How far away is IU from being a top 10 program? Okay how about top 20

[82hoosier]

I mentioned this on another thread but think it deserves its own.

Let just suppose that IU eeked out wins Michigan and Ohio State this year. And pretend that they did not have the meltdown against Rutgers. The record going into the bowl games would have been 9-3. And, yes, the recored was actually 6-6. But use your imagination.

What do you think IU would have been ranked after the Purdue game? Northwestern is ranked 12 with a 10-2 record. Michigan is ranked 19th with a 9-3 record. So, we were not "light years" away from being a Top 20 team this year. And, again we were a 6-6 team. But we were competitive.

Watch the 30-30 show on ESPN and see what McCartney did with Colorado. Look what one of his assistants did with Northwestern.

Coach Hep was hired and immediately said “Can we win here? There is no doubt about it,” Hoeppner said. “We’re going to build a championship football team here. That is no joke.” Nobody doubted him. His enthusiasm was contagious. How else can you explain Miami of Ohio becoming a top 15 team - even if it was just for one year.

It is being made more difficult for IU to turn around the program with an athletic director that says that IU has different expectations for football and basketball. That is the reality. He has to get his head out of his butt and be more a recruiter and less of an apologist.

 

[HoosierJimbo89]

The 30 for 30 on Bill McCartney was excellent: one of the better 30 for 30's. Not only was it fascinating to watch Colorado's turnaround, but there were interesting off the field stories that I did not know about. Sal Aunese knocking up Mac's daughter and then dying from lung and stomach cancer at age 21: talk about drama! The racism against Colorado's black athletes by Boulder police and the town and Mac's reaction against it was interesting. I also really enjoyed the 30 for 30 about Miami: even more of a turnaround story.

It takes "X's and O's" as well as "Jimmy's and Joe's." Mac landed a bunch of the West Coast talent and was a good coach. Miami roped off the Miami area for talent and had a few great coaches in a row. Bill Mallory never reached the level of Mac or even Hayden Fry, but IU was respectable under his tenure for the most part and contended for the Big 10 title a couple of years. Mallory finished a couple of years ranked in the Top 20. Like you said, turnarounds have happened about everywhere: it isn't impossible at IU. Bill Mallory went 11-0 at Miami and also had them in the top 20 at #15.

My concern with Wilson is he would have shown it by now if he was at the level of Mac, Fry, or even Mallory. There are coaches like Beamer that take 7 years or Cutcliffe that take 6 years to get things going, but they are the outliers. It only took Cutcliffe 2 years at Ole Miss to get going. If IU wants to give Wilson a couple more years to try to achieve something greater, whatever. If IU wants to go in a different direction, whatever. I'd like to at least get back to the Mallory level of respectability and want the program to shoot for Hayden Fry or Mac level success.

 

[82hoosier]

This is CKW's first head coaching job. And yes he has made plenty of bad seat of the pants decisions. But he is a bright guy. Coaching is a game where the good ones learn from their mistakes. Next year I think he will use the run better to set up the pass. I think Howard will be back. And IU will be able to make better use of a man in motion. I see good things happening next year.

 

[HoosierJimbo89]

Offense isn't what worries me, other than Wilson out-thinking himself and trying to be too smart. The defense has a long, long way to go. No pass rush from DE's, poor secondary play, slow linebackers, players out of position, etc. Dantonio and Ferentz have an eye for defensive talent and have built impressive defenses: I haven't seen anything from Wilson that shows he can do the same or is anything beyond an OC. Defense is what will determine Wilson's fate.

 

[Cream&Crimson]

Offense isn't what worries me, other than Wilson out-thinking himself and trying to be too smart. The defense has a long, long way to go. No pass rush from DE's, poor secondary play, slow linebackers, players out of position, etc. Dantonio and Ferentz have an eye for defensive talent and have built impressive defenses: I haven't seen anything from Wilson that shows he can do the same or is anything beyond an OC. Defense is what will determine Wilson's fate.

