Pothole Hell

[twenty02]

Indy needs $1b to bring the roads into "fair" condition.

http://fox59.com/2018/02/15/indys-p...y-leaders-say-730-million-needed-to-fix-them/


https://www.indystar.com/story/news...would-take-10-times-current-budget/324044002/


It's a rite of passage to complain about the roads in this city every spring....but this year is by far the worst I can recall. Calling it 3rd world is being insulting to some 3rd world nations. It's like playing a game of Mario Cart every day.

I don't really know the funding formulas....but the most recent gas tax increase is only going to be a drop in the bucket. It's an area that's been neglected and starved of funding so long, it's now reached crisis level.

Only something done at the state level can fix this. There is some talk of a "commuter tax" for all the suburb residents that work in Marion country to help pay for the infrastructure that they use everyday....but that also requires legislation from...the statehouse.

 

[toastedbread]

Indy needs $1b to bring the roads into "fair" condition.

http://fox59.com/2018/02/15/indys-p...y-leaders-say-730-million-needed-to-fix-them/


https://www.indystar.com/story/news...would-take-10-times-current-budget/324044002/


It's a rite of passage to complain about the roads in this city every spring....but this year is by far the worst I can recall. Calling it 3rd world is being insulting to some 3rd world nations. It's like playing a game of Mario Cart every day.

I don't really know the funding formulas....but the most recent gas tax increase is only going to be a drop in the bucket. It's an area that's been neglected and starved of funding so long, it's now reached crisis level.

Only something done at the state level can fix this. There is some talk of a "commuter tax" for all the suburb residents that work in Marion country to help pay for the infrastructure that they use everyday....but that also requires legislation from...the statehouse.

dude, it's mutha****ing corruption. You know why roads are consistent potholed in 3rd world countries? They want a consistent business. Hence, temporary patches instead of permanent fixes. This is one of the best businesses throughout the FSU.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Indy needs $1b to bring the roads into "fair" condition.

http://fox59.com/2018/02/15/indys-p...y-leaders-say-730-million-needed-to-fix-them/


https://www.indystar.com/story/news...would-take-10-times-current-budget/324044002/


It's a rite of passage to complain about the roads in this city every spring....but this year is by far the worst I can recall. Calling it 3rd world is being insulting to some 3rd world nations. It's like playing a game of Mario Cart every day.

I don't really know the funding formulas....but the most recent gas tax increase is only going to be a drop in the bucket. It's an area that's been neglected and starved of funding so long, it's now reached crisis level.

Only something done at the state level can fix this. There is some talk of a "commuter tax" for all the suburb residents that work in Marion country to help pay for the infrastructure that they use everyday....but that also requires legislation from...the statehouse.

Money doesn't grow on trees. We have established the national priority of health care. To hell with roads and bridges.

the percentage of the [Indiana] budget dedicated to Medicaid rose from 23.1 percent in 2010 to 31.2 percent in 2015. However, state cuts to Medicaid funding can also mean fewer federal dollars received by the state.[22][23][24]
​

Note that the increase is as a % of state budget. That means 35% increase Medicaid cost over and above the normal increase in the state budget. Every state has the same issues (except those with extraction taxes--but don't worry, the feds are killing the extraction industry too). Colorado has a worse issue cuz of our silly constitutional amendment requiring ANY tax increase to be voted on. Next time you think about an increase in taxes for infrastructure, you can feel better by knowing that tax increase is really caused by better more accessible health care.

 

[twenty02]

Money doesn't grow on trees. We have established the national priority of health care. To hell with roads and bridges.

the percentage of the [Indiana] budget dedicated to Medicaid rose from 23.1 percent in 2010 to 31.2 percent in 2015. However, state cuts to Medicaid funding can also mean fewer federal dollars received by the state.[22][23][24]
​

Note that the increase is as a % of state budget. That means 35% increase Medicaid cost over and above the normal increase in the state budget. Every state has the same issues (except those with extraction taxes--but don't worry, the feds are killing the extraction industry too). Colorado has a worse issue cuz of our silly constitutional amendment requiring ANY tax increase to be voted on. Next time you think about an increase in taxes for infrastructure, you can feel better by knowing that tax increase is really caused by better more accessible health care.

Well, honestly, the right wing anti-tax groups have overshot the mark for nearly two decades now. Taxes in many areas were too high in the 70s, and tax cuts were needed. But the modern GOP become literally addicted to the 'tax cutting cures all ills' ever since.

