Yeah, I just remember it was a big deal under Reagan and I thought it was a bad decision at the time.
another elementary school shooting
- Thread starter kurt cloverdales
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And I'm sure someone somewhere claimed that a social worker would help in every single instance....?
He just bought the AR-15s and ammo last week.
No reported criminal record previously and reportedly only posted on FB 30 minutes before that he would shoot his grandmother and then 15 minutes before that he was going to shoot up the school.
He also dropped out of school during the pandemic. Many of us said at the time that this would cause social upheaval.
Don’t now what happened to the link, but it’s repeated below.
For #1, the casual tossing around of the phrase “toxic masculinity” and the depiction of young men as perverts or causing them to devolve into Incels has become quite a problem. It causes boys to tune out and be disenfranchised. It’s all over the internet, social media and in many homes - especially those of single mothers.
Young Men and Society: We Will Only Get Out What We Put In
When our book Man Interrupted was published in 2016, concern over boy’s and men’s issues, however legitimate, could not have been more unpopular. It’s a new world out there for everybody, yet amidst the shifting economic, social, and technological climates, boys are getting left behind. There...ifstudies.org
NYS
The article you linked that spoke of too few men in primary education is true, but I am not sure of the solution. Simply put, primary education isn't seen as socially high up as secondary education, and neither as high up as administration. Men are 76% of superintendents, 67% of HS principals, 60% of middle school, and 32% of elementary. So that 32% is low, but I believe it is higher than male teachers.
The argument goes we men are more status-oriented, how do we confer status on a second-grade teacher?
Wasn't Biden going to put Beto in charge of figuring out gun laws?
I have read through several of the pages of comments and there were several reasonable thoughts and comments. There were also the usual defenders of guns don't kill people, new laws won't help, get rid of guns, etc, blaming one or the other parties, or in general nothing we can do will stop the slaughter. Some of the post total lack of empathy made me angry.
But no one mentioned the fact that excluding the third world countries with banana republics our own country stands alone in the number of mass gun deaths. We simply stand alone as the worst country in the world in terms of gun violence by actual facts, not my opinion. Other countries have a fraction of the gun deaths that we have and there has to be a reason and at least one reason is the harsher gun laws. I'm sure someone could also point out they don't have the gun culture we do. But imo there is another reason.
We have two absolutely broken political parties that do not do what the people of our country elected them to do but perform in accordance with what the special interest wishes them to do. The liberal and conservative dark money people give millions for one reason and that is they want something in return. We will hear a lot of thoughts and prayer speeches as these spineless pokies wait for it to all die down and back to business as usual.
I have no solution to end this merry-go-round but I hope others feel the same rage as I do today for the endless do-nothing-congress. Take a moment to consider the 19 parents and the unspeakable pain they are experiencing today. We lost a grandchild 12 years ago and I can not put into words the agonizing sense of loss that followed. Theirs will be worse.
But no one mentioned the fact that excluding the third world countries with banana republics our own country stands alone in the number of mass gun deaths. We simply stand alone as the worst country in the world in terms of gun violence by actual facts, not my opinion. Other countries have a fraction of the gun deaths that we have and there has to be a reason and at least one reason is the harsher gun laws. I'm sure someone could also point out they don't have the gun culture we do. But imo there is another reason.
We have two absolutely broken political parties that do not do what the people of our country elected them to do but perform in accordance with what the special interest wishes them to do. The liberal and conservative dark money people give millions for one reason and that is they want something in return. We will hear a lot of thoughts and prayer speeches as these spineless pokies wait for it to all die down and back to business as usual.
I have no solution to end this merry-go-round but I hope others feel the same rage as I do today for the endless do-nothing-congress. Take a moment to consider the 19 parents and the unspeakable pain they are experiencing today. We lost a grandchild 12 years ago and I can not put into words the agonizing sense of loss that followed. Theirs will be worse.
Reagan pushed for California too close down institutions when he was governor. Jerry Brown carried that torch and decimated the California system.
As president Reagan repealed the Mental Health Systems Act that was put in place by Carter. The dems and Carter were trying to restart funding for mental institutions and clinics. Reagan was the death nail for all that.
So yes started under LBJ. Nail in the coffin was driven by Reagan.
Don't know yet what Ramos' past was, but if he had any other run-ins with LEO that were non-violent, the social worker could have made an impact earlier in his life so that we didn't get to this point. I also didn't suggest SWs would solve everything....I think I even mentioned non-violent/dangerous situations not necessarily being appropriate.
Your response is disingenuous to the hilt.
I'm pretty liberal and I've never cared much for Beto. Typical celebrity politician who has never reallly accomplished much.
However Abbott shouldn't be throwing stones right now. His record on gun safety is pretty terrible.
What the hell does do with my comments to do with Beto O'Roake? I was talking about dead children or is that simply too hard for hard for you to process?
The argument about social workers being used more in certain situations rose specifically out of some cases where police were called to scenes with a mentally disturbed person (teens, even), and in short order they had gunned him/her down. We're talking unarmed but erratic behaving individuals that would not follow orders from cops such as "put your hands over your head". One case was in Chicago IIRC.
Social workers with mediation/deescalation experience have been shown to be effective in such situations, and are also very effective in preventing violence in domestic violence situations, which of course are EXTREMELY common calls for police.
Social workers with mediation/deescalation experience have been shown to be effective in such situations, and are also very effective in preventing violence in domestic violence situations, which of course are EXTREMELY common calls for police.
