Was the IPFW loss last year an omen of things to come?

[snarlcakes]

We just need to realize that this board is made up of some posters who will never look at facts but only think with their emotions.

A fact is Archie is 28-24 at IU and 12-16 in the Big Ten. My opinion is Archie isn’t a good coach. A reasonable opinion. Another opinion is the reason Archie looks so awful is because he needs more time, player injuries and etc. That’s also reasonable. The only facts are Archie has a terrible winning percentage at IU. For comparison your boy Tom Crean currently has a better winning percentage. I’m sure your grinning ear to ear.

Now personally, I don’t get upset about this shit. I enjoy arguing and discussing basketball and try to post what I think the truth is. It has shit to do with emotions or being a meanie.

Some more facts are you still thought Tom Crean was a good coach after year 8 at IU. It’s also a fact Tom Crean was fired from IU. My opinion is you are clueless when it comes to figuring out who is and isn’t a good coach.

 

[Tasmanian Devil]

I really wish we could have seen how well the team had done if we had ALL our players. Even some of the players we have now have missed time due to injury. It has been a weird year in that regard.

If we had EVERYONE and had these results, I'd be leading the charge to criticize Archie.

But we haven't. All because our jerseys say INDIANA on the front doesn't make us invincible.

 

[Tasmanian Devil]

I know.

Davis was supposed to be rounding into form by now.

Who knows what Thompson and Hunter was going to give us. I do know that Thompson is a big, dude with a football mentality that helped lead his AAU Howard Pulley team to multiple AAU championships. He also dominated during the scrimmage, much more than Romeo, much more than anyone. That's all we've seen so who knows how big his loss really was...but we need active bigs that can hit three's in the worst possible way right now.

Who knows on Hunter. He was highly regarded as a six seven slasher. At a minimum I would think he'd been able to help during the times that Romeo and or Smith took plays off.

Our guards would still be a mess. Romeo still probably couldn't shoot so we'd still be pissed but...those guys at full I believe would have definitely helped.

Our guards are what they are.

But having extra bodies to spell guys inside (and to make sitting the bench a viable deterrent for Archie) would have had an enormous impact on how this team is playing. We damn sure wouldn't have lost 7 games in a row.

 

[fpeaugh]

You know what RIF means? You know - Reading Is Fundamental?

This is what I said:



"AS IT CURRENTLY IS" - what part of that do you not understand? I even put it in ALL CAPS.

You want to claim those teams have less than what IU CURRENTLY has? Ok - Here's a breakdown:


Purdue

Edwards, Carsen – 6-1 200 lbs JR, Unanimous 1st team All American

Eifert, Grady 6-6 220 lbsSR

Cline, Ryan 6-6 195 lbs SR

Williams, Trevion 6-9 280lbs FR (184)

Eastern, Nojel 6-6 220 lbs SO

Boudreaux, Evan 6-8 220 lbs Grad Transfer

Haarms, Matt 7-3 250 lbs SO

Wheeler, Aaron 6-9 200lbs RS FR

Stefanovic, Sasha 6-4 195 lbs FR (274)

Hunter Jr., Eric 6-3 170 lbs FR (278)


Wisconsin

Ethan Happ – 6-10237 lbs RS SR, 1st team All American

Davison, Brad 6-3 206 lbs SO

Trice, D'Mitrik 6-0 187 lbs RS SO

Iverson, Khalil 6-5 217 lbs SR

Reuvers, Nate 6-11 240 LBS SO

Ford, Aleem 6-8 220 lbs RS SO

Pritzl, Brevin 6-3 198 lbs RS JR

King, Kobe 6-4 203 lbs RS FR (433)


Iowa

Cook, Tyler 6-9 250 lbs JR

Garza, Luka 6-11 245 lbs SO

Wieskamp, Joe 6-6 205 lbs FR (579)