Mike Pence pushed through an income tax cut for no real policy reason, but rather a political reason in that he wanted to run for President.

I applaud the state for creating a long-term balanced budget situation, but at some point the state GOP has to be more than the tax cutting party. They finally raised the state gas tax, after a large portion of I65 basically collapsed a couple years back. But that's a drop in the bucket of what's needed.

 

[sglowrider]

Folks in Scandinavia countries dont mind pay high taxes as long as its being properly used. In the States, taxes have been stigmatized politically as an evil tool to beat up the citizens and COH implied, there no free lunch. It requires a reorganisation of the national priorities if thats the case.

What is needed is to implement the concept of a 'smart (and benevolent) government' and marry it with the idea of accountability measured against measurable outcomes.

But one can only dream.

 

[Zizkov]

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Money doesn't grow on trees. We have established the national priority of health care. To hell with roads and bridges.

the percentage of the [Indiana] budget dedicated to Medicaid rose from 23.1 percent in 2010 to 31.2 percent in 2015. However, state cuts to Medicaid funding can also mean fewer federal dollars received by the state.[22][23][24]
​

Note that the increase is as a % of state budget. That means 35% increase Medicaid cost over and above the normal increase in the state budget. Every state has the same issues (except those with extraction taxes--but don't worry, the feds are killing the extraction industry too). Colorado has a worse issue cuz of our silly constitutional amendment requiring ANY tax increase to be voted on. Next time you think about an increase in taxes for infrastructure, you can feel better by knowing that tax increase is really caused by better more accessible health care.

Would it not be nice for the R party to actually try to pass healthcare legislation to try and bend the cost curve?

 

[Marvin the Martian]

There is a video on Reddit showing a massive pothole at 465 and Allisonville.

I am not sure Bloomington has it much better in road/pothole percentage. That extended freeze at the beginning of winter was hard in roads. I remember as a kid watching commercials of some chemical company touting all the work they were doing to make better weather resistant asphalt, what happened to their research? Did Goodyear buy it and shelve it.

 

[IUCrazy2]

There is a video on Reddit showing a massive pothole at 465 and Allisonville.

I am not sure Bloomington has it much better in road/pothole percentage. That extended freeze at the beginning of winter was hard in roads. I remember as a kid watching commercials of some chemical company touting all the work they were doing to make better weather resistant asphalt, what happened to their research? Did Goodyear buy it and shelve it.

I do not know about Allisonville but 56th St. in front of Lawrence Central high school looks like it was carpet bombed.

 

[twenty02]

http://fox59.com/2018/02/21/local-er-doctor-warns-of-health-dangers-caused-by-potholes/


This guy thinks we should run a telethon raising donations!

While kind of adsurd, it's still a better idea than Mayor Hogsett has offered....which is absolutely nothing. The guy is the biggest empty suit this city has ever seen.

 

[IUCrazy2]

I figure potholes is as good of a place as any to put this...

First, yes, I know the source but I found this linked on a news aggregator. I think this idea sounds interesting but it would depend on the amount of assets that were available to sell. Additionally, it touches on some areas where bipartisanship should work and some of the shared interests between communities that are often viewed as at odds with each other.

So yes, it is Breitbart but I think there is some good discussion if you give it a chance.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...tax-hike-by-auctioning-off-government-assets/

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Would it not be nice for the R party to actually try to pass healthcare legislation to try and bend the cost curve?

No. It wouldn't be nice for the R party to do that. Government has done enough for health care reform. While this isn't a health care thread, I am really encouraged by the private sector. Government will always need to fill in the safety net gaps in health care; but health care reform for the masses will be much easier, cheaper, and more effective when it focuses on the issue at hand and breaks the bonds of political interest groups, donors, lobbyists, and eggheaded dumbassary that are the foundations for government action.

Speaking of private enterprise; what do you think of Falcon Heavy? I spent some time with my ME friend talking about that; Falcon 9 Heavy is truly innovative in rocket science, not just an extension of old tech. BFR will be another innovative leap. (who doesn't like BFR as a name for a Big -------Rocket?) And it isn't just Space X, ULA is also a significant private player.

I am encouraged by the bend towards the private sector and away from government solutions for everything. That's part of Making America Great Again. It remains to be seen how much of an impact the Trump administration will have on that, but some of the things he has done so far are a good start.

