What we've learned in the past 2 weeks

[outlawyer]

1. Arizona is really good on a neutral floor.

2. Kansas is really good at home.

3. Rutgers is much tougher than IU.

4. IU is not very good against really good teams away from AH.

5. We need both point guards (X and JHS) playing well to ha e a chance to beat really good teams.

6. TOs, lack of rebounding, and bad shooting usually lead to losses.

7. IU keeps playing this way will put us on the bubble yet again for March.

 

[Hoosiervannah]

Since winning away games will be nearly impossible for this team, I’d say the bubble is a done deal.

 

[8Stars5Banners]

Since winning away games will be nearly impossible for this team, I’d say the bubble is a done deal.

We live for the bubble

 

[benhyoung14]

About half of that is true.

1. What kind of intensity it takes to lose.

2. Need JHS healthy.

3. This team is still learning how to play together.

4. Without X, IU is a one dimensional team which can be managed.

5. Don't play March basketball in December.

 

[Hoosier Clarion]

Rutgers record indicates they're pretty tough at home.

 

[McNutt76]

1. Arizona is really good on a neutral floor.

2. Kansas is really good at home.

3. Rutgers is much tougher than IU.

4. IU is not very good against really good teams away from AH.

5. We need both point guards (X and JHS) playing well to ha e a chance to beat really good teams.

6. TOs, lack of rebounding, and bad shooting usually lead to losses.

7. IU keeps playing this way will put us on the bubble yet again for March.

In my opinion, we need to play Trey Galloway more. The kid knows how to play basketball and he pours his heart and soul into it. I also like his dribble penetration.

 

[RegionHoosiers]

I think scheduling these games were a good idea. Team should know now what it takes.

 

[kurt cloverdales]

what I have learned is that my expectations for this team, were overly optimistic

 

[Lucy01]

what I have learned is that my expectations for this team, were overly optimistic

I’ll second that!

 

[bsmitty08]

We have learned Woodson is not the answer.
We are seeing why TJD is still in college and the NBA doesn’t have much interest.
We are soft.
Our guards are undisciplined
We have no system.
We have zero shooting

I hate to say it but Matt Painter does much more with less talent.

 

[Harry Hondo]

Meh.. Purdue beat Davidson by only 8 in Mackey and had to get lucky to win at Nebraska. Is there that big of a difference between the “big ten favorite” and IU?

The season is still relatively young. Let it play out.

 

[kurt cloverdales]

Meh.. Purdue beat Davidson by only 8 in Mackey and had to get lucky to win at Nebraska. Is there that big of a difference between the “big ten favorite” and IU?

The season is still relatively young. Let it play out.

been letting it play out the last 30 years, keep seeing the same movie

 

[SRIV94]

Meh.. Purdue beat Davidson by only 8 in Mackey and had to get lucky to win at Nebraska. Is there that big of a difference between the “big ten favorite” and IU?

The season is still relatively young. Let it play out.

Game was in Indy, but point taken.

 

[Harry Hondo]

Game was in Indy, but point taken.

Just found that out. Still, they aren’t looking that impressive. The B1G is still winnable by several teams, including IU. Let’s just hope IU gets better as the season progresses.

 

[Hoosiervannah]

Just found that out. Still, they aren’t looking that impressive. The B1G is still winnable by several teams, including IU. Let’s just hope IU gets better as the season progresses.

Agree but going to be hard to get better with injuries already piling up. Sucks.

 

[Tscurlo]

I think scheduling these games were a good idea. Team should know now what it takes.

Well one thing for sure.... it gives us tape to watch on what we need to work on for March.
Exposes our weaknesses against great teams. Hope it helps us throughout the B1G.

 

[steelyvan]

We have learned Woodson is not the answer.
We are seeing why TJD is still in college and the NBA doesn’t have much interest.
We are soft.
Our guards are undisciplined
We have no system.
We have zero shooting

I hate to say it but Matt Painter does much more with less talent.

does PU really have "less talent" ?

 

[benhyoung14]

We have learned Woodson is not the answer.
We are seeing why TJD is still in college and the NBA doesn’t have much interest.
We are soft.
Our guards are undisciplined
We have no system.
We have zero shooting

I hate to say it but Matt Painter does much more with less talent.

Lemme guess.. you were part of the sky is falling crew after NW. It's DECEMBER!!! No coach gets his team to gell by December...none. Otherwise we would skip the regular season and go straight to NCAA tournament. Woodson is the best thing since Knight and has had a better start than CRMK.

 

[bsmitty08]

does PU really have "less talent" ?

Lemme guess.. you were part of the sky is falling crew after NW. It's DECEMBER!!! No coach gets his team to gell by December...none. Otherwise we would skip the regular season and go straight to NCAA tournament. Woodson is the best thing since Knight and has had a better start than CRMK.

