Debt

[Spartans9312]

Nearly $35 trillion.

U.S. International Investment Position, 4th Quarter and Year 2023 | U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis (BEA)

Fourth Quarter

www.bea.gov

Net international trading position….nearly $20 trillion in the red

https://www.cato.org/blog/concerns-over-us-manufacturing-trade-deficit-are-misplaced

“The trade deficit is a statistic with little relation to a country’s prosperity….the vast majority of trade economists do not see the U.S. trade deficit as a ‘problem’ to be solved.”

 

[Indyhorn]

Trump gave us damn near 8 trillion in debt while telling us it was the “greatest economy.” We are truly screwed

 

[stollcpa]

Trump gave us damn near 8 trillion in debt while telling us it was the “greatest economy.” We are truly screwed

Covid certainly contributed.

 

[Spartans9312]

Trump gave us damn near 8 trillion in debt while telling us it was the “greatest economy.” We are truly screwed

Is the problem the debt itself?
If we have been successful….most likely we started with a loan.
Smart people on here, and other places, have stated correctly that there are times when government needs to borrow (emergencies).

But this needs to be done as an investment. We have obviously failed across the board

 

[WhyisIUBBcursed]

But sometimes that shiny Mustang convertible just needs to be bought. Don’t blame Congress. They wanted it really badly

 

[Spartans9312]

Does America Need Global Savings to Finance Its Fiscal and Trade Deficits? - American Affairs Journal

It is frequently argued that America’s twin deficits—the government budget deficit and the trade deficit—result from profligate spending by the government and private sectors. This excess domestic spending, moreover, must be financed by global savings, putting America on an unsustainable debt...

americanaffairsjournal.org

“As a matter of accounting, our trade deficit must be balanced by a combination of public and private deficits”

 

[Indyhorn]

Covid certainly contributed.

True but if you study trickle down economy you’ll note a strong pattern from the GOP- no fiscal solvency, we’ve lost our way!

 

[Spartans9312]

America's Growing Trade Deficit Is Selling The Nation Out From Under Us. Here's A Way To Fix The Problem--And We Need To Do It Now. - November 10, 2003

“Our country has been behaving like an extraordinarily rich family that possesses an immense farm. We have, day by day, been both selling pieces of the farm and increasing the mortgage on what we still own.”

 

[mcmurtry66]

Trump gave us damn near 8 trillion in debt while telling us it was the “greatest economy.” We are truly screwed

Biden’s budget plan for 2025 is 7.3 trillion. One year. And we’re not in a pandemic

 

[BCCHoosier]

Biden’s budget plan for 2025 is 7.3 trillion. One year. And we’re not in a pandemic

Trump ran up the debt before the pandemic. This should be the one thread where neither side throws stones. King of debt his whole life.

Each side only cares about debt levels and the budget when the other party is in power.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Trump ran up the debt before the pandemic. This should be the one thread where neither side throws stones. King of debt his whole life.

Each side only cares about debt levels and the budget when the other party is in power.

I don’t want to be taxed more to pay for it nor do I want my businesses. Cut spending

 

[Spartans9312]

From the previous linked article:

“There was a striking anomaly during the decade from approximately 1997 to 2007. The first half experienced a very unusual government budget surplus while the private sector experienced two unusual camel humps of large deficits over the decade. The first of these humps coincided precisely with the Clinton budget surpluses. But, holding the trade deficit constant, a move to a budget surplus had to be matched by a movement to a private sector deficit. In the second of the camel’s humps, the longer-term growth of the trade deficit was so large that the smaller turn of the private sector toward deficit implied an offsetting movement of the government’s budget toward only smaller deficits.”

 

[snarlcakes]

Nearly $35 trillion.

U.S. International Investment Position, 4th Quarter and Year 2023 | U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis (BEA)

Fourth Quarter

www.bea.gov

Net international trading position….nearly $20 trillion in the red

https://www.cato.org/blog/concerns-over-us-manufacturing-trade-deficit-are-misplaced

“The trade deficit is a statistic with little relation to a country’s prosperity….the vast majority of trade economists do not see the U.S. trade deficit as a ‘problem’ to be solved.”

Unfortunately, 80% of the population and politicians don’t care. There is always an excuse or emergency to add to the deficit. For example the 100 billion we just added to continue financing wars in ME and Ukraine. It will continue until something really bad happens or prolonged elevated inflation wakes up enough people who start voting for fiscal conservatives (not happening).

 

[DDE-6-20-23]

Covid certainly contributed.

OMG I've always said imagine if a dem was in office during covid it would have been triple.

You intelligent brainiacs butter understand one thing. The only path out of this is through a criminal mind and we have that opportunity before us. lol

 

[larsIU]

Whose ox gets gored?