Yeah, I know this is a hijack.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

No. It wouldn't be nice for the R party to do that. Government has done enough for health care reform. While this isn't a health care thread, I am really encouraged by the private sector. Government will always need to fill in the safety net gaps in health care; but health care reform for the masses will be much easier, cheaper, and more effective when it focuses on the issue at hand and breaks the bonds of political interest groups, donors, lobbyists, and eggheaded dumbassary that are the foundations for government action.

Speaking of private enterprise; what do you think of Falcon Heavy? I spent some time with my ME friend talking about that; Falcon 9 Heavy is truly innovative in rocket science, not just an extension of old tech. BFR will be another innovative leap. (who doesn't like BFR as a name for a Big -------Rocket?) And it isn't just Space X, ULA is also a significant private player.

I am encouraged by the bend towards the private sector and away from government solutions for everything. That's part of Making America Great Again. It remains to be seen how much of an impact the Trump administration will have on that, but some of the things he has done so far are a good start.

Yeah, I know this is a hijack.

To continue the threadjack, there is a myth the government can't do anything right. The Panama Canal, Interstate Highway System, moon landing, Atomic Bomb, and polio vaccine all came out of government programs. Heck, it was an international government program that conquered smallpox. I am happy SpaceX worked with Falcon Heavy. It is the most powerful rocket since the Saturn 5, which was a government rocket.

Strange that we have great respect in this country for the military yet somehow forget that technically those in the military are governmental employees...

 

[Cottage Grove]

Indy needs $1b to bring the roads into "fair" condition.

http://fox59.com/2018/02/15/indys-p...y-leaders-say-730-million-needed-to-fix-them/


https://www.indystar.com/story/news...would-take-10-times-current-budget/324044002/


It's a rite of passage to complain about the roads in this city every spring....but this year is by far the worst I can recall. Calling it 3rd world is being insulting to some 3rd world nations. It's like playing a game of Mario Cart every day.

I don't really know the funding formulas....but the most recent gas tax increase is only going to be a drop in the bucket. It's an area that's been neglected and starved of funding so long, it's now reached crisis level.

Only something done at the state level can fix this. There is some talk of a "commuter tax" for all the suburb residents that work in Marion country to help pay for the infrastructure that they use everyday....but that also requires legislation from...the statehouse.

I live and work in Hamilton Co, but my wife drives into Marion every day, and I would support a commuter tax. Like you said, the roads in Indy are the worst I've seen, and I've lived here since 2004.

The city has already tried selling assets (parking meters) to fund road repairs, and that well doesn't go much deeper. I read at the time that the Ballard administration prioritized maximizing the number of miles repaved over repaving fewer miles with longer-term solutions. In other words they did it on the cheap. At this point I think more revenue is the best answer, and since Indiana is already a low tax state as it is, perhaps the legislature will come to their senses on it. I know, I know. It's a pipe dream.

 

[twenty02]

I figure potholes is as good of a place as any to put this...

First, yes, I know the source but I found this linked on a news aggregator. I think this idea sounds interesting but it would depend on the amount of assets that were available to sell. Additionally, it touches on some areas where bipartisanship should work and some of the shared interests between communities that are often viewed as at odds with each other.

So yes, it is Breitbart but I think there is some good discussion if you give it a chance.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...tax-hike-by-auctioning-off-government-assets/

Interesting idea. I'm not seeing any details on what kind of $$ they think they'll raise.

 

[sglowrider]

I live and work in Hamilton Co, but my wife drives into Marion every day, and I would support a commuter tax. Like you said, the roads in Indy are the worst I've seen, and I've lived here since 2004.

The city has already tried selling assets (parking meters) to fund road repairs, and that well doesn't go much deeper. I read at the time that the Ballard administration prioritized maximizing the number of miles repaved over repaving fewer miles with longer-term solutions. In other words they did it on the cheap. At this point I think more revenue is the best answer, and since Indiana is already a low tax state as it is, perhaps the legislature will come to their senses on it. I know, I know. It's a pipe dream.

The cautionary tale is where i used to live... Kansas.

Financial snapshot of the state:

https://www.statedatalab.org/state_data_and_comparisons/detail/kansas

They are in deep doo-doo.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Interesting idea. I'm not seeing any details on what kind of $$ they think they'll raise.

Yeah, the stickler is in the details but I would think with the pedigree of the people involved that it should be a respectable amount of money.

