Roy Moore done fo(u)r?
- Thread starter iuwclurker1
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I guess before it was within the state and the women would know that they were powerless and it would be suppressed. Since he is going onto a national platform the woman may feel they have better support and protection?
Yes, I've read the story.
No, I am not defending this Moore guy. I think he is a scumbag. Most people who act like holier-than-thou are scumbags, especially when they bring God into the discussion. When they have no defense, they usually bring God.
What I was saying is that, while I think he is a scumbag, that is just my opinion, and opinion doesn't necessarily make it a fact. Until there is a concrete proof, a person is considered innocent. That is what I was saying.
Never been there. Any different from Forest Grump?Yeah, but you are talking about Alabama, the God country at that!
Bell South(? It was such a long time ago, and I may be wrong on the exact name) was my client, and I made several trips to Birmingham. Yes, Alabama was interesting. God and hypocrisy go together there. Having said that, my hosts were gracious and I had great time whenever I went there. No, we never discussed politics; it is my rule with the clients.Yeah, but you are talking about Alabama, the God country at that!
And how exactly do you find concrete proof of a crime that happened decades ago? About as close as you can come is 30 different sources and other women saying the same. Sexual crimes are often he said, she said. And another reason women don't come forward.
Accusations were enough for republicans when the guy’s last name was Clinton.
Now? We need to get all the facts and this is likely a smear campaign. Oh, and 14 year old girls can consent.
Concrete proof is not required.
The problem isn't necessarily "he said she said". The problem is victims are made to feel stigmatized. That's a result of a combination of things. We reinforce feelings of victim shame with victim shielding. On college campuses this ends up denying the accused of due process. (See the title IX regulations about sexual assault). Along those lines, did you follow the Taylor Swift trial in Denver last summer? Her testimony and demeanor were outstanding. If all victims testified with the composure and forthrightness she did, the problem would be less.
Also, when one makes accusations in the political world, the attacker better be the "right" politician, otherwise the victim will be smeared. At least that is the way it was in the 80's and 90's. As we are seeing in the world of celebrities, maybe things are changing now.
The Alabama GOP speaks out:
“I think it’s just a bunch of bull,” Perry Hooper Jr., President Trump’s Alabama state chairman, told TPM.
. . . “The same thing went on when President Trump ran for office, there was about 15 ladies who ran to the press and said the same thing,” he said.
When asked how the claims could be proven, he suggested the woman take a polygraph.
“Maybe she just needs to take a polygraph test. And the people who are pushing her, they need to take the same test too to see if they’re telling the truth,” he said.
Alabama State Rep. Ed Henry (R), Trump’s other Alabama campaign co-chairman, was even harsher.
“I believe it is very opportunistic and they are just looking for their chance to get on some liberal talk show. I’m sure they’ve probably been offered money by entities that surround the Clintons and that side of the world. We know they will pay to dirty anyone’s name that’s in their way. If you believe for a second that any of these are true then shame on these women for not coming forward in the last 30 years, it’s not like this guy hasn’t been in the limelight for decades. I call B.S. myself. I think it’s all lies and fabrication,” Henry told TPM.
. . . And he said he’d need photographic evidence to believe the women.
“They got some pictures? That’ll do,” he said. “You can’t sit on something like this for thirty-something years with a man as in the spotlight as Roy Moore and all of a sudden three weeks before a senatorial primary all of a sudden these three or four women are going to talk about something in 1979? I call bull. It’s as fabricated as the day is long.”
. . . Alabama Secretary of State John Merrill (R) also dismissed the allegations.
“These allegations have been made against Judge Moore but at this time that’s all they are, they’re allegations. I know Judge Moore to be a man of integrity and character,” he told TPM. “It’s very interesting to me and very odd that these charges have just now been introduced… People will say and do anything, and you and I both know they will.”
Alabama gonna Alabama. ("Your snooty arrogance is exactly why you libtards keep losing elections.")
“I think it’s just a bunch of bull,” Perry Hooper Jr., President Trump’s Alabama state chairman, told TPM.
