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Russia-Ukraine war has begun

UN resolution 1234 declares that Mexican drug cartels have become a threat to Mexico and world stability. Accordingly, we move to set up a 30,000 man security force to bring peace and order to the country.

"Ok, who would like to put their military on America's doorstep in an internationally sanctioned peace keeping force?"

Xi, Putin, and Khamenei: "We're in..."

What do you think 30,000 UN troops could do, invade?
 
UN resolution 1234 declares that Mexican drug cartels have become a threat to Mexico and world stability. Accordingly, we move to set up a 30,000 man security force to bring peace and order to the country.

"Ok, who would like to put their military on America's doorstep in an internationally sanctioned peace keeping force?"

Xi, Putin, and Khamenei: "We're in..."
I've got news - they're already in country.
 
Agree to disagree. Why would we care about what happens on the Mexican side of the border that would help us out?
Gotta step in here brother. Obviously there needs to be some adults step up in Mexico, but the only acceptable helmets allowed on our southern boarder are US SF or full out massive Army immobilization helmets. Most of us threw a total fit when someone tried to give our water ways to UN control. Massive UN troups on our southern boarder, oh hell no!
Mexico unwilling to stop their problem that we have paid for for 60 years should cause a total US invasion, just to stop what they are bought and paid for, for. No outside corruption needed, we have our own natural corruption that will profit from it. Sorry to admit.
 
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I've got news - they're already in country.
Then apparently being just as efficient as anything else the UN is tasked to do. Which is totally inept. The UN is a $ scrape off entity for the one world people. They fix NOTHING.
 
I think we are at a halt of major operations until the mud solidifies on about a month.
I'm keeping an eye on that bridge since that storm took out a bunch of the harbor defenses that the rooskies put in place. But yea, it looks like the Avdiivka meat waves have slowed either from weather or lack of amour replacement by the orcs.
 
I'm keeping an eye on that bridge since that storm took out a bunch of the harbor defenses that the rooskies put in place. But yea, it looks like the Avdiivka meat waves have slowed either from weather or lack of amour replacement by the orcs.
Russia will continue to stage large attacks against the Avdiivka salient, but given the correlation of forces and the maturity of the fortifications, I don’t see much happening other than the Russians killing mediocre infantry.
 
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Russia will continue to stage large attacks against the Avdiivka salient, but given the correlation of forces and the maturity of the fortifications, I don’t see much happening other than the Russians killing mediocre infantry.
I just looked, -514 orcs yesterday in the industrial zone south east of Avdiivka. -1,141 across the whole front. High #'s on other hardware too.

 
I just looked, -514 orcs yesterday in the industrial zone south east of Avdiivka. -1,141 across the whole front. High #'s on other hardware too.

I guess there could be wild cards to play…

The Surovikin Line has been breached near Verbove; what is lacking is the capability to reduce the enormous minefields and open an operational gap. Might see something here
 
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I just looked, -514 orcs yesterday in the industrial zone south east of Avdiivka. -1,141 across the whole front. High #'s on other hardware too.


I am taking all the numbers with some skepticism. The Russians have reportedly killed every Ukrainian twice. If the Ukrainian numbers are accurate they are verging on every Russian dead. Still, it is very apparent Vlad doesn't care how much it takes for his name to appear next to Peter the Great's. I wonder if Russia's letters to next of kin read:

Dear Comrade,​
We are very happy to inform you that you have the honor of your child/husband/father having given their life so the name Putin shall be forever remembered in Russia. We realize this is a great honor for you to honor Comrade Putin in this way. To show your appreciation for this tremendous honor, please send another family member or money. Future generations will recognize how lucky you were to live under Vlad the Greatest.​
 
The next night, another tank car train exploded near the same location, at the Itykit-Okusikan crossing in Buryatia.

That’s over 3,000 miles from the Ukrainian border
Yep. I’ve been watching it. It seems there’s 3 lines for transport with china and they damaged/ shut down 2 of them. If it wasn’t SF’s doing it then it could be sympathizers of the BS the orcs are pulling. I’m not sure which would be better, SF’s or Russians doing the right thing.
 