Bohannon, Jordan 6-1 185 lbs JR

Moss, Isaiah 6-5 208 lbs RS JR

Baer, Nicholas 6-7 218 lbs RS SR

Kriener, Ryan 6-9 255 lbs JR

McCaffery, Connor 6-5 205 lbs RS FR

Pemsl, Cordell 6-8 230 lbs JR

Dailey, Maishe 6-7 200 JR


Minnesota

Coffey, Amir 6-8 210 lbs JR

McBrayer, Dupree 6-5 195 lbs SR

Murphy, Jordan 6-7 250 lbs SR

Kalscheur, Gabe 6-4 200 lbs FR (603)

Oturu, Daniel 6-10 225 lbs FR (445)

Curry, Eric 6-9 240 lbs RS SO

Washington, Isaiah 6-1 195 lbs SO

Stockman, Matz 7-0 245 lbs RS SR


Rutgers

Geo Baker 6-4 180 lbs SO

Eugene Omoruyi 6-7 240 lbs JR

Montez Mathis 6-4 200 lbs FR (432)

Ron Harper Jr. 6-6 230 lbs FR (389)

Shaq Carter 6-9 245 lbs JR

Peter Kiss 6-5 190 lbs SO

Myles Johnson 6-10 255 lbs FR (323)

Caleb McConnell 6-6 190 lbs FR (239)

Shaquille Doorson 7-0 275 lbs Grad Student

Issa Thiam 6-10 190 lbs JR


OHIO STATE

Wesson, Kaleb 6-9 270 lbs SO

Jackson, C.J. 6-1 175 lbs SR

Muhammad, Luther 6-3 185 lbs FR (561)

Wesson, Andre 6-6 220 lbs JR

Young, Kyle 6-8 205 lbs SO

Washington Jr, Duane 6-3 190 lbs FR (344)

Woods, Keyshawn 6-3 205 lbs Gr Transfer

Jallow, Musa 6-5 200 lbs SO


Now, Compare those rosters to Indiana

Langford, Romeo 6-6 215 lbs FR (678)

Morgan, Juwan 6-8 232 lbs SR

Smith, Justin 6-7 227 lbs SO

Durham, Aljami 6-4 181 lbs SO

Phinisee, Rob 6-1 182 lbs FR (471)

Green, Devonte 6-3 185 lbs JR

Davis, De'Ron 6-10255 lbs JR

Fitzner, Evan 6-10 225 lbs Gr Transfer

Moore, Clifton 6-10 230 lbs SO

Forrester, Jake 6-8 218 lbs FR (38)

Anderson, Damezi 6-7 215 lbs FR (174)

Now, I KNOW what you're going to say: "BUT . . . BUT, INDIANA HAD TWO PLAYERS ON THE PRESEASON ALL BIG 10 TEAM!!!" . . . NFS, Sherlock. You think the voters back then would've picked IU to finish in the top 5 of the conference KNOWING they would not have Jerome Hunter and Race Thompson for the ENTIRE year (at least so far with Race), that with the rash of injuries to Devonte, Zach, DeRon, Phin, Al . . . that we'd just magically be able to overcome that?

I put in parenthesis the FRESHMAN minutes above on each team. Rutgers is the only other team with near as many of freshmen / young players in key roles.

But they also have something IU SORELY lacks - inside depth. You sub out Morgan or Smith, you bring in Moore or Forrester. Where's your bulk? Against Rutgers we were doing good - until we got in foul trouble and had to sub. We brought 6-8 218 lb freshman Forrester in for 6-8 232 lb Sr Morgan; Rutgers subs 6-10 255 lb freshman Johnson for 7-0 275 lbs Grad Student Doorson. And they still had 6-9 245 Carter avaialble, also. The majority of the teams you mention have VETERANS - look at what IU has in upperclassmen. Morgan, an injured Davis, a dope-smoking Green. You don't think that matters?

"Get a clue" You are a real dumb shit, you know that? CDK fits you to a T.

Your bias is clouding your judgement yet again.