Purdue has less talent but recruits the state and gets kids that play hard, shoot and play to Purdue’s system.

Also what have you seen from Woodson to say that?

 

[hoosier_est_1984]

That I cant wait tell X is gone. Hes the most selfish player weve ever hsd in the 30 years ive been watching.

That JHS isnt the answer, so much deeper than that.

That it still remains to be the lack of intensity, year after year after year, coach after coach after coach.

That we constantly recuit the softest players, we never recruit aggressive players like kenyan martin or demarcus cousins, and instead recruit betas who are always shook playing outside assembly hall.

That we are no where closer to prime time at this point with Woodson than we were with Miller or Crean.

That the players really dont care about playing to the best effiecient ability of theirs, they care about the money behind the nil, nba, or overseas that lurks, girls, drugs (weed/alcohol) and campus popularity.
Understandable with the latter, but playing to actually win in an IU jersey should be first with ppl built like champions, not showing up only for all the other reasons.

That Uncle Mark is a little bitch

 

[Hoosiervannah]

That I cant wait tell X is gone. Hes the most selfish player weve ever hsd in the 30 years ive been watching.

That JHS isnt the answer, so much deeper than that.

That it still remains to be the lack of intensity, year after year after year, coach after coach after coach.

That we constantly recuit the softest players, we never recruit aggressive players like kenyan martin or demarcus cousins, and instead recruit betas who are always shook playing outside assembly hall.

That we are no where closer to prime time at this point with Woodson than we were with Miller or Crean.

That the players really dont care about playing to the best effiecient ability of theirs, they care about the money behind the nil, nba, or overseas that lurks, girls, drugs (weed/alcohol) and campus popularity.
Understandable with the latter, but playing to actually win in an IU jersey should be first with ppl built like chamipons, not showing up for only for all the other reasons.

That Uncle Mark is a little bitch

Bailey, Alford, Hilman, Coverdale - those guys f’n cared and it showed.

 

[benhyoung14]

Purdue has less talent but recruits the state and gets kids that play hard, shoot and play to Purdue’s system.

Also what have you seen from Woodson to say that?

JHS, TB, and MR. Thet are freshman (TB was last year) and will have lapses and be inconsistent.

 

[bsmitty08]

JHS, TB, and MR. Thet are freshman (TB was last year) and will have lapses and be inconsistent.

Loyer-freshman, Smith- freshman, Furst/Kauffman soph. So what’s your argument again?

 

[benhyoung14]

Loyer-freshman, Smith- freshman, Furst/Kauffman soph. So what’s your argument again?

IT'S DECEMBER!!! You realize Painter isn't in his second year right? How long did it take Painter to achieve a record over .500? I'll give you a hint. It's more than 2. I'll assume those are Purdue players that I could GAF about. Yes, Painter has built a wonderful program that has done an outstanding job of flaming out in the NCAA tournament and that is perfectly acceptable for them. This will be a sweet 16 team. Be patient and let Woodson do his job.

 

[benhyoung14]

That I cant wait tell X is gone. Hes the most selfish player weve ever hsd in the 30 years ive been watching.

That JHS isnt the answer, so much deeper than that.

That it still remains to be the lack of intensity, year after year after year, coach after coach after coach.

That we constantly recuit the softest players, we never recruit aggressive players like kenyan martin or demarcus cousins, and instead recruit betas who are always shook playing outside assembly hall.

That we are no where closer to prime time at this point with Woodson than we were with Miller or Crean.

That the players really dont care about playing to the best effiecient ability of theirs, they care about the money behind the nil, nba, or overseas that lurks, girls, drugs (weed/alcohol) and campus popularity.
Understandable with the latter, but playing to actually win in an IU jersey should be first with ppl built like chamipons, not showing up only for all the other reasons.

That Uncle Mark is a little bitch

Give Woodson 3 to 4 years to implement his system and their will be vast differences. JHS was a stud against UNC. You get that same play in March and you got a FF team. He will be inconsistent. Most of the roster are AM recruits and are slightly tougher than he would have them if he were still here. X is X but a key to the team. IU will be tough next year starting JHS, MR, and TB.

 

[Radio Zero]

Give Woodson 3 to 4 years to implement his system and their will be vast differences. JHS was a stud against UNC. You get that same play in March and you got a FF team. He will be inconsistent. Most of the roster are AM recruits and are slightly tougher than he would have them if he were still here. X is X but a key to the team. IU will be tough next year starting JHS, MR, and TB.

Not fair to Archie. *He* had to work with Crean recruits.

 

[Paterfamilias]

Lemme guess.. you were part of the sky is falling crew after NW. It's DECEMBER!!! No coach gets his team to gell by December...none. Otherwise we would skip the regular season and go straight to NCAA tournament. Woodson is the best thing since Knight and has had a better start than CRMK.

