up? I HAVE seen that particular play called a Flagrant 2 before. And I'd contend that's WAY more dangerous than a kick in the balls would be. What if Leal steps wrong and turns his ankle, or buckles his knee? Anyway, tripping like that could have been a Flagrant 1, at least. Then, as Leal is taking off to run away, he kicks his left leg back. It looked like an intentional kick, and probably was. But, was it a reaction to Furst trying to trip him? Was he purposely trying to stomp on Fursts balls? Or was he just flipping his leg back to clear it from Furst tripping attempts?
Furst instigated the whole thing. His actions likely were NOT basketball plays. Leal's actions ended it, and it likely wasn't a natural action to get out of being tangled up. So...fair to take the stance that whatever Leal deserved to get, so should have Furst. Both Flagrant 2's...seems excessive, but o.k. Both Flagrant 1s...this is what I would have done. Shows there's a consequence to both their actions, but doesn't disproportionately punish. Or...neither gets anything. In no world would it have been fair to give Leal a harsher punishment than Furst.
I think you also undersold Furst coming down on Leal with his elbow. I really think Painter has taught his bigs to swing their bows, because it's been so prevalent with all their bigs, from TKR, Edey, Furst, the scandinavian goofball and the big Herpes kid. But, he lands on Leal with his elbow, and then uses his arm to pull Leal down and then trips him. Then yes, Leal kicks back at him without looking. I think as long as they at least called both for an equal level of foul, that was fine and I really think that's what the ref did: knew the Leal kick was retaliating for the crap Furst did.
would assume Furst has a pretty big vagina, Leal is lucky he didn't get his foot stuck
Are you serious Clark? You think there is any chance in hell he is talking about Furst??? Come on man
He's obviously taught them to lead with their elbows on drop step moves...and to step in and lean hips in to ball screens. It was refreshing to see that Officiating crew call a few of them. Did someone post that that crew has Final Four experience?
Shocking they would have just missed that Leal obviously intentionally bagged Furst... "Oh well, I know he kicked him in the dick on purpose, unprovoked...and I know this game is on national TV...and I know we're judged closely on calls like this...but I say we just let him play on...whatya think?"
So you're telling me if a guy comes down on you with his elbow to your head or neck like Furst did, and then pulls you down and tangles up your legs as you try and get up, you're not doing anything? I think most everyone is going to kick back at the guy and I don't think Leal ever looked back or was trying to kick him in the balls. I have no issue with what Leal did, and obviously in reviewing it, neither did the refs. If it was so egregious, why didn't he get a flagrant? The refs saw both sides too.
And I think this is what brought the refs to the conclusion they did. They got it right.
He was clearly talking about Leal, but that is becuse he say the "money shot" and not the rest of what happened.
Boo was lazy
I have not once said Furst didn’t do anything dirty too. Leal also kept his arms straight as hell where if he bent them would have got untangled (trying to draw fouls is his forte remember). Then Leal kicked him in the nuts. Way dirtier than any other play that was made by a mile. If they switched jerseys you would be ripping Furst. It’s ok you got some Indiana hypocrite in you. I don’t
.
Should be obvious... its frustrating explaining the realities of that play to Purdue fans...an IU fan...?? It don't make no sense.
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