I agree with this. I still think Wilson can succeed as HC at Indiana but he needs a stud DC and staff who he can trust to identify, recruit and develop talent on the D side. And he needs budget to pay that kind of talent.

 

[HoosierJimbo89]

I agree with this. I still think Wilson can succeed as HC at Indiana but he needs a stud DC and staff who he can trust to identify, recruit and develop talent on the D side. And he needs budget to pay that kind of talent.

That is a really good point. The good coaches have good assistants. Bill McCartney was one of Bo's assistants, and Bo was an assistant for Woody Hayes. McCartney had Les Miles and Gary Barnett as assistants. If Wilson isn't a great defensive coach or recruiter, he needs a top notch DC and defensive staff and the money to do it.

Also, the non-conference football schedule should have been four patsies since year 1 for Wilson. Wilson would have went 6-6 and to a Bowl in year 2.

The budget and scheduling aren't Wilson's fault. Does Glass get that these things are on him? I doubt it.

 

[IUNY]

I mentioned this on another thread but think it deserves its own.

Let just suppose that IU eeked out wins Michigan and Ohio State this year. And pretend that they did not have the meltdown against Rutgers. The record going into the bowl games would have been 9-3. And, yes, the recored was actually 6-6. But use your imagination.

What do you think IU would have been ranked after the Purdue game? Northwestern is ranked 12 with a 10-2 record. Michigan is ranked 19th with a 9-3 record. So, we were not "light years" away from being a Top 20 team this year. And, again we were a 6-6 team. But we were competitive.

Watch the 30-30 show on ESPN and see what McCartney did with Colorado. Look what one of his assistants did with Northwestern.

Coach Hep was hired and immediately said “Can we win here? There is no doubt about it,” Hoeppner said. “We’re going to build a championship football team here. That is no joke.” Nobody doubted him. His enthusiasm was contagious. How else can you explain Miami of Ohio becoming a top 15 team - even if it was just for one year.

It is being made more difficult for IU to turn around the program with an athletic director that says that IU has different expectations for football and basketball. That is the reality. He has to get his head out of his butt and be more a recruiter and less of an apologist.

We had a small window to win the Michigan game, and we let it close. Although we had a last-play chance against Ohio State, we also would have faced the two-point conversion decision. And yes, the Rutgers game was almost impossible to lose. On the flip side, though, we sweated out the SIU and Western Kentucky games. So when we're dealing in hypotheticals, we have to do it for all the games, not just the ones we lost. As Bill Parcells said, you are what your record says you are.

 

[VCHoosier]

Until Glass (or whoever) agrees to start paying big money for assistant coaches KW is basically rolling the dice on his DC. In order to get a proven one that can recruit it's going to take more than below average $.

A huge part of Nebraska success during the Osborne era is there was very little staff turnover. They found great coaches and paid them more than they could get anywhere else.

 

[Big Red Crimson Buffalo]

Colorado has been in the tank ever since MacCartney left. Ever since the Eric Bienimi years, they've fallen on hard times.

 

[82hoosier]

Colorado got into trouble with recruiting. Similar to what is going on with Louisville basketball.

 

[cubsflan]

I think all would agree with me, but I just want our football program to get to the point where we are making bowl games every year ( getting 6 wins every year shouldnt be that difficult) and then like every 3-4 years when we have a team that has alot of seniors and developed talent, that we maybe could make an outside run at a Big Ten title. I do think Wilson can be the guy, but I do agree with everyone else about it would be great if we could some how hire a big name DC. I thought Knorr overall did an ok job this year. Even though the numbers didnt show it, I did feel like the D was better this year though. But I do feel we are close to at least having this program to the point where we are at least making bowls every year and being able to replace the seniors each years with solid next classes.

 

[Optimist13]

If it were up to me, Knorr would be hearing
Auf Wiederzehen, Sayonara and Adios, immediately
after signing day. Donald Trump's "You're Fired"
for Knorr would also be satisfactory.