Knight's first team finished 3rd in the Big 10 (9-5) and ranked #17 in the AP. His second team won the Big 10, finished ranked #6 and gave UCLA's Walton Gang a scare in the Final 4.

Woody's second season is obviously far from over and it didn't seem totally unreasonable that this team might have a shot at equaling (or close to) the accomplishments of that 72-73 team. They don't look promising right now though and comparisons to the likes of Downing, Ritter, Buck, Laz and Green feel a bit on the silly side.

I still think Woodson has the pieces to have a really good team and if this were his 5th season, with an established culture and foundational identity, maybe they'd be rolling. It seems to me like we're still seeing repeats of that St. Mary's ass whoopin' which makes me doubtful that they get where they want to go this season.

The worst part for me, and I'm no expert, is that a lot of pundit types are starting to lean in the direction of IU's early season woes being reflective of coaching/game planning/preparedness type issues. Well coached teams will frequently overcome early season hiccups and get good at the right time.

Huge Woodson fan here and I'll be rooting for him all the way, but I think we'll know where we stand as far as Head Coach by the end of this season. Two years would normally be too soon to judge, but too much talent, depth and experience to not be really good by years end.

 

[bsmitty08]

IT'S DECEMBER!!! You realize Painter isn't in his second year right? How long did it take Painter to achieve a record over .500? I'll give you a hint. It's more than 2. I'll assume those are Purdue players that I could GAF about. Yes, Painter has built a wonderful program that has done an outstanding job of flaming out in the NCAA tournament and that is perfectly acceptable for them. This will be a sweet 16 team. Be patient and let Woodson do his job.

Woodson isn’t a rookie coach dude. Woodson isn’t taking this team anywhere.

 

[bailey777]

Woodson isn’t a rookie coach dude. Woodson isn’t taking this team anywhere.

Woodson was a feel good hire I said that on day one. He never would of been looked at if he didnt go ti IU. We have enough talent to make him look ok this year but starting next year I highly doubt we see 20 wins.

 

[BCCHoosier]

Bailey, Alford, Hilman, Coverdale - those guys f’n cared and it showed.

As did Cheaney, Graham, Henderson, and Garrett.

 

[hoosier_est_1984]

Give Woodson 3 to 4 years to implement his system and their will be vast differences. JHS was a stud against UNC. You get that same play in March and you got a FF team. He will be inconsistent. Most of the roster are AM recruits and are slightly tougher than he would have them if he were still here. X is X but a key to the team. IU will be tough next year starting JHS, MR, and TB.

expand...

"Give Woodson 3 to 4 years to implement his system and their will be vast differences."

3 fine at the longest and that includes being at the top at the end of that bout, all while seeing CONSISTENT improvments along those 3 years.
We cant keep giving these coaches excessive amounts of time with inconsistent results only to waste time and fire them in the end.

"JHS was a stud against UNC"...., and was terrible against Kansas....and thats ok, ill make an excuse for him being green. Again though it all compounds as inconsistent results. The inconsistency shows a lack of effort, and thats both on the players and the coach.
We know this team can do better then they do in big time games.
But they dont. Its like grounding your kid for "B's" when you know damn well they can make "A's"... This is Indiana basketball and sorry not sorry but we expect a lot, and if youre not willing to give max effort then lets part ways, both with players and coaches.
The only one I can see giving max effort all the time is Galloway, and that root problem falls on the coach.

"You get that same play in March and you got a FF team"-
this is a very flawed way of coming to a conclusion.
Ask yourself how many sub par teams can say that when they beat a great team.
Now ask yourself about how many actually will.
The inconsistency of Iu has proven time and time again where IU will be years later when you put more weight into the occasional big wins (unc was harldy even a great win at this point) vs the more majority of bad losses (Rutgers),terrible blowouts with countless mistakes (Arizona/Kansas)

 

[bsmitty08]

Woodson was a feel good hire I said that on day one. He never would have been looked at if he didnt go ti IU. We have enough talent to make him look ok this year but starting next year I highly doubt we see 20 wins.

I see us being barely .500 in conference play

 

[benhyoung14]

Knight's first team finished 3rd in the Big 10 (9-5) and ranked #17 in the AP. His second team won the Big 10, finished ranked #6 and gave UCLA's Walton Gang a scare in the Final 4.

Woody's second season is obviously far from over and it didn't seem totally unreasonable that this team might have a shot at equaling (or close to) the accomplishments of that 72-73 team. They don't look promising right now though and comparisons to the likes of Downing, Ritter, Buck, Laz and Green feel a bit on the silly side.