Old People (SS, Medicare)
Poor People (Medicaid, SNAP, tax credits, etc)
Veterans/Military (Defense, military pensions/retirement)

Take aware all discretionary non military spending and we're still in a massive hole ever year.

Or we could, of couse, raise taxes.

The Federal Budget in Fiscal Year 2023: An Infographic | Congressional Budget Office

The federal deficit in 2023 was $1.7 trillion, equal to 6.3 percent of gross domestic product.

www.cbo.gov

 

[larsIU]

I don’t want to be taxed more to pay for it nor do I want my businesses. Cut spending

Where. Be specific.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

The problem has been that "the boy that cried wolf" has been involved. I recall when the debt got to $1 trillion and the word was spread that that was it, we were doomed, no way we could ever recover. That's happened at basically every interval sense, so people have tuned out the dire warnings.

Let the Trump era tax cut age out, cut spending 1% (or even 2%) on programs including defense then freeze for a couple of years. The defense side of that used to lose conservatives, but now that they have decided McGovern was right they'll probably want even more cuts. Eliminate the cap on Social Security taxes.

Oh, and tax cryptocurrency 99%.

 

[Spartans9312]

A Path Out of the Trade and Savings Trap - American Affairs Journal

Except in Africa and South Asia, the world’s population is aging rapidly. Between 2010 and 2050 the proportion of Americans over 65 will nearly double assuming constant fertility and immigration. By 2034 the Social Security Trust Funds will be depleted. By that time there will be two Americans...

americanaffairsjournal.org

With regards to the 2007 financial crisis and Great Recession: “excess foreign savings contributed significantly to the asset bubbles that broke our economy.”

 

[Spartans9312]

Unfortunately, 80% of the population and politicians don’t care. There is always an excuse or emergency to add to the deficit. For example the 100 billion we just added to continue financing wars in ME and Ukraine. It will continue until something really bad happens or prolonged elevated inflation wakes up enough people who start voting for fiscal conservatives (not happening).

Who Owns US Stock? Foreigners and Rich Americans.

Our new analysis shows that foreign investors owned about 40 percent of US corporate equity in 2019, up substantially over the last few decades. Retirement...

www.taxpolicycenter.org

Before the 1970s…foreigners held only 5% of Treasury bonds.

It is “around 40%” today.

 

[snarlcakes]

Where. Be specific.

Cut: I’d try to make cuts to everything. Eliminate several departments completely or drastically reduce them. The military would get a 20% reduction. I’d try my hardest to leave SS alone for people 65 and older and Medicare.

Increase tax rate cap on SS/Medicare. Increase corporate taxes 5%. Spread it out over 10-20 years to lessen the burden depending on the numbers. I’d also be open to a VAT tax that expired once the debt was paid off.

 

[hookyIU1990]

Reagan ran up the debt. Then old man Bush ran it up more. Then Clinton did (although he had a balanced budget for a time during his 2 terms). G Bush really ran it up, then Obama said hold my beer. That's brought us to last 2 clowns who have just exploded it.

Congress, who could/should put a stop to it, is more than happy to go along with it because that's how they get votes and stay in power.

There are no adults in the room to make hard decisions and 80-90% of the people who do vote just want to stick it to "the other side".

We (the federal gov) backstop so much stupidity that I don't see how it gets better until it falls down first.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Where. Be specific.

Everywhere Lars. I would gradually shrink the size of our expenditures across the board including defense spending

 

[Bowlmania]

Covid certainly contributed.

Donald Trump Built a National Debt So Big (Even Before the Pandemic) That It’ll Weigh Down the Economy for Years

The “King of Debt” promised to reduce the national debt — then his tax cuts made it surge. Add in the pandemic, and he oversaw the third-biggest deficit increase of any president.

www.propublica.org

 

[snarlcakes]

Who Owns US Stock? Foreigners and Rich Americans.

Our new analysis shows that foreign investors owned about 40 percent of US corporate equity in 2019, up substantially over the last few decades. Retirement...

www.taxpolicycenter.org

Before the 1970s…foreigners held only 5% of Treasury bonds.

It is “around 40%” today.

I agree with Luke’s prediction below with US Treasuries in the future. It’s also why I am so bullish on Bitcoin. They’re going to get swapped out for Gold and Bitcoin.

 

[Bowlmania]

Trump gave us damn near 8 trillion in debt while telling us it was the “greatest economy.” We are truly screwed

His trade policy was a mess as well. Trump started a trade war with China, a war that the United States ultimately lost. It cost the United States nearly 300,000 jobs and an estimated $316 billion by the end of 2020. Research from the Federal Reserve Bank of New York and Columbia University found US companies lost $1.7 trillion in the price of their stocks as a result of tariffs imposed on imports from China during the Trump administration. Our trade deficit with China ballooned as a result of Trump’s trade policy, far exceeding what it had been under the previous administration.

