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Pick One: Conservatism or Trump


By CHARLES C. W. COOKE
March 21, 2023 10:20 AM


Those are our only two choices — we cannot have both of these things.

Conservative Americans must choose. Do they want Donald Trump to play a central role in Republican politics, or do they want to win elections and achieve the policy outcomes that supposedly inspired them to get involved in politics in the first instance? My question is literal, not rhetorical. Conservatives must choose. They cannot have both of these things. They must pick only one.

As president, Donald Trump delivered some welcome conservative victories. He is not going to do so again. In fact, the opposite is true. If Trump is allowed to stick around, he will remain what he has already become: a massive drag on the fortunes and the efficacy of the political Right. Electorally, Trump is a bust. Ideologically, he is a mess. And as an agent of persuasion . . . well, let’s just say that, at this point, the GOP might be better off asking Charles Manson to serve as the chief representative of its brand. A Republican Party that features Trump as its star attraction is a Republican Party that will stay at the margins of federal office and watch impotently as progressives continue to accrete power. The bureaucracy will grow. Taxes will increase. Entitlement spending will spiral. The border will remain porous. The Supreme Court will be flipped back. That, and not the handful of salutary reforms that were achieved between 2017 and 2021, will be Trump’s legacy.

Trump is not going to win elections going forward. He won in 2016 because he ran against Hillary Clinton — and, even then, he secured only 46.1 percent of the vote. In 2018, he was a drag on the Republican ticket. In 2020, he lost reelection by 7 million votes. In 2022, he almost single-handedly demolished the GOP’s chance to retake the Senate. If Trump is nominated in 2024, he will lose once again. The same goes for 2028, 2032, 2036, and every election season in between. Trump is a poor candidate; he has become worse, not better, over time; and his time in the wilderness has turned him into King Lear.

Nor is Trump going to help other conservatives to win office or to thrive. We can, of course, debate who is and who is not a “conservative,” just as we can argue over which sort of conservatives we would like to lead the movement going forward. But that is not the endeavor in which Donald Trump is engaged. Rather, Trump habitually divides the world into two groups — one full of people he likes, one full of people he does not — and then backfills his reasoning on the fly. For Trump, there is nothing important in American politics besides the one-way personal loyalty that other Republicans exhibit toward him and his ambitions. Why are Kevin McCarthy and Elise Stefanik and Dr. Oz held up as desirable conservatives? Answer: Because McCarthy and Stefanik are willing to prostrate themselves before him. Why, by contrast, are Brian Kemp, Mike Pence, Paul Ryan, and, increasingly, Ron DeSantis deemed problematic? Answer: Because, in one way or another, they are unwilling to toe his line. Given a choice between advancing his own interests and burning down the entire American conservative movement, Trump would light a match.

If pushed, Trump will suggest that he is now synonymous with American conservatism — that, as a practical matter, his interests and its interests are inextricable. This is false. Across the board, Trump’s existence within the debate is making it more difficult to sell conservatism than it was before he arrived. Conservatives believe in the importance of institutions, of delayed gratification, and of exhibiting humility about what we do not — and, perhaps, cannot — know. Donald Trump believes in none of these things. Conservatives believe that politics exists to facilitate civil society, and they insist that the idea that “everything is political” represents the first step toward totalitarianism. Donald Trump sits at the head of a cult of personality and subordinates all political and moral questions to his whim. Conservatives cherish the American constitutional order, and they understand that its constraints will not always line up with the transient wishes of the majority. Like contemporary progressives, Donald Trump expresses a desire to abolish any portion of the system that temporarily inconveniences him.

This infantile impatience is applied universally, because, at root, Donald Trump believes in nothing. Sensing a fleeting political advantage, Trump has begun to throw the entire Democratic playbook at Ron DeSantis, who, because he has noticed that our federal entitlements are insolvent, has been labeled a “wheelchair off the cliff kind of guy.” This is not helpful. Desperate to divert blame for the performance of his ridiculous candidates in 2022, Trump insisted that it was Republicans’ position on abortion — one he once adopted himself — that had cost them the Senate. This is not helpful. Blinded by the cameras after the massacre at Parkland in 2018, Trump responded to Mike Pence’s demand that any changes to the law must “allow due process so no one’s rights are trampled” by declaring, “I like taking the guns early” and, “take the guns first, go through due process second.” This is not helpful.

