Argentina elects "far-right" libertarian--will they turn it around?
- Thread starter BradStevens
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Yes, but that's not because they wanted the powers of the government limited like a anarcho-capitalist. It's because they were concerned with local rule and thought of their states/colonies as separate sovereigns and where the true power should lie (analogous to today's disputes in the European Union about the power of the EU vs. national soveregnty).
But within those state governments, they still had far more expansive notions of the police power than just security and courts, and the people in power certainly did not view their own state govts as "enemies."
Argentina has a federal system. Unless I've missed it, he's not calling for an end to the provincial or municipal governments. His focus is on what he views as a corrupt and out of control federal gov't. He's said he can't go full-on Anarchy, so he's going to strive for a minarchy, which takes me back to my previous statement that it shares some commonality with what founding fathers were all about.
I don't know how he thinks about local government. As an avowed anarchocapitalist, I'm taking him at his word. Maybe--hopefully--he's more pragmatic than that.
Here's a link to links about anarchocapitalism. It's really interesting to read about:
Everything You Ever Wanted to Know About Anarcho-Capitalism, But Were Afraid to Ask - Econlib
The most intellectually serious proponents and fellow travellers of anarchism are, paradoxically, a bunch of stodgy economists. That’s one of the lessons of Ed Stringham‘s new 700-page anthology, Anarchy and the Law: The Political Economy of Choice. This volume brings together: The classic...
www.econlib.org
I'm a big fan of the Austrian School generally and Mises & Rothbard specifically. I can't go full Rothbard, but I appreciate a lot of what he wrote. As an aside, one of my favorite Rothbard quotes is "It is clearly absurd to limit the term 'education' to a person's formal schooling"
Murray N. Rothbard Books | Mises Institute
Selected major works by Murray N. Rothbard (1926–1995), who made important contributions to economics, history, political philosophy, and legal theory. Rothbard
And even then, it only took a few years for them to figure out that it didn't work, and they needed the federal government to have more power.
In fact, looking back on history, can you find one example of a society that accomplished any level of greatness by scaling back the power of government? Greece, Rome, the Franks, etc. Western civilization, which many here consider the pinnacle of human social development, certainly didn't rise to where it is today riding the coattails of any sort of libertarianism. Elsewhere, the great Chinese dynasties, Indian empires, Japan, all societies that were either very regimented or at most had some level of individual freedom only within the confines of a powerful bureaucratic state apparatus.
We're the Founders "miniarchists" or practical enough to know ratification of the Constitution required that the states would feel comfortable voting in favor of the Constitution only if the states held a powerful position relative to that of the Federal government.
As time went on given such things as a national defense and a national economy the practical answer was to give more power to the Federal government.
He’s not messing around. Bukele and Milei showing the blueprint on how to turn nations around quickly.
Lots of left wing protests going on. Hope they stay the course.
VanPastorMan
Hall of Famer
He is cutting out wasteful government jobs. I like it. People in government need to go work in the private sector before the enter government service and then once they are in the government they should get out and live under the crazy laws they just passed.
Javier Milei: Argentina's far-right outsider wins presidential election
Ex US President Donald Trump congratulates Javier Milei, saying he will "Make Argentina Great Again".www.bbc.com
VanPastorMan
Hall of Famer
I specifically remember reading he was cutting 1 out of 4 jobs that were appointment jobs. He also got rid of jobs concerning climate change and women's strategy positions. Really, I think what he is doing is what we need in our country. We don't have the money to keep on doing what we are doing. Only cuts make a lot of sense because people are taxed too much already.
All of them.
Bill Clinton says “hello”- best law and order president on the crime of others I ever saw- but he like Trump, Prince Albert, Allen Dershowitz, and Bill Gates names all came out in Maxwell trial so screw him and all pedophiles- even while some in Water Cooler root for them
VanPastorMan
Hall of Famer
21 ministries to 9 by his first Executive Order. Good job.
So you're good with a single politician unilaterally gutting the government apparatus without any participation from the legislature? Dictator much?
I’m good with it if it’s allowed. Also, cutting the government and turning it over to the private sector is the opposite of a dictator.
Uh, no. A dictator is any individual who is empowered to dictate what the law is. Doesn't mean he can't dictate privatization.
lol…because there is a long history of dictators turning over power and capital to private citizens 🙄
That's actually where the term comes from.
Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus - Wikipedia
That guy was awesome. Milking cows on Monday and taking souls on Saturdays. He’s the farmer version of William Wallace.That's actually where the term comes from.
Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
SC, but what if the leader turns over the government run entities to cronies for his and their control and profit ?
Think Putin.
I assume most of the positions are just being cut. There isn’t anything being turned over to cronies. The market will decide if the jobs are needed or not.
As for your question, I wouldn’t consider cutting government jobs and giving it to another person a free market practice, so I’d be against it. It would be just more of the same.
SC, guess we are talking about two different functions of government. Your emphasis was on cutting government jobs and my concern was about turning over government ownership as can be found in socialist countries.
SC, upon reflection after reading your post, I must admit my remarks about Milei turning over government owned entities to cronies probably doesn't fit the situation in Argentina.
VanPastorMan
Hall of Famer
Biden signed an executive order to stop the keystone pipeline. Were you ok with that? Btw, what is wrong with cutting government? The bigger. Government is the.less freedom people have.
And good for us. If this dude is successful and can make Argentina a successful US aligned model in South America, that would be great for us.
Why would he align with us? I don't think he did what he did because he's pro-US. I think he did it because he's naturally inclined to nationalism and protectionism. You think I'm reading him wrong?
He totally is in it for Argentina but he has a worldview that is going to make him more likely to want to do business with countries in the US led sphere than those in the Russia/China sphere. The world is being divided back up as our power/influence has waned over the past few decades. His rejection of BRICS is a good thing for us. At worst it makes them neutral in the realignment. We are back to competing visions for the world, the China vision is one that would be bad for us and bad for the world. Every obstacle to them asserting themselves somewhere else in the world is good.
It seems like a no brainer. What he is trying to accomplish is much more similar to the U.S. than China/Russia. Not to mention he’s in the U.S. backyard. He’d be a fool to not ally with us in my opinion. I know he is a blow hard and eccentric, but he’s essentially a hardcore free market capitalist…..aka my animal spirit.
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Ya, I think the current world economic order means you either align w the US or China. There is no third option for struggling countries trying to “modernize”. It also means you align yourself politically or at least make significant concessions. And for US partnership, it most often requires military cooperation
I think the US will be happy to give Argentina a shot. We’re mostly friendly with Brazil but they are the big dog in s. America and can chart their own course. A rising Argentina will make Brazil feel a little less secure, which the US is fine with.
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He campaigned on closer U.S. relations, I think.
Interesting. I'm just reading some of his statements now. Pro-US and pro-Israel? Thatcher fanboy? Things must be really bad in Argentina for him to get elected on that sort of platform.
Ha wrong!!! They’re World Cup champions. Get yourself a Messi prayer card
Lionel Messi: The love story that moved the Argentina captain | CNN
As captain of the Argentine national team, Lionel Messi fulfilled his lifelong dream by leading his country to World Cup glory at Qatar 2022.
Things have been bad in Argentina for a long time.
So, to sum up, you're OK with Presidents issuing orders without Congressional approval, but are against it when done by a libertarian in another country?
