CTA is 17-17 through his first 34 games. He is 500. The last coach to be 500 or better was Bo McMillin in the 1940s. Let that sink in.
how good is CTA
- Thread starter JWilk1234
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I think CTA is good coach. I think as IU fans we need to realize what we are as a program. We will not be Ohio State. Not now and probably not ever. CTA is not going to make use into Ohio State and that should not be the expectation of him.
I think CTA given the support he needs can be a Dantonio, Ferentz or a Fitzgerald though. I think that is a reasonable expectation for this program. Make bowls more often than not and occasionally have a break out season when the league is down.
I think the difficult part for IU going forward is maintaining a bowl program in the Big Ten East, keeping up recruiting and getting good replacement coaches when our assistants get poached (and they will be poached).
I think CTA given the support he needs can be a Dantonio, Ferentz or a Fitzgerald though. I think that is a reasonable expectation for this program. Make bowls more often than not and occasionally have a break out season when the league is down.
I think the difficult part for IU going forward is maintaining a bowl program in the Big Ten East, keeping up recruiting and getting good replacement coaches when our assistants get poached (and they will be poached).
I don't necessarily disagree with you (except the for when the league is down part) but I'd still like to see us aspire to surpass "the" ohio $tate...
I'm excited to have a coach that can potentially be 500 over a period of time. No true IU fan thinks we will become an Ohio State caliber team. Deep down I think we all just want to be better then mediocre and have fans that go to games.
Last year he was a total failure. In over his head. A high school coach who personally destroyed Ben Davis and needed to be let go. This year he is a world beater who is moving on to Florida State after the season. DWS.
I'm guessing the truth is somewhere in between. Huge Grin!
I believe this guy may be in the right place at the right time to get some things dones at IU. How sweet would that be? I've been waiting for a winner at IU since the 70's.
Go Hoosiers!
I'm guessing the truth is somewhere in between. Huge Grin!
I believe this guy may be in the right place at the right time to get some things dones at IU. How sweet would that be? I've been waiting for a winner at IU since the 70's.
Go Hoosiers!
He could be very good, yet, he could just be OK. The goal for Indiana football is to stay off the bottom of the Big Ten. I think he can do that. The question is whether he is a guy that can get solid recruits and beat teams that are down or if he can truly develop guys to become a legit Big Ten football program. I do not think he is a flash in the pan though.
Neither as bad as last year nor as good as (so far) this year. Just the opposite for poor Pat Fitzgerald.
I must admit, this board is a lot more fun to read at 7-2 than at 5-7, if not less delusional.
It's a fun season. Here's to many more!
I must admit, this board is a lot more fun to read at 7-2 than at 5-7, if not less delusional.
It's a fun season. Here's to many more!
I will answer this after 3 seasons...no less. Any fool can win once on luck...but not 3 in a row. That will tell us who we have.
Initial reaction is still mixed...like it or not...
Initial reaction is still mixed...like it or not...
If he were to beat Michigan and Purdue, he would be Big Ten CoTY! Let that sink in!
It is interesting, he brought in Kalen Deboer and this program looks completely different. Had Deboer been here from jump, I think Allen's overall record would be far better than it currently is....
It is interesting, he brought in Kalen Deboer and this program looks completely different. Had Deboer been here from jump, I think Allen's overall record would be far better than it currently is....
Hard to tell to be honest. 500, but has yet to beat a higher ranked team, no “signature” wins....hope springs eternal tho
I dont think we have made a huge leap. More talent, more depth, better coaching, ect. We are better than we were last year. I expect to be better still next year.
I suspect Indiana's offensive line and defensive line to control the Bucket game. Stevie having a large day and running for several touchdowns along with 150 yards rushing, is subject to happen.
It could play out that way, but it would be counter to how those games have gone the previous two years, where they’ve controlled us with superior skill. IU needs to play well, regardless of the outcome, against PSU and UM, before the Purdue game. Good performances against those quality opponents, which will be the second and third on our schedule, will define the progress of the team and program.
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This is IU's first winning season in 12 years, and just the 10th 7+ win season in program history. We won a B1G game on the road before 90,000 fans, and we've won four straight conference games for the first time since 1993. If that doesn't already "define progress," I don't know what does. I don't know what's going to happen at PSU and against UM, but it won't diminish what IU has already accomplished this season.
P.S. I do expect that we will kick "Pursue's" ass into oblivion on November 30.