. . . “The same thing went on when President Trump ran for office, there was about 15 ladies who ran to the press and said the same thing,” he said.
When asked how the claims could be proven, he suggested the woman take a polygraph.
“Maybe she just needs to take a polygraph test. And the people who are pushing her, they need to take the same test too to see if they’re telling the truth,” he said.
Alabama State Rep. Ed Henry (R), Trump’s other Alabama campaign co-chairman, was even harsher.
“I believe it is very opportunistic and they are just looking for their chance to get on some liberal talk show. I’m sure they’ve probably been offered money by entities that surround the Clintons and that side of the world. We know they will pay to dirty anyone’s name that’s in their way. If you believe for a second that any of these are true then shame on these women for not coming forward in the last 30 years, it’s not like this guy hasn’t been in the limelight for decades. I call B.S. myself. I think it’s all lies and fabrication,” Henry told TPM.
. . . And he said he’d need photographic evidence to believe the women.
“They got some pictures? That’ll do,” he said. “You can’t sit on something like this for thirty-something years with a man as in the spotlight as Roy Moore and all of a sudden three weeks before a senatorial primary all of a sudden these three or four women are going to talk about something in 1979? I call bull. It’s as fabricated as the day is long.”
. . . Alabama Secretary of State John Merrill (R) also dismissed the allegations.
“These allegations have been made against Judge Moore but at this time that’s all they are, they’re allegations. I know Judge Moore to be a man of integrity and character,” he told TPM. “It’s very interesting to me and very odd that these charges have just now been introduced… People will say and do anything, and you and I both know they will.”
Part of #MAGA is to bring the culture of the 50s back. Ignoring women rights would also fall lock step into their vision.
They're still living in the 1950s. Or maybe the 1850s.
State Rep. Ed Henry lashed out at Roy Moore’s accusers and Republicans who said the U.S. Senate candidate should back out of the special election in an interview Thursday evening with The Times.
. . . "The idea that accusations like this would stop his campaign is ludicrous. If this was a habit, like you’ve read with Bill Cosby and millions of dollars paid to settle cases and years of witnesses, that would be one thing,” Henry said. “You cannot tell me there hasn’t been an opportunity through the years to make these accusations with as many times as he’s (Moore) run (for office) and been in the news.
. . . “If they believe this man is predatory, they are guilty of allowing him to exist for 40 years. I think someone should prosecute and go after them. You can’t be a victim 40 years later, in my opinion,” Henry said.
. . . “I’m not buying it,” Henry said. “It’s too easy for someone to make these accusations. It’s foolish to go down that road, it’s like what if a frog had wings, he wouldn’t bump his ass every time he jumps.”
They're still living in the 1950s. Or maybe the 1850s.
State Rep. Ed Henry lashed out at Roy Moore’s accusers and Republicans who said the U.S. Senate candidate should back out of the special election in an interview Thursday evening with The Times.
. . . "The idea that accusations like this would stop his campaign is ludicrous. If this was a habit, like you’ve read with Bill Cosby and millions of dollars paid to settle cases and years of witnesses, that would be one thing,” Henry said. “You cannot tell me there hasn’t been an opportunity through the years to make these accusations with as many times as he’s (Moore) run (for office) and been in the news.
. . . “If they believe this man is predatory, they are guilty of allowing him to exist for 40 years. I think someone should prosecute and go after them. You can’t be a victim 40 years later, in my opinion,” Henry said.
. . . “I’m not buying it,” Henry said. “It’s too easy for someone to make these accusations. It’s foolish to go down that road, it’s like what if a frog had wings, he wouldn’t bump his ass every time he jumps.”
Maybe Moore's defenders sound good within AL.
But outside AL.. if I had friends like them... who needs enemies. They lack self awareness or its something in the AL waters that changes their prism.