Yep. I’ve been watching it. It seems there’s 3 lines for transport with china and they damaged/ shut down 2 of them. If it wasn’t SF’s doing it then it could be sympathizers of the BS the orcs are pulling. I’m not sure which would be better, SF’s or Russians doing the right thing.
I tried to link an article from BBC but am not having any luck. Anyway, they said the first explosion disabled the main line through the tunnel. The second explosion blocked a 35-meter-high bridge on the alternate route. Where’s DanC …I think he can read Russian
 
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I tried to link an article from BBC but am not having any luck. Anyway, they said the first explosion disabled the main line through the tunnel. The second explosion blocked a 35-meter-high bridge on the alternate route. Where’s DanC …I think he can read Russian
I think there’s even one more route, but I bet that dude is guarded now like a man’s first 15 yr old daughter at a Kentucky family reunion!
 
I tried to link an article from BBC but am not having any luck. Anyway, they said the first explosion disabled the main line through the tunnel. The second explosion blocked a 35-meter-high bridge on the alternate route. Where’s DanC …I think he can read Russian
I used to be able to. Pretty rusty now, after 50 years. Damn, it hurts to type that.
 
I agree, but Ukraine isn't driving the deficit and it wouldn't matter if all Ukraine aid stopped today - the debt will continue to grow exponentially.

This is why the West looks weak to our enemies - anything that takes too much time or money and we lose interest. We expect instant success while our enemies view their struggle against us as lifetime commitments - and they won't stop until they've won. Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan..... all were countries we should have beat into submission and didn't because we never considered them real 'wars'.

And now that we have people literally dying to actually defend the West against real enemies, we throw up our hands and say "Well, it's taking too long and we're running a deficit, so.....".

Israel should be worried about their relationship with us.
I'm not sure about this. The U.S. spent 18 years in Afghanistan. It still has troops in Iraq, but were there officially for 11 years while still doing combat missions into 2021.

The purpose of the military--the way it is structured, trained, and equipped--is to win battles and destroy armies. The U.S. military is, by far, the most powerful force to accomplish that purpose in human history. At this point, the U.S. can accomplish that objective anywhere in the world in a year, tops, I'd imagine, excluding China, maybe, given their numbers.

What the military is not very good at, though, is nation building or fighting an insurgency. That has nothing to do with the military qua military but everything to do with Western values. Past militaries not tied to the Western tradition were good at putting down insurgencies--the Mongols and the Romans. But the U.S. won't use their tactics (which I think a good thing)so, no matter how strong or smart our military, we will never be very good at that.

I think we need to internalize this lesson and be much more careful about where we deploy troops and, as has been repeated ad naseum during my lifetime, figure out what winning looks like before sending troops, and clearly defining objective requirements that bring troops home.
 
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I'm not sure about this. The U.S. spent 18 years in Afghanistan. It still has troops in Iraq, but were there officially for 11 years while still doing combat missions into 2021.

The purpose of the military--the way it is structured, trained, and equipped--is to win battles and destroy armies. The U.S. military is, by far, the most powerful force to accomplish that purpose in human history. At this point, the U.S. can accomplish that objective anywhere in the world in a year, tops, I'd imagine, excluding China, maybe, given their numbers.

What the military is not very good at, though, is nation building or fighting an insurgency. That has nothing to do with the military qua military but everything to do with Western values. Past militaries not tied to the Western tradition were good at putting down insurgencies--the Mongols and the Romans. But the U.S. won't use their tactics (which I think a good thing)so, no matter how strong or smart our military, we will never be very good at that.

I think we need to internalize this lesson and be much more careful about where we deploy troops and, as has been repeated ad naseum during my lifetime, figure out what winning looks like before sending troops, and clearly defining objective requirements that bring troops home.

ya, I think people are confused by thinking it was lack of US resolve that lead to the US "losing" these wars. the natives will always have time and resolve on their side. Afghanistan is a great example: they waited out the Russians and Americans. and, just like the Russians, we looked like idiots thinking we could prop up a local government that had our interests in mind. Russia used "modern" terror tactics and we tried "heart and minds", didn't matter.

knock on wood, the US has internalized the lessons. Iraq and afghanistan were such recent examples of short-term wins, long-term losses. I think we're entering our mature phase as a super power. the image of the US as world savior is long gone. our moral high-ground is shakier than ever.
 