We’re missing two unproven freshmen. That’s it. We’re the 4th or 5th most talented team in the Big Ten at a minimum...as it currently stands.

 

[fpeaugh]

Thankfully, I wasn’t on here for Creans first 3 years. The excuses for Archie are bizarre. I understand not wanting to fire him and giving up on him like myself. However, at least acknowledge he’s been terrible at IU so far.

Believe it or not it was even worse with Crean. It was a full on cult.

The only thing that hasn’t changed are the same posters running the cult. Just a different leader.

 

[fpeaugh]

Said it then? Bullshit!!

Here are the 3 threads that followed the Indiana St game.

FIRST
SECOND
THIRD

You didn't have a SINGLE EFFING POST in any of the 3 thread. You did LIKE one post out of the 3 threads. But that's it.

You LIE so much you can tell it apart from the truth . . . YDS

Pull your head out for some air every now and then. It’s cutting off circulation up there.

 

[Tasmanian Devil]

Your bias is clouding your judgement yet again.

We’re missing two unproven freshmen. That’s it. We’re the 4th or 5th most talented team in the Big Ten at a minimum...as it currently stands.

My bias?

Go back and look at those rosters again, CDK. Tell me who has LESS depth. bulk and EXPERIENCE than IU does.

 

[Tasmanian Devil]

Pull your head out for some air every now and then. It’s cutting off circulation up there.

"I said it THEN"

Your words, not mine. Where are all these statements you made THEN that @T.M.P. , @hondo314 and I shot down? Huh?

 

[snarlcakes]

Believe it or not it was even worse with Crean. It was a full on cult.

The only thing that hasn’t changed are the same posters running the cult. Just a different leader.

I plan on bowing out here at some point and coming back when it’s painfully obvious that even IU Scott see its. I know you will keep beating a dead horse

 

[TommyCracker]

Thankfully, I wasn’t on here for Creans first 3 years. The excuses for Archie are bizarre. I understand not wanting to fire him and giving up on him like myself. However, at least acknowledge he’s been terrible at IU so far.

I'll give you that.

I actually thought he was okay last year. We we're better than we started. Of course we started as low as possible.

But that starting lineup of Morgan, McSwain, McRoberts, Johnson and Newkirk is about as challenged as you can find for a high major. Smith contributed as a freshman too.

I gave him a B. Up from an F to start the year and the excuse that it was a shocking change.

This year we supposedly upgraded our talent. Romeo took over for Johnson was the big one. Phinesse was supposed to be an upgrade over Newkirk even as a freshman. Brought in a boatload of wings and forwards, surely one was going to emerge out of Smith, Hunter, Thompson, Anderson, Moore, Forrester. Surely someone would be an upgrade to Freddy.

No, we're worse. Blame injuries. Blame chemistry. Blame overrating talent.

But this is on Archie. He's lost the locker room and that's his main job.

If it continues he'll get an F for this year.

Does it mean we're doomed. I don't think so but I'll admit when a coach loses the fanbase it's pretty much over (see Alford, Weber, Turgeon, Crean) and it's best to move swiftly.

I like Archie. I would like to see if he can get us winning again so unless there's an obvious guy like Stevens available I'm giving him at least four years.

But it shouldn't take four years to get to the tournament.

He was going to do it in two until he lost the locker room. So again...F.

 

[victorbear]

A fact is Archie is 28-24 at IU and 12-16 in the Big Ten. My opinion is Archie isn’t a good coach. A reasonable opinion. Another opinion is the reason Archie looks so awful is because he needs more time, player injuries and etc. That’s also reasonable. The only facts are Archie has a terrible winning percentage at IU. For comparison your boy Tom Crean currently has a better winning percentage. I’m sure your grinning ear to ear.

Now personally, I don’t get upset about this shit. I enjoy arguing and discussing basketball and try to post what I think the truth is. It has shit to do with emotions or being a meanie.