Heres the thing I like...Its consistent and the plan has been solid. We beat the teams we are supposed to while steadily improving and thats what anyone wants. I would rather have this kind of result rather than go beat a top 10 team and follow it up with a flop or several flops. Its a ladder climb but its been concise. Starting from the beginning even the Debord hire. Allen turned that part of the team over to an experienced guy (Hoosier) so he could handle what he knew best. Then the the assistants, he has held those guys together since he hired them. Then the S&C coaches, the most important hire he could have made. Then Deboer and Wommack. The recruits and pipeline. Its a solid plan that is obviously coming together. CTA is a smart guy, and this build and the results are on track from the decisions he made. Time to make a bigger splash
Its a ladder climb but its been concise. Starting from the beginning even the Debord hire. Allen turned that part of the team over to an experienced guy (Hoosier) so he could handle what he knew best. Then the the assistants, he has held those guys together since he hired them. Then the S&C coaches, the most important hire he could have made. Then Deboer and Wommack. The recruits and pipeline. Its a solid plan that is obviously coming together. CTA is a smart guy, and this build and the results are on track from the decisions he made. Time to make a bigger splash He is a good coach. All I expect from him is to improve each year, and eventually, we will be up there. And he has done that, at least this year. Easy schedule or not, we are beating the teams we are supposed to, or at least beating the teams at the bottom of the big ten. In the past, we did not. If he can continue selling the program to recruits, which I think he really does, then I fully expect him to keep improving. What I like best about him, though, is when I watch a game where we play poorly and I'm pissed as hell.....HE is pissed as hell, too. And expects better from his players. That is a sign of a successful coach, to not take losing in stride. I can tell this past couple of years killed him going 5-7 and always talking of "breaking through", because I know he fully believed he would. Just took him an extra year to do it!
Well said but I am a student of statistical realities...one time at anything means very little. Too many factors...maybe the B10i is so down we have the illusions of "greatness"...which is most likely the case.
But remember...one time is only an incident...two times is merely a co-incident...but three times is a trend. I will make my judgment then and only then.
Remember two bad seasons and one good is a losing record...period.
Why is PU revealing but winning as a road underdog at Nebraska not a signature win. Their backup is better than Martinez anyway. You folks are wacky.
Yes.....the opening line had us favored, but it changed to us being underdogs at some point before game day.
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So a road win as a BIG underdog but hey we haven't beat anyone. WE ARE BETTER BECAUSE THE 2018 RECRUITING CLASS WAS GREAT, NOT GOOD, GREAT. They were freshmen last year and now they are sophomores or redshirt freshmen. 2 years for team in weight program. We have been so much more physical tha last 4 weeks. Like old school Mallory physical. We have injured every QB we have played the last 3 weeks. And 2 against Nebraska. Yes we should be better next year but we are good now.
Different standards, I guess. To me, winning and progress are most accurately measured by the quality of the opponent, rather than just the score achieved against inferior competition. Most adults can ace an exam of basic arithmetic, but I’m not sure that would define one’s aptitude nearly as much as doing well on a calculus test. For some, the grade is solely how they choose to evaluate themselves, regardless of the level of challenge or difficulty. Just a difference in standards and expectations, that’s all.
They’re “revealing” because they’ve controlled the last two bucket games so, if we can reverse that trend, that would seem like progress.
Nothing was moved. My view is very straightforward. You’re welcome to be specific in your criticism, if you’re so inclined.
Here's what I like...other than Michigan St. (once), Purdue, and Illinois, the only B1G teams we had beaten were Maryland and Rutgers. It is so nice to add a couple new scalps with Nebraska and Northwestern. It's nothing to write home about for most programs, but we have now beaten half of the teams in the B1G in the past 4.5 seasons.
I believe CTA underachieved his first two years and has probably overachieved this season. i can't help but think that our new OC probably could have helped us become bowl eligible the two previous seasons as well. A head coach is only as good as his assistants, IMO.
I believe CTA underachieved his first two years and has probably overachieved this season. i can't help but think that our new OC probably could have helped us become bowl eligible the two previous seasons as well. A head coach is only as good as his assistants, IMO.
Last year doesn't matter. We aren't playing last years team. You have a built in excuse already because they are on to a walk-on QB. Injuries happen. IU didn't cry because Whop was hurt last year. Don't cry this year.
I’ve not mentioned their injuries, only the clear trend of them controlling the last two bucket games. If one considers performance against common opponents as an accurate barometer, the match up will likely be close. But PSU and UM are first, and those are the two opponents who, in my view, will most accurately gauge IU’s progress as a team and program, regardless of whether we win either game.
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Any reasonable person would recognize that going from five wins to seven (or more) wins is progress. Winning in the B1G on the road, something that can be difficult for even the best teams (just ask Ohio State, who lost to a mediocre Purdue team last year, or Wisconsin, who lost to a mediocre Illinois team this year) but has been particularly challenging for IU, is progress.