As a famous man once said, “We have come to a time for choosing.” Unlike in 2020, Donald Trump’s nomination in 2024 is not a fait accompli, and the question before conservatives is not whether they would prefer a second Trump term to the prospect of Joe Biden. The question now is whether, with the advantage of a great universe of alternative options before them, conservatives would prefer to take concrete steps to advance their political goals or to sacrifice everything to feed the ego of a maniac. Those are our two choices — and they are not going to change.

 
Pick One: Conservatism or Trump


By CHARLES C. W. COOKE
March 21, 2023 10:20 AM


Those are our only two choices — we cannot have both of these things.

Conservative Americans must choose. Do they want Donald Trump to play a central role in Republican politics, or do they want to win elections and achieve the policy outcomes that supposedly inspired them to get involved in politics in the first instance? My question is literal, not rhetorical. Conservatives must choose. They cannot have both of these things. They must pick only one.

As president, Donald Trump delivered some welcome conservative victories. He is not going to do so again. In fact, the opposite is true. If Trump is allowed to stick around, he will remain what he has already become: a massive drag on the fortunes and the efficacy of the political Right. Electorally, Trump is a bust. Ideologically, he is a mess. And as an agent of persuasion . . . well, let’s just say that, at this point, the GOP might be better off asking Charles Manson to serve as the chief representative of its brand. A Republican Party that features Trump as its star attraction is a Republican Party that will stay at the margins of federal office and watch impotently as progressives continue to accrete power. The bureaucracy will grow. Taxes will increase. Entitlement spending will spiral. The border will remain porous. The Supreme Court will be flipped back. That, and not the handful of salutary reforms that were achieved between 2017 and 2021, will be Trump’s legacy.

Trump is not going to win elections going forward. He won in 2016 because he ran against Hillary Clinton — and, even then, he secured only 46.1 percent of the vote. In 2018, he was a drag on the Republican ticket. In 2020, he lost reelection by 7 million votes. In 2022, he almost single-handedly demolished the GOP’s chance to retake the Senate. If Trump is nominated in 2024, he will lose once again. The same goes for 2028, 2032, 2036, and every election season in between. Trump is a poor candidate; he has become worse, not better, over time; and his time in the wilderness has turned him into King Lear.

Nor is Trump going to help other conservatives to win office or to thrive. We can, of course, debate who is and who is not a “conservative,” just as we can argue over which sort of conservatives we would like to lead the movement going forward. But that is not the endeavor in which Donald Trump is engaged. Rather, Trump habitually divides the world into two groups — one full of people he likes, one full of people he does not — and then backfills his reasoning on the fly. For Trump, there is nothing important in American politics besides the one-way personal loyalty that other Republicans exhibit toward him and his ambitions. Why are Kevin McCarthy and Elise Stefanik and Dr. Oz held up as desirable conservatives? Answer: Because McCarthy and Stefanik are willing to prostrate themselves before him. Why, by contrast, are Brian Kemp, Mike Pence, Paul Ryan, and, increasingly, Ron DeSantis deemed problematic? Answer: Because, in one way or another, they are unwilling to toe his line. Given a choice between advancing his own interests and burning down the entire American conservative movement, Trump would light a match.

If pushed, Trump will suggest that he is now synonymous with American conservatism — that, as a practical matter, his interests and its interests are inextricable. This is false. Across the board, Trump’s existence within the debate is making it more difficult to sell conservatism than it was before he arrived. Conservatives believe in the importance of institutions, of delayed gratification, and of exhibiting humility about what we do not — and, perhaps, cannot — know. Donald Trump believes in none of these things. Conservatives believe that politics exists to facilitate civil society, and they insist that the idea that “everything is political” represents the first step toward totalitarianism. Donald Trump sits at the head of a cult of personality and subordinates all political and moral questions to his whim. Conservatives cherish the American constitutional order, and they understand that its constraints will not always line up with the transient wishes of the majority. Like contemporary progressives, Donald Trump expresses a desire to abolish any portion of the system that temporarily inconveniences him.