More from the GOP's geographic base:
The Republican National Committeeman from Alabama, Paul Reynolds, said that he trusts Vladimir Putin more than Moore’s accusers. “My gosh, it's The Washington Post. If I’ve got a choice of putting my welfare into the hands of Putin or The Washington Post, Putin wins every time,” he told The Hill. “This is going to make Roy Moore supporters step up to the plate and give more, work more and pray more.”
. . . The chairman of the Bibb County Republican Party, Jerry Pow, said that he’d vote for Moore even if it was proved he committed a sex crime against an underage girl. “I would vote for Judge Moore because I wouldn’t want to vote for Doug,” he told the Toronto Star, referring to Democratic candidate Doug Jones. “I’m not saying I support what he did.”
Like Trump, Roy Moore isn't the problem here. The problem is the deeply rotten core of the Republican Party that elects and defends appalling people like Trump and Moore. Such are the fruits of the Southern strategy.. . . The chairman of the Bibb County Republican Party, Jerry Pow, said that he’d vote for Moore even if it was proved he committed a sex crime against an underage girl. “I would vote for Judge Moore because I wouldn’t want to vote for Doug,” he told the Toronto Star, referring to Democratic candidate Doug Jones. “I’m not saying I support what he did.”
I'm no fan of polygraphs, but it's notable that Moore's defenders only want to test Moore's slutty lying accusers, and not him.
This is correct. It happens with both parties, but lately the Republicans have surrendered almost completely to the need to gain more power. Almost every member of congress that spoke out against Moore yesterday included the phrase "if the allegations are true". When four independent women come forward after being sought out by an outstanding reporter and risk their privacy to tell their story, they should immediately be held up as credible. There are few members of congress who doubt the accusations are true, but they still hedge in their comments. Why? Because of politics. If these stories had surfaced four months ago, Republicans would be quick to denounce Moore and push Strange to victory. But the future of the Senate is in jeopardy, so let's make sure we are careful. I guarantee there are strategists working like crazy to look at any option, write-in candidate, the courts...you name it. If there is a good chance they can win the seat by throwing Moore to the side, it will happen. However, if coming out too strong against Moore puts the seat in play, we'll hear more about "innocent until proven guilty.
He allegedly sexually abused a 14-year-old. Three other women have come out with accusations of teenage abuse. Mitch McConnell wants him to withdraw.
Coyotes might be ahowling come December. That's a US Senate seat. Things just got more interesting.
Could have been your daughter:
Can we just let Alabama secede now? Maybe they can take Mississippi, Arkansas & Oklahoma with them?
My god these folks defending this guy are twisted as hell. If that were my daughter, I’d want to kill the man. There’s just some lines that you don’t cross.
Hate to say it, but in my experience the more forceful a person is as a religious/homophobe nut, the more twisted/conflicted they are. And it’s usually in a sexual way of some sort (not saying being a homosexual is bad- it’s not). Didn’t say that well, but I think you guys get the drift.
And we still look at these instances as sexual. It's about power. And this story shows how horrible the outcome can be. So what can happen to a 14 year-old who is molested by a 32 year-old man? Add to the situation that her family is going through the trauma of divorce. What does that experience lead to next? And what path does that young girl travel now that she's dealing with multiple traumas?
They had 30 sources. Clearly the women had talked to others about this, decades ago in many cases.
Yes, as a legal matter, he’s innocent until proven guilty. But, it’s oretty damn clear the man is a pretty terrible human being. On top of everything else.
How is this man still a candidate for senate? Even before all of this stuff came out.
Watched a Dr. Phil show several months ago featuring a young girl accusing her Step Father of sexually molesting her some ten years prior over a period of time during her teen years. The Step Father was a complete jerk who denied her charges, The show's audience along with Dr. Phil were entirely on the side of the accuser.
At the end of the show a statement appeared on the television screen explaining that a lie detector test was given to the Step Father after the show was taped. Surprisingly, the test results supported to a high degree that the Step Father was telling the truth about his innocence. .Ninety nine percent of those watching the show would have convicted the Step Father of child molesting.