I still think Woodson has the pieces to have a really good team and if this were his 5th season, with an established culture and foundational identity, maybe they'd be rolling. It seems to me like we're still seeing repeats of that St. Mary's ass whoopin' which makes me doubtful that they get where they want to go this season.

The worst part for me, and I'm no expert, is that a lot of pundit types are starting to lean in the direction of IU's early season woes being reflective of coaching/game planning/preparedness type issues. Well coached teams will frequently overcome early season hiccups and get good at the right time.

Huge Woodson fan here and I'll be rooting for him all the way, but I think we'll know where we stand as far as Head Coach by the end of this season. Two years would normally be too soon to judge, but too much talent, depth and experience to not be really good by years end.

I didn't realize there were so few teams in the NCAA tournament in the 70s. That obviously changes my comparison. I hoped to win 2/4 of Xavier, UNC, AZ, and KU. I got one of the wins flipped but still met my expectation. Is this team capable of making the final four? I think so but MR and JHS have to be playing like hardened Sophomores come March. It's the absolute ceiling but still possible. I think the biggest reason for the poor showing is JHS has been out and it was in that dangerous period after finals and before the end of the year. Woodson had his team peaking at the right time last year. We'll see if he can do it again.

 

[Indianaftw]

1. Were soft AF except against teams we should beat.

FIFY...Sorries. Let me see a good hard foul on the road and the players and bench get fired up and pissed. They act like the town they travelled from. jus sayin.

 

[guppy likes purdue]

IT'S DECEMBER!!! You realize Painter isn't in his second year right? How long did it take Painter to achieve a record over .500? I'll give you a hint. It's more than 2. I'll assume those are Purdue players that I could GAF about. Yes, Painter has built a wonderful program that has done an outstanding job of flaming out in the NCAA tournament and that is perfectly acceptable for them. This will be a sweet 16 team. Be patient and let Woodson do his job.

It was 2 years?
Painter took over a team that went 7-21 the year before went 9-19 year 1 and 22-12 in year 2 with a winning conference record and a single NCAA tourney win

 

[DCDAVID]

I didn't realize there were so few teams in the NCAA tournament in the 70s.

IU’s undefeated 75-76 team beat Michigan to win the Natty. That was only the second year in which more than one team from a conference was allowed in the tourney (and even at that it was capped at 2 teams).
Prior to that you could be the 4th ranked team in the country, as an example, but if you finished second in your conference to the number one team in the country you did not get into the tourney.

 

[destewart]

IT'S DECEMBER!!! You realize Painter isn't in his second year right? How long did it take Painter to achieve a record over .500? I'll give you a hint. It's more than 2. I'll assume those are Purdue players that I could GAF about. Yes, Painter has built a wonderful program that has done an outstanding job of flaming out in the NCAA tournament and that is perfectly acceptable for them. This will be a sweet 16 team. Be patient and let Woodson do his job.

Painter was 25-5 and 17-1 in his first year at SIU. He inherited a dumpster fire from Keady and went 9-19 and 3-13 in year one at Purdue. In year two he was 22-12 and 9-7 good for a 4th place tie in BT and made the NCAA second round. By yesr 3 he was 25-9 and 13-3 in Big Ten with secondplace finish and NCAA second round. He’s had 3 losing seasons in 19 seasons of coaching.

 

[RegionHoosiers]

If I remember right Painter had a good start as he was hired as the next coach a year before Keady retired, so that gave him an opportunity to start recruiting.

It's fun to hate on PU but it's ridiculous to say Painter hasn't done a great job there. The Big Ten overall doesn't do well in March but his teams are almost always competitive in the upper part of the conference. And it can't be that easy to recruit the kinds of players that will give you a chance at the final 4 to W. Lafayette.

 

[Sir_Saucy]

I didn't realize there were so few teams in the NCAA tournament in the 70s. That obviously changes my comparison. I hoped to win 2/4 of Xavier, UNC, AZ, and KU. I got one of the wins flipped but still met my expectation. Is this team capable of making the final four? I think so but MR and JHS have to be playing like hardened Sophomores come March. It's the absolute ceiling but still possible. I think the biggest reason for the poor showing is JHS has been out and it was in that dangerous period after finals and before the end of the year. Woodson had his team peaking at the right time last year. We'll see if he can do it again.

Feb and March we ended the regular season 2-7. We won those 2 B1G tourney games otherwise we miss the NCAAT... again.

We were definitely not "peaking" at the right time.

 

[dr.jb]

The worst part for me, and I'm no expert, is that a lot of pundit types are starting to lean in the direction of IU's early season woes being reflective of coaching/game planning/preparedness type issues. Well coached teams will frequently overcome early season hiccups and get good at the right time.

well coached teams are at least equal to or better than the sum of their parts

poorly coached teams......

there is time for woody to right the ship but the clock is ticking