This infantile impatience is applied universally, because, at root, Donald Trump believes in nothing. Sensing a fleeting political advantage, Trump has begun to throw the entire Democratic playbook at Ron DeSantis, who, because he has noticed that our federal entitlements are insolvent, has been labeled a “wheelchair off the cliff kind of guy.” This is not helpful. Desperate to divert blame for the performance of his ridiculous candidates in 2022, Trump insisted that it was Republicans’ position on abortion — one he once adopted himself — that had cost them the Senate. This is not helpful. Blinded by the cameras after the massacre at Parkland in 2018, Trump responded to Mike Pence’s demand that any changes to the law must “allow due process so no one’s rights are trampled” by declaring, “I like taking the guns early” and, “take the guns first, go through due process second.” This is not helpful.

As a famous man once said, “We have come to a time for choosing.” Unlike in 2020, Donald Trump’s nomination in 2024 is not a fait accompli, and the question before conservatives is not whether they would prefer a second Trump term to the prospect of Joe Biden. The question now is whether, with the advantage of a great universe of alternative options before them, conservatives would prefer to take concrete steps to advance their political goals or to sacrifice everything to feed the ego of a maniac. Those are our two choices — and they are not going to change.

I am not a fan of The Bulwark or The National Review for much anymore. I think there are arguments the Trump supporters make about the GOP as a political party that are on point. That being said, I also agree that Trump is drag on what I would like to see done because of most of the things listed in the article.
 
I am not a fan of The Bulwark or The National Review for much anymore. I think there are arguments the Trump supporters make about the GOP as a political party that are on point. That being said, I also agree that Trump is drag on what I would like to see done because of most of the things listed in the article.
Which right-leaning opinion coverage are you a fan of?
 
Which right-leaning opinion coverage are you a fan of?
I bounce all over. My issue with those two in particular is that many of their writers went from being "staunch conservatives" to "Never Trump" to flat out making arguments that I would identify as left of center and arguing to elect people who are left of center who were running against regular run of the mill Republicans because? (See also: The Lincoln Project) I don't know why. I have my guesses but nothing concrete.

"A Conservative Case To Do This Thing The Progressive Left Wants To Do" are far too often found among that part of the commentariat these days. I want a conservative case to do conservative things. I find they don't speak as much for me anymore. In many cases I think guys like David French are the Washington Generals of the political world.

I will still pull content from those places but it isn't a go to, sometimes they are linked on other blogs. Places like Hot Air and other righty blogs usually link to stuff. The Federalist, American Greatness, PJ Media...more commentary. News you kind of pull from everywhere. I like the substack work that (non-righties) like Weiss and Greenwald do.

Donald Trump could make you not like the direction of the GOP. If you truly support conservative causes, I don't see how stumping for the Progressive Left does anything to advance your beliefs. I think a bunch of the commentators in those organizations showed their true colors in response to Trump. You can be not for him but you can't be against me. Seems to me there is a whole bunch of the latter to go with the former with those publications.
 
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I bounce all over. My issue with those two in particular is that many of their writers went from being "staunch conservatives" to "Never Trump" to flat out making arguments that I would identify as left of center and arguing to elect people who are left of center who were running against regular run of the mill Republicans because? (See also: The Lincoln Project) I don't know why. I have my guesses but nothing concrete.

"A Conservative Case To Do This Thing The Progressive Left Wants To Do" are far too often found among that part of the commentariat these days. I want a conservative case to do conservative things. I find they don't speak as much for me anymore. In many cases I think guys like David French are the Washington Generals of the political world.

I will still pull content from those places but it isn't a go to, sometimes they are linked on other blogs. Places like Hot Air and other righty blogs usually link to stuff. The Federalist, American Greatness, PJ Media...more commentary. News you kind of pull from everywhere. I like the substack work that (non-righties) like Weiss and Greenwald do.

