This is so good, I could have written it myself. Hits on all points.
http://www.si.com/2017/03/08/indiana-hoosiers-should-keep-tom-crean
http://www.si.com/2017/03/08/indiana-hoosiers-should-keep-tom-crean
Members Only jackets for everyone. SI article on Crean
- Thread starter JonesIndiana
- Start date
Definitely Pulitzer material.
But most of us read this days ago when it was posted numerous times.
In the article: IU is no longer relevant and Crean is the best you can do.
No shit you agree with it.
No shit you agree with it.
always love the logic: IU can't get a better coach now because of being down for a generation...and we've been down a generation because of weird coaching moves
troll on, trolly...or indianascout...or purdue fan...or crean's PR firm lackey...or whomever you are
I am not endorsing Kentucky's style but Calipari rights his ship every year. Perhaps IU should have paid Crean a Div. 2 salary those first three years. Or just said in 2012 - Tom we were thinking about giving you a raise but we decided to call it even after the abysmal performance when you started.
Paid sports journalist, made solid points. Non emotional. There are also some really good points made here, but too often way too emotional.
A journalist who has probably watched IU play a minuscule amount of times compared to we the fans who have watched this crap for 9 years. I love how these journalists feel like they have a pulse for a team they barely watch. There's no depth in that article. He hits on your so-called "key points" like politicians and their talking points.
Crean sucks..without a doubt.
That article is pure nonsense. Because we hired a mediocre coach and the calender doesn't say 1987, we should not hire a better coach? That just isn't logical. It is entirely based on the opinion that we could not hire a better coach, which is ludicrous. Without that premise, the article has no legs to stand on.
With that dumb ass logic, Alabama never hires Saban and never becomes the current power that they are now.
This guy who wrote this is clueless. Recruiting is in the toilet!
The only other user I've seen argue these irrational points is Niego and he's dissapeared. The 48-72hr flames trying to put Crean in a better light is something so bizarre it makes you question if there really are paid users on here for TC.
Similar articles were written around 2005/2006 about Tubby at UK. The mantra then was "parity is here to stay in college basketball" to justify UK keeping a good man, good coach, good father.
again, similar mantra - the Tom Crean coached Marquette with Dwayne Wade beat UK as a number 1 seed, and UK's final four absence was justified by a series of bad luck injuries and excuses while we were being told that its March, anything can happen and you have a program that regularly sees the elite 8.
I really have no dog in the hunt - while I've had some laughs over the various meme's of Tom Crean - I can see both sides of the discussion. However as an IU fan, I would never accept that a big 10 championship justifies 1 or more bad years. But I am not an IU fan, just an observer. I would also tell anyone that says my program is old history to go to hell. You'll never get to the next level by accepting mediocrity - and extending mediocrity in the hopes that something changes and all the tumblers fall into place for one magical run is not a solution to sustained success.
again, similar mantra - the Tom Crean coached Marquette with Dwayne Wade beat UK as a number 1 seed, and UK's final four absence was justified by a series of bad luck injuries and excuses while we were being told that its March, anything can happen and you have a program that regularly sees the elite 8.
I really have no dog in the hunt - while I've had some laughs over the various meme's of Tom Crean - I can see both sides of the discussion. However as an IU fan, I would never accept that a big 10 championship justifies 1 or more bad years. But I am not an IU fan, just an observer. I would also tell anyone that says my program is old history to go to hell. You'll never get to the next level by accepting mediocrity - and extending mediocrity in the hopes that something changes and all the tumblers fall into place for one magical run is not a solution to sustained success.
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Even IF conceded that we can't find, lure, pay, persuade, a "better" coach than Crean. Something has the ire of a knowledgeable and passionate fan base. There is a benefit in changing just for the sake of changing, at times.
If you were an AD...at a high major school like Indiana, that had 5 Natty banners hanging in the rafters, a 17000 seat arena...would you hire Tom Crean based off his resume?
If the answer is anything but a hard NO...1)I don't believe you...and 2)you probably need a little more real world experience to go with those two business degrees you have. Because his resume doesn't add up to where IU was, and could be again.
Where were we? And where should we go? We were NEVER a perennial top 5-10 program like Duke or Kentucky. I think many on here do mess that one up. But we were a perennially well coached, competitive, NCAA bound program. And every few years we had the right pieces to make a run at a title. That's Michigan State, Wisconsin, type expectations. Not Duke or Kentucky. Obviously we'd all love Stevens or Donovan to fly in to get us to that level tomorrow. But we've never been there before, why hold to those expectations. But we have been perennial B10 contenders. We have been perennial NCAA participants. Its just fine to hold those same expectations again.
And getting back to your answer to the above question...if your answer is a NO...why on earth would you decide to keep him right now?