 

[DDE-6-20-23]

His trade policy was a mess as well. Trump started a trade war with China, a war that the United States ultimately lost. It cost the United States nearly 300,000 jobs and an estimated $316 billion by the end of 2020. Research from the Federal Reserve Bank of New York and Columbia University found US companies lost $1.7 trillion in the price of their stocks as a result of tariffs imposed on imports from China during the Trump administration. Our trade deficit with China ballooned as a result of Trump’s trade policy, far exceeding what it had been under the previous administration.

This is a solutions thread dipshit! Not a trash Trump thread.

Get the wars under control and get the interest rates down. Then start cutting programs. Thats a start!

 

[snarlcakes]

Donald Trump Built a National Debt So Big (Even Before the Pandemic) That It’ll Weigh Down the Economy for Years

The “King of Debt” promised to reduce the national debt — then his tax cuts made it surge. Add in the pandemic, and he oversaw the third-biggest deficit increase of any president.

www.propublica.org

Taxes revenues have increased since the Trump tax cuts. He did however increase spending, as did Biden when he got into office.

 

[Bowlmania]

This is a solutions thread dipshit! Not a trash Trump thread.

Get the wars under control and get the interest rates down. Then start cutting programs. Thats a start!

You're unable to respond on the merits so, in typical fashion, you throw a tantrum.

Go scream at somebody else, loser.

 

[snarlcakes]

The problem has been that "the boy that cried wolf" has been involved. I recall when the debt got to $1 trillion and the word was spread that that was it, we were doomed, no way we could ever recover. That's happened at basically every interval sense, so people have tuned out the dire warnings.

I agree and people don’t understand today isn’t like 1980. The numbers and demographics are different.

Let the Trump era tax cut age out, cut spending 1% (or even 2%) on programs including defense then freeze for a couple of years. The defense side of that used to lose conservatives, but now that they have decided McGovern was right they'll probably want even more cuts. Eliminate the cap on Social Security taxes.

I’d be fine with the tax increases, but the cuts would have to be much higher. 20-30% for example.

Oh, and tax cryptocurrency 99%.

That’s beyond stupid. The U.S. government should be buying Bitcoin and making it easier for U.S. citizens to do the same. They thankfully already did this when they approved the ETFs.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Whose ox gets gored?

Old People (SS, Medicare)
Poor People (Medicaid, SNAP, tax credits, etc)
Veterans/Military (Defense, military pensions/retirement)

Take aware all discretionary non military spending and we're still in a massive hole ever year.

Or we could, of couse, raise taxes.

The Federal Budget in Fiscal Year 2023: An Infographic | Congressional Budget Office

The federal deficit in 2023 was $1.7 trillion, equal to 6.3 percent of gross domestic product.

www.cbo.gov

Across the board. I hate cori bush but I’m not picking on her here but using as one tiny example of just one rep on community projects. At least half of this is bullshit - bc it’s unnecessary, bc it won’t work, bc funding from other sources is available. This is a drop in the ocean but if we are ever going to get lean this shit adds up.

Congresswoman Bush Selects Fifteen St. Louis Projects for FY23 Federal Community Funding Projects

The Official Website of Congresswoman Cori Bush of Missouri

bush.house.gov

But this is sort of interesting

The Programs You’d Have to Cut to Balance the Budget (Published 2023)

Without trimming popular programs or raising taxes, cuts to the rest of the federal budget would have to be monumental.

www.nytimes.com

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Does America Need Global Savings to Finance Its Fiscal and Trade Deficits? - American Affairs Journal

It is frequently argued that America’s twin deficits—the government budget deficit and the trade deficit—result from profligate spending by the government and private sectors. This excess domestic spending, moreover, must be financed by global savings, putting America on an unsustainable debt...

americanaffairsjournal.org

“As a matter of accounting, our trade deficit must be balanced by a combination of public and private deficits”

One thing I don’t understand about the trade deficit.

If we buy a computer chip from Taiwan for $100 and sell them some wheat for $50, do we have a trade deficit of $50 from that transaction? Isn’t the net dollar negative offset by the value of the computer chip? If we leverage chip to produce value, is there a deficit at all?

 

[Marvin the Martian]

That’s beyond stupid. The U.S. government should be buying Bitcoin and making it easier for U.S. citizens to do the same. They thankfully already did this when they approved the ETFs.

Money launderers should pay taxes too...

 

[mcmurtry66]

Money launderers should pay taxes too...

Bitch we can’t even spend it!!! Or access it!!! And you want to tax us?!!!!

 

[snarlcakes]

Money launderers should pay taxes too...

Money launders should be prosecuted. Bitcoin should be taxed at the capital gains rate when someone stupidly decides to sell it.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Money launders should be prosecuted. Bitcoin should be taxed at the capital gains rate when someone stupidly decides to sell it.