Donald Trump could make you not like the direction of the GOP. If you truly support conservative causes, I don't see how stumping for the Progressive Left does anything to advance your beliefs. I think a bunch of the commentators in those organizations showed their true colors in response to Trump. You can be not for him but you can't be against me. Seems to me there is a whole bunch of the latter to go with the former with those publications.
I like that the right and right-leaning commentators disagree about this stuff and write articles like that. I find they are much more up for debating issues than the left right now.

I don't usually care about articles pumping up or tearing down political candidates, but that's because I've become a cynic about politicians.
 
I like that the right and right-leaning commentators disagree about this stuff and write articles like that. I find they are much more up for debating issues than the left right now.

I don't usually care about articles pumping up or tearing down political candidates, but that's because I've become a cynic about politicians.
I read sites that disagree about Trump and they disagree about policy--from the conservative side. There are a few groups that moved from being "I am on this side but here is where I have disagreements" to being "I claim to be on this side but none of the positions I am currently taking or the people I am supporting would lead you to believe that." I think National Review is a little way down that road, The Dispatch and Bulwark are further, and The Lincoln Project people are so far down that I won't ever respect their "conservative" opinion again.
 
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Pick One: Conservatism or Trump


By CHARLES C. W. COOKE
March 21, 2023 10:20 AM


Those are our only two choices — we cannot have both of these things.

Conservative Americans must choose. Do they want Donald Trump to play a central role in Republican politics, or do they want to win elections and achieve the policy outcomes that supposedly inspired them to get involved in politics in the first instance? My question is literal, not rhetorical. Conservatives must choose. They cannot have both of these things. They must pick only one.

As president, Donald Trump delivered some welcome conservative victories. He is not going to do so again. In fact, the opposite is true. If Trump is allowed to stick around, he will remain what he has already become: a massive drag on the fortunes and the efficacy of the political Right. Electorally, Trump is a bust. Ideologically, he is a mess. And as an agent of persuasion . . . well, let’s just say that, at this point, the GOP might be better off asking Charles Manson to serve as the chief representative of its brand. A Republican Party that features Trump as its star attraction is a Republican Party that will stay at the margins of federal office and watch impotently as progressives continue to accrete power. The bureaucracy will grow. Taxes will increase. Entitlement spending will spiral. The border will remain porous. The Supreme Court will be flipped back. That, and not the handful of salutary reforms that were achieved between 2017 and 2021, will be Trump’s legacy.

Trump is not going to win elections going forward. He won in 2016 because he ran against Hillary Clinton — and, even then, he secured only 46.1 percent of the vote. In 2018, he was a drag on the Republican ticket. In 2020, he lost reelection by 7 million votes. In 2022, he almost single-handedly demolished the GOP’s chance to retake the Senate. If Trump is nominated in 2024, he will lose once again. The same goes for 2028, 2032, 2036, and every election season in between. Trump is a poor candidate; he has become worse, not better, over time; and his time in the wilderness has turned him into King Lear.

Nor is Trump going to help other conservatives to win office or to thrive. We can, of course, debate who is and who is not a “conservative,” just as we can argue over which sort of conservatives we would like to lead the movement going forward. But that is not the endeavor in which Donald Trump is engaged. Rather, Trump habitually divides the world into two groups — one full of people he likes, one full of people he does not — and then backfills his reasoning on the fly. For Trump, there is nothing important in American politics besides the one-way personal loyalty that other Republicans exhibit toward him and his ambitions. Why are Kevin McCarthy and Elise Stefanik and Dr. Oz held up as desirable conservatives? Answer: Because McCarthy and Stefanik are willing to prostrate themselves before him. Why, by contrast, are Brian Kemp, Mike Pence, Paul Ryan, and, increasingly, Ron DeSantis deemed problematic? Answer: Because, in one way or another, they are unwilling to toe his line. Given a choice between advancing his own interests and burning down the entire American conservative movement, Trump would light a match.