"the Republicans have surrendered almost completely to the need to gain more power." Horsehockey! The Democrats desperately wanted to put the Clinton's back in the White House knowing about Bill's sexual assaults and Hillary's smear campaigns. Hillary finally said in the aftermath of Weinstein's exposure that his conduct is not to be "tolerated," yet she was so hungry for power she tolerated it, and enabled it, for years. And speaking of Weinstein, I have little doubt, and certainly no reasonable doubt, that the Clinton's knew all about him. After all, his sexual activities were an "open secret". But they, and especially Hillary, continued to embrace Weinstein because the considerable entertainment influence and money to her campaign's benefit flowed through Weinstein.
Concerning Moore. For reasons I said before, I wouldn't vote for him. The only hope is that the Senate would refuse his membership. That would be precedent setting, but I think the Senate needs to take control.
Finally, I think the timing of the WaPo story is fishy. I believe, based on nothing more than WaPo's history of wanting to help the Democrats and hurt the GOP, that they sat on this story for a while and broke it when it was too late for Alabama to make a different choice.
That is why I think intra-family accusations are different from stranger or other non-family accusations. Within families, there can be strong motives to hurt people with false claims. There are a surprising number of unsupported and unfounded allegations of child abuse in divorce cases as an example. Stepparent, boyfriend and step sibling false allegations are also an issue.
CoH, have to disagree with your following remark,
"The Democrats desperately wanted to put the Clinton's back in the White House knowing about Bill's sexual assaults and Hillary's smear campaigns."
A good many Democrats who voted for Obama in some key electoral states voted for Trump.
It's nice that you managed to shoehorn an anodyne non-endorsement of Moore into your tribal enabling bullshit. Seeming to recognize that you can't speak your mind like the Alabama GOP, you distract, dissemble, obfuscate, evade, change the subject, make stuff up, and otherwise throw sand in the works. "Look, over there!" says CO. Hoosier.
You've lost all credibility on this board CO and this statement is a good example why. The story was pursued by the reporter who was covering the campaign. People were talking about the rumors because Moore was running for the Senate. This is an excellent job of reporting. She worked the story, found these women, convinced them to go on the record and the Washington Post published with at least 30 sources. The timing of the story is because of the interest in the campaign. If Moore had run for national office two years ago, the story would have probably come out then. It's the role of the media to investigate those running to lead our government. You should be applauding the outstanding work.
But instead, you invent some conspiracy plot to undermine our election system. And when you do that, just like many of the Republican leaders and members of the "conservative" media have done, you are trying to discredit the story of these abused women.
If Weinstein was a foreign government I would be more upset with the Clinton's too for accepting his money and influence but he is merely a degenerate Hollywood producer. His contributions to the Democrats may have been in some way penance for his deplorable actions.
Ha. Political contributions to liberals is therapy for sexual predators. Good one!
Edited out extraneous windbaggery. - The Editors
Chorus: Let's count all the Democrats sticking up for Weinstein...zero? Still counting?
Bull.
I haven't said one thing to discredit the accusations. I think they are probably true. I believe WaPo's agenda is more than reporting news.
Who cares about WaPo's supposed agenda if the stories are true? (Hint: Someone who's trying to change the subject.)
Keep saying that and you continue to discredit the women. Got to call it out when I see it.
The only justification for your conclusion is that you believe WaPo has taken sides. I agree with that.
Bill O and Hannity haven’t made campaign contributions? We all know what Bill O did. And we know Hannity thinks 14 year old girls can give consent.
Is this where you say you’ve never heard of Bill O or Hannity until today?
I said it might explain his contributions to the Democrats. I didn't say it was necessarily his reason. How would I know? I guess you would need to talk with his therapist and accountant.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...nt-deserve-survive-max-boot-column/851640001/
It's your party, you should cry if you want to,
You would cry too, if it happened to you.
How far can the "party of family values" fall? I guess we will see.
It's your party, you should cry if you want to,
You would cry too, if it happened to you.
How far can the "party of family values" fall? I guess we will see.