It is absolutely killing you that IU is vastly improved this season while Purdue sucks. All you've got left in your pitiful arsenal is strength of schedule. Well, it wasn't long ago when IU was losing to weak teams like Nevada, or getting crushed at home by the likes of Illinois. That's not happening anymore. I'd call that progress.
Vegas set us as the slight favorite, then a bunch of Nebraska money pushed the line and made us a slight dog. The Northwestern line moved similarly. We covered both easily, of course.
The Nebraska game (technically, after money moves) has been the only game CTA has won as an underdog....including the Utah game.
I'm developing faith, but I'd like to see a couple more upsets before I go all in that he is a savior.
That said, I believe he has only lost as a favorite twice....so we've eliminated those for the most part. PLUS, we just seem to be favored more now, and hold serve, which obviously is huge as well.
Beat Michigan and Purdue I go all in.
Lose to Mich in OT again but beat Purdue....still pretty all in.
Blowouts to PSU and Mich, and edge Purdue...happy, but need a broader body of work.
Lose the last three and still go 7-5....gotta admit the magicalness of the season will be gone, and we'd be in a tough spot raise wise....at least to me.
I'm developing faith, but I'd like to see a couple more upsets before I go all in that he is a savior.
That said, I believe he has only lost as a favorite twice....so we've eliminated those for the most part. PLUS, we just seem to be favored more now, and hold serve, which obviously is huge as well.
Beat Michigan and Purdue I go all in.
Lose to Mich in OT again but beat Purdue....still pretty all in.
Blowouts to PSU and Mich, and edge Purdue...happy, but need a broader body of work.
Lose the last three and still go 7-5....gotta admit the magicalness of the season will be gone, and we'd be in a tough spot raise wise....at least to me.
Winning as an underdog isn't a great statistic, since it doesn't examine the size of the spread, etc. Winning at Nebraska this year wouldn't count the same as winning at Ohio State this year, even though we were dogs in both. I wonder what Allen's record against the spread is...both this year and career.
Also, 7 wins is 7 wins, and winning the games we should win is kind of novel.
Quite the apples to oranges comparison to Bo, who I think should have a statute outside the south end of MS, standing along 1 of the 2 greatest IU players ever, Pete Pihos. Did you know Bo was an AA halfback, and let Centre College to what was then called the greatest upset in college football history, a 6-0 win over mighty Harvard in 1921? He ran 35 yards for the winning TD, which broke Harvard's 25 game winning streak. He was so good that he was a part of the first college football HoF class ever, in 1951, as a player.
In the two years before Bo took over, IU was 1-7-3 in the BT, 4-9-3 overall. That was with only 1 "gimme" game per year.
In his first 4 years (1934-37) after he took over, IU was 17-11-4 overall, 9-8-3 in the BT. (With 1 gimme each year) Through today, CTA is 8-18 in the BT. Also, 7 of his total wins have been against OOC "gimme" competition (I am not counting our games v. VA here)
I think the more interesting comparison for CTA is with Bill Mallory.
I set aside Mallory's 1984 0-11 record, as it was immediately after the 1 year Sam Wyche debacle. People can quibble with me on that, but that's my take. I think CTA came into 2017 with an intact team & recruiting class.
From 1985-87, BM was 18-17 overall, 10-14 in BT play. That was with 1 "gimme" game every year v. 2/3 for CTA; however, OSU & Michigan were both relatively 'down' in 1987, when we beat them and finished 6-2 in the BT....and there was no PSU then. Also, BM was an established coach when he came to IU. CTA's time here has been his first 3 years as a HC.
Mallory went 8-4/6-2 & 8-3-1/5-3 in 1987 & 1988. If this is CTA's 1987, I'd be happy with a repeat of Mallory's 1988 next season.
The guy who I think has a real gripe is Lee Corso. He was fired after the 1982 season, when he went 5-6 overall, and 4-5 in the BT. In 1981, he was 3-8 overall, and 3-6 in the BT.
Here was our 1981 & 1982 schedule (we played the exact same schedule, in the same order, each year. The only thing that changed was home v. away):
Northwestern
USC
Syracuse
Michigan
Iowa
Minnesota
OSU
MSU
Wisconsin
Illinois
Purdue
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I don't expect us to beat PSU or Michigan, or win the bowl game. I will be happy if we beat Purdue, period. I could not handle a loss to Purdue with a 3rd string walk-on QB. I see that as a possibility if Moore comes back, which appears likely.
Any reasonable person evaluates with a bit more complexity than just wins and losses, if true progress is the issue. Winning against inferior competition is great, but progress should be measured in the actual level of play. Again, it’s about standards for me, but I understand others see it differently.
Oh for the love of God.
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