If pushed, Trump will suggest that he is now synonymous with American conservatism — that, as a practical matter, his interests and its interests are inextricable. This is false. Across the board, Trump’s existence within the debate is making it more difficult to sell conservatism than it was before he arrived. Conservatives believe in the importance of institutions, of delayed gratification, and of exhibiting humility about what we do not — and, perhaps, cannot — know. Donald Trump believes in none of these things. Conservatives believe that politics exists to facilitate civil society, and they insist that the idea that “everything is political” represents the first step toward totalitarianism. Donald Trump sits at the head of a cult of personality and subordinates all political and moral questions to his whim. Conservatives cherish the American constitutional order, and they understand that its constraints will not always line up with the transient wishes of the majority. Like contemporary progressives, Donald Trump expresses a desire to abolish any portion of the system that temporarily inconveniences him.

This infantile impatience is applied universally, because, at root, Donald Trump believes in nothing. Sensing a fleeting political advantage, Trump has begun to throw the entire Democratic playbook at Ron DeSantis, who, because he has noticed that our federal entitlements are insolvent, has been labeled a “wheelchair off the cliff kind of guy.” This is not helpful. Desperate to divert blame for the performance of his ridiculous candidates in 2022, Trump insisted that it was Republicans’ position on abortion — one he once adopted himself — that had cost them the Senate. This is not helpful. Blinded by the cameras after the massacre at Parkland in 2018, Trump responded to Mike Pence’s demand that any changes to the law must “allow due process so no one’s rights are trampled” by declaring, “I like taking the guns early” and, “take the guns first, go through due process second.” This is not helpful.

As a famous man once said, “We have come to a time for choosing.” Unlike in 2020, Donald Trump’s nomination in 2024 is not a fait accompli, and the question before conservatives is not whether they would prefer a second Trump term to the prospect of Joe Biden. The question now is whether, with the advantage of a great universe of alternative options before them, conservatives would prefer to take concrete steps to advance their political goals or to sacrifice everything to feed the ego of a maniac. Those are our two choices — and they are not going to change.

One thing you can be certain of is that no matter who the nominee is that they will be a racist according to the left.
 
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I'm for any "Republican" or Democrat honestly that can deliver on Trump's promises. Burn the deep state to the ground day one...FBI, CIA, military industrial complex...secure the border, no wars unless attacked, America first trade policies, hold China accountable for COVID, end all woke nonsense, end mail on balloting, take care of crime and George Soros, etc.

It has really nothing to do with Trump. It's just that he's the only one promising to do those things.
 
Well yeah, whoever the nominee is will be “liTeRalLy hItleR” the moment they’re announced.
DeSantis is in second place at the moment and they are already saying he is worse than Trump. It is the same story each election cycle. If DeSantis or Haley get the nomination you will get a long flood of "white adjacency" and advancing "white supremacy" while they totally are fascists hell bent on overturning the constitution and if only we could go back to the days of George W. Bush who we called a Nazi chimp at the time.
 
I'm for any "Republican" or Democrat honestly that can deliver on Trump's promises. Burn the deep state to the ground day one...FBI, CIA, military industrial complex...secure the border, no wars unless attacked, America first trade policies, hold China accountable for COVID, end all woke nonsense, end mail on balloting, take care of crime and George Soros, etc.

It has really nothing to do with Trump. It's just that he's the only one promising to do those things.
Very fair Dbm
 
One thing you can be certain of is that no matter who the nominee is that they will be a racist according to the left.

And the Dem will be a Socialist who hates America. That's how it works nowadays.
 
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I read sites that disagree about Trump and they disagree about policy--from the conservative side. There are a few groups that moved from being "I am on this side but here is where I have disagreements" to being "I claim to be on this side but none of the positions I am currently taking or the people I am supporting would lead you to believe that." I think National Review is a little way down that road, The Dispatch and Bulwark are further, and The Lincoln Project people are so far down that I won't ever respect their "conservative" opinion again.
I'm surprised you say that about NR. The only one I can think of who a conservative would have a real problem with might be Michael Brendan Dougherty? Cooke is a libertarian first and foremost, I guess. You mentioned French before, but he left a few years ago I thought.
 
That’s an incredibly broad brush you’re using and very unfair.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure it is. Who was the last Republican presidential candidate that wasn't portrayed as a racist by some part of the left?

When I say "some part of the left" I mean a significant part--one significant enough that we can find evidence for it through Google. (I should also qualify--I think most of the mudslinging criticisms of racism in the past were from the Dem party apparatus, cynically used to win elections, so the stories/arguments might not be ginned up by someone truly "of the left.")
 