It is the type of out of the box thinking we need right now and joining the Freedom Caucus with the Congressional Black Caucus and Hispanic Caucus is something that could be beneficial down the road. It is some of the most conservative and most progressive groups getting together to put forth legislation that benefits everyone.

It is that pragmatism iuwc is always on about. As a conservative, I also like the outreach to the black and Hispanic caucuses.

 

[twenty02]

Yeah, the stickler is in the details but I would think with the pedigree of the people involved that it should be a respectable amount of money.

It is the type of out of the box thinking we need right now and joining the Freedom Caucus with the Congressional Black Caucus and Hispanic Caucus is something that could be beneficial down the road. It is some of the most conservative and most progressive groups getting together to put forth legislation that benefits everyone.

It is that pragmatism iuwc is always on about. As a conservative, I also like the outreach to the black and Hispanic caucuses.

There is an interesting political point there....about how the poorest congressional districts are now split between some of the most conservative and most liberal lawmakers.

 

[IUCrazy2]

There is an interesting political point there....about how the poorest congressional districts are now split between some of the most conservative and most liberal lawmakers.

Yes!

It also represents some of the most marginalized voters. Each of those groups expresses some feelings of only being a part of the coalition to push forward other people's priorities. If (Big If) this type of solution to the infrastructure problem is viable and is put into place, it could be a blueprint for future bipartisan action. Something used to reduce the debt, pay for infrastructure, and invest in the poorest sectors of our country to boot. Almost too good to sound true.

To the political point though, marginalized and forgotten peoples tend to go to the extremes of their comfort zone. What the article points out is that there are ways to bridge those gaps still if we are willing to look for them and open to thinking outside the box a little bit.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

To continue the threadjack, there is a myth the government can't do anything right. The Panama Canal, Interstate Highway System, moon landing, Atomic Bomb, and polio vaccine all came out of government programs. Heck, it was an international government program that conquered smallpox. I am happy SpaceX worked with Falcon Heavy. It is the most powerful rocket since the Saturn 5, which was a government rocket.

Strange that we have great respect in this country for the military yet somehow forget that technically those in the military are governmental employees...

This isn't either or. Certainly the public speaking through its government ought to be setting the goals and objective for the big things. Normally a government will issue an RFP and several companies will compete to get the contract. I think the military has done this with new fighters as an example. We also did this for many aspects of the Apollo Program.

Consider the VA Hospital in Colorado. That was a VA-run program and it was a disaster. The Army Corps of Engineers, which is accustomed to building things had to take it over and finish the job. Much better would have been to have a private organization, whose purpose is to design and build things, do the job from the beginning.

 

[Noodle]

There is a video on Reddit showing a massive pothole at 465 and Allisonville.

I am not sure Bloomington has it much better in road/pothole percentage. That extended freeze at the beginning of winter was hard in roads. I remember as a kid watching commercials of some chemical company touting all the work they were doing to make better weather resistant asphalt, what happened to their research? Did Goodyear buy it and shelve it.

Love this suggestion on Reddit as to how to get that pothole fixed:

find a way to spray paint a penis around it. they will be out there to fix it in a couple days time.​

 

[Fro]

This isn't either or. Certainly the public speaking through its government ought to be setting the goals and objective for the big things. Normally a government will issue an RFP and several companies will compete to get the contract. I think the military has done this with new fighters as an example. We also did this for many aspects of the Apollo Program.

Consider the VA Hospital in Colorado. That was a VA-run program and it was a disaster. The Army Corps of Engineers, which is accustomed to building things had to take it over and finish the job. Much better would have been to have a private organization, whose purpose is to design and build things, do the job from the beginning.

Counter-argument is I-69 in Bloomington where Pence took the "cheapest" bid from a sketchy company who went belly-up and INDOT had to bail out the project.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Counter-argument is I-69 in Bloomington where Pence took the "cheapest" bid from a sketchy company who went belly-up and INDOT had to bail out the project.

Bad management and incompetence is a problem no matter who is in charge. Good management and competent people are even more important on a design/build project. When it works as intended, projects proceed faster and cost less.

 

[i'vegotwinners]

Counter-argument is I-69 in Bloomington where Pence took the "cheapest" bid from a sketchy company who went belly-up and INDOT had to bail out the project.

the company, (Insolux), was in trouble for bribery.

lucky for them, bribery is totally legal in the US. (you just have to launder the bribe properly).

any word on how much this company "donated" to Indiana Pubs.