If you were an AD...at a high major school like Indiana, that had 5 Natty banners hanging in the rafters, a 17000 seat arena...would you hire Tom Crean based off his resume?
If the answer is anything but a hard NO...1)I don't believe you...and 2)you probably need a little more real world experience to go with those two business degrees you have. Because his resume doesn't add up to where IU was, and could be again.
Where were we? And where should we go? We were NEVER a perennial top 5-10 program like Duke or Kentucky. I think many on here do mess that one up. But we were a perennially well coached, competitive, NCAA bound program. And every few years we had the right pieces to make a run at a title. That's Michigan State, Wisconsin, type expectations. Not Duke or Kentucky. Obviously we'd all love Stevens or Donovan to fly in to get us to that level tomorrow. But we've never been there before, why hold to those expectations. But we have been perennial B10 contenders. We have been perennial NCAA participants. Its just fine to hold those same expectations again.
And getting back to your answer to the above question...if your answer is a NO...why on earth would you decide to keep him right now?
Too emotional? That is what makes IU basketball what it is! The emotion, support, and togetherness between a fan base and their team. Hell yes folks are emotional. We are now Illinois. We are not as good as Wisconsin, Michigan St, Michigan, Ohio State, Maryland. Soon to surpassed by Northwestern.
if he isn't good enough to hire.....he isn't good enough to keep. As for Billy Donovan.....why not ask the guy what it would take for him to say yes to IU.....then, and only then....decide how, if possible...to get it done?
You should tell Fred that.
So let's add to your list of excuses.
- IU can't do any better than Crean because IU is no longer relevant.
- IU should not hire a new coach because it would be an "emotional" move after a poor season.
- His recruiting is amazing and no one can prove otherwise
- IU something something won the Big Ten.
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Rosenberg is a lot like my Momma and Auntie, who love basketball once the brackets come out. They watch the NCAA Tournament from beginning to end just like they do the Olympics. They rub it in to their UK fan friends about beating the cats last year. They like basketball for the spectacle and storylines of March Madness. They think Crean is great because they've seen him win a few tournament games and seen pictures on facebook of Bryant crying on his shoulder.
As long as you can't tell good basketball from bad, Crean probably looks pretty good. Two Big Ten Titles and three Sweet 16's seems like enough to wait and see what he might pull off next. The problem for Crean and his supporters is that too many IU fans still know the difference. That number might be dwindling, but there are still enough to make the promoters of bad basketball uncomfortable.
The results that sportswriters and bracket lovers might point to in support of Crean mean absolutely nothing to those of us who abhor bad basketball. We're not mad at Tom Crean for missing the NCAA Tournament, because we couldn't stand to watch his team play any more games anyway.
Good coaches also have under-performing teams from time to time, but you still look forward to seeing the team they will put on the floor next year or the year after. With poor coaches you grow weary of watching their teams play whether they win games or not.
Tom Crean might be a great teacher, but he's a poor coach. He can't be moved from what is a horrible philosophy of how the game should be played. His philosophy and decision making from the bench render whatever x and o genius he might possess absolutely useless.
Has it become emotional? How could it not? Don't force bad basketball down my throat and call it chocolate pudding. Give me good basketball and I'll be patient and wait for the results that I know will eventually come. If IU's time as a blue blood has passed, so be it, but that doesn't mean IU has to become LSU or NC State either.
one thing about "blue bloods".....they incorporate a return to that status into their hiring standards as a priority after a failed coach is removed. Kansas, Louisville, UNC, Kentucky all follow that method. Even UCLA is attempting a return to former glory. IU? Political correctness seems to have pushed the blue blood thing out the door.......
Agree 100%. I expect to see basketball teams that play smart. I want to see us beat teams more talented than us. I do not want to have a program where we need to have more talent than anyone else just to be a top 25 team.
I want to have a program where we have the ability to take a collection of players that individually aren't talented at all and still compete at a high level because the team is better than the sum of its parts. Bo Ryan did that at Wisconsin. Is it too much to ask for a program like IU?
We have the opposite.
UK fan here, so sorry to intrude, but you will always get the mediocrity you accept.
TC was your Tubby, decent coach but ultimately not where the future lies because he cant meet what the fans and programs require to coach there.
GIVEN Sweet Sixteens, and then consistently a four seed or better, so your far more often then not, in the HUNT for the NC. Then you roll out of the ball and let them play, because the last 3 games or so is about showing up, and to some degree a bit of luck that the tourney gives to a one and done format.
TC was your Tubby, decent coach but ultimately not where the future lies because he cant meet what the fans and programs require to coach there.
GIVEN Sweet Sixteens, and then consistently a four seed or better, so your far more often then not, in the HUNT for the NC. Then you roll out of the ball and let them play, because the last 3 games or so is about showing up, and to some degree a bit of luck that the tourney gives to a one and done format.