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Unfortunately, I'm not sure it is. Who was the last Republican presidential candidate that wasn't portrayed as a racist by some part of the left?

When I say "some part of the left" I mean a significant part--one significant enough that we can find evidence for it through Google. (I should also qualify--I think most of the mudslinging criticisms of racism in the past were from the Dem party apparatus, cynically used to win elections, so the stories/arguments might not be ginned up by someone truly "of the left.")
I’m old enough to remember when a not so insignificant portion of the right was adamant that a two term POTUS was not even an American citizen. The outlier nuts are not “everyone” on either side.

I also think Republicans need to quit comparing how “normal” GOP candidates will be treated versus Trump. He was very derserving of most all of the criticism he received. He’s nothing like any other political candidate I’ve seen in my lifetime.
 
I'm surprised you say that about NR. The only one I can think of who a conservative would have a real problem with might be Michael Brendan Dougherty? Cooke is a libertarian first and foremost, I guess. You mentioned French before, but he left a few years ago I thought.
I view NR as basically an arm of the establishment GOP. I agree with them on quite a bit but I am disaffected (annoyed) at the inability of the establishment to advance conservatism of any kind, in any measurable degree, for the majority of my adult life.

Since this is a sports site we are talking on: I like my coach in general. I like the things he says. However, he doesn't put wins on the board. He doesn't recruit well. In fact I catch him making arguments for why it would be better to go to our competition (like here is how we want to be like our competition as opposed to why we are better than them because of this style we run that makes us better).

NR is just kind of the agreeable losers to me. The point of politics is to actually advance your agenda and not just talk about it. They are talkers.
 
I’m old enough to remember when a not so insignificant portion of the right was adamant that a two term POTUS was not even an American citizen. The outlier nuts are not “everyone” on either side.

I also think Republicans need to quit comparing how “normal” GOP candidates will be treated versus Trump. He was very derserving of most all of the criticism he received. He’s nothing like any other political candidate I’ve seen in my lifetime.
And yet the table is already being laid for how DeSantis is worse. Brad is right, wolf got cried too often.
 
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Unfortunately, I'm not sure it is. Who was the last Republican presidential candidate that wasn't portrayed as a racist by some part of the left?

When I say "some part of the left" I mean a significant part--one significant enough that we can find evidence for it through Google. (I should also qualify--I think most of the mudslinging criticisms of racism in the past were from the Dem party apparatus, cynically used to win elections, so the stories/arguments might not be ginned up by someone truly "of the left.")
So would it be fair to use a broad brush on the right and say that they would claim any dem nominee was a woke socialist?

While dems weren't fond of Bush, I don't recall any widespread claims that he was racist. Maybe some after his slow response to Katrina but it's a little bit of an exaggeration to say any GOP candidate would be called racist by dems as a whole. Unless you're thinking it is fair to brush the entire party with those you find to be the worst of said party.

Ask aloha if he wants trumpers representing the entire conservative party. It would be unfair.

Anyway, don't make racists comments, don't pander to the KKK and other extremist, white supremacy groups and most dems won't call the person racist. Trump deserved the label.
 
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DeSantis is in second place at the moment and they are already saying he is worse than Trump. It is the same story each election cycle. If DeSantis or Haley get the nomination you will get a long flood of "white adjacency" and advancing "white supremacy" while they totally are fascists hell bent on overturning the constitution and if only we could go back to the days of George W. Bush who we called a Nazi chimp at the time.
Read what Trump said about DeSantis. Lol. He roasted him worse than anyone on the left has. What a team player!
 
And yet the table is already being laid for how DeSantis is worse. Brad is right, wolf got cried too often.
There are a few right leaning folks on here who have been critical of DeSantis focus on culture wars and his a Trumpian tone. He’s been leaning into it.
 