🤣🤣🤣🤣 imagine selling it

 

[snarlcakes]

🤣🤣🤣🤣 imagine selling it

I know you’re joking, but I wake up everyday and ask myself what f#cking idiot is selling Bitcoin today. It’s incredible anyone is selling it.

 

[mcmurtry66]

I know you’re joking, but I wake up everyday and ask myself what f#cking idiot is selling Bitcoin today. It’s incredible anyone is selling it.

we're in it for the long run

 

[BradStevens]

Where. Be specific.

Here's a chart that I'm going to assume is approximately true:

Federal Spending: Where Does the Money Go

In fiscal year 2014, the federal government will spend around $3.8 trillion. These trillions of dollars make up a considerable chunk - around 22 percent - of the US. economy, as measured by Gross Domestic Product (GDP). That means that federal government spending makes up a sizable share of all...

www.nationalpriorities.org

For total federal spending, Social Security/Unemployment/Labor is the highest; Medicare & Health the second highest; Military the third highest. We need cuts there. My druthers:

1. Means test SS payments. Raise retirement age.

2. 10% of Medicare beneficiaries account for 60% of total expenditures. Address this somehow (I don't know how).

A Primer on Medicare – How much does Medicare spend, and how does current spending compare to past trends and the future outlook? – Sec 13 - 7615-04 | KFF

Spending on Medicare accounted for 14 percent of total federal spending in 2014. Federal spending for fiscal year 2014 totaled $3.5 trillion, with net spending on Medicare (that is, Medicare spending minus income from premiums and other offsetting receipts) comprising 14 percent of the total...

www.kff.org

3. Cut military spending by 20% for 10 years. Shrink, but do not eliminate, our worldwide footprint.

4. Re revenues:

Increase the estate and gift tax. In 2022, it accounted for $33 billion in revenue. Let's triple that to get to $100 billion per year.

Start taxing all college sports (per Google AI: in 2022, college athletics generated around $13.6 billion in revenue, which is more than Major League Baseball, the National Basketball Association, and the National Hockey League combined).

Tax all university endowments not spent on lowering tuition ($800+billion stashed away here).

5. Pass a constitutional amendment that limits debts or deficits in some way. Our constitutional structure is broken in this way, whereby there is little to no accountability or incentives for politicians to limit spending. We need to fix that.

I doubt any of this happens and the U.S. will continue to slide into the abyss, with fried chicken prices continuing to skyrocket, while our national debates focus on the definition of a woman, the evils of "whiteness," the "heroism" of the J6ers, and whether our Presidential candidates like to be peed upon or smell hair.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Here's a chart that I'm going to assume is approximately true:

Federal Spending: Where Does the Money Go

In fiscal year 2014, the federal government will spend around $3.8 trillion. These trillions of dollars make up a considerable chunk - around 22 percent - of the US. economy, as measured by Gross Domestic Product (GDP). That means that federal government spending makes up a sizable share of all...

www.nationalpriorities.org

For total federal spending, Social Security/Unemployment/Labor is the highest; Medicare & Health the second highest; Military the third highest. We need cuts there. My druthers:

1. Means test SS payments. Raise retirement age.

2. 10% of Medicare beneficiaries account for 60% of total expenditures. Address this somehow (I don't know how).

A Primer on Medicare – How much does Medicare spend, and how does current spending compare to past trends and the future outlook? – Sec 13 - 7615-04 | KFF

Spending on Medicare accounted for 14 percent of total federal spending in 2014. Federal spending for fiscal year 2014 totaled $3.5 trillion, with net spending on Medicare (that is, Medicare spending minus income from premiums and other offsetting receipts) comprising 14 percent of the total...

www.kff.org

3. Cut military spending by 20% for 10 years. Shrink, but do not eliminate, our worldwide footprint.

4. Re revenues:

Increase the estate and gift tax. In 2022, it accounted for $33 billion in revenue. Let's triple that to get to $100 billion per year.

Start taxing all college sports (per Google AI: in 2022, college athletics generated around $13.6 billion in revenue, which is more than Major League Baseball, the National Basketball Association, and the National Hockey League combined).

Tax all university endowments not spent on lowering tuition ($800+billion stashed away here).

5. Pass a constitutional amendment that limits debts or deficits in some way. Our constitutional structure is broken in this way, whereby there is little to no accountability or incentives for politicians to limit spending. We need to fix that.

I doubt any of this happens and the U.S. will continue to slide into the abyss, with fried chicken prices continuing to skyrocket, while our national debates focus on the definition of a woman, the evils of "whiteness," the "heroism" of the J6ers, and whether our Presidential candidates like to be peed upon or smell hair.

I love this!!! And you know we’re brothers from another mother but damn I am lost on your take on estates

 

[BradStevens]

I love this!!! And you know we’re brothers from another mother but damn I am lost on your take on estates

I only tripled it to appease you, snarl, et al. You've softened me.