Some more facts are you still thought Tom Crean was a good coach after year 8 at IU. It’s also a fact Tom Crean was fired from IU. My opinion is you are clueless when it comes to figuring out who is and isn’t a good coach.

I agree he is a good DEFENSIVE coach but so far his offensive coaching and his roster management has been awful.

 

[fpeaugh]

My bias?

Go back and look at those rosters again, CDK. Tell me who has LESS depth. bulk and EXPERIENCE than IU does.

Every team besides 3-4 in the Big Ten is your answer.

 

[Bulk VanderHuge]

I agree he is a good DEFENSIVE coach but so far his offensive coaching and his roster management has been awful.

Roster management?

 

[Tasmanian Devil]

Every team besides 3-4 in the Big Ten is your answer.

RIF

You don’t qualify

 

[fpeaugh]

My bias?

Go back and look at those rosters again, CDK. Tell me who has LESS depth. bulk and EXPERIENCE than IU does.

Jay Bilas must be wrong too huh? Just said this is a capable offense and capable team.

 

[Tasmanian Devil]

Jay Bilas must be wrong too huh? Just said this is a capable offense and capable team.

He also acknowledged the injuries. And said the key is for IU to maintain it for 40 minutes. Guess you missed that part huh?

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

You were another one. Now your ego has been crushed after you’ve been proven so wrong.

Not at all. I will enjoy when you’re proven wrong. I like the odds.

 

[fpeaugh]

Not at all. I will enjoy when you’re proven wrong. I like the odds.

I hope so too. But I was told the same on Crean.

 

[Tasmanian Devil]

I hope so too. But I was told the same on Crean.

You’re the one hoping for losses. That’s the only thing you’re hoping for.

 

[frikkenfrakken]

Said it then? Bullshit!!

Here are the 3 threads that followed the Indiana St game.

FIRST
SECOND
THIRD

You didn't have a SINGLE EFFING POST in any of the 3 thread. You did LIKE one post out of the 3 threads. But that's it.

You LIE so much you can tell it apart from the truth . . . YDS

I figured that would be the case, but was too lazy to look it up.

 

[frikkenfrakken]

I hope so too. But I was told the same on Crean.

Reply to the post pointing out you just lied, you friggin liar.

 

[fpeaugh]

Reply to the post pointing out you just lied, you friggin liar.

You really think there were only 3 threads after 20-30 point drummings by Indiana St and IPFW? Those were probably the only ones I didn’t post in.

 

[Courtsensetwo]

You’re the one hoping for losses. That’s the only thing you’re hoping for.

Juwan hurt...fire Fred Glass!!!

 

[RBB89]

The honeymoon is way over and the imminent 30 point beat down today won’t help matters at all.

Oh dear.

 

[Rakkasan29]

The honeymoon is way over and the imminent 30 point beat down today won’t help matters at all.

Good call.

 

[IUgradman]

Good call.

I got a prediction wrong. Me and 99.9% of the human population.

 

[rocketo]

They weren't ready to play.

John Beilein was 5-13, 9-9, and 7-11 in the conference going into his 4th season at Michigan. After starting with 3 wins against lower competition, he then drops 2 back to back including a loss to UTEP to sit at 3-2.

Imagine the disdain at that point. Then they went on a winning streak to close the noncon season, only to then lose 7 of the first 8 Big Ten games.

At that point in 2011, there could not have been any defense of his record in the Big Ten. A fan could not have made a strong case to keep him, and I'm sure most wanted him fired then and there, or probably earlier.

Even after three years of 1st, 4th, and 1st in the conference, he then fell to 9th and 8th in consecutive years. That is, he had had only 3 good seasons out of 9.

Since then, Beilein has won 26, 33, and now sit on a 20-2 record and a phenomenal year. He is safe now. He will retire there. But it was close. And honestly, I don't think he would have lasted at IU.

The point of all of this: Miller needs more time and he needs a healthy team

Hard to explain this to some. We need to foster stability to allow CAM to flourish. We gave Crean every chance and probably 2-3 years too many. But CAM should get at least 4 years IMO. Unless Brad Stevens calls IU himself and says he’s ready...