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Read what Trump said about DeSantis. Lol. He roasted him worse than anyone on the left has. What a team player!
I am on record all over the place as not supporting Donald Trump in 2024. I think he is beclowning himself over DeSantis because he knows that is his competition and his competition is better. However, that doesn't negate the fact that every new GOP candidate is sold as a racist, sexist, fascist, threat to humanity by the Democrats. H.W. was, W. was, McCain was, Romney was, Trump was, DeSantis is being set up that way. If he or Haley get the nomination they will become the new Latino and Asian faces of White Supremacy....scratch that, they don't even have to be the nominee.



One tool and everyone is a nail.
 
I am on record all over the place as not supporting Donald Trump in 2024. I think he is beclowning himself over DeSantis because he knows that is his competition and his competition is better. However, that doesn't negate the fact that every new GOP candidate is sold as a racist, sexist, fascist, threat to humanity by the Democrats. H.W. was, W. was, McCain was, Romney was, Trump was, DeSantis is being set up that way. If he or Haley get the nomination they will become the new Latino and Asian faces of White Supremacy....scratch that, they don't even have to be the nominee.



One tool and everyone is a nail.
DeSantis isn't Latino.
 
And the Dem will be a Socialist who hates America. That's how it works nowadays.
Yep. When in reality they (politicians) are all working towards the same goal. Divide and conquer is the name of the game. They are all on the same team, playing for the same coach. Money, power and control is what it's all about. And they're winning, quite easily. We are largely, a lazy, stupid and compliant citizenry.

Now I'm going to take a long nap, even though I have tons of work to do. Then I'll watch a few hours of reality tv, before finishing my day with my 5th booster.
 
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One thing you can be certain of is that no matter who the nominee is that they will be a racist according to the left.
Nice headshot. ;)

icegif-172.gif
 
No it's not.... I didn't say all Democrats would label them as a racist but there will be a certain segment that will.

lol you didn't say some or certain segment either in the initial post

"Conservatives want to split the United States in half" comes off as a lot different than "A certain segment of conservatives want to split the United States in half"
 
I’m old enough to remember when a not so insignificant portion of the right was adamant that a two term POTUS was not even an American citizen. The outlier nuts are not “everyone” on either side.

I also think Republicans need to quit comparing how “normal” GOP candidates will be treated versus Trump. He was very derserving of most all of the criticism he received. He’s nothing like any other political candidate I’ve seen in my lifetime.
Ok, but back to the original statement that you thought unfair: who is the last Republican presidential candidate not accused of racism? Eisenhower?
 
Ok, but back to the original statement that you thought unfair: who is the last Republican presidential candidate not accused of racism? Eisenhower?

By a decent portion of dems or by a small portion of dems that you want to represent the majority?
 
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I disagree with the premise.

Conservatives didn’t block vote for McCain or Romney and got Obama.
Conservatives didn’t block vote for Trump and almost got Hillary and then got Biden.

The real choice is vote for a unified GOP to vote for the GOP candidate or get Biden again.

I do not expect a unified GOP. Neither does Europe, Russia or China.
 
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lol you didn't say some or certain segment either in the initial post

"Conservatives want to split the United States in half" comes off as a lot different than "A certain segment of conservatives want to split the United States in half"
Well I didn't think I had to explain that so I forgot to simplify it. I've seen quite a few people on here say Republicans are racist but I've never assumed that they were talking about ALL Republicans. Maybe there a few that do mean all but I don't think most do.
 
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Pick One: Conservatism or Trump


By CHARLES C. W. COOKE
March 21, 2023 10:20 AM


Those are our only two choices — we cannot have both of these things.

Conservative Americans must choose. Do they want Donald Trump to play a central role in Republican politics, or do they want to win elections and achieve the policy outcomes that supposedly inspired them to get involved in politics in the first instance? My question is literal, not rhetorical. Conservatives must choose. They cannot have both of these things. They must pick only one.

As president, Donald Trump delivered some welcome conservative victories. He is not going to do so again. In fact, the opposite is true. If Trump is allowed to stick around, he will remain what he has already become: a massive drag on the fortunes and the efficacy of the political Right. Electorally, Trump is a bust. Ideologically, he is a mess. And as an agent of persuasion . . . well, let’s just say that, at this point, the GOP might be better off asking Charles Manson to serve as the chief representative of its brand. A Republican Party that features Trump as its star attraction is a Republican Party that will stay at the margins of federal office and watch impotently as progressives continue to accrete power. The bureaucracy will grow. Taxes will increase. Entitlement spending will spiral. The border will remain porous. The Supreme Court will be flipped back. That, and not the handful of salutary reforms that were achieved between 2017 and 2021, will be Trump’s legacy.