I'm not sure about this. The U.S. spent 18 years in Afghanistan. It still has troops in Iraq, but were there officially for 11 years while still doing combat missions into 2021.

The purpose of the military--the way it is structured, trained, and equipped--is to win battles and destroy armies. The U.S. military is, by far, the most powerful force to accomplish that purpose in human history. At this point, the U.S. can accomplish that objective anywhere in the world in a year, tops, I'd imagine, excluding China, maybe, given their numbers.

What the military is not very good at, though, is nation building or fighting an insurgency. That has nothing to do with the military qua military but everything to do with Western values. Past militaries not tied to the Western tradition were good at putting down insurgencies--the Mongols and the Romans. But the U.S. won't use their tactics (which I think a good thing)so, no matter how strong or smart our military, we will never be very good at that.

I think we need to internalize this lesson and be much more careful about where we deploy troops and, as has been repeated ad naseum during my lifetime, figure out what winning looks like before sending troops, and clearly defining objective requirements that bring troops home.

Western military powers are hamstrung relative to those of the past.
 
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I have an interesting view of that. Social media has really shrunk the world. In the past our leaders could tell us that we were swell and that, despite some loud mouths, our allies were really generally fond of the US and appreciative of what we do and stand for.

If you are someone who generally believes that to be true, things like Twitter are an absolute minefield for that opinion. Government officials, popular foreign figures, and regular citizens from our allies are on social media regularly shitting all over the United States. And they have a particular disdain for conservative Americans. The most recent dust up related to the US veto of the ceasefire vote for Israel at the UN.

You read through that stuff and our foreign "allies" often sound as bad as a conservative American's worst domestic political foes. Having Charles from England, Pierre from France, and Hans from Germany talking about how backwards and stupid American conservatives are and how evil and awful the US has been to world peace builds on itself. The amount of positive you see about the US is usually reduced to "our attack dog is biting who we want them to bite" and nothing more. Our NATO allies are petulant trust fund kids who live a life of privelege because of their parents (the U.S.), yet they spend all their time and effort denigrating every benefit they have as a result of being attached to their parents.

What NATO is facing right now is that the parents are heavily leveraged and one of the two is starting to really notice how much shit talking their kids are doing out in the open. Yeah there is a benefit to supporting the kids but damn if their behavior doesn't make you want to say, "You think it is so bad living with my rules because of the protection you get under me, then fine asshole, try it on your own a bit."

Having Europe a little concerned that their shit has grown thin with enough of the electorate in the US to cause them some tangible issues isn't a bad thing. Maybe it gets them to readjust some of the behavior that has led to this breakdown in the relationship to begin with.
 
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I'm not sure about this. The U.S. spent 18 years in Afghanistan. It still has troops in Iraq, but were there officially for 11 years while still doing combat missions into 2021.

The purpose of the military--the way it is structured, trained, and equipped--is to win battles and destroy armies. The U.S. military is, by far, the most powerful force to accomplish that purpose in human history. At this point, the U.S. can accomplish that objective anywhere in the world in a year, tops, I'd imagine, excluding China, maybe, given their numbers.

What the military is not very good at, though, is nation building or fighting an insurgency. That has nothing to do with the military qua military but everything to do with Western values. Past militaries not tied to the Western tradition were good at putting down insurgencies--the Mongols and the Romans. But the U.S. won't use their tactics (which I think a good thing)so, no matter how strong or smart our military, we will never be very good at that.

I think we need to internalize this lesson and be much more careful about where we deploy troops and, as has been repeated ad naseum during my lifetime, figure out what winning looks like before sending troops, and clearly defining objective requirements that bring troops home.
I'm not sure what, specifically, you're disagreeing with. I never said the US doesn't have a superb military and can devastate any opponent if we want to.

Problem is, we don't want to. All I said was, if I was an ally of the US, I'd be worried, based on our past record of taking action but then not following up all the way to victory.

You kind of endorsed that point of view, no?
 
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