 

[Courtsensetwo]

I got a prediction wrong. Me and 99.9% of the human population.

(99% and me.)

 

[Courtsensetwo]

Reply to the post pointing out you just lied, you friggin liar.

I put him on ignore.

 

[Al Bino]

Even worse was the Indiana State loss at home by 30.

I said it then but I was quickly quieted by TMP, Taz, Jimbo, Hondo, Al Bino, and so many others in the cult telling me to shut up and don’t believe my eyes. They assured me Archie is elite and will be here 30+ years winning multiple titles. Never mind the warning signs...full speed ahead!

There you go again, making shit up and using outrageous claims. I said no such things. Link the posts to prove your point.

 

[tru123dt]

Jay Bilas must be wrong too huh? Just said this is a capable offense and capable team.

Yes this team is very capable and talented when all the parts are healthy but that has not happen since really early in the season.

 

[Al Bino]

Believe it or not it was even worse with Crean. It was a full on cult.

The only thing that hasn’t changed are the same posters running the cult. Just a different leader.

You keep spewing this cult crap and maybe you think if you say it enough it will be true but with most things you are wrong.

Start posting threads that back up your claims or STFU.

 

[frikkenfrakken]

You really think there were only 3 threads after 20-30 point drummings by Indiana St and IPFW? Those were probably the only ones I didn’t post in.

Prove it.

 

[fpeaugh]

Yes this team is very capable and talented when all the parts are healthy but that has not happen since really early in the season.

They were capable last night even without Morgan. You don’t win there without talent. We’ve proven we can do it. Enough of the excuses.

 

[T.M.P.]

Believe it or not it was even worse with Crean. It was a full on cult.

The only thing that hasn’t changed are the same posters running the cult. Just a different leader.

Again you are completely full of shit and now resorting to full on lies.

 

[speroni]

They were capable last night even without Morgan. You don’t win there without talent. We’ve proven we can do it. Enough of the excuses.

You DO realize this was the first time all season that a likely starter on the team (Davis) played meaningful minutes?

 

[ndhuntington]

I think any smart IU fan would agree that they never saw a 7 game losing streak IU has more talent and should of never lost 7 straight games. Alot falls on Archie and the coaching staff they have regressed alot this season I for one don't think any basketball coach needs 4 years football yes but basketball no it just gives people excuses.

 

[speroni]

I think any smart IU fan would agree that they never saw a 7 game losing streak IU has more talent and should of never lost 7 straight games. Alot falls on Archie and the coaching staff they have regressed alot this season I for one don't think any basketball coach needs 4 years football yes but basketball no it just gives people excuses.

While "any smart IU fan" may not have seen a seven game losing streak happening this year, "any smart IU fan" would also have to know that losing what likely would have been two starters for most of the season (Davis finally played meaningful minutes for the first time, and McRoberts has been injured for most of the season), another starter (Phinesee) for a significant period, and two reserves (Hunter and Thompson) for essentially the entire season so far, may be a significant cause for what appears to be a regression.

If you're going to blame the coaching staff for the losses, let's also give them credit for wins against Marquette, Louisville, and most improbably - at MSU.

And the idea that a football coach should get four years to get results, but a basketball coach shouldn't? Do football players get fewer years of eligibility than basketball players??

 

[ndhuntington]

McRoberts is not a starter neither is Davis to this point Davis has been a huge disappointment. A football coach needs to develop 105 players vs 13 for a basketball coach..

 

[ndhuntington]

Billy Donovan by year 3 was in sweet sixteen, Brad Stevens Ncaa runner up, Bruce Pearl sweet 16, Kelvin Sampson sweet sixteen, Bob Knight was 23-5 year 3, Tom Izzo sweet sixteen, Rick Pitino elite eight Roy Williams Ncaa Runner up. So to me by year 3 if were not a sweet sixteen team there is something wrong.