Trump is not going to win elections going forward. He won in 2016 because he ran against Hillary Clinton — and, even then, he secured only 46.1 percent of the vote. In 2018, he was a drag on the Republican ticket. In 2020, he lost reelection by 7 million votes. In 2022, he almost single-handedly demolished the GOP’s chance to retake the Senate. If Trump is nominated in 2024, he will lose once again. The same goes for 2028, 2032, 2036, and every election season in between. Trump is a poor candidate; he has become worse, not better, over time; and his time in the wilderness has turned him into King Lear.

Nor is Trump going to help other conservatives to win office or to thrive. We can, of course, debate who is and who is not a “conservative,” just as we can argue over which sort of conservatives we would like to lead the movement going forward. But that is not the endeavor in which Donald Trump is engaged. Rather, Trump habitually divides the world into two groups — one full of people he likes, one full of people he does not — and then backfills his reasoning on the fly. For Trump, there is nothing important in American politics besides the one-way personal loyalty that other Republicans exhibit toward him and his ambitions. Why are Kevin McCarthy and Elise Stefanik and Dr. Oz held up as desirable conservatives? Answer: Because McCarthy and Stefanik are willing to prostrate themselves before him. Why, by contrast, are Brian Kemp, Mike Pence, Paul Ryan, and, increasingly, Ron DeSantis deemed problematic? Answer: Because, in one way or another, they are unwilling to toe his line. Given a choice between advancing his own interests and burning down the entire American conservative movement, Trump would light a match.

If pushed, Trump will suggest that he is now synonymous with American conservatism — that, as a practical matter, his interests and its interests are inextricable. This is false. Across the board, Trump’s existence within the debate is making it more difficult to sell conservatism than it was before he arrived. Conservatives believe in the importance of institutions, of delayed gratification, and of exhibiting humility about what we do not — and, perhaps, cannot — know. Donald Trump believes in none of these things. Conservatives believe that politics exists to facilitate civil society, and they insist that the idea that “everything is political” represents the first step toward totalitarianism. Donald Trump sits at the head of a cult of personality and subordinates all political and moral questions to his whim. Conservatives cherish the American constitutional order, and they understand that its constraints will not always line up with the transient wishes of the majority. Like contemporary progressives, Donald Trump expresses a desire to abolish any portion of the system that temporarily inconveniences him.

This infantile impatience is applied universally, because, at root, Donald Trump believes in nothing. Sensing a fleeting political advantage, Trump has begun to throw the entire Democratic playbook at Ron DeSantis, who, because he has noticed that our federal entitlements are insolvent, has been labeled a “wheelchair off the cliff kind of guy.” This is not helpful. Desperate to divert blame for the performance of his ridiculous candidates in 2022, Trump insisted that it was Republicans’ position on abortion — one he once adopted himself — that had cost them the Senate. This is not helpful. Blinded by the cameras after the massacre at Parkland in 2018, Trump responded to Mike Pence’s demand that any changes to the law must “allow due process so no one’s rights are trampled” by declaring, “I like taking the guns early” and, “take the guns first, go through due process second.” This is not helpful.

As a famous man once said, “We have come to a time for choosing.” Unlike in 2020, Donald Trump’s nomination in 2024 is not a fait accompli, and the question before conservatives is not whether they would prefer a second Trump term to the prospect of Joe Biden. The question now is whether, with the advantage of a great universe of alternative options before them, conservatives would prefer to take concrete steps to advance their political goals or to sacrifice everything to feed the ego of a maniac. Those are our two choices — and they are not going to change.

Couldn’t be an easier choice. Trump must go.
 
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One thing you can be certain of is that no matter who the nominee is that they will be a racist according to the left.
That never changes, but it’s usually very easy to defend against those bogus accusations. It’s not easy to defend Trump and he’s so unfit it’s difficult to want to.
 
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