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We can't even get proper mental and behavioral health professionals at medical facilities. The idea that we're going to get SWs that can address serious issues in high-stakes circumstances is ignorant.
Operating for more than three decades, the Crisis Assistance Helping Out on the Streets program in Eugene, Oregon, dispatches a medic and a crisis worker instead of a police officer to non-violent calls involving mental illness, homelessness and addiction. In Dallas, three-person teams made up of a paramedic, a social worker from a local hospital and a police officer are dispatched to mental health calls in the south central part of the city. A number of other cities across the US are either putting together or considering similar programs.
one success story from Kentucky
Ignorant? hardly.
www.theguardian.com
one success story from Kentucky
Ignorant? hardly.
The US police department that decided to hire social workers
In 2016, the Alexandria, Kentucky, police chief talked the city into hiring a social worker – and four years on, the current chief sees the program as indispensable
You get what you pay for. If it were a priority to us, we'd find ways to make changes. Just like everything else. Not a quick fix, necessarily, but progress towards a solution.
Or just do nothing. We're good at that.
You are probably right. It takes special and skilled people to fully understand illness of all kinds. Hell we pay excellent wages and still can’t find skilled or unskilled laborers. It’s great in a perfect world though.
Yea, a bunch of them would love to try it. A three member team for one of the largest cities in the country... that'll do it. Tell me how many behavioral health institutions aren't dramatically understaffed and seeking additional counselors, psychiatrists, etc.? Probably less than 5%. I haven't come across one in years.
This TX town has a census of 15,000. It's a miracle they even have any healthcare professionals given the disparity of rural areas. There's no way they are going to have the ability to employ qualified personnel that can handle difficult situations.
You seemed to miss a letter.
I will highlight it for you
In Dallas, three-person teams made up of a paramedic, a social worker from a local hospital and a police officer are dispatched to mental health calls...
Not one team. Not one social worker. One on every team, with many teams.
You're welcome.
I guess that kinda kills the "let them have fistfights to blow off some steam" theory from a few pages back.
No, if read the news that’s what was being reported. That’s what Paul Gosar was tweeting.
No, it's part of an actual strategy but the right keeps deflecting from it while offering nothing but platitudes and prayers.
The licensing and registration is like a curfew, as it will separate the actual 'good guys with a gun' from the paranoid nutjobs, the wannabe gravy seal militia, the gang bangers, the drug smugglers.
While still allowing the real 'good guys with a gun' the ability to have as many guns as they want.
If I were King.
1. Figure out a profitable buyback. Allow the guns that you don't want to register to be returned for a good profit.
2. Pass legislation that all gun owners need to pass a licensing application and must register all of their guns.
3. After that happens, you go after those that didn't hard. Like a curfew, anyone out after curfew will be arrested and the penalty will be severe...like 5 to 10 years if your caught with an unregistered gun.
That's how you use legislation to clean things up as quickly as possible.
Sorry if already discussed, I'm back on page 6 trying to catch up.
We do produce more nuts than we used to. And you’re exactly right it begins in Elementary School. Why wouldn’t young kids from unstable families be confused? Look at the social bull we start teaching at a young age. Hell they don’t even know if they’re a boy or girl.
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anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa
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That seems like an excellent approach but NOT at the expense of police boots on the ground. And that’s exactly what morons were calling for in 2020. A lot of morons. Many in here.Operating for more than three decades, the Crisis Assistance Helping Out on the Streets program in Eugene, Oregon, dispatches a medic and a crisis worker instead of a police officer to non-violent calls involving mental illness, homelessness and addiction. In Dallas, three-person teams made up of a paramedic, a social worker from a local hospital and a police officer are dispatched to mental health calls in the south central part of the city. A number of other cities across the US are either putting together or considering similar programs.
one success story from Kentucky
Ignorant? hardly.
The US police department that decided to hire social workers
In 2016, the Alexandria, Kentucky, police chief talked the city into hiring a social worker – and four years on, the current chief sees the program as indispensable
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anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa
Guest
This is the problem. This is where - and we see it time and again in these shootings and in terrorism - they’re known offenders to police but they cannot “do” anything about it. That has to change.
Access to guns is one thing, but these nut jobs were always going to try to kill people.
Seems some common sense solutions would be at a minimum.... to implement what Florida did after the Parkland shooting. Red flag laws and age 21 minimum to purchase a gun.
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anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa
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Precisely - at a minimum. And then start to go after the military grade hardware.
How dare Beto O'Rourke turn a political event into a political event.
Earlier in this thread I said something to the effect of we're beholden to the strong lobbying arm of scared pussies.
I'd like to rescind that and offer this up.
We're beholden to the lobbying efforts of scared, pussy hypocrites.
I'd like to rescind that and offer this up.
We're beholden to the lobbying efforts of scared, pussy hypocrites.
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Yeah this list helps debunk the concept that guns equal safety.
If that were the case, our country would be the safest in the world by far.
Paul Gosar also deleted the tweet because it was a insanely stupid thing to tweet.
I go back to my story about how my biggest gun zealot friend once struck out swinging in a critical moment in a weekend, beer league softball game because he was too nervous and amped up.
He's the last guy I want firing off rounds in a crowd because he feels threatened which makes him even more nervous and amped up.
The collateral damage would be Team America World Police like.
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anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa
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anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa
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